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Apple's iPhone 5s remains best selling smartphone in US as handset market softens, shifts - Page 2

post #41 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic View Post

island hermit: "... and yet the S4, now a year old, is still in 2nd or 3rd place. Makes that "no longer 'new'" argument seem a bit pale."

The iPhone 5s is also a 2013 model. Samsung will be coming out soon with the Galaxy S5, and shortly after that Apple will come out with the iPhone 6... but in the meantime, it is fair to compare the two 2013 model phones.

 

That wasn't the point.

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post #42 of 64

island hermit ignoring the fact that 5C is the #2 phone in the world for Jan and Feb 2014

post #43 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by tzeshan View Post


HTC One M8 was released on March 25.  How does it take second place at Verizon?  So the numbers are shipped not actual sales?  Further, it easily trumped Samsung in March.  Does it mean Verizon did not order too much Samsung S4 and did not order any S5?

There was an immediate BOGO offer on the M8. I initially thought it was for the remaining stock of M7s.
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post #44 of 64

A bit more context for the Samsung basher:

 

Top 10 smartphone* list of February 2014

Rank Brand Model Category
1 Apple iPhone 5S smartphone
2 Apple iPhone 5C smartphone
3 Samsung Galaxy S4 smartphone
3 Samsung Note 3 smartphone
5 Apple iPhone 4S smartphone
6 Samsung Galaxy S4 Mini smartphone
7 Xiaomi Hongmi Redrice smartphone
8 Samsung Galaxy S3 smartphone
9 Samsung Galaxy S3 mini smartphone
10 Xiaomi MI 3 smartphone

Apple is #1, #2 and #5. So they are #1. Samsung meanwhile has half the devices in the top 10 including 2 in the top 5. That is a great spot to be in. They are clearly the #2 smartphone maker. Clearly a good position to be in. Also, Apple is not going to be the only smartphone maker in the world. Everyone else is not going to just give up and stick with feature phones. Folks are not going to just stop making tablets either. So if it wasn't Samsung on that list, it would just be somebody else.

P.S. Amazon is going to come out with their own Android (actually Kindle) smartphone later this year. So I guess you are going to root for them? Or against?

post #45 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

island hermit ignoring the fact that 5C is the #2 phone in the world for Jan and Feb 2014

And you're ignoring the diagram included in the article. I can't remember ever not seeing a iPhone in the number 3 spot until now. I wouldn't be surprised if sales fail to meet expectations.
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post #46 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


And you're ignoring the diagram included in the article. I can't remember ever not seeing a iPhone in the number 3 spot until now. I wouldn't be surprised if sales fail to meet expectations.

 

Dude,  that diagram is only for a few selected carriers in the USA ONLY.

 

What I'm referring to is WORLD-WIDE SALES in Jan and Feb. 

post #47 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by mensmovement View Post

A bit more context for the Samsung basher:

Top 10 smartphone* list of February 2014
Rank Brand Model Category
1 Apple iPhone 5S smartphone
2 Apple iPhone 5C smartphone
3 Samsung Galaxy S4 smartphone
3 Samsung Note 3 smartphone
5 Apple iPhone 4S smartphone
6 Samsung Galaxy S4 Mini smartphone
7 Xiaomi Hongmi Redrice smartphone
8 Samsung Galaxy S3 smartphone
9 Samsung Galaxy S3 mini smartphone
10 Xiaomi MI 3 smartphone

Apple is #1, #2 and #5. So they are #1. Samsung meanwhile has half the devices in the top 10 including 2 in the top 5. That is a great spot to be in. They are clearly the #2 smartphone maker. Clearly a good position to be in. Also, Apple is not going to be the only smartphone maker in the world. Everyone else is not going to just give up and stick with feature phones. Folks are not going to just stop making tablets either. So if it wasn't Samsung on that list, it would just be somebody else.

P.S. Amazon is going to come out with their own Android (actually Kindle) smartphone later this year. So I guess you are going to root for them? Or against?

(Quote formatting removed because Huddler still lets posters use HTML without correcting issues)

I don't think that chart is working for you the way you think it is. Apple has 30% of the Top 10 spots which include a device that came out back in 2011 at spot number 5. Those are the all the smartphones they are selling. They don't sell the iPhone 5, iPhone 4, iPhone 3GS, iPhone 4G or original iPhone so they can't possibly dominate those other spots.

On top of that your un-cited chart has the Samsung Galaxy S4 and Note 3 between the iPhone 5C and iPhone 4S. Higher than an iPhone came out 30 months ago v two flagship device that came 11 and 6 months ago, respectively, doesn't look good. The article in which you're posting has charts that make the 5C and 4S look bad and the Galaxy S4 et al. Android-based devices look good, but your chart do not.

Finally, just mentioning anything after the 30 month old iPhone 4S and Xiaomi hurts Samsung's image even further.
Edited by SolipsismX - 4/3/14 at 1:07pm

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post #48 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


And you're ignoring the diagram included in the article. I can't remember ever not seeing a iPhone in the number 3 spot until now. I wouldn't be surprised if sales fail to meet expectations.

 

Actually, I'm just ignoring Sog. I have had him blocked for quite a while now. One rampage too many...  lol

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post #49 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

Dude,  that diagram is only for a few selected carriers in the USA ONLY.

What I'm referring to is WORLD-WIDE SALES in Jan and Feb. 

2 of those 'select' carriers account for 2 out of 3 people in the US. Their sales numbers are not something to be taken lightly.
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post #50 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


2 of those 'select' carriers account for 2 out of 3 people in the US. Their sales numbers are not something to be taken lightly.

 

who cares.  Worldwide figures are much more important.

 

Worldwide 5C is #2

post #51 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post
 

 

Actually, I'm just ignoring Sog. I have had him blocked for quite a while now. One rampage too many...  lol

 

My main rampage with you was about the 5C.

 

you said it would be an utter failure and should have been priced at $300.

 

Now its the #2 phone in the world the last 4 months.  Guess who got it right?  You or Apple?

post #52 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


(Quote formatting removed because Huddler still lets posters use HTML without correcting issues)

I don't think that chart is working for you the way you think it is. Apple has 30% of the Top 10 spots which include a device that came out back in 2011 at spot number 5. Those are the all the smartphones they are selling. They don't sell the iPhone 5, iPhone 4, iPhone 3GS, iPhone 4G or original iPhone so they can't possibly dominate those other spots.

On top of that your un-cited chart has the Samsung Galaxy S4 and Note 3 between the iPhone 5C and iPhone 4S. Higher than an iPhone came out 30 months ago v two flagship device that came 11 and 6 months ago, respectively, doesn't look good. The article in which you're posting has charts that make the 5C and 4S look bad and the Galaxy S4 et al. Android-based devices look good, but your chart do not.

Finally, just mentioning anything after the 30 month old iPhone 4S and Xiaomi hurts Samsung's image even further.

My un-cited chart? http://www.counterpointresearch.com/top-10-smartphones-in-february-2014

With that out of the way:

1. "Apple has 30% of the Top 10 spots".

 

I said that Apple was the #1 smart phone maker, did I not?

 

2. "Those are the all the smartphones they are selling. They don't sell the iPhone 5, iPhone 4, iPhone 3GS, iPhone 4G or original iPhone so they can't possibly dominate those other spots."

 

True but irrelevant. Having more devices on the market is part of Samsung's strategy. Since Samsung is one of the biggest electronics manufacturers in the world, they can leverage that by making more devices and writing off the phones that do not sell. Apple doesn't need to do that, which is why they are #1. But that is not the point. The point is that the other, smaller manufacturers like LG, HTC, Nokia etc. can't do that because that business model would cause them to go bankrupt in 18 months. They can't match Samsung's range of devices on the market or volume manufacturing/shipping or huge advertising strategy. That is why they are, well, behind Samsung and will stay there. Samsung's only real competition in the Android space right now is Amazon, and will be until Google gets serious about their Google Play line in 2015. 

 

3."Higher than an iPhone came out 30 months ago v two flagship device that came 11 and 6 months ago, respectively, doesn't look good."

 

Is looking good the object, or is selling phones? Windows and HTC look good but they have like 5% of the smartphone market between them.

 

4. "Android-based devices look good, but your chart do not."

How, when 7 of the 10 devices on the chart are Android phones?

 

5. "Finally, just mentioning anything after the 30 month old iPhone 4S and Xiaomi hurts Samsung's image even further."

 

If being the #2 smartphone maker is bad for your image, what does that say about #3? 

 

Any way you slice it, Samsung is in a good position. They are the #2 smartphone and tablet maker despite having no ecosystem to drive their devices like Microsoft, Apple and Amazon (tablets and streaming device with a phone coming out this year). And should they ever have any reason to switch from Android, they can just switch to their own OS which natively runs Android apps. 


Samsung only "looks bad" to those who have convinced themselves that Apple would be the only smart device maker on the planet with absolutely no competition were it not for Samsung. But as stated earlier, if Samsung weren't #2, another Android smart device maker would be.

post #53 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by mensmovement View Post

My un-cited chart? http://www.counterpointresearch.com/top-10-smartphones-in-february-2014

Don't get an attitude. Your chart had no citation.
Quote:
I said that Apple was the #1 smart phone maker, did I not?

And backhanded compliment usually say something nice first.
Quote:
True but irrelevant.

It's not irrelevant. There are only two major players and you're trying to claim that Android (an OS) is "winning" by domination over the iPhone (a device by one vendor) despite every iPhone being sold is being reprented and much better levels than the chart this article is based on despite your odd anti-Apple tilt.
Quote:
Having more devices on the market is part of Samsung's strategy.

Their strategy to make more money with the S4 and have it rank better than the iPhone 4S is by having hundreds of other devices? What?!
Quote:
Is looking good the object, or is selling phones? Windows and HTC look good but they have like 5% of the smartphone market between them.

Looking good is clearly a reference to their unit sales ranking which is shown here to be much, much worse than the source chart shows.
Quote:
How, when 7 of the 10 devices on the chart are Android phones?

If that's your logic then why not make a chart for a 100 or 1000 smartphones. Then Android-based devices will probably dominate well over 90 or 900 spots and the iPhone will still only have three making their presence by your standards only 3% or 0.3%.
Quote:
If being the #2 smartphone maker is bad for your image, what does that say about #3?

Again, you're chart shows the mid-range, iPhone 5C that is using old components as besting both the top end Galaxy S4 and Note 3. That looks worse than the original charts where the 5C isn't even making the top 3. The only way it's a good thing that Samsung is the #2 smartphone maker is if you really care about Xiaomi and yet it's a company most don't know. People know and care about Samsung and Apple. Apple the number 1 maker of smartphones by a wide margin and Samsung the number maker of Android-based devices by a wide margin to the next closest Android-based developer.
Quote:
Any way you slice it, Samsung is in a good position.

No one is denying that but the questions till remains why you are so strong on Samsung and Android that you'd post info that makes them look weaker in comparison to Apple. But, hey, knock yourself out. I'm looking forward to the list of the 1000 smartphones that show Apple only ranks in 0.3% of the spots. 1hmm.gif


PS: It's annoying to fix your quoting so I may not reply to you again.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #54 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

who cares.  Worldwide figures are much more important.

Worldwide 5C is #2

A lot of people care. I'm not discounting the importance of worldwide sales, but US sales are a strong indicator of total sales figures.
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post #55 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


A lot of people care. I'm not discounting the importance of worldwide sales, but US sales are a strong indicator of total sales figures.

 

No kidding. In the US* the 5c is #4 at best on the top 4 carriers but, somehow, sales in the rest of the world have made it #2. Hmmmm...

 

... and I do trust Cannacord's figures more than most.

 

I am curious about the December chart, though... hmmmmm....

 

(*the USA... you know, the place where sales of the 5c are, apparently, stronger than anywhere else in the world)

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post #56 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post
 

The Galaxy S4 is a a much older phone than the 5s. Wasn't it released around April last year? For all the people here that continue to say large display phones don't sell in any significant quantity, the chart above seems to disagree with you.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post


Yup, announced last March and available to buy in April/13. The latest iPhones went on sale starting late October IIRC, about a 6 month gap between the two. I guess this is the schedule Samsung will be sticking with for awhile. Makes complete sense.

 

What's most surprising to me is the Note 3 actually making such a strong showing.  While I certainly laughed at the 'DED math' when he compared like a month of Note 3 sales against a years worth of S4/iPhone sales to declare the Note3 and phablets in general as complete failures- what I didn't expect is sales to be anywhere near the top 3 or even outselling the 5c on any carriers.  At that size you'd think it would be in much more of a niche.


Edited by Frood - 4/3/14 at 6:00pm
post #57 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frood View Post



What's most surprising to me is the Note 3 actually making such a strong showing.  While I certainly laughed at the 'DED math' when he compared like a month of Note 3 sales against a years worth of S4/iPhone sales to declare the Note3 and phablets in general as complete failures- what I didn't expect is sales to be anywhere near the top 3 or even outselling the 5c on any carriers.  At that size you'd think it would be in much more of a niche.

The 'Ellen' factor maybe?
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post #58 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


I can't remember ever not seeing a iPhone in the number 3 spot until now.

Bollocks! Try and find just one example of these Canaccord figures showing an iPhone in 3rd place.

Quote:
I wouldn't be surprised if sales fail to meet expectations.

What, like your memory?
post #59 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by piot View Post

Bollocks! Try and find just one example of these Canaccord figures showing an iPhone in 3rd place.

 

You mean like this one:

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post #60 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

You mean like this one

No.

Go find me a month, any month, prior to the 5C launch where Apple had MORE than ONE iPhone in the top three.
post #61 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by piot View Post


No.

Go find me a month, any month, prior to the 5C launch where Apple had MORE than ONE iPhone in the top three.

 

Sorry, can't find the graph but this should do:

 

“Our monthly channel checks indicated very strong sales trends for the new iPhone 4S and lower priced legacy iPhone 4 and 3GS models,” Canaccord analyst T. Michael Walkley said in a research note today. The iPhone 4S was the top selling model at AT&T, Sprint and Verizon, with the less expensive iPhone 4 a top three selling model at each of those carriers, he added.

 

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/investment-ideas/apple-primed-for-record-iphone-sales-canaccord/article4248790/ 


Edited by island hermit - 4/3/14 at 8:23pm
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post #62 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

 

You do know the CEO of Samsung is a two time felon?  EAsy to hide numbers.

 

 

 

The Supreme Court in India has asked the Samsung CEO to appear before a court to face criminal charges.

 

Link to the WSJ article:

 

http://tinyurl.com/mxk32qj

 

Nothing much may come off it though.

post #63 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Don't get an attitude. Your chart had no citation.
And backhanded compliment usually say something nice first.
It's not irrelevant. There are only two major players and you're trying to claim that Android (an OS) is "winning" by domination over the iPhone (a device by one vendor) despite every iPhone being sold is being reprented and much better levels than the chart this article is based on despite your odd anti-Apple tilt.
Their strategy to make more money with the S4 and have it rank better than the iPhone 4S is by having hundreds of other devices? What?!
Looking good is clearly a reference to their unit sales ranking which is shown here to be much, much worse than the source chart shows.
If that's your logic then why not make a chart for a 100 or 1000 smartphones. Then Android-based devices will probably dominate well over 90 or 900 spots and the iPhone will still only have three making their presence by your standards only 3% or 0.3%.
Again, you're chart shows the mid-range, iPhone 5C that is using old components as besting both the top end Galaxy S4 and Note 3. That looks worse than the original charts where the 5C isn't even making the top 3. The only way it's a good thing that Samsung is the #2 smartphone maker is if you really care about Xiaomi and yet it's a company most don't know. People know and care about Samsung and Apple. Apple the number 1 maker of smartphones by a wide margin and Samsung the number maker of Android-based devices by a wide margin to the next closest Android-based developer.
No one is denying that but the questions till remains why you are so strong on Samsung and Android that you'd post info that makes them look weaker in comparison to Apple. But, hey, knock yourself out. I'm looking forward to the list of the 1000 smartphones that show Apple only ranks in 0.3% of the spots. 1hmm.gif


PS: It's annoying to fix your quoting so I may not reply to you again.

Your presumptions are all off. You are presuming that I have some anti-Apple bias or agenda. I do not. Quite the contrary, I have purchased several Apple devices, regularly use I-Tunes and its store to obtain media for my Windows device, and will purchase an I-Pad this year. Not being in the "Apple to the exclusion of everything else" camp does not make me anti-Apple. I am not interested in Samsung and Android beating Apple. I am interested in Android and other alternatives remaining commercially viable.

 

"There are only two major players and you're trying to claim that Android (an OS) is "winning" by domination over the iPhone (a device by one vendor) despite every iPhone being sold is being reprented and much better levels than the chart this article is based on despite your odd anti-Apple tilt."

 

I never said or implied anything. I only stated - explicitly several times in multiple posts - that Samsung is #2 to Apple. So what is annoying is your trying to make me an anti-Apple guy, an Android triumphalist or otherwise attributing to me statements or thoughts that I do not have and are not trying to push. And if you continue that, then it is you who is not worth replying to.

 

Let me try to get you to understand something. I am a tech worker who has attended a number of schools and worked in a variety of companies over quite awhile. Here is the deal: not everybody can afford Apple products. Let me restate that for you. Not everyone can afford Apple products. This is not even about the "if your household income isn't 6 figures then oh well you are a loser so I guess you can go ahead and buy the cheap, inferior Android and Windows crap" nonsense that gets bandied about. Instead, well hey not every school is Stanford or UCLA. If Apple products were all that existed, most schools wouldn't even have IT or programming departments because they wouldn't be able to afford enough devices for their students. Small or even medium-sized businesses? More of the same. How many companies out there do you think can actually afford to equip all of their workers with MacBooks and I-Pads? Developing markets? Ditto. They have the same worker productivity needs that we have in America, but I-Phones are out of reach for them. For places like that, go Xiaomi!

 

And yes, even in good ole USA, let me give you an example. A great niche market for putting educational software on Android tablets has sprung up. Your kids probably don't need them, but they are great learning tools for kids who don't have upper middle class parents. There are some schools where lots of the students have them and teachers actually give assignments on them and such. Those educational Android tablets aren't competing with I-Pads by the way, but with electronic learning products made by companies like Leapfrog and V-Tech. The Android tablets are superior to those far more limited e-learning devices in every way, to the point where the electronic learning companies will either have to start making their own Android tablets, convert their learning software to Android apps or go the way of Blackberry. Is Apple competing in that space? Nope, because the profit margins are too small. But lots of companies are, and their products are much better than what existed before. So stuff like that is why rooting for Android's failure is idiotic. Android products can most certainly succeed in ways that don't affect Apple at all, and that is one example of many. As more entrepreneurs play around with it, more specialty type devices and products will emerge, and since they won't have pre-existing Apple products to compare them to (which is why the Android-based MP3 players failed ... they were utterly inferior to I-Pods in every way and weren't even all that cheap) they will have a much better chance of succeeding.

 

Sorry, but rooting for only Apple to succeed is bad for business. Consumers who can't afford their products benefit from having cheaper but still quality devices to meet their needs. And sellers such as Wal-Mart, Best Buy, Target etc. certainly benefit from having products available that more of their shoppers can afford. Sorry, but rooting for Apple to have the same kind of hegemony that Microsoft did is ridiculous. Apple advocates complained about Microsoft's monopolistic tactics for decades only to now want to enjoy their own. But here's the deal: an Apple monopoly would be WORSE than the Microsoft one. At least Microsoft products were available from a range of OEMs who could compete, which made prices affordable for the lower end market and quality pretty good (not Apple quality but still pretty good) for higher end devices. But an Apple monopoly would just be "well if you can't afford our premium products then hey it sucks to be you (and to be the school or business that you are trying to run)."

 

Bottom line: Samsung's success is good for Android. That is not an anti-Apple stance, but a pro-market and pro-consumer stance. Yes, I do want someone else i.e. HP, Toshiba, Asus, Acer, Lenovo, Amazon etc. to compete with Samsung. They've been doing a bad job so far for a variety of reasons, mainly bad marketing strategies. (For example, HP should have targeted the enterprise market for their tablet from the outset, now they have lost that market potential to Samsung with their gigantic 12.2 inch ultra-tablet. Instead, virtually no one, not even people who use HP Windows machines at work, even knows that HP sells tablets. ) I also want Ubuntu and other OS to compete with Android. (But Ubuntu isn't doing so hot; they are having trouble lining up manufacturers and distributors, and they just discontinued their cloud drive service.) But the main thing is that I want to see competition. If your real issue is not desiring competition for Apple, whatever the negative consequences to the market and consumers, then my posts will generally annoy you. 

post #64 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

 

Now its the #2 phone in the world the last 4 months.  Guess who got it right?  You or Apple?

 

Any source for that?

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