Just got a Compaq Tablet, Apple surrenders

Post some pics,

in it's different modes, holding it, typing on it, next to some other devices, I want to get an idea of it's relative size.

Thanks.

[quote]Originally posted by Relic:
<strong>Ever since the unfortunate demise of the Powerbook 2400 I have been waiting impatiently for Apple to introduce a new sub notebook.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I have the same problem. I sold my PowerBook 2400c to buy an iBook that could run OS X. I haven't regretted the upgrade, but still find myself longing for a real subnotebook, i.e. one that is lighter than 3 lbs. In the end, however, OS X has kept me on the Mac side. I simply do not want to deal with Windows, its still-terrible user interface, and all the viruses that haunt the Wintel platform.

I have to admit that the Compaq TC-1000 Table looks interesting. But I have no need and would have no use for a pen interface.

Escher

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

CNN just had a damn, ah not toshiba but some 10" PC Tablet/Laptop for $2200 using M$'s handwriting recognition software. So Renay, the host of hotwired, said he's been at it for a few hours and still couldn't get it to recognize his name, Renay. It kept spelling Renoir & Renae. HAHA, then he hands it to another host Stephen, he writes his name and it comes out as Steuhen. HAHAHA. Then Bill Gates comes on from an earlier interview to talk about the software. He says " It's a breakthrough. It won't replace your keyboard but it's great for a quick email letter. If you want to write something longer then you'd be better to use your keyboard". HAHAHA, so a $2200 Tablet/Laptop with this software to write a 'short email' HAHAHAHAHA.

Enjoy your tablet but Apple isn't surrendering anything, are you still a mac user?

[ 11-12-2002: Message edited by: KidRed ]</p>

Hey Relic - forget the distractors - congrats on getting a new toy! Do post picts and reviews once you get it.

As for Microsoft getting your information, I personally do not think you will have to worry about it too much for now. Install Zonealarm, which is a great firewall program that tells you which proccess is trying to connect to the internet - great for detecting unnecessary outbound traffic. There are also numerous places that teaches you how to tweak Windows to disable unnecessary services. We will talk once you get the tablet PC!

Using a provactive title for your thread was unnecessary....see where it got you. Methinks you wanted this kind of response from some on this board.

Wouldn't installing Linux mean dispensing with pen input, which is the entire point of this computer?

the next version of the ibook cpuld have the same functionality as this thing. I posted the patents apple filed for it (under a cover name).
But everybody just brushed it of back then.
I'll try finding them again.
Since apple has the inkwell technology, there is really no reason not to do this, (unless the whole tablet thing flops that is).
Apple really don't need another newton project, os I guess they're wise to hold out and see how thing fare...

Is the search function totally busted?

[quote]Originally posted by Belle:
<strong>Wouldn't installing Linux mean dispensing with pen input, which is the entire point of this computer? </strong><hr></blockquote>

Well I haven't kept track of all of the other Tablets, but the Paceblade currently can run a Beta release of LINUX ( With Hand writing recognition and screen rotation capabilities ). The last I heard they expect an official release around January 2003.

The revolution of the Pen Tablet Computer has just started. I think its was last year when view sonic came out
with the super pda and the tablet pc. This technolgy is very new. Just like when apple came out with the newton.
People were'nt ready for it. Maybe people are ready for this new technology. I think that the industries and market is there, but the technolgy is'nt. The companies are all bound to The Microsoft stronghold and there for will never have a product that they call there own. That is Apple's advantage, there hardware and software is designed together.

You know i would hate to be drawing or writing on my tablet-pc and have it tell me that the XP tablet pc driver just had an illegal error and had to shutdown (ohh and please restart your tablet PC). It would also be bad for explorer to crash to ehhh.

Apple and Steve know what there doing when it comes to portable computing, they've been working at this for a long time. If Apple ever comes out with a Tablet Mac it will most likely be a spectacular product.

Untill this technology allows instant on and error free service all the time it willl not replace a peice of paper.

[ 11-12-2002: Message edited by: dmgeist ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by dmgeist:
<strong>The revolution of the Pen Tablet Computer has just started. I think its was last year when view sonic came out
with the super pda and the tablet pc. This technolgy is very new. Just like when apple came out with the newton.
People were'nt ready for it. Maybe people are ready for this new technology.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I think it was more like the Newton wasn't ready for the people.

The technology isn't new at all. While the underlying algorithms and overlying functionality may have moved on, the usability of pen devices - on the evidence of Palm, Pocket PC, and Tablet PC devices - hasn't moved on one little bit.

None of these devices recognize my handwriting satisfactorily, even if I write neatly. And you have to write BIG. My natural handwriting is small.

Have you tested inkwell, belle? I find it almost usable...

[quote]Originally posted by Belle:
<strong>
I think it was more like the Newton wasn't ready for the people.
...None of these devices recognize my handwriting satisfactorily, even if I write neatly. And you have to write BIG. My natural handwriting is small.</strong><hr></blockquote>

First.
The Newton was/is loved by many and would have become something great if it wasn't killed off so early in its young life. Though I preferred the Emate.

Second.
Just like we all have conformed to the layout of the QWERTY keyboard and pay little attention to its awkwardness... the next generation of users will write the way the Tablet wants them to without giving any thought to its awkwardness.

you should see if it can correctly translate "beat up martin" into "eat up martha"

[quote]Originally posted by Relic:
<strong>Geeesh, here we go. Yes, to clarify if Im still a Mac user its yes, I have a Dual gig. I like the Compaq; it fits my needs in everyway. The hand recognition is a nice feature but believe me it wasnt the main selling point. I use Visio to graph out my customers Lan configuration, having a tablet when I walk around with my customers to jot down ideas is great. Im not going to right my master thesis on the thing. Im a fast typist and have horrible handwriting. At least someone has the balls to bring out a new idea, while Apple sits on their ass with last years technology. Why do a majority of Mac users feel threaten when one of their own goes to the competitor. Hey, this might be just a toy at the end, but you know what its a cool toy. Defiantly one that I will use and cherish to the max. Lately Apple hasnt come out with what I can honestly called trend moving. This gadget is pure wow factor, the child who opens up that bike on Christmas feeling. So back off with that kind of attitude, at least until Apple comes out with there own. <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>

Couple of things:

Hope you are not walking around too long without it plugged in as the battery lasts only 2 hours.

You have no idea if it meets your needs, you have not even gotten it, EVERY tablet review I have read says it is a great theory that suffers from horrible execution.

As far as new ideas, you must be forgetting this tech has been aroung for years and has already failed a couple of times, not to mention successful recent ideas like the iMac, and iPod, or iSych or Rendezvous...those are new technologies are they not???

Your little tablet is cool however, but I can think of a lot of things that you could get for 2 grand other than a novelty computer.

[quote]Originally posted by New:
<strong>Have you tested inkwell, belle? I find it almost usable...</strong><hr></blockquote>

I find it completely unusable. Then again, I'm a sloppy handwriter.

According to David Pogue, there isn't much to recognize the handwriting on these things:

<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2002/11/07/technology/circuits/07stat.html" target="_blank">http://www.nytimes.com/2002/11/07/technology/circuits/07stat.html</a>

[quote]...And in hopes of avoiding the ridicule heaped on Apple's Newton, Microsoft emphasizes that handwriting recognition isn't an important aspect of the Tablet PC...

...To share your handwritten Tablet PC notes with other people, by contrast, you must export them as TIFF graphics files or Web pages, or ask your colleagues to download a free Journal viewer that Microsoft intends to put on its Web site...

...But for the moment, only a handful of programs accept Tablet PC-style handwriting. For example, Tablet PC owners can download a free software add-on that lets them add handwritten comments in Microsoft Office programs...

...This Office Pack, as it's called, lets Outlook send handwritten e-mail - an intriguing novelty. True, your recipients won't be able to search your correspondence, sort it or copy its contents, because your message is sent as an attached graphic. (In fact, recipients whose e-mail programs don't display graphics won't see your note at all.)<hr></blockquote>

Anyway, it goes on.

The technology in many cases doesn't try to convert handwriting to typed text at all. So Tablet PCs aren't quite a digital clipboard just yet, but these things do provide a few good ideas and features. They'll need a bunch more to really be a replacement for a pad and pen, or for a Newton in some respects. Hopefully as these things mature, some of these guys will have a clearer idea of how exactly the tablet will not only be as accessible as the "analog" original, but also a lot more useful (therefore worth the cost).

[really sloppy]

[ 11-13-2002: Message edited by: BuonRotto ]</p>

Looks purdy.

[quote]Originally posted by BuonRotto:
<strong>

The technology in many cases doesn't try to convert handwriting to typed text at all. </strong><hr></blockquote>

Need to correct a factual error here. The user decides whether to store the handwriting as is or have the machine convert tha handwriting to text.

Furthermore, even if the handwriting is not converted, the content is indexed and searchable. For example, I can search through the meeting notes I have taken in the last three days for instances of the word 'prototype' despite the fact it is not converted. When that writing is sent to non-supported OS (non-tablet Windows, Mac, linux), it is obviously just a picture.

Right. Communication is not its strong suit. They are certainly try to keep clear of more, um, substantial uses for the technology thus far.

Relic, looks nice but...
its a good thing you're IT. Enjoy your rebooting.

I find the Apple bunch a crazy bunch.

With Apple and the big advance of iChat LOL the thing is full of bugs and all apple folks are fast to tell you it is version 1.0 just wait just wait just wait. It will get better they all say.

When Microsoft and Compaq come up with a real new product for the market these same Apple bunch are quick to write off the entire thing.

I see... a sort of double mindedness.....

It is Funny to watch in action..

Fellowship

[quote]Originally posted by FellowshipChurch iBook:
<strong>I find the Apple bunch a crazy bunch.

With Apple and the big advance of iChat LOL the thing is full of bugs and all apple folks are fast to tell you it is version 1.0 just wait just wait just wait. It will get better they all say.

When Microsoft and Compaq come up with a real new product for the market these same Apple bunch are quick to write off the entire thing.

I see... a sort of double mindedness.....

It is Funny to watch in action..

Fellowship</strong><hr></blockquote>

It's all part of being a fanatic. You should know all about this FCiB.

Hmmm..I think he actually got ya on that one Fellowship

[quote]Originally posted by FellowshipChurch iBook:
<strong>
When Microsoft and Compaq come up with a real new product for the market these same Apple bunch are quick to write off the entire thing.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Hmmmm. We have had wireless tablet pc's for almost two years with touch screens running NT 4 workstation. Wouldn't really call it a "real new product". I would call it more of a "we don't have any new ideas so we will take one that most people don't know already exists, put it in a shinny box, and tell people/executives they really need these". Now we plan on buying these things where I work, but please lets not make them out to be something they are not. "Real new product" they ain't!!

[quote]Originally posted by SQUÅSH:
<strong>Hmmm..I think he actually got ya on that one Fellowship </strong><hr></blockquote>

SQUASH HOW ARE YA MAN!

Great to see you

Fellowship

TabletPC is a novel concept, but I'm glad Apple doesn't have one yet. Microsoft has deeper pockets, let them test the market. When the market is there, and loyal (like with MP3 players), then Apple will jump in. They got burned with the Newton--though Newton was profitable, it wasn't the groundbreaking success it was intended to be.

[quote]Originally posted by FellowshipChurch iBook:
<strong>With Apple and the big advance of iChat LOL the thing is full of bugs and all apple folks are fast to tell you it is version 1.0 just wait just wait just wait. It will get better they all say.

When Microsoft and Compaq come up with a real new product for the market these same Apple bunch are quick to write off the entire thing.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Actually, this was my point about Tablet PCs too. It's essentially at version 1.0, so it has a ways to go before it's more viable to the general populace.

I agree with Gordy. I'm willing to let others be trailblazers and make a first really concerted push towards this stuff (I suppose Newton could be considered the first by some, but it's irrelevant). I'd rather have Apple learn a little from the market on this one. My purchases have less to do with what's new any more, and more to do with what works best for me. Age and the hindsight of seeing other trailblazing tech and companies go to pasture will do that to you.

Look at it this way, at least MS can't "steal" the market from anyone else now. With a lot of luck, someone can steal it from them for a change.

I think the tablet will need to have great handwriting recognition to have any chance of success for the long haul.

The newton 2100 did have good recognition and I think a lot of this had to do with the facts that it would identify a half printing/half cursive style. It also let you write anywhere on the screen. That was a very natural way to write.

The Tablet PC makes you write in a certain area. Inkwell, at this time makes you write on a tablet watching the screen. From all reports, Tablet PC does not recognize very well and MS encourages the user not to use it this way. I have used Inkwell and found it to be behind the Newton in recognition ability and intuitive feel.

MS has deep pockets and can afford the ridicule which they will get whether right or wrong. The clientele these are aimed at are not necessarily Apple type clients.

I believe Apple has a strong idea what they want to do with InkWell. I think they are also wise to sit back and let MS take a few lumps. I am sick and tired of journalists again beating the drum about how dismal of a failure the Newton was. I doubt half of them even tried it, especially towards the end.

It's too bad Apple was in such dire straits when Jobs showed up because the Newton was just hitting it's stride. I still think its form factor is arms and legs ahead of these tablet PC's.

Remember when one the biggest complaints with the Newton were how big and expensive it was? Well looky now. Seems puny compared to these high priced SUV sized Tablets.

the handwriting recognition on the tablet pc is really very good. better than it was on my mp130. i'd say, for me, it was about 99% accurate. i've written a couple of paragraphs on one and i think there was one error in conversion.

[quote]Originally posted by kcmac:
<strong>From all reports, Tablet PC does not recognize very well and MS encourages the user not to use it this way. </strong><hr></blockquote>

What way? I demoed one six months ago and found the handwriting recognition to be veru good although not perfect of course. The HWR engine can better full natrual cursive rather than half-print half cursive style. Note that MS has been working on this for the past three years; they have been refining the HWR engine used in since PocketPC 2000.