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Rumor: Apple prepping 12" MacBook without fan, mechanical trackpad button - Page 3

post #81 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by brlawyer View Post
 

 

Interestingly, the diagram below doesn't show them - is the picture above from liquid-cooled models?

 

http://appleinsider.com/article/?id=508

 

Yes, it was a from a liquid cool G5. Otherwise it wouldn't have the radiator looking heatsink. The liquid cooling was just to assist in cooling since the fans weren't adequate to do the entire job. Like I said, the true last fanless Mac was the PowerMac G4 Cube. That PowerMac G5 also has fans elsewhere anyways like all the other PowerMac G5's. 

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post #82 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by psitthipo View Post
 

 

Try highlighting a sentence...you can only do it with press-down-click then drag your finger to highlight. If you double tap to click, it only highlights one word. 

 

Don't do it Apple, you will make a lot of people really angry!

??? No "press-down-click then drag" to highlight required at all. (Not even on this idiot PC laptop I'm stuck with right now, and its trackpad and related drivers are barely ready for prime time.)

 

Use "tap-and-a-half"; Tap twice, but don't let your finger lift from the trackpad on the second tap, then drag your finger to the end of the section you want highlight. For that matter, "tap-and-a-half" has worked on Apple mice since long before the first trackpads showed up.

post #83 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by psitthipo View Post
 

 

Try highlighting a sentence...you can only do it with press-down-click then drag your finger to highlight. If you double tap to click, it only highlights one word. 

 

Don't do it Apple, you will make a lot of people really angry!

You're showing your lack of a clue...pretty heavily.

 

I highlight plenty of sentences every day. I never click the track pad. Ever. Magic.

post #84 of 171
Originally Posted by pmz View Post
Seriously who uses the press-down-anywhere to click?

 

Everyone who wants to actually select an item, since tap click doesn’t work 1:1 with mechanical click. I don’t mechanical right-click ever, but that’s because of multitouch. It’s great.

 

Originally Posted by Seankill View Post
Especially on windows 7.

 

Particularly since it DOESN’T WORK AT ALL unless you do mechanical. :p

 

Originally Posted by waybacmac View Post
Forget the 12" iPad. There is no usage model that makes any sense

 

So no one would ever want a tablet in the same category as a laptop, huh.

 

Originally Posted by pmz View Post
Just false. It is the mechanical click that is limiting and more difficult.

 

Just false.

 
There is a 3 finger drag for that, which is literally the easiest drag in the world...

 

Except for, you know, one finger drag, which we mechanical users use. Never mind how much less precise that is.

 

Originally Posted by pmz View Post
I highlight plenty of sentences every day. I never click the track pad. Ever. Magic.

 

And there again, 3-finger drag is less precise.

Originally posted by Marvin

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Originally posted by Marvin

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post #85 of 171

If the next MBA is an Intel powered, and I assume it will be, for it to not have a fan I will assume for more intense processing for both CPU and GPU (Apple Aperture for me) will come with a performance cap to keep the heat away. My current Haswell MBA will run the fans while editing on the go in Aperture, especially if I am exporting and editing. 

 

This would mean that at a certain point, it would just throttle the processing to a point and no more, maybe even backing it down. Should be interesting to see how that stacks up against current MBA's. 

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post #86 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac-sochist View Post

People (for certain values of "people") whine about the "Apple Tax™"—but the real anchor tied around the industry's neck is the Intel Tax. The prices of their processors are highway robbery.

If it were possible to use an ARM processor instead of Intel (I have no opinion on its feasibility), that would be a great thing. Probably it will take a generation or two more before that's possible.

In the meantime: Adding an ARM processor like the A7 to a laptop would (proportionally) add almost nothing to the cost—could it be used to handle a lot of the housekeeping chores that CPU cycles are currently wasted on? Then the ARM processors could progressively take over more and more functions until the Intel chip could be done away with—some years down the road.

Highway robbery? Probably not. Each time Intel decreases the size of the process (i.e. 90 nm to 60 nm), the cost rises. 

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post #87 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

So no one would ever want a tablet in the same category as a laptop, huh.

Nope. 

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post #88 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

Could be. The Haswell-Y series performs ok at the maximum TDP, it's around a 2010 dual-core i5:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Core-i5-4202Y-Notebook-Processor.102728.0.html

The fanless designs might be restricting it below the maximum power but a small fan could be enough to keep it higher power:



A few people say they get on just fine with 6 or 7 year old hardware so 4 year old hardware should suffice for them. The biggest problem is getting the heat away from the CPU so a piezo fan can sit right next to it and blow over the top, spreading the heat out further.

Maybe Intel should put tiny low power piezo fans inside the CPU itself and force airflow between individual cores.

What I'm getting at is not the fan you show in the video, but a cluster of coin sized piezoelectric fans throughout the laptop chassis, one focused on each component that needs heat dissipation. And perhaps another near an air inlet and another near an air outlet. Controlled by firmware these could cycle on/off in various patterns to create the necessary airflow to cool based upon the type of work the machine is doing, and with discrete control over each in a cluster of these fans the firmware could optimize power conservation.
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post #89 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by psitthipo View Post

Try highlighting a sentence...you can only do it with press-down-click then drag your finger to highlight. If you double tap to click, it only highlights one word. 

Don't do it Apple, you will make a lot of people really angry!
When the multitouch trackpad came out in 2008 on MacBook Air, the way to highlight a sentence and to drag an object was a double tap with hold after the second tap with dragging without letting go after the second tap-and-hold. A couple years layer, Apple came out with a three-finger tap and drag for that purpose. When they did, they obsoleted the double-tap-hold-and-drag method. It can still be enabled, but it's not listed as a gesture in the Trackpad preference pane anymore; instead, it's in the accessibility preference pane.

My first Mac was a 2008 MacBook Air, followed by a 2008 unibody aluminum MacBook 13", followed by a 2009 unibody aluminum MacBook Pro 15". Therefore, I learned my drag using the double-tap-hold-and-drag method. I think the three-finger-tap-and-drag was first introduced in Lion. When I upgraded, I lost my favorite way to do dragging, and I spent some time trying to figure out why it didn't work anymore. Then I found it in the Accessibility preference pane. I tried the three-finger-tap-and-drag method, but didn't like it.

I have seen people who used Macs before 2008 click on the trackpad with one hand and while holding down the trackpad, use the other hand to drag. It looks really strange and outdated to me. I'm sure those who started using Macs with Lion, prefer the three-finger-tap-and-drag method, and consider the double-tap-hold-and-drag method as weird and outdated too.
Edited by sirozha - 3/22/14 at 6:36pm
post #90 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by december View Post


Ding ding ding! I believe you nailed it -- except the 13" MBP is here to stay; see below.

Since the price difference between the 11" and 13" MBA is only $100, it's really hard to justify going with the 11" on portability alone -- and paying for that portability with its small display. Could as well have priced it at $100 more than the 13", since price really doesn't play any role in the decision for the 11"; at least for me. It sort of is a Pro device; for those who need a full-size keyboard-equipped Mac with them at all times.
And the 13" is basically redundant. Anyone getting a 13" MBA today either hasn't done their homework comparing it to the 13" MBP; or is an idiot for skimping on the upgrades necessary to still be able to enjoy it a year or two down the road:
The only scenario where the 13" MBA is actually cheaper than the 13" MBP is when you're looking at the respective base models. But then you're stuck with 4 GB of RAM and a 1.3 GHz CPU; the 128 GB SSD might in fact be sufficient for many, as there's always external storage (but even that only really works when you're at your desk). Once you bring the specs up to 8 GB of RAM, which at $100 is a no-brainer, and the very reasonably-priced $150 CPU upgrade, you're already looking at $1349; and if you add to that the 256 GB SSD you're at $1549 -- $50 more than a 13" MBP with 8 GB of RAM, 256 GB SSD and a much faster CPU. Plus you're getting a retina display, and even a smaller footprint than the MBA's -- at the cost of a somewhat shorter battery life, and less than 18% more weight.

So if Apple were to consolidate the two into one 12" MBA, and reduce the bezel a little, that could be a very nice replacement for the 11"; preferably at the same $999. And for whom that is too small, there's the 13" MBP starting at $1299 (I had to check -- prices on retina MBPs really have come down!); soon to take the classic MBP's $1199 price point. So there really is no need for a 13" MBA, is there.
I bet the name will return; quite possibly with this very sensible 12" notebook. One model, which surely will become the top-selling Mac (that the MBA is now), one name. The 'Air' has been around for 6 years now (it's been six years already? WTF?!), so it sure would be time for something new. Or in this case old. Well, different. 1tongue.gif

december, I think you are on to something. We've all been waiting to see Apple intro a Retina MBA. It makes sense they would consolidate to an in between screen size of 12" rather than develop two separate Retina models at the low end of the Mac lineup. So it's to be a 12" MBA with Retina display and an intelligent cluster of slim, efficient, nearly silent, and reliable piezoelectric fans for component cooling. And something different about the trackpad (I haven't got that quite sorted yet).
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post #91 of 171
See me
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogar View Post

I remember reading about an apple patent related to the use of ionized air electrict, and magnetic fields to creat an air current without the need of fan... maybe they have perfected that technology and it is ready for deployment,

See message #17 where I hypothesize that Apple incorporate piezoelectric fans. GE seems to have perfected this and exactly for the purpose of replacing rotating fans in computers. A piezoelectric fan is nearly silent, uses half the energy and is more reliable. A cluster of such fans, each about the size of a quarter could be controlled by firmware to optimize airflow where needed according to the specific task the computer is performing, which would further increase energy conservation.

No need for all this theorizing about Haswell processors that don't need cooling or using the ARM-based processor from the iOS kit. Occam's Razor, folks!
Edited by RadarTheKat - 3/22/14 at 6:52pm
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post #92 of 171

In the new Mac Pro they didn't have separate heat sinks and fans for each chip, but a central heat sink that everything just pressed against. With something as thin as the Macbook Air, I wonder if they would use the case as the heatsink, and have the CPU literally pressed up against it?

post #93 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post


What is this craziness about drag? Read my post, two up.

And read my post. :p

 

You can't possibly use other multi-touch gestures with the 3-finger drag and it's awkward as heck to do it on a MacBook form factor. With the mechanical button, you can click with your thumb and freely move the cursor anywhere with the index finger and perform the 4-swipe Mission Control, so you can sweep to your desktop, click and hold a file, Mission Control to Skype or something, and drag it to there; you can't do that with the 3-finger drag.

 

Besides, I use BetterTouchTool to have 3-finger swipe up to go to the top of a page and 3-finger swipe down to go to the bottom of a page. So the 3-finger drag would fail or some other crazy thing would happen.

 

My Trackpad cursor speed is set such that I can move the cursor across the whole screen in a 1.5-inch circular area. The 3-finger drag is just awkward to do.

 

 

I just turned it on, and yeah it's awkward as heck since you have to drag your 3 fingers across the whole trackpad versus just 1. I also use 3-finger swipe left/right to go back/forward (quick swipe, so it's not awkward to do at all), so the 3-finger drag destroys that function.

 

 

Also, you can't rapidly click links without a mechanical button, just like a mouse.

 

You can say the same thing for a virtual keyboard vs physical keyboard. Sure, you can get things done, but the mechanical keyboard offers far more efficiency and functions. I use the best of both worlds with the current mechanical Trackpads and custom gestures and my workflow would be obliterated if I lost the function of the mechanical click. I use the drag-Mission Control-drop thing all the time, as with rapid clicking of links, and just having a convenient point-click, point-click, point-click mechanical/touch workflow instead of point, let go of trackpad, tap, point, let go of trackpad, tap, point, let go of trackpad, tap. It's just really slow.

 

And yes, I do game with the Trackpad. I'm actually worse when playing with a mouse. You can't play first-person shooter games without a mechanical click, period. Speed is key with FPS games, and a tap is not going to work out, let along having rhythmic shots with specific timing (tapping has a delay).


Edited by narfybob - 3/22/14 at 8:27pm
post #94 of 171
Didn't we see Apple patents within the last couple years that allow for fan-less heat dispersal via the keyboard? I don't think it was piezoelectric but rather some passive concept.

edit: The last one on the list is probably what I'm remembering.

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post #95 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Didn't we see Apple patents within the last couple years that allow for fan-less heat dispersal via the keyboard? I don't think it was piezoelectric but rather some passive concept.

I hope that's not it, the keyboard on the MBP already gets uncomfortably hot when gaming.

post #96 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I hope that's not it, the keyboard on the MBP already gets uncomfortably hot when gaming.

I think I was conflating the "solid-state cooling" with another patent regarding a waterproof membrane under the keyboard that still allowed for air to flow through it.

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post #97 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post
 

I hope that's not it, the keyboard on the MBP already gets uncomfortably hot when gaming.


Indeed. I thought the MacBooks already incorporate a cooling system that draws air into the keyboard...or at least that was part of the airflow system for some generations of MacBooks if I recall correctly. Because of this, I don't use the silicone keyboard covers on my MacBook.

post #98 of 171

Sir Jony Ive is a genius.  Not like those guys in the store, but a real one.  The Air is already a great product but this sounds even better,

post #99 of 171

The key is portability, and now it is possible with the new Intel chips. Apple should make a light (400 to 600 g) Mac, as small as possible and whih whatever form factor (clamshell, slider or tablet). Great for Keynote and PowerPoint presentations. The Mac in your pocket. Always.

post #100 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleSauce007 View Post

Wrong, wrong and wrong...  

iPhones and iPads ARM SOCs have the fastest GPUs around with power to spare. (Imagination Technologies Power VR)
This device will most certainly not use Intel Chips.


It will use ARM CPU and Power VR GPU and Flash for storage.

The keyboard and trackpad will be context sensitive on a sapphire glass slab.
It will run iOS with a modern laptop UI that borrows heavily from the iPad Air iOS 7 paradigm.
It will be 64 bit and super efficient and iCloud integrated.
It will run iOS applications that exist today.

So certain and yet so certainly wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iRun262 View Post

That sure would be a useless machine for those of us who use BootCamp!

I would never buy a computer with no ability to efficiently run the code that currently works on my MBA (all x86 software).

I can't see macs ever moving away from Intel. It was a genius transition.
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post #101 of 171

Intel and Macs were made for each other and that is the bottom line.

post #102 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by SudoNym View Post
 

Not like those guys in the store, but a real one. 

Lol, that's great. What if the reason they are changing from a click trackpad to a tap one, is that the base is *so* thin, there is just not enough height for a button that depresses? Would that be genius enough. :)

post #103 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by RadarTheKat View Post

It makes sense they would consolidate to an in between screen size of 12" rather than develop two separate Retina models at the low end of the Mac lineup. So it's to be a 12" MBA with Retina display and an intelligent cluster of slim, efficient, nearly silent, and reliable piezoelectric fans for component cooling.

I'd buy that. Me and a couple million others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RadarTheKat View Post

And something different about the trackpad (I haven't got that quite sorted yet).

Usability aside, the mechanical trackpad on the current MacBooks just feels dated. And knowing Apple that's enough reason for them to put some serious effort into sorting that out.
Edited by december - 3/23/14 at 5:50am
post #104 of 171
Well, end of gaming on the couch.
This means, the mouse is back.

Also, that quote feature is horrible on iPhone. I guess no user of Ai uses iPhone...
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

Unknown?

Umm...tap to click? Seriously who uses the press-down-anywhere to click? They should have done away with the button a while ago. Tap + Gestures is all I need.
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post #105 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by iRun262 View Post

That sure would be a useless machine for those of us who use BootCamp!
Obviously it wouldn't be a machine for you! Because boot camp and virtual machines are so important to Apples Mac lineup I don't think such a machine would be marketed as a "Mac". I can see it becoming something different that is neither a Mac nor an iOS device. The main reason Apple would do this is to be able to market a high quality machine 2-300 dollars cheaper than current laptops.

In any event useless is a state of mind, given the right OS support I'd jump on such a machine. The reality is I would either be using mainstream software likely to be quickly running on the machine or I will write my own. Besides the only VMs I run right now are to support Linux, I could see Linux running in a VM on an ARM based machine nicely. That won't happen overnight though.
Quote:
I would never buy a computer with no ability to efficiently run the code that currently works on my MBA (all x86 software).

I understand your point here but many of us have mixed needs. I have plenty of hardware for my legacy x86 needs. For my more general needs I don't really need that x86 capability. More so I would suspect that very very few of Apples mainstream customers give two hoots over running x86 code. Frankly this is no different than the initial fears that cropped up with iPad, if the machine is compelling software will come.

Frankly iPad is why I believe Apple could be working on an expanded performance ARM based device that isn't actually a tablet and more like a laptop. Done right the machine could immediately support all of the existing iPad apps out there while offering programmers the APIs to further leverage the machines architecture. To really fly though the machine has to offer much of the flexibility and access Mac OS does. That isn't as big a problem as some might imagine though.
post #106 of 171

Without a fan? My current laptop doesnt have a fan at all and runs totally silent. Thats down to it using an ARM processor and and SSD. 

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post #107 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

In the new Mac Pro they didn't have separate heat sinks and fans for each chip, but a central heat sink that everything just pressed against. With something as thin as the Macbook Air, I wonder if they would use the case as the heatsink, and have the CPU literally pressed up against it?

Bingo!

I was about to offer up something similar but you beat me to it. With Apples CNC'ed chassis process they can build heat sinking right into the laptops shell. This might require rearrangement of components, in this case the bottom shell becoming the heat sink / machined aluminum piece. The PC board would then be flipped so that the hot components are in contact with the aluminum via a thermal transfer media.

The problem here is thickness. To lower thermal resistance you need thick cross sections of aluminum. AIRs are currently rather thin so maybe we end up with more taper. I could actually see Apple adding short fins on the back edge as flat surface aren't the best for radiating heat. I can even see a black finish on the aluminum.

Given all of that I still think they will be forced to either ARM or Broadwell as you would likely need to limit power to about ten watts. Haswell based processors in this power range would be worst than ARM performance wise.
post #108 of 171

Maybe Apple could do a hybrid OS that boots in iOS, but when a user taps/clicks an app it will either run as an iOS app or "port" (in so many words) over to an anything-from-minimal-to-full-power OSX desktop, depending on the resources needed.

 

Ahem.

 

;)

post #109 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bondm16 View Post

Without a fan? My current laptop doesnt have a fan at all and runs totally silent. Thats down to it using an ARM processor and and SSD. 

I'm not sure why so many are arguing against the possibility of a fan less device, it is already a done deal as you point out. The only real question is this, does Apple go ARM or Intel?

Well the other question would be does the machine remain a Mac or end up running another OS. Apple has a lot of incentive to add something like a laptop to the iOS line. If that machine has all the restrictions of the current iOS devices then it won't be for me. However if it runs iPad apps along with more traditional UNIX like accessibility then I'd be interested. In my mind this is very doable.
post #110 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


I'm not sure why so many are arguing against the possibility of a fan less device, it is already a done deal as you point out. The only real question is this, does Apple go ARM or Intel?

Well the other question would be does the machine remain a Mac or end up running another OS. Apple has a lot of incentive to add something like a laptop to the iOS line. If that machine has all the restrictions of the current iOS devices then it won't be for me. However if it runs iPad apps along with more traditional UNIX like accessibility then I'd be interested. In my mind this is very doable.

I hope this doesnt get me into any bother or a load of nasty comments...my laptop is an HP 11 Chromebook. So yes it is already doable. ARM or Intel depends on battery life and performance I guess. 

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post #111 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

I'm not sure why so many are arguing….

Welcome to the internet. 1biggrin.gif
Quote:
Well the other question would be does the machine remain a Mac or end up running another OS. Apple has a lot of incentive to add something like a laptop to the iOS line. If that machine has all the restrictions of the current iOS devices then it won't be for me. However if it runs iPad apps along with more traditional UNIX like accessibility then I'd be interested. In my mind this is very doable.

That's an interesting question. My feeling is that Apple would want to continue the Mac brand even if they used ARM over Intel. I don't think they would add a laptop to the iOS line because that means adding a mouse pointer and a many drivers for peripherals that iOS doesn't have. Plus, I believe Tim when he says they aren't going to do what MS did with the Surface by trying to create a "no compromise" device that is nothing but a compromise. The simplest and best solution of the two is to make OS X work on ARM and update their IDE to allow for compiling Mac apps for ARM. That said, even simpler would be to continue using Intel chips even though they can save a lot of money with an ARM-based solution, but they could have saved a lot by not using the $250+ Intel chips in every Mac they've sold.

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post #112 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bondm16 View Post

I hope this doesnt get me into any bother or a load of nasty comments...my laptop is an HP 11 Chromebook. So yes it is already doable. ARM or Intel depends on battery life and performance I guess. 

In what way does that make it doable? Chrome OS is a very difference beast from iOS.

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post #113 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


In what way does that make it doable? Chrome OS is a very difference beast from iOS.

I'm not a tech expert. I just that seeing how efficient iOS is, I just thought it would be possible to run it on a similar platform.

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post #114 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bondm16 View Post

I'm not a tech expert. I just that seeing how efficient iOS is, I just thought it would be possible to run it on a similar platform.

OS X is also very efficient but it's also a desktop OS which means it has a lot more stuff in it since people expect a mouse pointer, expect to be able to plug in printers, scanners, and all sorts of additional items. I suppose Apple could create something in-between that is close to Chrome OS that has a mouse pointer but missing a lot of features that make it a robust desktop OS. I like Chrome OS but I don't think it's something Apple wants to focus on for their customers.

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post #115 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Howie View Post

Maybe Apple could do a hybrid OS that boots in iOS, but when a user taps/clicks an app it will either run as an iOS app or "port" (in so many words) over to an anything-from-minimal-to-full-power OSX desktop, depending on the resources needed.
It doesn't even need to be that complicated. Give the user the same general interface and start up iPad apps full screen as is done now. However give the user enough RAM and CPU horse power to keep the apps running in background, in other words eliminate the multitasking problem. That part of the machine would mostly remain iOS like. However that won't be good enough for many iOS/Mac users.

So you would need to offer more traditional UNIX like facilities. For example:
  1. a "Finder" or file browser of some sort.
  2. a terminal emulator.
  3. scripting facilities such as BASH and especially Python.
  4. the ability to install the vast trove of UNIX software out there including command line apps.
  5. the ability to install drivers as needed (free the I/O ports).
  6. run apps with true multitasking support not just a Apples blessed apps.
Note that none of these really require giving up the full screen nature of iOS apps. The Finder, a terminal emulator, even Pythons Idle could easily be reimplemented as iOS full screen apps. You really don't need to leave behind much of iOS's good features and frankly the jailbreak community has already demonstrated just how powerful iOS can be.

With a larger "laptop" like device, battery life is no longer the huge issue that has keep multitasking of user apps off of iOS. More importantly something as simple as Python support and a finder type app would vastly improve the user experience of an enhanced laptop iOS device.
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Ahem.

1wink.gif

In the end I can see many ways for Apple to deliver an ARM based "laptop" the above is just one example. The above example being a minimal impact way to enhance the iOS experience. Functionally this machine wouldn't be much different than current iOS machines to most users. The real multitasking wouldn't even be noticed in many cases. The only people using a terminal emulator, Finder and what ever else gets ported, would be those that really could use the features.

There are other ways of course but people can chew on this idea for awhile.
post #116 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by antkm1 View Post

there are a few uses still for the click.  When you restart or start up the Mac, you have to click to select your user account.  I've tried tapping more times than i can count.  Also, click-drag is still more intuitive and quicker than tap twice to move.  I usually click and hold with left hand and drag with right.  you can also two-finger scroll while click&hold with the other hand.  Sure, OS X has implemented other ways to do this without having to click and/or hold/drag.  but I've found it's quicker and easier for me to do it the conventional way.

In Mavericks, there is no need to click down for logging in at startup, at least with a Magic Trackpad. Tap to click was introduced for this functionality with Mavericks.
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post #117 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

1) When the articles say 12" MacBook do they mean a 12" MacBook or just a 12" device within Apple's notebook line? I can see a 12" MBA arriving as 11" is a little small (especially at 16:9) and 13" somewhat convolutes the decision for many buyers with the new MBP designs. I am not sure we'll see the MB line come back as the MBA line seems to fill that space nicely.

2) Fanless is interesting. It's certainly possible with some of Intel chips but as an ARM-based system it's also possible now that they have the MAS providing they update the SDK and give a decent lead time for developers to recompile their apps for AArch_64. My guess is that they would at least consider if the average MBA user isn't needed heavy computing with large apps from slow-to-update 3rd-party vendors. That said, I'd think it's likely a lower-power x86_64 chip.

Re MBA screen size: yes, whilst I'm sure the 11" has plenty of fans, I would always advise someone to buy the 13", because it's ergonomically better. The problem with the 11" is that if you have it on a table, the top of the screen is very low and you are looking down too far at it. It also feels somewhat odd having the keyboard so close to the low screen. The 13" is a much more relaxed experience. I guess 12" might be a reasonable compromise.
Edited by Benjamin Frost - 3/23/14 at 9:35am
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post #118 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthusia View Post

Some time ago, I mused on this forum about a mobile device with a laptop form factor. Instead of traditional keys, it would use a glass "keypad" with tactile feedback. It would be more mobile (thinner and lighter) than the current MacBook Air. This could be it and it probably will be a Mac. The iPad is already taken care of. Apple knows folks will slap a keyboard cover on it if need be.

The MacBook Air will be removed from the Mac product line and this will be branded simply MacBook. It will be $999 and it will be the best selling Mac ever. 

As another poster mentioned there exists Apple IP for tactile feedback "keypads". There also is IP for etching solar circuits on glass. The surface area of a buttonless "laptop" with a single sheet of glass with tactile feedback and a context aware keyboard/UI glass is the future. Apple wants to completely seal the device. (They also have IP for fusing glass (sapphire?) with Liquidmetal.) If used, such a keypad would eliminate a major source of damage-keyboard spills.

In less than 10 years, Apple has trained several generations of users to type on glass. 

You're now looking at fanless, keyless, .5 inch thick Retina device with a 12" display, Intel ULP processor, and 15 hours of battery life-all under 2 pounds. It's Jony Ive's dream machine, all glass and aluminum exterior. I definitely fantasize about this.

Dream machine? 2 inches more than an iPad Air for twice the weight? I don't think so.
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post #119 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by iRun262 View Post

That sure would be a useless machine for those of us who use BootCamp!

I would never buy a computer with no ability to efficiently run the code that currently works on my MBA (all x86 software).

You're a niche market.
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post #120 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Welcome to the internet. 1biggrin.gif
I need to run so this will be quick. I do believe though that people don't understand that Intels goal, probably pushed by Apple is chips suitable for tablets and other fan less devices. They really haven't made it there yet but it is a real goal.
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That's an interesting question. My feeling is that Apple would want to continue the Mac brand even if they used ARM over Intel.
It is possible but I see it as a marketing nightmare. Keeping all Mac devices x86 for now keeps the natives from getting restless. I don't see the Mac brand going away, I just see an ARM based device encroaching on Mac OS's capabilities.
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I don't think they would add a laptop to the iOS line because that means adding a mouse pointer and a many drivers for peripherals that iOS doesn't have.
Apparently mouse support isn't a problem, I haven't jail broken myself but that is what I hear. As for drivers, I understand, but Apple could take the same hard line attitude they currently have with iOS devices. You would still end up with a very salable device after all iPad sales have slowed. If the machine was so restricted I might be disinclined to buy one, it really depends upon the specifics. In any event there appears to be a big market for these "Internet" devices.
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Plus, I believe Tim when he says they aren't going to do what MS did with the Surface by trying to create a "no compromise" device that is nothing but a compromise.
It is only a compromise if you believe it to be so! For many it would be another iOS device with additional capabilities. Very much an improved device.
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The simplest and best solution of the two is to make OS X work on ARM and update their IDE to allow for compiling Mac apps for ARM.
In a way I could agree with this as I would absolutely love an ARM based, Mac OS, laptop. Obviously any technical restrictions are fading away real fast as ARM development continues. The problem I see is one of marketing and minimizing consumer confusion. It would be years before ARM would be good enough to replace all the x86 chips in Apples lineup, as such having two architectures supporting the same OS would be problematic. It would be far easier to extend iOS with more professional features.
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That said, even simpler would be to continue using Intel chips even though they can save a lot of money with an ARM-based solution, but they could have saved a lot by not using the $250+ Intel chips in every Mac they've sold.

Well that is an idea that is something to consider. I just don't see Apple going this route for performance reasons. Let's face it Mac Book AIRs would be less inviting than they are now with significantly slower hardware. The line has matured into a very nice laptop.

The Mini is perhaps the place where Apple could best put this idea to work, as an entry level machine the base Mini should be cheap. That would allow Apple to add real differential between the base model and the up sell model. The one frustrating thing with the Mini is that there isn't a huge performance gap between the entry machine and the high performance one even though there is a huge price differential. I was actually hoping to see them address this in a Haswell based Mini by now. In this case the high performance machine would come with Iris Pro, for all I care the base machine could stay with the current series of processors.

In any event pulled the thread off track there! I really think Apple has a lot of options when it comes to ARM based devices. I think the least likely is the device I would most want, that would be an ARM based Mac OS laptop with no restrictions. Given that some modest tweaks to iOS could make for a very interesting machine.
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