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The many (alleged) lives of Microsoft's Office for iOS - Page 2

post #41 of 63

Well it seems that Tableau IS coming natively to the Mac:

 

http://www.tableausoftware.com/public/blog/2013/09/tableau-public-mac-2130

 

I just checked the exhibitor listing at MacWorld (coming up in SF at the end of this month) and they are not listed as exhibitors.  Too bad as that would have been a great venue for them to announce/release the product.

 

http://www.macworldiworld.com/expo-hall/

 

It is VERY encouraging that high end data visualization programs like Tableau are moving to the Mac.  I for one will be supporting them when they do.

post #42 of 63
I've already made the switch to Pages, Numbers, and Keynote. In fact, I made the switch to Keynote years ago; it's always been better than PowerPoint. As for Pages, it's so much better at page layout than Word. Images and typography are so much better in Pages. Excel is the only program I though I'd miss, but when I discovered the Filter feature in Numbers works as well as Excel, that's all I needed to know to make the switch. In addition, Numbers shows Excel how a spreadsheet interface should be designed for the iPad. Most people fear that they would miss Excel, but if you take a deep look at Numbers, it's really not a beginner program. MS Office has lots of handy features, but if you hang in there with Pages, Numbers, and Keynote, it's quite possible that they will work for you. One other important thing: Pages, Numbers, and Keynote are now free; MS Office now cost $70 or $100 per year depending on which version you get.
post #43 of 63
The interesting aspect of the argument for Microsoft Excel is that there are much better applications for data analytics than Microsoft Excel but the ability to perform data analytics is supposedly the killer feature. There is absolutely no need for Microsoft Excel for Apple iOS.
post #44 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by foad View Post

While Google Docs is gaining traction on Office, it by no means has the market penetration the Microsoft still has. Google Docs has a ways to go.

The other thing to think about is that maybe Microsoft might have a new approach with their new CEO. He was instrumental in their cloud services, which have been very well received. Maybe there might be a more productive strategy at the company.

 

Google Doc's is a joke, unless you like using Office 1998.

post #45 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnie T View Post

I've already made the switch to Pages, Numbers, and Keynote. In fact, I made the switch to Keynote years ago; it's always been better than PowerPoint. As for Pages, it's so much better at page layout than Word. Images and typography are so much better in Pages. Excel is the only program I though I'd miss, but when I discovered the Filter feature in Numbers works as well as Excel, that's all I needed to know to make the switch. In addition, Numbers shows Excel how a spreadsheet interface should be designed for the iPad. Most people fear that they would miss Excel, but if you take a deep look at Numbers, it's really not a beginner program. MS Office has lots of handy features, but if you hang in there with Pages, Numbers, and Keynote, it's quite possible that they will work for you. One other important thing: Pages, Numbers, and Keynote are now free; MS Office now cost $70 or $100 per year depending on which version you get.

 

Excel is the only program in the Microsoft suite of programs worth talking about, and most people don't use it. Microsoft is probably years away from having Works (full version) on Arm systems. Ribbons UI is a big holdup.

post #46 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danox View Post

Google Doc's is a joke, unless you like using Office 1998.

I personally don't use it unless I'm previewing files in Google Apps. I actually really like iWork. It works really well for my needs.
post #47 of 63
I really would like to know why Apple or even Google aren't interested in creating an equal or superior office suite. If they did that they both would sell more products. This whole concept just blows my mind that they wouldn't do this.

Apple had bootcamp but that was limited to only the people who would bother to buy a Microsux license and install it on a different machine. Google has just contracted to have an interface created so people can use Office on their machines. http://www.geekwire.com/2014/vmware-joins-google-offer-windows-virtualization-chrome-os/

Both Apple and Google need to create their own native office suites that are better than the other one. That way they will be in control of the software quality and their customers won't need to go elsewhere to find an office suite and then load it. Having to buy separate software and then load it just adds a barrier. If the people will be using that software most of the time then why bother buying an Apple or Google device when they can get it on a Windoz machine?
post #48 of 63
Originally Posted by Smallwheels View Post
I really would like to know why Apple or even Google aren't interested in creating an equal or superior office suite.

 

Used any software in the last eight years?

 
Both Apple and Google need to create their own native office suites that are better than the other one. 

 

Uh…

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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post #49 of 63

I use Office 2007 at work. I like it on my work PC.

 

I have Office 2011 on my Mac at home.

 

I got tired of the "broken link" message when opening Excel. Go online for a solution and it doesn't work.

 

I use Numbers on my iPhone. I like it a lot. I never really used it on my Mac.

 

After this article, I opened up my Excel spreadsheets in Numbers, saved to iCloud, and I LOVE it. 

 

So, MS has lost me now on Office. For what I do, Numbers is just great. Just financial planning for the future. And I can get it via iCloud now.

 

(Before, I was saving the Excel spreadsheet to Dropbox, getting it via GoodReader Pro on my iPhone, then using Numbers to pull it over. A pain. Now, no pain!

 

Apple did a great job with Numbers.

 

I think MS is too late to the party and will lose again. Too bad for their Windows group too closely tied to Office and preventing Office from being all that it can be on iOS.

post #50 of 63
In many ways, Apple forced Microsoft's hands on this one - and the story is not too different from what happened with Google Maps.

Google was giving the step motherly treatment to iOS, keeping back crucial features like Turn-by-turn, StreetView, etc. After Apple released their own Maps, the story changed - Google faced the risk that the sheer volume of iOS users would help Apple improve Maps, both in terms of accuracy and features. They promptly released an App in the AppStore for Maps!

The story with Microsoft is going to be exactly the same. As every new device from Apple comes preloaded with iWork for free, this gives iWork a massive installed base. Remember, including the iPad, Apple is the largest PC maker on the planet, and counts about 20% of PCs sold. This 20% gets iWork for free. Soon Office will be irrelevant.

The reason why iWork will work, while alternatives like Open Office, etc may not, is that Apple gives a lot of importance to usability, even if it means compromised featureset. This attracts people, and makes it easier for everyone to get familiar.

MS has a very small window here. Any further delay, and it might completely destroy their Office monopoly. Office is unquestionably better, but for almost 80% of people, iWork is "good enough"!

In many ways, this is a reverse of how the OS wars played out. Mac OS is unquestionably better than Windows, but for most people, Windows was good enough!

People are not giving enough value to Apple's software edge. Running the largest AppStore, with better quality apps, better monetization, low piracy, etc, gives Apple a humongous edge even against a player like Microsoft.

And if Apple is smart, they will soon release a version of XCode with support for compiling apps for Windows. This will run only on the Mac obviously, and the code will be native Objective-C. The exact same code can be used to create Windows binaries. Apple already has such a concept internally, and it is capable of handling sophisticated products like iTunes and Safari. And Apple is the biggest contributor to CLANG and LLVM projects, so if anyone can do this, Apple can.

Creating a native cross platform code, will make Apple the choice of all developers, and will give iOS and Mac OSX the best software and the earliest software. And since this software would be designed from the ground up to be running on Apple hardware, the performance and look on Apple hardware will be best, while still offering a reasonable option on Windows.
post #51 of 63
Originally Posted by macarena View Post
As every new device from Apple comes preloaded with iWork for free

 

Popup asking if you’d like to download, right? Not installed.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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post #52 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post
 

This on the iPad:

 

 

 

I just can't wait...

Why would it have to be a cut and paste ui?

post #53 of 63

I suspect that if Office for iOS doesn't include a direct connection to OneDrive, it will likely not succeed. Also, I hope Outlook for iOS will be something like Outlook Web Access, where the bulk of information is stored on OneDrive (and mail of course on an exchange server of one sort or other), but with the expanded robustness of an app (vice browser page) that can take advantage of the (iOS) platform's resources/storage.

 

Or am I just being Captain Obvious?

post #54 of 63

Macarena, The issue in enterprise does not come down to which is the better OS, but rather price per seat. An intel i3 NUC comparably hardware equipped and licenses for Windows / Office is to the tune of $400-$600 cheaper than a Mac. While the OSX/iOS experience is smooth and steady, Windows 8.1/WP8 provides a very comparable stability for the price point. I agree with you that the Apple ecosystem is extremely more robust, it is not that Windows is "just good enough" but does the job at a reasonable price.
Office needs to come to the iPad/iPhone. With the BYOD in huge effect (I set up about 20 Apple devices a week for enterprise users), being able for users to keep standardization across platforms would benefit both Apple and Microsoft. Hopefully Microsoft does not nerf the iOS version, as it needs to keep functionality with SharePoint, Office365, CRM, Onedrive, etc.(WP8 has this functionality in Office) I would like to see a iCloud plugin for Office on Windows, but that will probably never happen.
 

post #55 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post
 

I think the Office monopoly was doomed the moment they opened up the file format (the XML based one). Now they have to compete on app features, and not having a version for a particular platform is about an uncompetitive as you can get.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post
 

This on the iPad:

 

 

I just can't wait...

 

 

This certainly more than justifies the need for the so-called iPad Pro (12.9" diag screen with 4 Ultra HiDef Screen)¡

post #56 of 63
I remember when MS made more when people bought a Mac than a PC. That was when Excel and Word were popular on the Mac while Lotus and Word Perfect dominated on the PC.
post #57 of 63

Microsoft has had 3 years to make a version of Office for the most popular tablet in the world. They've probably had a finished product for the last 2.

 

But unfortunately Microsoft has no desire to simply release a good software product for the iPad just for the sake of releasing some good that people might find useful.

 

For them its about what scam can they run...what ridiculous business model can they come up with to squeeze dollars out of the few people that might consider this.

 

iWork is now free. There is almost no reason for any iPad user to use Office for iPad. Microsoft knows this, and they don't want the "long awaited and anticipated" Office to now arrive way too late and completely fall on its face...as well as fall to the bottom of Paid Apps category.

 

No, it'll be something else ridiculous, like you must subscribe to Office365 and already pay for Office desktop apps, in order to have access to Office for iPad, or something equally ridiculous.

post #58 of 63

Frankly, whether MS Office ever gets on the iPad doesn't really matter for people who really want to get real work done using office style applications. It's more flash, bragging rights, and a PR stunt than substance, a meaningless milestone to prove that something Could be done rather than it Should be done. The current crop of office productivity applications (and many other application categories) are all so deeply hard wired at a DNA level to require as much screen space and keyboard as you can throw at them. Really big screens and really tactile and table resonating keyboards. There's always something to be said for having the right tool for the right job and trying to coerce tool/job misfits doesn't change the reality of the situation. This is why I laugh when I hear people state that they'll only consider something like a Surface tablet because they have to run Photoshop or a bloatiferous office suite on the thing. Really? You really want to be running a big screen & big keyboard (BSBK) application on a 10" screen and floppy keyboard? In some parts of the world this would be considered a Human Rights violation, like trying to eat a 12 oz porterhouse with a toothpick and straw. Can it be done? Absolutely. Would it be pure torture to actually do it? Absolutely.

 

Did we learn nothing from the Netbook debacle?

 

None of the current office suites work well on a tablet, much less a smartphone. Can tablets and smartphones serve as "companion" application platfoms to big office suites? Probably. Like doing minor touch-ups and tweaks. But as companion apps they'd better do the limited things that make sense to do in their form factors extremely well and with as few compromises as possible. 

 

Truth be told, I don't care if any of the current BSBK applications get sausage stuffed into a tablet any time soon. The ones that are supposedly there already universally suck. If I'm thinking "dude, you gotta write a document or put together a worksheet" my hand is immediately reaching for my Macbook Pro or Air, not my iPad. I may setup the iPad as a second screen if I'm away from home, but the right tool for these jobs is a traditional computer with BSBK credentials. Leave the toothpicks and straws at home.

 

Microsoft proved that they couldn't make Office work well in their old Tablet Edition. With Surface the situation is no better, still trying to push the "your finger is the mouse" paradigm. Until they figure out how to provide effective touch interaction without compromising productivity don't even bother trying repackaging traditional Office for the small screen no keyboard (SSNK) market. It's a very simple reality, we need the right tool for the right job and we ain't there - yet. My hope is that Microsoft recognizes this reality and will take the time to redefine ways that SSNK tools can be folded into office productivity environments effectively and additively rather than clumsily and compromised. There's no value in trying to push the envelope on Elfin Magic. I think Microsoft has some really good ideas around Touch and is even ahead of Apple and others in defining a standard and effective Touch centric model. They simply haven't figured out how to make their old battleship era applications like Word and Excel work effectively in a world where air superiority (mobility) reigns supreme. Apple is only slightly ahead in this regard but still way off target.

post #59 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

The only thing we do know is that Office for iPad won't be rushed.

Microsoft's motto: "We make no products until well after its time."
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
Reply
post #60 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by DewMe View Post

Microsoft proved that they couldn't make Office work well in their old Tablet Edition. With Surface the situation is no better, still trying to push the "your finger is the mouse" paradigm. Until they figure out how to provide effective touch interaction without compromising productivity don't even bother trying repackaging traditional Office for the small screen no keyboard (SSNK) market. It's a very simple reality, we need the right tool for the right job and we ain't there - yet. My hope is that Microsoft recognizes this reality and will take the time to redefine ways that SSNK tools can be folded into office productivity environments effectively and additively rather than clumsily and compromised. There's no value in trying to push the envelope on Elfin Magic. I think Microsoft has some really good ideas around Touch and is even ahead of Apple and others in defining a standard and effective Touch centric model. They simply haven't figured out how to make their old battleship era applications like Word and Excel work effectively in a world where air superiority (mobility) reigns supreme. Apple is only slightly ahead in this regard but still way off target.

I agree with you except for parts of your last paragraph reproduced above. When Apple rewrote iWorks to be 64 bit native they removed a bunch of features before addind some back in. I suspect this was to make the basic iWork programs a best fit to touch UI on a small screen. The original iWork, like MS Office, was written to work best in the BSBK environment, as you called it. Any programs that are designed with the small touch screen in mind have the best chance of winning wide-spread adoption, even though they lack some of the features common to their BSBK brethren.

If 80% of the needed work can be done with 20% of the available features of of MS Office, then the first order of business needs to be in identifying the essential 20% of the features. The second order of business needs to be in identifying the next group of features to move utility toward 95% of the potential users. That could be done with less then 50% of the features in MS Office.
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
Reply
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
Reply
post #61 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanukStorm View Post

If you're a serious spreadsheet user, there's nothing that comes close to MS Excel.  Numbers doesn't hold a candle to it.  But there are many apps that are becoming suitable replacements for MS Word & PowerPoint.

I'll take it further, if you are serious about spreadsheets, nothing comes close to Excel on a PC. Microsoft will never let Excel on the iPad compete with Excel on the PC, for both financial and competitive reasons.

People that do "real" Excel work aren't going to use an iPad nor a MS Surface Pro or RT. They are going to use a 2-3 monitor setup using Windows Excel on PC or Mac hardware.

The iPad and Surface are ok for reviewing Excel docs, but no one in their right mind would create those Excel docs on the Surface or iPad.

Check out this post by Ben Evans and look at all the Excel default document types ( in the pic) that are now substituted by $0.99 or free apps, or SAAS.

http://ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2014/2/26/tablets-pcs-and-office

Excel has its place, but I'd guess 95% of people are reading Excel docs while 5% are creating them?

Food for thought.
post #62 of 63
Open Office for iPad?
post #63 of 63
Originally Posted by droslovinia View Post
Open Office for iPad?

 

Why would you want fast food for free when you can get a gourmet meal for free (iWork)?

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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