or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › General › General Discussion › Apple to shut down higher education Authorized Campus Stores in Canada this June
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Apple to shut down higher education Authorized Campus Stores in Canada this June - Page 2

post #41 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by konqerror View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by d4NjvRzf View Post
 

When did Dell ever sell its computers through retail? 

 

They seriously got into it around 2007. They even had their own mall kiosks. It was part of the industry shift into cheap assembly in China. (Apple made the shift too, they ended US assembly around 2003.)

 

The end of Dell's shift happened around last year. With their margins so low, they can't afford to air freight computers or manage a dynamic supply chain anymore. Build-to-order options are gone for all but large corporate orders and high-margin gaming systems. Everything is basically sold from stock, fitting in well with the retail store model.

found this on wikipedia:

 

United States[edit]

In the early 1990s, Dell sold its products through Best BuyCostco and Sam's Club stores in the United States. Dell stopped this practice in 1994, citing low profit-margins on the business, exclusively distributing through a direct-sales model for the next decade. In 2003, Dell briefly sold products in Sears stores in the U.S. In 2007, Dell started shipping its products to major retailers in the U.S. once again, starting with Sam's Club and Wal-MartStaples, the largest office-supply retailer in the U.S., and Best Buy, the largest electronics retailer in the U.S., became Dell retail partners later that same year.

"Building for the future?! They should be running around reacting to the present!" -John Moltz
Reply
"Building for the future?! They should be running around reacting to the present!" -John Moltz
Reply
post #42 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by snova View Post
 

not always true.. I know plenty of people who sent their kids away to school with a PC laptop in hand as freshman (as you state), only to replace them with Macs at the campus store when their PC laptop "died (whatever that means)" in the middle of the term.  :lol: 

Happened to my daughter. Got thru 2 years of college with her Sony Viao...it died.

 

I gave her my MacBook (and a brand new 1st gen iPhone) which got her thru college and the first two years of Med School. I replaced it with a MBP.

 

The macbook kept going and going and I sold it to get an iPad2.

post #43 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post


Apple is clearly being run with only immediate profits the driving force.

Clear as mud.
"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
Reply
"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
Reply
post #44 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woochifer View Post


Low inventory is not an indicator of low sales -- just low inventory. The biggest selling point of campus stores for the longest time was the student/staff discounts, and even if something was not in inventory, the campus stores I'm familiar with would take the order and have it ready for pick up in a day or two. The campus stores carry other brands simply because not all consumers purchase the same platform (and Future Shop does the exact same thing).  Plus, other manufacturers have their own academic discount programs.

The campus stores' decline is sad for a long-time Mac fan like me because they helped prop Apple up during some dark times. They were often one of the few stores where Macs were on an equal footing with PCs, if those other stores even bothered carrying Macs in the first place. With Apple as this global colossus, it's hard to look at them as the struggling underdog with declining retail support. But, that indeed was the case.

We lament your sorrow. But at least Apple has thrived. Imagine if the campus stores shut due to Apple going bankrupt? Then we would all be sharing your tears, nay, drowning in them.
"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
Reply
"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
Reply
post #45 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by DennyC2013 View Post

I hate any store that my university runs, this includes the book, computer, clothing and coffee stores.  All of them have either horrible hours or horrible prices. Something as simple as some printer paper is way over priced.  I understand apple sets the price for its products available at the stores, but after getting shafted on so many items I don't want to shop at the school.

I am in canda and live close to the border.  So if you cross the border and get a full price computer from a state with very low sales tax, you will be similar to ontario after edu discount plus the ridiculous amount of tax we have to pay.

Is Canda the country next to Canda Crush? I think I once visited on a Saga cruise.
"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
Reply
"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
Reply
post #46 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

Very short sighted on the part of Apple. Apple technology in campus stores has made Apple computers the default for students and faculty. Dell, the previous darling on campuses, has not had campus sales for quite some time.

Apple is clearly being run with only immediate profits the driving force. If Apple continues this trend, it is dead, and there won't be another Steve Jobs coming along to save their asses.

Clearly, schmearly. Apple knows what it it doing. 

Daniel Swanson

Reply

Daniel Swanson

Reply
post #47 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post
 

That or order online at Apple.com which is probably what they are already doing hence declining sales at the campus shop.

Yep- Online has the same discounts and customized setups. And it's delivered to my door. So why bother with 18th century or earlier shopping?

post #48 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

Very short sighted on the part of Apple. Apple technology in campus stores has made Apple computers the default for students and faculty. Dell, the previous darling on campuses, has not had campus sales for quite some time.

Apple is clearly being run with only immediate profits the driving force. If Apple continues this trend, it is dead, and there won't be another Steve Jobs coming along to save their asses.

Everybody buys online: this is just acknowledging brick and mortar in a bookstore environment isn't cutting it. They've retained educational discounts and with online customization: the way to go.

 

No "doom" required.

post #49 of 66
Looks to me like Apple is once again looking for a segment of their sales they can use to generate more attractive margin numbers. They did this a few years ago, when they reduced the profit margin for their retailers they had factored into the retail price by several percent, and then shortly after made huge announcements about "posting record margins" for the quarter. Not higher sales, not more profits, just record margins, which they attained at the cost of profitability of their partners. Now they are deauthorizing small retailers, independent stores, and now campus stores. All to keep a higher percentage of the sale price in house, making the balance sheets look that much more attractive even in the face of declining market share for their phones, tablets, and computers. Fine for now, but what happens when they run out of places to reabsorb costs? Do they raise their (already pretty high) prices? Admit to declining profitability? And will their investors stand for that?
post #50 of 66
Originally Posted by MisterRick View Post
,,,in the face of declining market share for their phones, tablets, and computers. 

 

See, no. That’s not what is happening.

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply

Originally Posted by Marvin

The only thing more insecure than Android’s OS is its userbase.
Reply
post #51 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post
 

It doesn't matter. Until relatively recently, the idea of buying an Apple was considered a stupid move. Dell was the default on the campuses I'm familiar with. What happens during orientation when mom and dad accompany their freshman to campus. "I need a computer!" They go to the campus store, and mom and dad see Apple computers for the first time. The staff can talk to them, demonstrate the Apple, let them touch it. Be told, "Sure you can run Windows programs. Bootcamp and VMs from Parallels or VMWare. Let me demonstrate....". And, they can walk out with a  computer immediately. You can't do that with Dell. Mom and Dad might even buy one. 

 

This really doesn't happen any more at the majority of college campuses (from experience).  Most colleges have either recommended or mandatory programs that they disclose to freshman before they get to campus in the fall, so most freshman are already arriving on campus with what they need, whether that's from Apple, or another manufacturer.  In addition, Apple partners with many schools on customized online stores hosted by Apple where students authenticate with their school credentials and received a bigger discount on the purchase than the standard educational discount offered online, and the school receives a small percentage back from Apple for these purchases.

At this point, most parents and students need to be convinced why they shouldn't be purchasing the computer directly from the Apple Store or Apple.com, not the other way around.

post #52 of 66

No? The reports I have seen for 2013 indicate that Apple lost 5.8% of the phone market, and almost 17% share of the tablet market. In the education market, Mac computers - which once accounted for upwards of 3/4 of machines on campus - have lost upwards of ten percent of market share, and will lose more under this new arrangement. Now, they may recover some of that share, but they have to release something more than just speed bumps into their product assortment.

post #53 of 66
To say that these stores are "Apple subsidized" I think is a mistatement. They earn profit on each machine they sell (a samller percentage than just about any other manufacturer) just like other products they sell or any other retailer does but as well they have expenses just like every other reseller (usually higher as they generally pay their staff members a living wage instead of minimum wage like the Big box resellers).

We will see how this ends up playing out. Some people are fine with purchasing online but some would rather see and try the product out before purchasing (and some don't want to wait the week to get their product like they have to from the Apple online store). These stores had supported Apple during the times when it was almost out of business but now that they are in a time that may be hard for them Apple is in my opinion trying to take advantge of it to grab a few more percentage of margin (which they get if people buy online instead).

One things Apple and many others have not taken into consideration is that there is generally an Apple service centre associated with each of these campus resellers (for on campus repair of Apple machines) and these are usually a money losing operation (if you look at warranty reimbursement rates versus a living/union wage Universities pay you will understand why) but have been kept becuase of the sales aspect of the operation. With the loss of the sales aspect I would expect that all these service centres will b shut down as well so that will be one less service option for everyone in each of these centres (and for students who may find it harder to get around they don't have the option of taking their machine with them to school to get it fixed). This on campus service will no longer be a selling feature for Apple.

As well currently the people at thezse stores (who often have long standing relationships with departments on campus) have had no reason to try and switch people from using a Mac to a PC (or from an iPad to a different tablet) but now that Apple has pulled thier agreement they will have a reason to try and convince people to switch. We will see if they are successful (or to what level) but it is a risk for Apple (one I guess they are willing to take).
post #54 of 66

Well I can speak to the campus store that I've worked at the past 18 years. We've been selling on average $2 million/year of Apple products. Apple has some nice products, but they have always been a miserable company to do business with. The problem with buying online and the big box stores will be when you're looking for service and warranty work, of which there is usually plenty.

post #55 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterRick View Post

Looks to me like Apple is once again looking for a segment of their sales they can use to generate more attractive margin numbers. They did this a few years ago, when they reduced the profit margin for their retailers they had factored into the retail price by several percent, and then shortly after made huge announcements about "posting record margins" for the quarter. Not higher sales, not more profits, just record margins, which they attained at the cost of profitability of their partners. Now they are deauthorizing small retailers, independent stores, and now campus stores. All to keep a higher percentage of the sale price in house, making the balance sheets look that much more attractive even in the face of declining market share for their phones, tablets, and computers. Fine for now, but what happens when they run out of places to reabsorb costs? Do they raise their (already pretty high) prices? Admit to declining profitability? And will their investors stand for that?

ie you don't know how Apple works or what numbers actually mean.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterRick View Post

No? The reports I have seen for 2013 indicate that Apple lost 5.8% of the phone market, and almost 17% share of the tablet market. In the education market, Mac computers - which once accounted for upwards of 3/4 of machines on campus - have lost upwards of ten percent of market share, and will lose more under this new arrangement. Now, they may recover some of that share, but they have to release something more than just speed bumps into their product assortment.

Well Apple has announced record sales of iPhones in yoy qtrs. market share is lower because the shipment "smartphone" market is growing faster than one company. If you look at the overall cell phone market, Apple has increased its share.

Source for this 75% campus share?
post #56 of 66

On campus sales were not declining across Canada. Most stores were maintaining sales levels or ahead of previous years. Only a few were seeing declines. This is clearly a short sited decision by the finance people at Apple Canada, who clearly do not know what they are doing based on the decisions over the last 18 months. Campus stores are there for the staff students and faculty of the campus, this short sited decision will alienate the faculty and researchers on campus that have research dollars to spend. Yes students can order online and buy their MacBook and have it shipped to their house. Student sales make up less the 50% of sales at most campus computer stores. How is a researcher going to purchase $20k worth of macs for their lab on a research account. Use their personal credit card, file an expense claim with the campus and wait 6 months to get paid, not likely. Or try to use the under funded, under trained purchasing department on campus to order from apple, not going to happen. Very bad business decision for Apple Canada, hopefully someone at Apple Global will have a talk with Wendy and John up in Canada.

post #57 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by canapple1 View Post
 

On campus sales were not declining across Canada. Most stores were maintaining sales levels or ahead of previous years. Only a few were seeing declines. This is clearly a short sited decision by the finance people at Apple Canada, who clearly do not know what they are doing based on the decisions over the last 18 months. Campus stores are there for the staff students and faculty of the campus, this short sited decision will alienate the faculty and researchers on campus that have research dollars to spend. Yes students can order online and buy their MacBook and have it shipped to their house. Student sales make up less the 50% of sales at most campus computer stores. How is a researcher going to purchase $20k worth of macs for their lab on a research account. Use their personal credit card, file an expense claim with the campus and wait 6 months to get paid, not likely. Or try to use the under funded, under trained purchasing department on campus to order from apple, not going to happen. Very bad business decision for Apple Canada, hopefully someone at Apple Global will have a talk with Wendy and John up in Canada.

This researcher or the lab manager pops a purchase order request into the system and it's all delivered to my lab.

 

Welcome to the modern world of academia.

post #58 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by canapple1 View Post

On campus sales were not declining across Canada. Most stores were maintaining sales levels or ahead of previous years. Only a few were seeing declines. This is clearly a short sited decision by the finance people at Apple Canada, who clearly do not know what they are doing based on the decisions over the last 18 months. Campus stores are there for the staff students and faculty of the campus, this short sited decision will alienate the faculty and researchers on campus that have research dollars to spend. Yes students can order online and buy their MacBook and have it shipped to their house. Student sales make up less the 50% of sales at most campus computer stores. How is a researcher going to purchase $20k worth of macs for their lab on a research account. Use their personal credit card, file an expense claim with the campus and wait 6 months to get paid, not likely. Or try to use the under funded, under trained purchasing department on campus to order from apple, not going to happen. Very bad business decision for Apple Canada, hopefully someone at Apple Global will have a talk with Wendy and John up in Canada.

Source? A lot of companies and universities have purchasing departments that buy assets for their employees. No employee just goes out and buys a computer for the employer without approval.
post #59 of 66

People are forgetting about colleges providing free IT support for computers purchased through the school, as long as the student is enrolled in the program (MBA, etc.).  Are colleges going to provide free support for computers that a student just goes out and buys from somewhere?  Is an off-campus Apple Store genius going to understand all the special configurations or custom applications used by the school?  Will students now have to make genius bar appointments off campus and wait longer for service?


Edited by Haggar - 3/19/14 at 9:59am
post #60 of 66

Really..on this campus the purchase order comes through the Campus store, or, used to. We'll just have to start filling the labs with PC's

post #61 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecaissie View Post
 

Really..on this campus the purchase order comes through the Campus store, or, used to. We'll just have to start filling the labs with PC's

Configure to order has always been direct with Apple, via purchasing for generating a PO for the order (attaching the order# to the PO request). Doing that for standard configurations wouldn't change much. And Apple express shipping is often more responsive than having a bookstore guy trundle this way with his cart....

post #62 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfc1138 View Post

Yep- Online has the same discounts and customized setups. And it's delivered to my door. So why bother with 18th century or earlier shopping?

But will there be educational pricing available at the online store? If yes then the campus store issue matters little. Many were actually not run by the educational institution but were totally independent businesses.

That being said it would be very shortsighted for Apple to not have educational pricing at its retail and online stores.

Philip
post #63 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haggar View Post

People are forgetting about colleges providing free IT support for computers purchased through the school, as long as the student is enrolled in the program (MBA, etc.).  Are colleges going to provide free support for computers that a student just goes out and buys from somewhere?  Is an off-campus Apple Store genius going to understand all the special configurations or custom applications used by the school?  Will students now have to make genius bar appointments off campus and wait longer for service?

Where I work the computer store is not owned or run by the university. It is a totally independent business. Same for books actually. So IT support is not at all related to having computer stores on campus. It is usually built into the general operating budget and is completely independent of the campus stores.

Philip
post #64 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcd View Post


But will there be educational pricing available at the online store?

 

That's how it is today. You can get educational pricing either by: buying online, buying online and doing personal pickup at an Apple store, in person at an Apple store by showing ID.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by canapple1 View Post
 

Student sales make up less the 50% of sales at most campus computer stores. How is a researcher going to purchase $20k worth of macs for their lab on a research account. Use their personal credit card, file an expense claim with the campus and wait 6 months to get paid, not likely.

 

Large orders are done by PO through Apple direct. For small orders, our bookstore is considered just another vendor, they have to compete against other resellers, specifically CDW. And yes, there's no problem with a professor putting an order on your personal credit card. Here, they direct deposit a reimbursement within 4 weeks, before the credit card becomes due, and you pocket the points/miles/cashback. If you don't like it that way, then they'll issue you a corporate credit card.

post #65 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcd View Post

But will there be educational pricing available at the online store? If yes then the campus store issue matters little. Many were actually not run by the educational institution but were totally independent businesses.

That being said it would be very shortsighted for Apple to not have educational pricing at its retail and online stores.

Philip

Yes they will be. From the end of the article: " Although it will no longer have an official physical presence on campuses across Canada come June, Apple will continue to serve educational discounts through its online storefront and authorized dealers. "
Edited by jfc1138 - 3/19/14 at 8:23pm
post #66 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterRick View Post
 

No? The reports I have seen for 2013 indicate that Apple lost 5.8% of the phone market, and almost 17% share of the tablet market. In the education market, Mac computers - which once accounted for upwards of 3/4 of machines on campus - have lost upwards of ten percent of market share, and will lose more under this new arrangement. Now, they may recover some of that share, but they have to release something more than just speed bumps into their product assortment.

LOST market share oh no!!!!  Apple is doomed!!!   its right there in their balance sheet.. can't you see the problem? The LOST market share is clearly reflected in their continued increases profits year or year and quarter over quarter.  Apple is doomed. /s

 

darn they must be doing something right. If there is direct relationship between lost market share and increased profits,then I welcome even more lost marketshare.   sell more, make more, "lose" market share while doing it, laugh all the way to the bank. 


Edited by snova - 3/19/14 at 8:47pm
"Building for the future?! They should be running around reacting to the present!" -John Moltz
Reply
"Building for the future?! They should be running around reacting to the present!" -John Moltz
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: General Discussion
AppleInsider › Forums › General › General Discussion › Apple to shut down higher education Authorized Campus Stores in Canada this June