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Explicit content slipping through Apple's iTunes Radio profanity filters

post #1 of 67
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While Apple's iTunes Radio is set by default to block songs with explicit language from streaming, the current filters are far from perfect, with profane content slipping through the cracks to the surprise of some listeners.


Some explicit content gets through Apple's iTunes Radio filters


A reader who contacted AppleInsider said that although they had purposefully left the explicit content filter on, they found that multiple uncensored songs continued to play. In one example, an uncensored version of the track "Billionaire" by Travie McCoy and Bruno Mars, which features a prominent "f-word" in the opening lines of the song, was said to have played on numerous occasions in front of children.

In our own tests, we also found that explicit content was slipping through the cracks, though many censored songs were also playing with the toggle enabled. Still, many songs with language considered to be unacceptable on radio and television in the U.S. were still being played through iTunes Radio.

Conversely, it seems that the same issue also exists in reverse: Users turning off the filter, in order to allow explicit content to play, report continuing to hear censored tracks, rather than the original explicit language.


Even with explicit content allowed, some censored songs still play.


The issues have existed since iTunes Radio launched to the public last September, as indicated by numerous threads on the Apple Support Communities website. Users have suggested that competing streaming music services do not have this same issue.

"The 'allow explicit' is turned on for iTunes Radio and it's still playing explicit songs," user "Ben Hur" wrote. "We recently switched from Pandora where we didn't have this problem at all."

There have also been reports of unexpected content that may not be appropriate for certain audiences creeping into unexpected custom streaming stations. One user posted last year claiming that the station "Disney World Attraction Radio" began playing rap songs intended for mature audiences in front of their child.

There are two ways to enable or disable explicit content in iTunes Radio. The easiest is tapping the "i" button at the top of the screen while playing a station, then flipping the switch for "Allow Explicit Tracks."

Users can also disable all mature-language iTunes content by opening the iOS Settings application, choosing General, and then Restrictions. Under "Allowed Content," users can uncheck "Music & Podcasts," which will change the content filter to "clean." Doing so also removes the ability toggle such content back on through iTunes Radio.
post #2 of 67
This is awesome news. I've been looking to add a few words to my vocabulary for some time now. ;-)
post #3 of 67

This isn't exactly breaking news. The problem with Apple's filters is that it's filtering what is labeled explicit in the iTunes Store. 

 

Lots of items are labeled incorrectly in the store. And older (pre-iTunes store era release items) items might not be labeled at all. The service isn't perfect, and it seems Apple hasn't made updates or changes to it since it debuted. 

post #4 of 67
Well, f*ck me!!!
post #5 of 67

Wish they'd get a move on and offer iTunes Radio to their international customers, come on Apple you released this half a year ago. Show some love to the customers that pay far more for your goods than your American customer base!

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post #6 of 67
I have to weigh in because this is the one major issue I've had with iTunes Match since day one. The root of the problem goes back to iTunes itself. The "Explicit" tag needs to be separate item that can be selected under View Options, similar to "Part of a Compilation".

In my experience, iTunes Match incorrectly censored most of the Explicit songs in the Hip-Hop/Rap genre. I think part of the problem is that you are not given the opportunity to select Explicit or Censored when iTunes makes a match. Almost all music ripped from CDs or purchased from Amazon are incorrectly matched to censored versions. Since I used iTunes Match to replace all of my lower nitrate songs with higher quality versions, I'm forced to re-rip from CD or re-purchase to fix the problem.

What I'd really like the ability to do is toggle between Explicit and Censored on the fly for music in my library in the same fashion that iTunes Radio offers (once it's fixed). I manage all the music on my kid's iPod Touches to sync to playlists that only include "approved" songs that I deem appropriate. I've even run into an issue before buying a song that wasn't labeled Explicit that contained a prominent use of the S-word. iTunes was kind enough to refund the purchase, but I find the whole process very cumbersome. I'd gladly pay a nominal fee to have access to both versions of a song when I make purchases - maybe $1.49 instead of $1.29.

I've also had an issue with a Guns n' Roses album incorrectly matching to a censored version but it's not as obvious when it happens to a Rock song as when it happens in Hip-Hop/Rap.

Until Apple offers a fix, I guess I'll continue providing feedback (Provide iTunes Feedback) and hope that enough people do the same until the issues are resolved.
post #7 of 67

What's explicit anymore? George Carlin made news with his 7 explicit words that could never be said on TV yet I believe every single one of them is now used, at least on cable. Daytime TV uses several on them. Kids use them because their friends and family use them. I'm not condoning their use but it really isn't Apple's problem to regulate their use. There are a lot of people who say they don't swear but they still use offensive language and they are not stopped by any filter.

post #8 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob53 View Post
 

What's explicit anymore? George Carlin made news with his 7 explicit words that could never be said on TV yet I believe every single one of them is now used, at least on cable. Daytime TV uses several on them. Kids use them because their friends and family use them. I'm not condoning their use but it really isn't Apple's problem to regulate their use. There are a lot of people who say they don't swear but they still use offensive language and they are not stopped by any filter.

 

I think we can all agree on at least a few words should be classified as "explicit".  If you don't care what your kid hears- thats fine, just take explicit off.  I would hope that when my child is 13 year old that I don't want the risk of having F bombs dropped in songs. Of course, I'm sure the majority don't care (about anything- not just cursing).  Yes, 13 year olds hear F bombs all the time- it doesn't mean that I choose to promote the word.

 

Can we also agree that cursing it typically ignorant because you can't expand your vocabulary enough to create other adjectives, verbs, and noun (all of which an F bomb could be) ;)

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post #9 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob53 View Post

What's explicit anymore? George Carlin made news with his 7 explicit words that could never be said on TV yet I believe every single one of them is now used, at least on cable. Daytime TV uses several on them. Kids use them because their friends and family use them. I'm not condoning their use but it really isn't Apple's problem to regulate their use. There are a lot of people who say they don't swear but they still use offensive language and they are not stopped by any filter.

On network and basic cable shit is the only one that can be used. Or at least the last one I heard about via South Park circa 2001.

That said, I think the FCC's list for network TV is much more extensive than those infamous 7 words. I found this on Buzzfeed:

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post #10 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Well, f*ck me!!!
Yeah! I'll be buggered!!
post #11 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

Can we also agree that cursing it typically ignorant because you can't expand your vocabulary enough to create other adjectives, verbs, and noun (all of which an F bomb could be)

G. Rover Cripes, don't be a consarn scalawag. 1tongue.gif

No, we can't all agree that cursing in and of itself is a sign of ignorance and the lack of a diverse vocabulary. The import we put upon certain words are surely learned but no word, even cursed words are not actually cursed. They are a part of our diverse lexicon and can be used to great effect to make a point more poignant because the word carries a heavier meaning, not in spite of. This is the beauty of language.

Example 1:


Example 2:


Example 3:
Edited by SolipsismX - 3/31/14 at 9:01am

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post #12 of 67
I found the article also to suffer from profanity, with lines like: "slipping through the cracks", but maybe that's just Apple Inside 'er.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

Wish they'd get a move on and offer iTunes Radio to their international customers, come on Apple you released this half a year ago. Show some love to the customers that pay far more for your goods than your American customer base!

I hear you. Still, I simply registered for a free US iTunes account and enjoy US Radio now. Also handy for free apps in the App Store that aren't available in your country.

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post #13 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post
 

Wish they'd get a move on and offer iTunes Radio to their international customers, come on Apple you released this half a year ago. Show some love to the customers that pay far more for your goods than your American customer base!

 

That's not Apple's doing.  Blame the UK labels.  Part of the cost/benefit of national sovereignty.

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post #14 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B View Post

That's not Apple's doing.  Blame the UK labels.  Part of the cost/benefit of national sovereignty.
Apple was willing to negotiate with the same labels in the USA to arrange this. It didn't magically drop into their laps, all I'm asking is that they put a similar amount of effort into their UK/all other international operations.
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post #15 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


G. Rover Cripes, don't be a consarn scalawag. 1tongue.gif

No, we can't all agree that cursing in and of itself is a sign of ignorance and the lack of a diverse vocabulary. The import we put upon certain words are surely learned but no word, even cursed words are not actually cursed. They are a part of our diverse lexicon and can be used to great effect to make a point more poignant because the word carries a heavier meaning, not in spite of. This is the beauty of language.

There's the paradox.  If it is used in common and casual conversation, it loses it's poignancy and doesn't carry the heavy meaning it once did.  Essentially, without the discrepancy, it loses it's clout.

 

So I guess I'm saying that I'm for cursing, just not over-cursing.  Because when I curse, which is rare, I want it to really mean something. :smokey: 

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post #16 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B View Post

That's not Apple's doing.  Blame the UK labels.  Part of the cost/benefit of national sovereignty.
Apple was willing to negotiate with the same labels in the USA to arrange this. It didn't magically drop into their laps, all I'm asking is that they put a similar amount of effort into their UK/all other international operations.

They added Australia, so I would think there are more countries to follow. Check here for availability of iTunes Music, Radio & Match:

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT5085?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US
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post #17 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

There's the paradox.  If it is used in common and casual conversation, it loses it's poignancy and doesn't carry the heavy meaning it once did.  Essentially, without the discrepancy, it loses it's clout.

So I guess I'm saying that I'm for cursing, just not over-cursing.  Because when I curse, which is rare, I want it to really mean something. 1smoking.gif  

That could be a major why certain words fall out of use.



PS: Personally, I hate that there are words I won't use. It's just a string of letters or sound waves yet I won't use them because they are considered too taboo for today's society. I am a hypocrite because I also feel that no words should be off limits to adults. I should be able to use certain words in a non-pejorative manner without having to defend myself for its usage. The problem is we choose to get emotional about certain words and terms. Sure, this emotion is taught but we still choose to get upset because we see this string of letters or have our eardrums vibrated in a particular pattern. I find that sad. In fact, as noted by Louis C.K.'s hilarious monologue on SNL this past weekend he makes fun of the non-offensive term "wife beater" to refer to a style of T-shirt.

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post #18 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by sestewart View Post
 

This isn't exactly breaking news. The problem with Apple's filters is that it's filtering what is labeled explicit in the iTunes Store. 

 

Lots of items are labeled incorrectly in the store. And older (pre-iTunes store era release items) items might not be labeled at all. The service isn't perfect, and it seems Apple hasn't made updates or changes to it since it debuted. 

Seconded. This is something Apple has gotten away with on iTunes for a while, in lots of different forms.

 

1) Many tracks on iTunes are either not labeled at all, or are improperly labeled Clean/Explicit

2) iTunes Match has a VERY bad habit of a taking a Clean edit you may have of a song, and Matching it with the unedited Explicit version.

 

Both are well documented issues that Apple does not seem keen to address.

post #19 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

PS: Personally, I hate that there are words I won't use. It's just a string of letters or sound waves yet I won't use them because they are considered too taboo for today's society. I am a hypocrite because I also feel that no words should be off limits to adults. I should be able to use certain words in a non-pejorative manner without having to defend myself for its usage. The problem is we choose to get emotional about certain words and terms. Sure, this emotion is taught but we still choose to get upset because we see this string of letters or have our eardrums vibrated in a particular pattern. I find that sad. In fact, as noted by Louis C.K.'s hilarious monologue on SNL this past weekend he makes fun of the non-offensive term "wife beater" to refer to a style of T-shirt.

 

Saw that monologue.  Very funny.

 

Except c*nt... that word can only be used once in a lifetime, and be prepared to sleep on the couch.  :)

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post #20 of 67

The existence of such a system, the fact that a (supposedly) intelligent human being could rely on it to know what is good for him (or his children) to hear or not to hear is beyond my comprehension.

 

 

cf PMRC Senate Hearing :

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxB-ZePpS7E

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post #21 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

Saw that monologue.  Very funny.

Except c*nt... that word can only be used once in a lifetime, and be prepared to sleep on the couch.  1smile.gif

That's one of those words I'm talking about. You didn't use it in a negative context but you still didn't spell it out. Yet other words we will spell or say without fear of the lack of or neutral context being an issue. I find our lack of high-level thinking on this matter quite perplexing.

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post #22 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Users have suggested that competing streaming music services do not have this same issue.

 

Unfortunately this is not true.  I've had this same issue with Slacker Radio and have reported it to them multiple times.  I don't like profanity in music myself, but it's really infuriating when something unexpected pops up while the kids are in the car.  :mad:

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post #23 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

PS: Personally, I hate that there are words I won't use. It's just a string of letters or sound waves yet I won't use them because they are considered too taboo for today's society. I am a hypocrite because I also feel that no words should be off limits to adults.

 

Why is this a bad thing?  Language, like action, can offend, hurt or embarrass.  I hate that our society is starting to see boundaries of civility as a negative.  Like burping at the dinner table, profanity should be seen as both unnecessary and undesirable.

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post #24 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedHotFuzz View Post

Why is this a bad thing?  Language, like action, can offend, hurt or embarrass.  I hate that our society is starting to see boundaries of civility as a negative.  Like burping at the dinner table, profanity should be seen as both unnecessary and undesirable.

So context has no meaning for you? So you don't see a difference between a bigoted comment that uses no negative terminology" vs. a using a bigoted term in a non combative way?

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post #25 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

So context has no meaning for you? So you don't see a difference between a bigoted comment that uses no negative terminology" vs. a using a bigoted term in a non combative way?

 

Of course.  But there are words I find unnecessary regardless of context, which is something some people choose to hide behind when throwing out words they know will likely inflame.

 

Frankly I find most profanity in music gratuitous and gimmicky.  It's all about the shock value.

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post #26 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedHotFuzz View Post

Of course.  But there are words I find unnecessary regardless of context, which is something some people choose to hide behind when throwing out words they know will likely inflame.

Frankly I find most profanity in music gratuitous and gimmicky.  It's all about the shock value.

You're missing the point. I'm talking about using language without any intent to inflame, and yet there is a major divide between these all these inflammatory, derogative words that we will or won't use in a disinterested manner because the reader or listener chooses to get worked up over the placement of letters or utterance of a sound even when the context clearly shows it's not pejorative.

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post #27 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


G. Rover Cripes, don't be a consarn scalawag. 1tongue.gif

No, we can't all agree that cursing in and of itself is a sign of ignorance and the lack of a diverse vocabulary. The import we put upon certain words are surely learned but no word, even cursed words are not actually cursed. They are a part of our diverse lexicon and can be used to great effect to make a point more poignant because the word carries a heavier meaning, not in spite of. This is the beauty of language.

Example 1:


Example 2:


Example 3:

 

When it's intended to be used for dramatic effect, a curse can be quite effective, but let's get real.   As used by most comics, in much music and by people being interviewed, it's far over-used and it's a crutch.     If you have to say f__k every few words, then I would agree with the OP that it's used by people who have a very limited vocabulary and imagination.

 

I also disagree with the person who posted that words are just sound waves.   Words have very specific meanings and contexts and they're far from just sound waves.   Words can be very hurtful.    Call your girlfriend a c__t and see if you still agree that it's just a sound wave.  

 

I actually hate it when John Stewart curses because who is he doing it for?   It's not like there's a way you can hear it un-bleeped.   The only people who hear it uncensored are the studio audience.    IMO, that makes his cursing a bit absurd and since he does it so often - multiple times per show - it's also not very effective.    

 

As far as children are concerned, it's not that they're going to have some kind of breakdown if they happen to hear a curse-word in the media.   It's that hearing such words in the media makes them acceptable for daily use, regardless of the audience.     We used to filter what we'd say depending upon who was listening.    We talked to our friends on the street corner differently than we'd talk to our parents or a teacher or even a waiter in a local diner.    What's happened today is that everyone has lost their filters.   That doesn't make us more honest - it only makes us more vulgar and IMO, is part of the dumbing down of America. 

 

But getting back to the original topic, I can only think of two cases where this "bug" would be a problem:   where kids listen and where music is played publicly.    Does anyone else who personally listens to rap/hip-hop actually choose to NOT listen to the explicit version?    Seems to me that if you don't want to hear the explicit version, then you don't really want to listen to the "song" at all.    And this should be easy for Apple to fix as long as they're tying every track of every album to the original SKU#.   While the SKU itself doesn't provide info as to whether it's the explicit version or not, once that's known, the SKU can be used to control the filter.   This is Metadata 101.  

post #28 of 67
I guess it's time for me to weigh in on a pet peeve of mine related to this topic, though slightly different from the gripe (which seems like a bug). The "explicit" rating system is poorly implemented and over-simplistic.

It's not just the famous 7 words that should get a song the "explicit" rating. I can hear some of you saying "huh?!", but I'll list the lyrics below of a song that's completely inappropriate in the context of, say, an 11 year old daughter that loves to listen to popular music, and yet it's NOT marked explicit on the iTunes store, apparently because it doesn't use any of a specific set of words (this may have changed, as song ratings do change over time, but true last time I checked).


Macklemore: The Penis Song

Ladies and gentlemen
Introducing, the penis song.
(Oh no he didn't)
(Honk a dick)

This is my penis song
I wish that I had a bigger shlong
One that was quite a bit more thick and way more long
One of those porno king kong dongs

Check it out
I wish my dick was bigger, I can admit it
I'm above average on inches but I want a damn double digit
If I had a big ol' cock what would I do?
I'd probably go to Florida and show it Katrina and screw
Get buck naked and start streaking at my school
And get arrested but at least the girls would be impressed
With my third leg and, and then I'd go to a keg and
Do a keg stand, get drunk and do the running man
With no clothes on just to show off
My dick's bigger than yours when mine is cold and soft
Haha, oh yeah I forgot that's not really the cock that I have
I went out and party-bagged 'em and quickly opened the package
And it fit me like Kriss Kross's old school starter jackets
Trying to convince myself like, "Size doesn't matter, "
Anyways I'd probably just put it on backwards cause I mean
I know that god made us all different and special
But shit did he really have to invent lopsided testicles?
I don't have them I just feel bad for the like you know the guys with like
Their left one hangs like lower than the right, kinda like a lazy eye like on your balls
I mean I don't know, I just feel bad

This is my penis song
I wish that I had a bigger shlong
One that was quite a bit more thick and way more long
Fellas if ya'll feel me sing along

Yo ladies
Yeah?
Ladies!
Yeah?
Do you want a guy with an average dick?
Hell no
Then- wait you don't?
No you honkey dick
Okay that's cool, no that's fine

I promise, I'm so self conscious
That's why you never see me skinny dippin' in August
Always walkin' around with my hands in my pockets trying to pump blood into my guy Alfonso
I mean, goddamn I don't think you girls understand
I've had a complex since that song Short Short Man
And even though girls have told me that I'm big when I watch a porno I feel like a little kid
I mean, let's take Ron Jeremy
Now if a girl sees him she'll compare him to me
And every MC in hip hop has got a huge cock
Or at least talks about it in every song that they've got
I mean, shit
If I was really hung I'd make a whole album called Me and My Dick
With interludes of all the girls that I'd been with
And talk about my package and multiple orgasms
'Cause all that I see is that size does matter
We got Enzite, penis pumps surgery to Viagra
But when it all adds up you can't really change it
I'm not a porno star I just gotta face it
You know, what can I do
This song goes out to like all the like little bit above average dudes
So like all the small dudes, medium dudes but all you big dudes stop

This is my penis song
I wish that I had a bigger shlong
One that was quite a bit more thick and way more long
Fellas if ya'll feel me sing along



I don't give a tiniest shit what we listen to as adults. I have my share of raunchy music from back in the day that I don't make available to my kids.

Does anyone else think this track should get away without an "explicit" rating?

Let me rephrase that. Does anyone who has or had daughters think this song is okay for kids?
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post #29 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

Except c*nt... that word can only be used once in a lifetime, and be prepared to sleep on the couch.  1smile.gif

Not here in The Netherlands. We use it all the time, including women. And it sounds just as 'blunt' in Dutch. If it comes out less ferociously we add 'mess' to it: KUTZOOI!

Yep, we're pretty crazy over here.
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post #30 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


You're missing the point. I'm talking about using language without any intent to inflame, and yet there is a major divide between these all these inflammatory, derogative words that we will or won't use in a disinterested manner because the reader or listener chooses to get worked up over the placement of letters or utterance of a sound even when the context clearly shows it's not pejorative.


No, I get your point, I just don't agree with it.  There are plenty of intelligent ways to express an idea, emotion or opinion without resorting to words that are well-known to inflame or offend.

 

Regarding music, I find few things more agitating than a bizarrely-placed F word in the middle of a beautiful song.  It's like a dog dropping a dookie on your freshly-mowed lawn.  It's annoying and it stinks.

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post #31 of 67

Thanks, Obama!

post #32 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blah64 View Post

Does anyone else think this track should get away without an "explicit" rating?

 

That song is not labeled as explicit???  Are you kidding?????  Wow.  The world has failed.

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post #33 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post

When it's intended to be used for dramatic effect, a curse can be quite effective, but let's get real.   As used by most comics, in much music and by people being interviewed, it's far over-used and it's a crutch.     If you have to say f__k every few words, then I would agree with the OP that it's used by people who have a very limited vocabulary and imagination.

I also disagree with the person who posted that words are just sound waves.   Words have very specific meanings and contexts and they're far from just sound waves.   Words can be very hurtful.    Call your girlfriend a c__t and see if you still agree that it's just a sound wave.  

I actually hate it when John Stewart curses because who is he doing it for?   It's not like there's a way you can hear it un-bleeped.   The only people who hear it uncensored are the studio audience.    IMO, that makes his cursing a bit absurd and since he does it so often - multiple times per show - it's also not very effective.    

As far as children are concerned, it's not that they're going to have some kind of breakdown if they happen to hear a curse-word in the media.   It's that hearing such words in the media makes them acceptable for daily use, regardless of the audience.     We used to filter what we'd say depending upon who was listening.    We talked to our friends on the street corner differently than we'd talk to our parents or a teacher or even a waiter in a local diner.    What's happened today is that everyone has lost their filters.   That doesn't make us more honest - it only makes us more vulgar and IMO, is part of the dumbing down of America. 

But getting back to the original topic, I can only think of two cases where this "bug" would be a problem:   where kids listen and where music is played publicly.    Does anyone else who personally listens to rap/hip-hop actually choose to NOT listen to the explicit version?    Seems to me that if you don't want to hear the explicit version, then you don't really want to listen to the "song" at all.    And this should be easy for Apple to fix as long as they're tying every track of every album to the original SKU#.   While the SKU itself doesn't provide info as to whether it's the explicit version or not, once that's known, the SKU can be used to control the filter.   This is Metadata 101.  

1) Andysol didn't say that the excessive use of a word or phrase is a sign of a limited vocabulary, he stated that the use of it at all — with no qualification for excessiveness — "is typically ignorant because you can't expand your vocabulary enough to create other adjectives, verbs, and noun." That's not factual.

2) I wrote that words are letter in a particular order and sound waves. That is undeniably true. It's that association with these forms as emotions that is the problems if they ignorantly applied to those forms and not the context in which they are meant. Do you think that having a conversation with someone where you say the word **** in a complete neutral form is worse than yelling at your girlfriend but calling her a "raging c-word" without actually saying ****? Come on! That's fucking* stupid.


* Fucking used for emphasis.

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post #34 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


So context has no meaning for you? So you don't see a difference between a bigoted comment that uses no negative terminology" vs. a using a bigoted term in a non combative way?
 
I'd love to hear how C*nt is used in a non-combative way.  And by that I mean in general conversation- not simply talking about the word like I am.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blah64 View Post

Does anyone else think this track should get away without an "explicit" rating?

Let me rephrase that. Does anyone who has or had daughters think this song is okay for kids?

That song is not okay for anyone.  These are lyrics? oh pop music... how you make it through the decades I'll never know.

 

But ya- have 2 daughters- no thanks on that song.

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post #35 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


1) Andysol didn't say that the excessive use of a word or phrase is a sign of a limited vocabulary, he stated that the use of it at all — with no qualification for excessiveness — "is typically ignorant because you can't expand your vocabulary enough to create other adjectives, verbs, and noun." That's not factual.
 

I'll disagree.  With the same inflection, one could call something "F*cking big" or "gargantuan" and get the same point across.  Now if someone were to say "F*cking gargantuan"- I don't see how that makes something sound any bigger or makes my ears perk up more.

The problem is that most cursers say "F*cking big" because they can't think of anything better to say.

 

I have an over-curser in my office.  Instead of hearing his point- I think "Man- can he say a sentence without cursing?"

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post #36 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blah64 View Post



Let me rephrase that. Does anyone who has or had daughters think this song is okay for kids?

I think it's okay for 12 and above.    I certainly have less of a problem with that song, which is meant to be a joke and isn't hurtful to anyone than with a rapper who talks about "bitches and hoes".     But let's say it isn't okay for a 12-year-old.    Why does it need to be censored?    Why can't parents raise their kids so either 

a) they'd have no interest in that song   -or-

b) they'd tell their kid that they didn't want them listening to it (and the kid would actually obey).

 

Why are you asking Apple to be a parent to your child?

 

Back in the day, my daughter was reading some Judy Blume book (probably intended for teens or tweens), where the young girl takes off her blouse when a boy she likes refuses to leave her bedroom (or something like that).   I happened to catch that page and I said to my daughter that it wasn't for her yet and I didn't want her reading it.    She said, "fine" and that was that.   She never read it, but if she had snuck reading it anyway, I probably would have figured that it meant she was mature enough to handle it.     Certainly, even 10-year-old girls know that boys are sexually attracted to them, even if they don't understand every aspect of what that physical attraction means.  

post #37 of 67
Originally Posted by Blah64 View Post
Macklemore: The Penis Song

 

0/10, would not rise to appreciate.

 

 

 

Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post
Why can't parents raise their kids so either 

a) they'd have no interest in that song   -or-

b) they'd tell their kid that they didn't want them listening to it (and the kid would actually obey).

 

Because that’s too hard. 

 

EDIT: I’M SO SORRY. I DIDN’T MEAN THAT TO BE A JOKE.

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There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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post #38 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

I'd love to hear how c.unt is used in a non-combative way.

Done.
Quote:
And by that I mean in general conversation- not simply talking about the word like I am.

So now you want a very specific type of example without considering that a word that is oft used in a pejorative way doesn't have to be used in a pejorative way? That's just ridiculous!

Show me a dictionary or encyclopedia that refers to vulgar and derogatory terms in a language with symbols found above the number row on a keyboard instead of actually spelling it out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

I'll disagree.  With the same inflection, one could call something "F*cking big" or "gargantuan" and get the same point across.  Now if someone were to say "F*cking gargantuan"- I don't see how that makes something sound any bigger or makes my ears perk up.
The problem is that most cursers say "F*cking big" because they can't think of anything better to say.

I have an over-curser in my office.  Instead of hearing his point- I think "Man- can he say a sentence without cursing?"

Again, you're using a very limited scope to make a declaration for everything. This comnversrtaion clearly shows that you, zoetmb and RedHotFuzz are putting your emotions before your critical thinking. Have you ever considered why these words get you so upset? Did you even read the page of outmoded curse words?

The worse part of all this is people thinking that using the specific, altered terms: N-word, C-Word, F-you, etc. in a nasty way somehow exempts them.


edit: This is likely an example of a bigoted comment poking fun at how native speakers of different language speak additional languages but since he doesn't use one the predetermined cursed words you were taught I have to think this is not an issue for you.

Edited by SolipsismX - 3/31/14 at 11:37am

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post #39 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

So now you want a very specific type of example without considering that a word that is oft used in a pejorative way doesn't have to be used in a pejorative way? That's just ridiculous!

Show me a dictionary or encyclopedia that refers to vulgar and derogatory terms in a language with symbols found above the number row on a keyboard instead of actually spelling it out.

The dictionary is simply spelling it out and providing a definition.  And yes- I would like an example of how it is used in a way that is not pejorative.

 

There are two sides to this coin on other words.  Take the N-word.  There is a camp that thinks it should be used so often that it no longer has a negative connotation, and there is a camp that never wants it used for any reason- rap songs or otherwise.

Who is right?  I have no idea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post
 

I think it's okay for 12 and above.    I certainly have less of a problem with that song, which is meant to be a joke and isn't hurtful to anyone than with a rapper who talks about "bitches and hoes".     But let's say it isn't okay for a 12-year-old.    Why does it need to be censored?    Why can't parents raise their kids so either 

a) they'd have no interest in that song   -or-

b) they'd tell their kid that they didn't want them listening to it (and the kid would actually obey).

 

Why are you asking Apple to be a parent to your child?

I agree with you completely.  However, I think he meant if he puts on a station on iTunes Radio, then that song shouldn't play.  Say your daughter has her headphones on and shes listening to "katy perry radio" or some godawful station, so you don't get to hear that to have the opportunity to tell them to not listen to it because you never heard it.  Yes, I would love to monitor my child all the time, but the reality is that isn't a reality.

Again- I agree- and I'm with you- a big believer of making sure you raise your kids.  Not depending on the church, school, friends, etc, but if a program is going to say it will do something, one should hope it would.

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post #40 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

The dictionary is simply spelling it out and providing a definition.  And yes- I would like an example of how it is used in a way that is not pejorative.

It's been done and you just explained one way it which is can be done, but if you want other examples take the word fag or homo. Each of these can be used in a negative way but also be used in a neutral way with the same spelling and pronunciation.
Quote:
There are two sides to this coin on other words.  Take the N-word.  There is a camp that thinks it should be used so often that it no longer has a negative connotation, and there is a camp that never wants it used for any reason- rap songs or otherwise.
Who is right?  I have no idea.

There is truth that the excessive use of a term reduces its effect but in regards to the "N-word" that will never happen. For society to allow any term to be accepted that term can't be segregated to particular group or groups within a given society.

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