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Update may bring games, controller support to Apple TV this spring

post #1 of 65
Thread Starter 
Apple's favorite hobby may soon see a long-awaited update that would add support for iOS games and Bluetooth game controllers, a new report claims.

Apple TV


The update could come as soon as March, according to iLounge. Apple engineers are said to be working on adding support for Bluetooth game controllers, which may indicate that the refresh would also bring a new fourth-generation hardware platform.

Without new hardware, the publication speculates that the set-top box could stream games from iCloud, similar to the ill-fated Ouya streaming device. The Apple TV currently features just 8 gigabytes of built-in memory, used for buffering high-definition video and audio.

Rumors of an Apple TV refresh also surfaced ahead of last September's iPhone 5s launch event with a tweet from journalist MG Siegler that stated "those excited about a software refresh in a week are gonna be *really* excited when new Apple TV hardware is unveiled next month." Ultimately, that update never materialized.

Apple's streamer is locked in a neck-and-neck battle for living room share with rival Roku, which already features its own application marketplace. The two devices account for 80 percent of the set-top market between them.
post #2 of 65
WOAH HO HOAH!! That would be awesome. Streaming iOS games from iCloud would be the bomb. I can Airplay some games from my 5s, but they won't go full screen. Really hoping this comes to fruition.
post #3 of 65
I'd love it more if they would let me install some UK apps such as BBC iPlayer!
post #4 of 65
I forget, does Apple TV 2 (first black one) have Bluetooth? I know it doesn't support the tap for settings.
post #5 of 65

this would be sweet.

 

do it.

post #6 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by starbird73 View Post

I forget, does Apple TV 2 (first black one) have Bluetooth? I know it doesn't support the tap for settings.

 

I think I used a wireless keyboard on mine, if so it does have it.

 

that being said, its running a single core A4, so dont expect a lot of games to run smooth this. 

post #7 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by starbird73 View Post

I forget, does Apple TV 2 (first black one) have Bluetooth? I know it doesn't support the tap for settings.

Yes. I use the Apple bluetooth keyboard with mine. Much quicker than using the remote.
post #8 of 65

Sony plans to start its Playstation Now service this summer.  During the announcement said Sony was going to bring it to Playstation devices as well as Sony TVs.  It is possible Apple and Sony are in talks to bring that service to Apple TV/iOS.  Sony already has several iOS apps out relateed to PlayStation and Sony services.  If it plans to charge a subscription for Playstation Now, it is in their interest to make it available in as many places as possible.  AppleTV would open up a pretty big market and wouldn't involve working with its more direct competitors like Samsung or LG (Yeah, Sony makes phones but they are almost a joke).

 

It also possible Apple is just preparing itself for the future or has its own plans to stream iOS games.

 

Of course, there's also a chance the rumor is false. 

post #9 of 65

If they can keep both the games and its data in the cloud it would solve a lot of issues and allow to built a very low cost game console. Its a good idea *IF* they actually dont "stream" the games but just "stored" the games in iclould then download the game you want to play. Streaming means we get in VM's so it implied costly servers to setup.  VM's are good to replace corporate PC's, but games requires too much interaction between the client and the server and games absolutly must be responsive or it will be just bad... like airplay.

 

If they do it I hope they release new hardware, like a 16g with the A7 so we can run decent games.  Currently, the ATV2 is running a single core A4 and the ATV3 is running a single core A5. I dont know how much ram those have but it must be minimal.  The old box wont be able to run games with intense graphics, just very simple games like angry birds or candy crush.


Edited by herbapou - 1/23/14 at 11:27am
post #10 of 65
Long over due, hoping this rumor is true and that springtime is the launch date.
post #11 of 65
Holy crap this speculation is ill informed. Streaming games like ouya? What? Do they mean like OnLive? OnLive may have been on ouya, I don't remember. Otherwise all ouya did was play android games. Anyway, no no no no no. Apple is not at all about to do anything like OnLive. That sort of service is monstrous to set up and run and just makes no sense here.
Besides why would apple do ANY if this when they already tout playing games over Airplay?? The Apple TV doesn't have the graphics capabilities of an iPhone or iPad.
None of this comes close to making sense.
post #12 of 65
streaming seems stupid. cheap games on appleTV would rock though.
they could sell 16GB / 32GB / 64GB versions to increase profits at $99 / $199 / $299
post #13 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by franktinsley View Post

Holy crap this speculation is ill informed. Streaming games like ouya? What? Do they mean like OnLive? OnLive may have been on ouya, I don't remember. Otherwise all ouya did was play android games. Anyway, no no no no no. Apple is not at all about to do anything like OnLive. That sort of service is monstrous to set up and run and just makes no sense here.
Besides why would apple do ANY if this when they already tout playing games over Airplay?? The Apple TV doesn't have the graphics capabilities of an iPhone or iPad.
None of this comes close to making sense.

It's an update.
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post #14 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by franktinsley View Post

Holy crap this speculation is ill informed. Streaming games like ouya? What? Do they mean like OnLive? OnLive may have been on ouya, I don't remember. Otherwise all ouya did was play android games. Anyway, no no no no no. Apple is not at all about to do anything like OnLive. That sort of service is monstrous to set up and run and just makes no sense here.
Besides why would apple do ANY if this when they already tout playing games over Airplay?? The Apple TV doesn't have the graphics capabilities of an iPhone or iPad.
None of this comes close to making sense.

 

Airplay is the mother of crap for games....  its glitches, lags and its unresponsive.

 

and it does makes senses, they can download the game into the ATV SSD, then run it.  Not great for big games but for games below 250 mb its not a problem with the current high speed connections. Or maybe some games could download on a MAC itunes (if available) and the ATV gets it from the mac.

 

Onlive is a Virtual machine system where the games are runs on a server and the device just display whats is receiving. Since games involved constant game control inputs it must be worst than airplay.  Bad idea indeed.

post #15 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by starbird73 View Post

I forget, does Apple TV 2 (first black one) have Bluetooth? I know it doesn't support the tap for settings.

 

Yes, at least to some extent.

 

Settings -> General -> Bluetooth mentions pairing a keyboard, which I have done before, and I'm pretty sure I've paired a mouse or trackpad before. I've always assumed the remote is done via bluetooth, but I really don't know. I've also assumed that the iOS Remote app works via WiFI, but again, it could use Bluetooth instead. I'm not certain.

post #16 of 65

My gripes with Apple TV have more to do with feature decisions than with anything else:

• Why have the inventors of quicktime abandoned it's central usability innovation? ATV seems to ignore bandwidth limitations and only stream at full quality, even if the connection can't support it. I'm sure they want the best possible experience for users (high quality images) but ignoring basic usability at lower bandwidths is stupid. Let users ramp up to full quality as they are able to.

• On the other hand, ESPN's streams can be completely unwatchable even if you have decent bandwidth.

It just looks really bad for Apple when content from Amazon Prime streams fine over a slow connection, but nothing works works well on the ATV over the same connection!

• I'm never going to use NBA, NHL, or MLB. Let me remove them (or at least move them out of my way.)

• Let me rearrange my favorite radio stations (under "Radio") the way I want!

• How about a web browser? I'd like to view FreeTV.com or Amazon Prime on my ATV (if Apple will let it stream properly) and stop using my computer.

• Last, the UI aint that great. They could take a few pointers from some of their rivals' efforts. And yes the Apple remote really does suck.

 

I hope ATV gets better. I want to like it. But frankly, I keep thinking I should just use one of the hacks (suggestions?)

Presently I mostly use it to watch content that lives on my computer (only content in iTunes, iPhoto, etc.that Apple lets me watch) on my big TV. How disappointed can I really be? I only bought it because a refurb ATV was only a bit more expensive than a video cable for my iPt!

post #17 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by DESuserIGN View Post
 

 

Yes, at least to some extent.

 

Settings -> General -> Bluetooth mentions pairing a keyboard, which I have done before, and I'm pretty sure I've paired a mouse or trackpad before. I've always assumed the remote is done via bluetooth, but I really don't know. I've also assumed that the iOS Remote app works via WiFI, but again, it could use Bluetooth instead. I'm not certain.

The remote that comes with the AppleTV is IR, like most others.  I know this because I used it to train an IR universal remote.

 

Thompson

post #18 of 65
Hmm so possibly in March. And ios 7.1 expected in March. Possibly an event in March .
post #19 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post
 

 

I think I used a wireless keyboard on mine, if so it does have it.

 

that being said, its running a single core A4, so dont expect a lot of games to run smooth this. 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freshmaker View Post


Yes. I use the Apple bluetooth keyboard with mine. Much quicker than using the remote.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DESuserIGN View Post
 

 

Yes, at least to some extent.

 

Settings -> General -> Bluetooth mentions pairing a keyboard, which I have done before, and I'm pretty sure I've paired a mouse or trackpad before. I've always assumed the remote is done via bluetooth, but I really don't know. I've also assumed that the iOS Remote app works via WiFI, but again, it could use Bluetooth instead. I'm not certain.

 

Thanks for the replies. Forgot about the keyboard. I have been planning for about a year to grab a second Apple TV. Keep putting it off, strangely, since it's so cheap. But I keep telling myself at this point that there is bound to be a new one, so may as well wait.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post
 

The remote that comes with the AppleTV is IR, like most others.  I know this because I used it to train an IR universal remote.

 

Thompson

 

Correct. I trained my DirecTV remote to work with it. Made the mistake to use the volume buttons....  :D

post #20 of 65

Just let me connect a PS controller and bring on any game.

post #21 of 65
I was surprised to see OUYA in the article despite my inability to play video games. I have a feeling OnLive was the intended target. I was impressed by the business model and early entry of OUYA and thought it had some steam behind it by supporters. I am concerned to start reading things without the technical background here. I have trusted this resource in the past. Please keep paying attention to the details.
post #22 of 65

I love how the headlines for these articles aways include "may."  When I read them, I always add the implied "or it might not!"  AI does this even when they attribute this to someone.  Maybe for a change of pace they could try "[source]: Apple will [do something]" as the headline.  Otherwise virtually any headline is true.  "Apple may go bankrupt in 2016!"  "Apple may buy Disney!"

post #23 of 65

If you not a hard core gamer and do not care if your frame rate is 90+ (which the human eye can not detect) what would you rather have for a game system, a huge ugly xbox or playstate or this little thing sitting there which does movies and music really well and op you could probable save and sync you game states across your computer, ipad and iphone and play online with all your friend from any of your preferred iOS devices.

post #24 of 65
It will probably have a hardware decoder for Ultra HD and 4K (h.265 & ProRess), so 4K content can be streamed from iTunes, Netflix, etc. It will also have a faster performing APU(A7, why not) and latest Wireless to up AirPlays capabilities. I think the main processing engines for gaming will remain in the handhelds going through an enhanced Airplay with upscaling for 4K...
post #25 of 65
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post
If you not a hard core gamer and do not care if your frame rate is 90+ (which the human eye can not detect) what would you rather have for a game system, a huge ugly xbox or play state or this little thing sitting there which does movies and music really well

 

That’s the thing. We shouldn’t be rooting for the destruction of quality of everything.

 

Yes, the Xbox is huge, loud, bulky, and operates solely under the most evil principle ever devised. But it’s designed for… Okay, it’s not, but it pretends to be designed to present the most technically advanced graphics, etc. available to gaming today.

 

Convenience shouldn’t trump the push for greater quality.

 

It did with cameras, but we can stop it here.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #26 of 65

Overdue.  

 

Lemon Bon Bon.

You know, for a company that specializes in the video-graphics market, you'd think that they would offer top-of-the-line GPUs...

 

WITH THE NEW MAC PRO THEY FINALLY DID!  (But you bend over for it.)

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You know, for a company that specializes in the video-graphics market, you'd think that they would offer top-of-the-line GPUs...

 

WITH THE NEW MAC PRO THEY FINALLY DID!  (But you bend over for it.)

Reply
post #27 of 65

AppleTV and Roku are just a blip compared to the number of people using a PS, Xbox, or Wii to watch Netflix. I think improvements to AppleTV are a great idea and it could become a good casual gaming device in addition to streaming video content. I am very content with my new PS4 as I was with my old PS3 that has now been moved to a less watched TV in another room primarily for Netflix and as a Plexmedia server. I think Apple is missing out on a lot of potential customers by not offering an iTunes like app for PS4 at least. There are plenty of reasons why Apple would not likely work with Microsoft to offer an app on the Xbox but I think Sony and Nintendo would be good partners for iTunes content. I don't know of anyone that has an AppleTV or a Roku if they already have a game console since it can do all the same things in addition to playing games and much more. So that means there are a lot of potential new customers for iTunes content that are now stuck with Amazon and a few more as their only choice for content if they use a gaming console. Apple is losing out on a lot of potential customers. It is really no different than offering iTunes on Windows PCs. 

 

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. 

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post #28 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

AppleTV and Roku are just a blip compared to the number of people using a PS, Xbox, or Wii to watch Netflix. I think improvements to AppleTV are a great idea and it could become a good casual gaming device in addition to streaming video content. I am very content with my new PS4 as I was with my old PS3 that has now been moved to a less watched TV in another room primarily for Netflix and as a Plexmedia server. I think Apple is missing out on a lot of potential customers by not offering an iTunes like app for PS4 at least. There are plenty of reasons why Apple would not likely work with Microsoft to offer an app on the Xbox but I think Sony and Nintendo would be good partners for iTunes content. I don't know of anyone that has an AppleTV or a Roku if they already have a game console since it can do all the same things in addition to playing games and much more. So that means there are a lot of potential new customers for iTunes content that are now stuck with Amazon and a few more as their only choice for content if they use a gaming console. Apple is losing out on a lot of potential customers. It is really no different than offering iTunes on Windows PCs. 

There are far more iPhones sold per quarter than all of these put together, users just need to be convinced that their existing games will run. If Apple is smart the App Store on the TV will run already bought iPhone games. Out of the box.
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post #29 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post


There are far more iPhones sold per quarter than all of these put together, users just need to be convinced that their existing games will run. If Apple is smart the App Store on the TV will run already bought iPhone games. Out of the box.

Who cares how many iPhones are sold? We are comparing the number of AppleTV's and Rokus sold vs the combined number of game consoles. How are you going to get iTunes content on your TV easily? How would you play those iOS games without an AppleTV? Why would you want to buy an AppleTV if you already have a game console? You wouldn't plain and simple. My PS4 already allows me to play games and view content so the only option to sell any iTunes video  content to me would be to add an iTunes app to my PS4. 

 

If you already have an AppleTV you can use Airplay or iTunes but what about the hundreds of millions who do not have an AppleTV. You completely missed the point. 

 

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. 

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Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. 

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post #30 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

Who cares how many iPhones are sold? We are comparing the number of AppleTV's and Rokus sold vs the combined number of game consoles. How are you going to get iTunes content on your TV easily? How would you play those iOS games without an AppleTV? Why would you want to buy an AppleTV if you already have a game console? You wouldn't plain and simple. My PS4 already allows me to play games and view content so the only option to sell any iTunes video  content to me would be to add an iTunes app to my PS4. 

If you already have an AppleTV you can use Airplay or iTunes but what about the hundreds of millions who do not have an AppleTV. You completely missed the point. 

The point I was making is that iPhone users with existing games on their iPhones will be the major market for a new Apple TV which can run their existing games. Apple are not in the business of selling other peoples hardware. A small fraction of iPhone sales in any month converting to Apple TV as well and you have a market much bigger than the existing console market.
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post #31 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

The point I was making is that iPhone users with existing games on their iPhones will be the major market for a new Apple TV which can run their existing games. Apple are not in the business of selling other peoples hardware. A small fraction of iPhone sales in any month converting to Apple TV as well and you have a market much bigger than the existing console market.

I doubt that.

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/microsoft-console-still-accounts-for-42-of-the-total-video-games-market/0115826
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post #32 of 65

looking forward to the update hope i don't have to buy new hardware

ac would be great

but i think expand BT to allow headsets, earbuds  their are many that need improved  hearing access

voice control would rock

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post #33 of 65
I would SWAGestimate:
  • an A7X APU
  • up to 16 GB RAM
  • up to 32 GB SSD
  • 802.11ac WiFi
  • Bluetooth 4.0
  • HDMI IN
  • HDMI OUT
  • 4K Video
  • Crossload from iTunes
  • Stream from iCloud
  • Interface Home Server
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post #34 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

If they can keep both the games and its data in the cloud it would solve a lot of issues and allow to built a very low cost game console. Its a good idea *IF* they actually dont "stream" the games but just "stored" the games in iclould then download the game you want to play. Streaming means we get in VM's so it implied costly servers to setup.  VM's are good to replace corporate PC's, but games requires too much interaction between the client and the server and games absolutly must be responsive or it will be just bad... like airplay.

If they do it I hope they release new hardware, like a 16g with the A7 so we can run decent games.  Currently, the ATV2 is running a single core A4 and the ATV3 is running a single core A5. I dont know how much ram those have but it must be minimal.  The old box wont be able to run games with intense graphics, just very simple games like angry birds or candy crush.
They should have 1/2 gb of ram, yet these things need a replacement like a SSD drive like the original HDD. These will obviosly have A7 chips and $150 or more price point when out.
post #35 of 65

We're talking about the future. If Apple get say 30% of households with iPhones to buy an Apple TV for games it will out sell the consoles. MS sold a record 3.9M xboxes last Q, Apple is reckoned to have sold 50M iPhones.
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post #36 of 65
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post
I would SWAGestimate:
  • an A7X APU
  • up to 16 GB RAM
  • up to 32 GB SSD
  • 802.11ac WiFi
  • Bluetooth 4.0
  • HDMI IN
  • HDMI OUT
  • 4K Video
  • Crossload from iTunes
  • Stream from iCloud
  • Interface Home Server

 

I sincerely doubt HDMI in, but it’d be great if A7 or whatever would decode h.265.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #37 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post


The point I was making is that iPhone users with existing games on their iPhones will be the major market for a new Apple TV which can run their existing games. Apple are not in the business of selling other peoples hardware. A small fraction of iPhone sales in any month converting to Apple TV as well and you have a market much bigger than the existing console market.

 

You still don't get it. I am an iPhone owner and also own an iPad and a PS4. What possible reason would any console owner and I am including all PS3, PS4, Xbox 360, Xbox One, and Wii which combined is a lot of people, ever have to buy an AppleTV if they already have one of those consoles?

 

Apple makes a version of iTunes for Windows PC's and you completely ignored that. If they can make a version for Windows then why not an app for game consoles? Apple would make money off selling content on these platforms just like they do on an AppleTV. 

 

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. 

Reply

 

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. 

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post #38 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

You still don't get it. I am an iPhone owner and also own an iPad and a PS4. What possible reason would any console owner and I am including all PS3, PS4, Xbox 360, Xbox One, and Wii which combined is a lot of people, ever have to buy an AppleTV if they already have one of those consoles?

Apple makes a version of iTunes for Windows PC's and you completely ignored that. If they can make a version for Windows then why not an app for game consoles? Apple would make money off selling content on these platforms just like they do on an AppleTV. 

I don't know how remedial I can make my explanation. Here goes.

The Apple TV Games console is. Not. For. People. With. Existing. Consoles. But. For. The. Far. Greater. Number. Of. iPhone. Users. Who. Will. Be. Tempted. Into. Buying. A. Console. Which. Plays. Natively. Their. Existing. iPhone. Games.

In other words you are not the only person in the world. I don't have an xBox, PS or Wii but would buy an Apple TV which streamed content and played my existing iDevice games selection.

They started to sell iTunes content on Windows to encourage the takeoff of iPod and (later) iPhone devices to Windows users. The model is always content sells hardware. Else they would put iTunes in google play.
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post #39 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

I don't know how remedial I can make my explanation. Here goes.

The Apple TV Games console is. Not. For. People. With. Existing. Consoles. But. For. The. Far. Greater. Number. Of. iPhone. Users. Who. Will. Be. Tempted. Into. Buying. A. Console. Which. Plays. Natively. Their. Existing. iPhone. Games.

In other words you are not the only person in the world. I don't have an xBox, PS or Wii but would buy an Apple TV which streamed content and played my existing iDevice games selection.

They started to sell iTunes content on Windows to encourage the takeoff of iPod and (later) iPhone devices to Windows users. The model is always content sells hardware. Else they would put iTunes in google play.

Funny 😂
We have a Wii that hasn't been touched in almost 2 years, kids & wife are gamers but prefer playing iOS games on iPads, iTouch, and my new iPhone
post #40 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

The point I was making is that iPhone users with existing games on their iPhones will be the major market for a new Apple TV which can run their existing games. Apple are not in the business of selling other peoples hardware. A small fraction of iPhone sales in any month converting to Apple TV as well and you have a market much bigger than the existing console market.

You still don't get it. I am an iPhone owner and also own an iPad and a PS4. What possible reason would any console owner and I am including all PS3, PS4, Xbox 360, Xbox One, and Wii which combined is a lot of people, ever have to buy an AppleTV if they already have one of those consoles?

Apple makes a version of iTunes for Windows PC's and you completely ignored that. If they can make a version for Windows then why not an app for game consoles? Apple would make money off selling content on these platforms just like they do on an AppleTV. 

What if an AppleTV could offer everything a PS4 or Xbox One has plus...
  • More games
  • Better games
  • Better performance
  • The Apple ecosystem

Here's a quote from an article from June 2013, discussing the PS and Xbox upgrades.

Quote:
The Why:

To get at why Microsoft and Sony chose AMD, you need to start with the content needs. Both makers were looking for a way to increase the console “footprint”, increase the amount of apps, and lower the cost of software development. The Xbox One and the PS4 are designed to do a lot more than games. They designed the consoles to be the future hub for all home entertainment and home automation and control. To effectively do this, they will need hundreds of complex apps that are relatively straight-forward to code. Therefore, you need to start with an application processor architecture that supports this, and it’s not Power architecture.

The apps processors that powers today’s Xbox 360 and the PS3 are based on the Power architecture. It delivered decent performance seven years ago, but it is much more difficult to program than the ARM (ARM Holdings PLC), MIPS (Imagination Technologies Group PLC), or X86 (AMD and Intel INTC -0.71%). Additionally, the technological investment in ARM, MIPS and X86 architectures and ecosystems dwarfed PowerPC over the last decade, rendering Power obsolete for the required performance per watt. In a world where your console needs to have as many apps as your smartphone, the only answer was ARM, MIPS or X86.


Quote:
The What:

My sources have confirmed for me that both Sony and Microsoft felt that MIPS didn’t have the right size developer ecosystem or the horsepower to power the new consoles. Then it came down to ARM versus X86 architecture. I am told there was a technical “bake-off”, where prototype silicon was tested against each other across a myriad of application-based and synthetic benchmarks. At the end of the bake-off, ARM was deemed as not having the right kind of horsepower and that its 64-bit architecture wasn’t ready soon enough. 64-bit was important as it maximized memory addressability, and the next gen console needed to run multiple apps, operating systems and hypervisors. ARM-based architectures will soon get as powerful as AMD’s Jaguar cores, but not when Sony or Microsoft needed them for their new consoles.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/patrickmoorhead/2013/06/26/the-real-reasons-microsoft-and-sony-chose-amd-for-consoles/


ARM-based architectures will soon get as powerful as AMD’s Jaguar cores...

I suspect that that day will have arrived with an A7X APU on an AppleTV.
Edited by Dick Applebaum - 1/23/14 at 4:21pm
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