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Apple pulls Bitcoin wallet app Blockchain from iOS App Store

post #1 of 67
Thread Starter 
Apple on Wednesday removed Blockchain from the App Store due to an "unresolved issue," leaving some 120,000 users of the only iOS-compatible Bitcoin trading and storage app in the lurch.

Blockchain
Image teasing Blockchain's redesigned website shows iPhone app. | Source: Blockchain via Twitter


Blockchain CEO Nicolas Cary told Wired that Apple did not offer a detailed explanation as to why the app was pulled, saying only that the title was "removed from the App Store due to an unresolved issue."

With over one million users worldwide using software on numerous operating systems, Blockchain is touted as the "world's most popular" wallet service for bitcoins.

Apple's move may not come as a surprise to some as the company has a history of denying app submissions that allow users to trade the world's most popular digital currency.

In November, an iOS Bitcoin wallet app from San Francisco startup Coinbase was removed, while another from Gliph was forced to disable transactions in order to stay in the App Store, reports Bloomberg.

Being a peer-to-peer "virtual currency" that exists only in the digital realm, Bitcoin has been met with resistance from governments loath to recognize it as a legitimate form of money. Most Bitcoin trading occurs online, but exchanges that convert bitcoins to traditional currencies like dollars and euros do exist.

While the U.S. does not have written laws against the trade of bitcoins, Apple's multinational App Store requires developers adhere to the laws of the territory in which their apps are offered. This does not explain, however, why the Blockchain app was yanked from all areas after being active in the App Store debut its debut in 2012.

The apparent demise of Blockchain for iOS leaves Bitcoin traders no recourse on Apple's mobile operating system, though price tracking apps like Coinbits and Bitcoin Tracker are still available.
post #2 of 67
You say, 'no recourse'... Can Bitcoin traders not use Safari?
post #3 of 67

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post #4 of 67
An observation: If Apple is really heavily curating it's appstore, closely examining every app before before it's made available then how did bitcoin apps ever get approved in the first place.
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post #5 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

An observation: If Apple is really heavily curating it's appstore, closely examining every app before before it's made available then how did bitcoin apps ever get approved in the first place.


Grey area? Apple trying to decide if they can get in trouble for currency transactions done through their devices?

post #6 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

An observation: If Apple is really heavily curating it's appstore, closely examining every app before before it's made available then how did bitcoin apps ever get approved in the first place.

I wonder if Apple is not treating the Blockchain app as a commodities buying app, or a banking app and is treating it like Amazon's e-book app? I see Bitcoins more like a currency or commodity (like gold or silver), or even like stocks. Maybe their app has been miscategorized by the app dev, or maybe the Blockchain app duplicates functionality in Apple's iWallet. It would be nice if the iWallet app had Bitcoin integration and used iTunes accounts as a form of storage for crypto currencies.

Apple could really revolutionize crypto if they've designed iWallet right. Could greatly simplify reporting for use in taxes also...another very fuzzy area for crypto coin holders and the IRS has made no decisions on how they will treat crypto coin buy-sell activity.
Edited by SpamSandwich - 2/6/14 at 4:20am

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post #7 of 67

I have mined a few Bitcoins, just for the technical challenge of it, but never spent any. I honestly don't think there's much of a future in it. Digital currencies and payment systems are clearly the future, but the winning crypto coin will be one backed by gold or by a government, none of the current ones. I think Apple is right to keep out of it until it settles down a bit, and the picture is a bit clearer.

post #8 of 67
This article inspired me to finally register to comment...
I'd like to see a reason for Apple removing this app. It could be that the security of the Blockchain wallet app was pretty low once the phone was unlocked.
However, I'm sure it is more to do with the fact that they're scared of the micro-payment / digital currency competition that is coming like a high-speed train towards them... and everyone else. For this reason, I think they could regret decisions like this. Something big is happening and it can't be stopped.
post #9 of 67

Just because it has been pulled from the store, doesn't stop existing users from continuing to use it.

New users will just have to JB their device and find a cydia download.

post #10 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilution View Post
 

Just because it has been pulled from the store, doesn't stop existing users from continuing to use it.

New users will just have to JB their device and find a cydia download.


Apple contends that doing so is a criminal offence under the DMCA. You also violate any license agreement you had with Apple and especially if you are a developer.

 

Is it really worth it? In the US I wouldn't take the risk.

post #11 of 67
My first thought was that these BTC wallets were duplicating functionality in Apple's yet-to-be-announced iOS wallet.

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post #12 of 67
Apple Insider commenting system sucks, you lose the comment after you login
post #13 of 67

Apple lost the jailbrake as DCMA issue in court.

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post #14 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyberzombie View Post
 

Apple lost the jailbrake as DCMA issue in court.


Did they? I thought that there was just a temporary exception passed.

post #15 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

This has really angered a lot of Bitcoiners: http://www.coindesk.com/apple-removes-blockchain-bitcoin-wallet-from-app-stores/

Oh noes, angry bitcoiners. There's only 79 comments. I wonder if these people belong to the top 100:

The top 100 bitcoiners own over 20% of all the bitcoins. Bitcoin inequality!

http://bitcoinrichlist.com/top100

One of those wallets is the Winkelvoss twins that made their money suing Facebook for stealing their idea. I think it's lower down though ($20m?). One of them is the wallet belonging to the FBI seized from the drug trading market. It might be incorrectly labeled as the top one but there could be more than one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich 
I wonder if Apple is not treating the Blockchain app as a commodities buying app, or a banking app and is treating it like Amazon's e-book app?

AI has a link to the guidelines. The section on currencies doesn't quite cover it exactly but it might be about external purchases:

"Apps utilizing a system other than the In App Purchase API (IAP) to purchase content, functionality, or services in an app will be rejected"

http://photos.appleinsider.com/App%20Store%20Review%20Guidelines%20-%20App%20Store%20Resource%20Centerai.pdf

Paypal apps or banking apps break this rule too but it's harder to use those for money laundering. Aren't bitcoiners just able to use a website to handle bitcoin transactions anyway, maybe a web app?
post #16 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

Oh noes, angry bitcoiners. There's only 79 comments. I wonder if these people belong to the top 100:

The top 100 bitcoiners own over 20% of all the bitcoins. Bitcoin inequality!

http://bitcoinrichlist.com/top100

One of those wallets is the Winkelvoss twins that made their money suing Facebook for stealing their idea. I think it's lower down though ($20m?). One of them is the wallet belonging to the FBI seized from the drug trading market. It might be incorrectly labeled as the top one but there could be more than one.
AI has a link to the guidelines. The section on currencies doesn't quite cover it exactly but it might be about external purchases:

"Apps utilizing a system other than the In App Purchase API (IAP) to purchase content, functionality, or services in an app will be rejected"

http://photos.appleinsider.com/App%20Store%20Review%20Guidelines%20-%20App%20Store%20Resource%20Centerai.pdf

Paypal apps or banking apps break this rule too but it's harder to use those for money laundering. Aren't bitcoiners just able to use a website to handle bitcoin transactions anyway, maybe a web app?

Blockchain.info just announced their millionth wallet, so they aren't small potatoes and they aren't the only place to trade. It's my understanding that BTC-e is now the biggest.

The money laundering comment doesn't make sense because rules from FinCEN already limit that kind of activity with their "know your customer" requirements. Unless one buys Bitcoin using cash in-person from a seller, there is no real anonymity. There are crypto currencies that are being created to have complete anonymity, but Bitcoin and the other most popular cryptos are not that.

The various stockbrokers apps also do not require IAP functionality, therefore my guess is iWallet (at least as described in their recently revealed patent) may offer duplicate functionality.

Finally, lest you sneer further at Bitcoiners...I know someone personally who got in early and will soon pay off his house with the proceeds from the sale of his Bitcoin. Not bad for his (approximately) $1,000 investment.
Edited by SpamSandwich - 2/6/14 at 8:48am

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post #17 of 67
It is very easy for many people to say and write Apple should do this, Apple should do that, Apple should do the other, Apple should, Apple should, Apple should...

A little while ago TechCrunch had an article blasting Apple about removing another bit coin app from the App Store. The next day a country declared bit coins illegal. TechCrunch did not update the article nor write another article about the illegality issues of bit coin support. TechCrunch just wanted Apple to support bit coins and illegality issues be damned.

Apple cannot operate that way.

To LozBlanko, welcome! I doubt Apple fears any coming digital currency as long as the currency is legal in every country Apple operates in. It would be interesting to see you and others start your own businesses then start supporting the bit coin currency as you want Apple to do. Then let interested readers know of your experiences. Obviously you think Apple has dropped an important ball. You could pick up the ball and show Apple exactly what it missed out on.
post #18 of 67

another way to look at is the fact that Apple may be getting into the payment processing system of their own and bitcoin is more or less a payment processing system of it own. Right now it is more of an investment in what it could be and lots of people will loose in the deal since people are buying in high and it is not stable so it makes it hard to buy things with it since each day you have no clue what it is going to cost you.

post #19 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

another way to look at is the fact that Apple may be getting into the payment processing system of their own and bitcoin is more or less a payment processing system of it own. Right now it is more of an investment in what it could be and lots of people will loose in the deal since people are buying in high and it is not stable so it makes it hard to buy things with it since each day you have no clue what it is going to cost you.

The volatility of crypto currencies is not really an issue. Businesses are using Bitcoin payment processors like BitPay (there are others).

In my opinion, crypto currencies are great for removing central bankers and politicians from the manipulation of money and also they reduce the costs of transmitting money (a la Western Union) to almost nothing.

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post #20 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

My first thought was that these BTC wallets were duplicating functionality in Apple's yet-to-be-announced iOS wallet.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post
 

another way to look at is the fact that Apple may be getting into the payment processing system of their own and bitcoin is more or less a payment processing system of it own. Right now it is more of an investment in what it could be and lots of people will loose in the deal since people are buying in high and it is not stable so it makes it hard to buy things with it since each day you have no clue what it is going to cost you.

 

Yeah, I think it's pretty clear it's due to their pending own mobile payment system.  They also covered their bases for banning such not exactly objectionable apps by the rule that if an app's activity is illegal anywhere in the world they have the right to ban it, so they can choose when to ban or let apps slide according to their needs.

 

 It's their store, they can do what they want.  Might be shutting themselves out of a slice of the pie, as Bitcoin has taken off enough that they may have set a standard format that could keep Apple close to the starting gate, similar to what Apple was able to do with the iTunes Store.  And I can see it being a dealkiller for those who use it and possibly that will quintuple in size in two years.  

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post
 

I have mined a few Bitcoins, just for the technical challenge of it, but never spent any. I honestly don't think there's much of a future in it. Digital currencies and payment systems are clearly the future, but the winning crypto coin will be one backed by gold or by a government, none of the current ones. I think Apple is right to keep out of it until it settles down a bit, and the picture is a bit clearer.

 

 

Now you've got me feeling like doing a little also, just for jollies.  Agree with your thoughts on the rest.

post #21 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

The money laundering comment doesn't make sense because rules from FinCEN already limit that kind of activity with their "know your customer" requirements. Unless one buys Bitcoin using cash in-person from a seller, there is no real anonymity. There are crypto currencies that are being created to have complete anonymity, but Bitcoin and the other most popular cryptos are not that.

There's a recent case involving cash:

http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/4/5374172/the-coin-prince-charlie-shrem-bitinstant-bitcoin-money-laundering-scandal

They got caught obviously so money laundering likely isn't the biggest issue but the transfer of bitcoins from person to person is pretty anonymous. People could easily be buying illegal drugs from their iPhone. There's no other payment method that would allow this so easily.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Finally, lest you sneer further at Bitcoiners...I know someone personally who got in early and will soon pay off his house with the proceeds from the sale of his Bitcoin. Not bad for his (approximately) $1,000 investment.

The returns are amazing for the people selling their coins for safe government-backed fiat currency. It's the people buying them (the new bitcoiners) that have to worry. Very volatile to go up 100x in 1 year:

https://blockchain.info/charts/market-price?timespan=all

Show me the savvy investors who are buying bitcoins right now.
post #22 of 67

It's one thing to have a law on the books. It's another to enforce said law. I HIGHLY doubt an FBI SWAT team will be kicking your door in because you jailbroke your phone and downloaded an app of cydia. On the warranty front, you're screwed but that's a different issue altogether. You can get sued, but if you don't have much to begin with, that's a moot point.

post #23 of 67
Quote:

 

 

Interesting story, involving someone not necessarily interested in dealing in hiding his own profits but clearly moved into that dubious area where others would have kept the door shut.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

They got caught obviously so money laundering likely isn't the biggest issue but the transfer of bitcoins from person to person is pretty anonymous. People could easily be buying illegal drugs from their iPhone. There's no other payment method that would allow this so easily.
 

 

Even if it's not as completely anonymous as systems set up for encrypted, anonymous transactions, perception counts for plenty.  It's so well known for doing what it does that many probably assume it's the safest way to launder, that they can make it as anonymous as needed, even if that's not entirely so.  Besides, if it takes cash in person to achieve it, that's in no way an inconvenience to someone in that position, so that's not a dissuading factor.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

The returns are amazing for the people selling their coins for safe government-backed fiat currency. It's the people buying them (the new bitcoiners) that have to worry. Very volatile to go up 100x in 1 year:
 

 

There's a good line in one of the comments after the story that says a lot about why it's not due for a long life:

 

 "That sort of highlights the problem with bits. Its being seen as a get-rich-quick investment rather than a “money”"

 

Those who actually do want digital currency, especially now that the price is so high and can lower but more importantly crash at any time now that it may be too high for its health, will look elsewhere, and leave Bitcoins to the speculators.

post #24 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post
 

I have mined a few Bitcoins, just for the technical challenge of it, but never spent any. I honestly don't think there's much of a future in it. Digital currencies and payment systems are clearly the future, but the winning crypto coin will be one backed by gold or by a government, none of the current ones. I think Apple is right to keep out of it until it settles down a bit, and the picture is a bit clearer.

Why does a crypto currency need to be a commodity-based currency, backed by physical goods?
 

How could a crypto currency be "backed" by a government?   What would that mean?

post #25 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post
 

I have mined a few Bitcoins, just for the technical challenge of it, but never spent any. I honestly don't think there's much of a future in it. Digital currencies and payment systems are clearly the future, but the winning crypto coin will be one backed by gold or by a government, none of the current ones. I think Apple is right to keep out of it until it settles down a bit, and the picture is a bit clearer.


Right on, current Bitcoins are a suck you in scam.

 

Hopefully the follow on is a real currency backed Netcoin, which is definitely needed.

Come on Gov banks, get up to date with the real need for Netcoins.

post #26 of 67
This is why you don't allow a single entity to control what you can and can't have. "App stores" are just as evil as NSA spying.

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post #27 of 67

Bitcoins are a scam and have DEEP connections with money laudering, tax fraud, drug cartels, and murders.

 

Why the F would Apple want anything to do with that?

 

No one is regulating Bitcoins.  The creator of Bitcoins is not even known.  He could easily create himself billions of Bitcoins and no one would be the wiser.  That would instantly tank the market and make Bitcoins worthless.

post #28 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by bottleworks View Post

This is why you don't allow a single entity to control what you can and can't have. "App stores" are just as evil as NSA spying.

 

lol.

 

Thats like saying a video game system like an Xbox should not be able to control what games can be played on it?

 

Go buy a Nexus18 and report back to us.

post #29 of 67
Originally Posted by bottleworks View Post
This is why you don't allow a single entity to control what you can and can't have. "App stores" are just as evil as NSA spying.

 

Everyone needs at least one laugh a day. This was almost mine. Thanks.

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post #30 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SudoNym View Post

How could a crypto currency be "backed" by a government?   What would that mean?

They can't be backed by a government because the supply is solely controlled by a computer algorithm. A computer advance or flaw in the algorithm could flood the market with new coins and devalue the others. The supply of fiat currency is controlled by the central banks - the base amount is called M0:

http://money.howstuffworks.com/how-much-money-is-in-the-world.htm

The fact crypto-currency supply isn't controlled by people is seen as a good and bad thing. The people who see governments as inherently corrupt see these types of currency as a way to remove their control. That control, however, usually offers some stability.

The biggest instability bitcoin has is that people need to believe it's going to work. It's like the old saying "whether you think you can or you can't, you're right". The more people trust bitcoins and trade with them, the more stable they'll be. The less they trust them, the more volatile they'll be. This doesn't happen with a currency that is legal tender because no matter if people don't trust it, everyone uses it to pay taxes so that constant high volume of transactions keeps it more steady.

The relative currency value in different countries fluctuates and this is how forex traders make their money but the changes are so small that they leverage their bets by as much as 100:1. A fractional percentage shift against them can wipe out their bet but one that works for them can bring significant returns. That's the other thing about digital currency, it has no borders. 1BTC in America = 1BTC in China but how do they determine its value relative to groceries unless they hold it to a local currency? Bitcoins will have to be traded in retail outlets meaning every retail outlet has to have internet connectivity and there's the verification time for transactions:

http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/3562/will-transaction-confirmation-time-be-reduced-as-the-network-size-increases
post #31 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


They can't be backed by a government because the supply is solely controlled by a computer algorithm. A computer advance or flaw in the algorithm could flood the market with new coins and devalue the others. The supply of fiat currency is controlled by the central banks - the base amount is called M0:

http://money.howstuffworks.com/how-much-money-is-in-the-world.htm

The fact crypto-currency supply isn't controlled by people is seen as a good and bad thing. The people who see governments as inherently corrupt see these types of currency as a way to remove their control. That control, however, usually offers some stability.

The biggest instability bitcoin has is that people need to believe it's going to work. It's like the old saying "whether you think you can or you can't, you're right". The more people trust bitcoins and trade with them, the more stable they'll be. The less they trust them, the more volatile they'll be. This doesn't happen with a currency that is legal tender because no matter if people don't trust it, everyone uses it to pay taxes so that constant high volume of transactions keeps it more steady.

The relative currency value in different countries fluctuates and this is how forex traders make their money but the changes are so small that they leverage their bets by as much as 100:1. A fractional percentage shift against them can wipe out their bet but one that works for them can bring significant returns. That's the other thing about digital currency, it has no borders. 1BTC in America = 1BTC in China but how do they determine its value relative to groceries unless they hold it to a local currency? Bitcoins will have to be traded in retail outlets meaning every retail outlet has to have internet connectivity and there's the verification time for transactions:

http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/3562/will-transaction-confirmation-time-be-reduced-as-the-network-size-increases

 

great info. Thanks

post #32 of 67
post #33 of 67

Whatever happened to "Think Different"? I think Apple abandoned that a long time ago regarding the iPhone, iPod, and iPads by not allowing people to download and run whatever they want on the devices for which they paid. If you can't do what you want to do with the device you bought, then you really don't own it. Do you?

 

Apples new catch phrase is "Think Suppression".

post #34 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallwheels View Post
 

Whatever happened to "Think Different"? I think Apple abandoned that a long time ago regarding the iPhone, iPod, and iPads by not allowing people to download and run whatever they want on the devices for which they paid. If you can't do what you want to do with the device you bought, then you really don't own it. Do you?

 

Apples new catch phrase is "Think Suppression".

 

Then you open yourself and others to spyware, malware, ect.

 

If you don't like Apples closed system go buy a Nexus19.  Personally I love not having to worry about virus and spyware attacks.

 

Bitcoin is a grey area right now.  It may be legal in the US or it may not.  Why would Apple want to be associated with such a shady market? Some of the biggest Bitcoin supports have been found guilty of tax fraud, drug distribution, human trafficing, murder, ect.  Until the DOJ fully confirms Bitcoins legal status Apple won't risk its $500B company on it.

post #35 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


Oh noes, angry bitcoiners. There's only 79 comments. I wonder if these people belong to the top 100:

The top 100 bitcoiners own over 20% of all the bitcoins. Bitcoin inequality!

http://bitcoinrichlist.com/top100
 

There are a hell of a lot more then 79 comments on Reddit.  One thread now deleted had over 1000 (that in itself is a story). 

 

The response from Blockchain.info was MUCH BETTER then what was quoted here:

 

http://blog.blockchain.info/2014/02/06/blockchain-response-to-apple/

 

They quoted Apple:

“Here’s to the crazy ones. The misfits. The rebels. The troublemakers. The round pegs in the square holes. The ones who see things differently. They’re not fond of rules. And they have no respect for the status quo. You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them. About the only thing you can’t do is ignore them. Because they change things. They push the human race forward.”Apple, Inc.

post #36 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

Bitcoins are a scam and have DEEP connections with money laudering, tax fraud, drug cartels, and murders.

 

Why the F would Apple want anything to do with that?

 

No one is regulating Bitcoins.  The creator of Bitcoins is not even known.  He could easily create himself billions of Bitcoins and no one would be the wiser.  That would instantly tank the market and make Bitcoins worthless.

Obviously to a Bitcoin user you don't understand how they work.

 

Bitcoin should remain free and outside of governmental interference. The Federal Reserve must really hate it because it takes away their control.

 

Bitcoins are every bit as real as electronic dollars. When you get your pay check is it real money? No. It is a slip of paper with numbers on it that must be given to a bank. If you have direct deposit from your employer is that real money? They just tell their bank to send some electronic signal to your bank. Do you shop with paper and metal money or do you use a debit or credit card? Are you getting the picture? If you have electronic Bitcoins and someone else is willing to take some of them for a purchase, then your Bitcoins are just as good as your debit card, credit card, or check.

 

Stop giving power to the financial industry. Stop giving power to the banking industry. Stop giving power to the Federal Reserve private banking system. They destroyed our country and continue to only work for the wealthy. Switch to Bitcoins. The more of us that do it the weaker our oppressors will be.

post #37 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeltsBear View Post

 

They quoted Apple:

“Here’s to the crazy ones. The misfits. The rebels. The troublemakers. The round pegs in the square holes. The ones who see things differently. They’re not fond of rules. And they have no respect for the status quo. You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them. About the only thing you can’t do is ignore them. Because they change things. They push the human race forward.”Apple, Inc.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Apple has become a hypocritical company. They promote this ideal but don't actually follow this ideal.

post #38 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

 

Bitcoin is a grey area right now.  It may be legal in the US or it may not.  Why would Apple want to be associated with such a shady market? Some of the biggest Bitcoin supports have been found guilty of tax fraud, drug distribution, human trafficing, murder, ect.  Until the DOJ fully confirms Bitcoins legal status Apple won't risk its $500B company on it.

 

It's currently legal in the U.S. but across the board illegal in Russia and China and all over the map everywhere else.  The tax aspect is very interesting.  Some countries have stated they recognize it as legit and will tax Bitcoin transactions, and some are going so far as to not recognize it as currency but will tax it anyway.  If that means the same as stocks, with "capital gains" for profits from transactions and mining considered "earned income" (or something like that) that's a big bite that big users will bristle at.  One thing's for certain: it will only take a few high profile cases with criminal elements to bring the hammer down hard, even if it's just for tax evasion and not drug money laundering, for better or worse. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallwheels View Post
 

Bitcoins are every bit as real as electronic dollars. When you get your pay check is it real money? No. It is a slip of paper with numbers on it that must be given to a bank. If you have direct deposit from your employer is that real money? They just tell their bank to send some electronic signal to your bank. Do you shop with paper and metal money or do you use a debit or credit card? Are you getting the picture? If you have electronic Bitcoins and someone else is willing to take some of them for a purchase, then your Bitcoins are just as good as your debit card, credit card, or check.

 

Well, just because they're as real as the rest doesn't mean they're similar in all ways that matter.   They are highly speculative, and currency, though the value can rise and fall, is not.  As long as speculation continues to be such a huge part of it it has less chance of fulfilling the role of an "everyman" 's currency.  The two are mutually exclusive in the long run, I would think.

post #39 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlandd View Post
 

 

It's currently legal in the U.S. but across the board illegal in Russia and China and all over the map everywhere else. 

 

 

This is OUTRIGHT false.  It is not illegal in China.  Banks are not allowed to process cash deposits for Bitcoin. 

In Russia the situation is grey, the central bank of Russia has said it is illegal, but the courts have said no such thing. 

Most countries are treating it like a foreign currency. 

post #40 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeltsBear View Post
 

 

This is OUTRIGHT false.  It is not illegal in China.  Banks are not allowed to process cash deposits for Bitcoin. 

In Russia the situation is grey, the central bank of Russia has said it is illegal, but the courts have said no such thing. 

Most countries are treating it like a foreign currency. 

 

You are correct about China.  There have been news reports as recently as yesterday, including Reuters, saying it is, hence my writing.  I apologize for passing along the inaccuracy.  See their language here:

 

http://rbth.ru/business/2014/02/05/russia_becomes_the_second_country_to_ban_bitcoin_33871.html

 

http://rt.com/business/bitcoin-russia-use-ban-942/

 

As far as Russia, the article quotes the Prosecutor General:

 

"Russia’s official currency is the ruble. The introduction of other types of currencies and the issue of money surrogates are banned,” the statement says, meaning that cryptocurrencies - the most popular of which is bitcoin - cannot be used by Russian citizens or corporations.

Members of the meeting also outlined recommendations on how to prevent the use of virtual currencies."

Which means that they haven't figured out yet how to apply their laws to it, but it's banned, using it is not permitted.   They're taking a pretty cut and dry stance pending a court ruling.  I understand the technicality of it not quite being spelled out by the courts yet, but that's not the Bank saying it's illegal, it's the Prosecutor General basically laying it out without using the "I" word.

In China it's half banned.  Being banned among financial institutions (and by the country's largest e-commerce business) puts it in a precarious place, but I understand that as long as it's not illegal in all areas it's not illegal.  Russia, IMO, is a different thing.

Respectfully,

j

 

 

 

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