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Samsung email targeted Steve Jobs' death as "our best opportunity to attack iPhone"

post #1 of 137
Thread Starter 
Samsung executives discussed Steve Jobs' passing as "unfortunately" having an "unintended benefit for Apple," and at the same time, "our best opportunity to attack iPhone," in internal memos marked "highly confidential," presented in the Apple v. Samsung trial.

Steve Jobs


On October 4, 2011, Apple's chief executive Tim Cook announced the new iPhone 4S, which was scheduled to go on sale October 14. Apple began taking preorders a week earlier on October 10. The announcement also included new details on iOS 5 and revealed the new Siri.

That same day, executives from Samsung Telecommunications America engaged in a discussion about the new iOS 5 and iPhone 4S, referencing a feature checklist comparison by Fierce Wireless that contrasted Samsung's own Galaxy S II and Motorola's Droid Bionic, both running Android 2.3; the BlackBerry Bold running BlackBerry OS 7; and HTC Titan running Windows Phone 7.5.

Michael Pennington, then Samsung's vice president of sales operations and head of national sales for its STA, suggested that Samsung should "use Google to attack Apple" in a marking campaign as a way to "avoid attacking Apple due to their status as a large customer."

The next afternoon, Jobs passed away on October 5, 2011. Apple and his family announced his death shortly afterward.

"The point here is the there is an unintended benefit for Apple"



On October 7, the day preorders for iPhone 4S started, Pennington replied to the previous iPhone 4S discussion, noting that "Google's core strength, Search Engine, can be radially minimized by Apple's new iPhone 4S implementation of Siri," describing the situation as "Google's 'Burning Platform' issue," an allusion to Nokia's similarly titled internal memo from the beginning of 2011.

"Unfortunately," Pennington then wrote, "Steve Job's [sic] passing has led to a huge wave of press coverage of Apple's and iPhone's 'superiority,' all created by the, 'passionate, tireless, perfectionist...'"I know this is our best opportunity to attack iPhone" - Michael Pennington, Samsung

"The point here is the there is an unintended benefit for Apple, since the external messages by 3rd parties are all highlighting and/or supporting the consumer perception that Apple products are superior, since Jobs' was such a visionary and perfectionist. What consumer wouldn't feel great about purchasing a device developed by such a person."

"Sorry to continue to push this issue, but I have seen this far too long and I know this is our best opportunity to attack iPhone," Pennington wrote.

Samsung Steve Jobs death attack iPhone


Pennington's email was in response to a note from Samsung's chief marketing officer in the STA Todd Pendleton, who said, "Hey Michael, we are going to execute what you are recommending in our holiday GSII campaign and go head to head with iPhone 4S.

"We are working on a very aggressive strategy touting our advantages in hardware and software. In the process we will demystify the perceived Apple advantage (ecosystem/services) by showing how consumers can easily switch to Android and have more personalization/more choice by being part of the Samsung ecosystem. More to come soon... Best TP"

Apple announced the following Monday that iPhone 4S had racked up more than one million preorders over its first weekend.

The conglomerate strikes back



Samsung's response included a Facebook page that compared its Galaxy S II, styled to look identical with Apple's iPhone, as "new school" versus Apple's iPhone 4, an early 1990s cellular phone and two cans on a string.

Samsung Facebook


"To be fair," wrote Cody Lee, for the iDownload Blog, "the iPhone 4S supports AT&T's HSPA+ network, as does the carrier's version of the Samsung's Galaxy S II. All of the other features line up pretty evenly as well, from the dual core processors, to the 8MP cameras. So the 1980′s cell phone is a bit of a stretch."

The company also orchestrated "Global PR Reviews to increase Buzz," resulting in glowing reviews for the Galaxy S II from a series of high profile blogs (below), which the company touted in an internal marketing document.



After iPhone 4S launch, Samsung predicts an "iPhone 5 tsunami"



NPD reported the following February that Samsung's S II was the fourth best selling smartphone in the U.S., after Apple's iPhone 4S, iPhone 4 and iPhone 3GS.

The next summer, STA president Dale Sohn wrote an email to Samsung general managers stating, "As you know well, there will be a tsunami when iPhone 5 is coming."

Pennington replied, "we need to quickly understand the exact reasons why we win customers away from iPhone," adding, "we should also quickly understand where we failed to win customers away from iPhone in our initial GS3 launch."

The next year, Sohn was replaced as STA president by Samsung's Global Marketing Operations chief Gregory Lee last summer. Sohn is now an advisor to Samsung Mobile chief executive JK Shin.

Pennington is among the "at least five" high ranking Samsung executives that have left the company over the past two months, according to a recent report by CNET.

Editor's Note: An earlier version of this article incorrectly stated Todd Pendleton's email was in response to correspondence from Michael Pennington, who alluded that media coverage of Apple cofounder Steve Jobs' death was an "unintended benefit" for the company.
post #2 of 137
Reminds me of Microsoft in the Bill Gates era: fixated on beating their competitors rather than enhancing their customers experience with the company's products. It's an old, tired, reactive strategy that prioritized Microsoft's interests firmly ahead of their users'.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #3 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Pennington is among the "at least five" high ranking Samsung executives that have left the company over the past two months, according to a recent report by CNET.

Interesting.
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My car keeps crashing whenever I do 150mph. It's a design flaw. People tell me to slow down and drive normally but I should be able to use it as I wish.
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post #4 of 137
How Samsung.
post #5 of 137

Suddenly Newton,

 

Exactly my thoughts. It's going to take a generation or so for higher education to catch up and update their curricula to the new and best way to do business. The world would be a far better place if all companies were like Apple. Make your products or services the best you can and the money will follow (assuming price and marketing and support are all given the same care).

 

If Samsung really pushed the envelope with new innovations and/or build quality, they wouldn't have to copy Apple so blatantly. That's not to say that you can't win sometimes by cheating but it's usually not a good long term strategy.

 

I'm not surprised that Samsung would think what's in that memo, but I am surprised that someone typed it out in an email. Couldn't they have had that meeting and expressed those thoughts privately? This stuff gets out and it makes them look terrible.

post #6 of 137

Oh Samsung, stay classy as always.

 

/s

post #7 of 137
Please just shut up your fat mouth Samsung. I don't like Samsung's employees attitude. You guys need to control your behavior. I am going not to buy any samsung products again because the samsung company are meanfull and cruel behavior.
Edited by tastowe - 4/16/14 at 12:59am
post #8 of 137
I understand competitiveness, but this is just pathetic.
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How to enter the Apple logo  on iOS:
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post #9 of 137
These Pennshit people have no heart and should go to Korea, they don't belong in the land of opportunities and big hearts..
post #10 of 137
While I personally prefer the current form factor (albeit on a 5 gen Touch), it is clear ftom the above article that currently Sammy will be shitting bricks at the imminent release of a 5.5 iPhone with sapphire glass.
post #11 of 137

I absolutely despise Samsung and all that they stand for. Lying, cheating and stealing will only get you so far, one day the chickens will come home to roost. I cannot wait for that day to come.

post #12 of 137
It's interesting that Samsung was fiercely battling Apple back then... and seemed to be worried about the iPhone 4S and the upcoming iPhone 5.

Samsung ended up as the #1 smartphone vendor by volume for 2011... and they've stayed in that position ever since. Apple was #2 at the time and have stayed in that position as well.

I wonder if Samsung still thinks Apple is such a threat? Or any company for that matter? Or has Samsung gotten comfortable being the world's largest smartphone vendor?

Last quarter the top 5 smartphone vendors were:

82m - Samsung
51m - Apple
16m - Huawei
14m - Lenovo
13m - LG

There were 31 million units separating 1st and 2nd place... and 35 million units separating 2nd and 3rd place. Samsung seems to be untouchable by that metric.

Thanks to this trial... we've seen the internal "confidential" emails from a worried Samsung written in 2011.

Is Samsung writing these same sorts of emails today? Or do they think they're the top dog?
post #13 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

It's interesting that Samsung was fiercely battling Apple back then... and seemed to be worried about the iPhone 4S and the upcoming iPhone 5.

Samsung ended up as the #1 smartphone vendor by volume for 2011... and they've stayed in that position ever since. Apple was #2 at the time and have stayed in that position as well.

I wonder if Samsung still thinks Apple is such a threat? Or any company for that matter? Or has Samsung gotten comfortable being the world's largest smartphone vendor?

Last quarter the top 5 smartphone vendors were:

82m - Samsung
51m - Apple
16m - Huawei
14m - Lenovo
13m - LG

There were 31 million units separating 1st and 2nd place... and 35 million units separating 2nd and 3rd place. Samsung seems to be untouchable by that metric.

Thanks to this trial... we've seen the internal "confidential" emails from a worried Samsung written in 2011.

Is Samsung writing these same sorts of emails today? Or do they think they're the top dog?

 

IF they think they are on top, then they need to hire some new people.  Market share and profit are two entirely different things.  And Apple blows Samsung out of the water when it comes to profits from smartphones.

 

They can be the McDonald's of the smartphone as long as they want.

post #14 of 137
I feel like to roost the samsung galaxy phones on the grill.
post #15 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

It's interesting that Samsung was fiercely battling Apple back then... and seemed to be worried about the iPhone 4S and the upcoming iPhone 5.

Samsung ended up as the #1 smartphone vendor by volume for 2011... and they've stayed in that position ever since. Apple was #2 at the time and have stayed in that position as well.

I wonder if Samsung still thinks Apple is such a threat? Or any company for that matter? Or has Samsung gotten comfortable being the world's largest smartphone vendor?

Last quarter the top 5 smartphone vendors were:

82m - Samsung
51m - Apple
16m - Huawei
14m - Lenovo
13m - LG

Is Samsung writing these same sorts of emails today? Or do they think they're the top dog?

Apple has never made the most smartphones, either by total number or by platform. It has long made the most money though, and has had the most important and valuable mobile platform since it first opened the App Store.

If you think Samsung is more confident today than in 2011-2012, you might have missed:

A) their GS4 sold about as well as the GS3, disappointing investors
B) its stock is doing worse than Apple's, and Apple is extremely low right now
C) a series of executives are leaving STA (that was toward the end if the article)
D) GS5 is selling poorly even in Korea.
E) company is reporting to investors that its volume is mostly "carrier friendly good enough" phones that have very low profit margins
F) Galaxy Tab has never sold well
G) it will soon have no niche left at all as Apple moves into larger screen sizes and Chinese vendors dump cheap mass market phone on the market
H) it has lost lots of business from one of its largest and best customers: Apple
I) Galaxy Gear!
post #16 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronJ View Post

IF they think they are on top, then they need to hire some new people.  Market share and profit are two entirely different things.  And Apple blows Samsung out of the water when it comes to profits from smartphones.

They can be the McDonald's of the smartphone as long as they want.

Samsung is profitable. According to legend... they're the only Android manufacturer who is actually making money selling Android phones.

But yes... Apple makes more smartphone profit than Samsung... while Samsung sells more smartphones than Apple. I wasn't talking about that.

My question was... is Samsung threatened by anyone today like they were by Apple in 2011?

Samsung is making money (the only profitable Android vendor) and they sell a lot of phones (#1 in the world). They're doing pretty good today.

But in 2011 their emails kept saying "Here's how we can attack Apple..." and "Beating Apple is our #1 priority..."

I was just wondering if Samsung is still writing "oh shit" emails today... like they were a few years ago.
post #17 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

It's interesting that Samsung was fiercely battling Apple back then... and seemed to be worried about the iPhone 4S and the upcoming iPhone 5.

Samsung ended up as the #1 smartphone vendor by volume for 2011... and they've stayed in that position ever since. Apple was #2 at the time and have stayed in that position as well.

Samsung ships a lot of low-end shit phones. If those are rolled in with their smart phones, then that an be an impressive number. Also, note that many of the analysts are shilling for Saqmsung, so any numbers being reported are suspect at best. Finally, even Samsung was over-stating their shipped numbers - even going so far as to lie to their shareholders.
Quote:
I wonder if Samsung still thinks Apple is such a threat? Or any company for that matter? Or has Samsung gotten comfortable being the world's largest smartphone vendor?

Last quarter the top 5 smartphone vendors were:

82m - Samsung
51m - Apple
16m - Huawei
14m - Lenovo
13m - LG

There were 31 million units separating 1st and 2nd place... and 35 million units separating 2nd and 3rd place. Samsung seems to be untouchable by that metric.

Going back to what I wrote above. Samsung's actual numbers have been purposefully overstated due to several factors. Finally, since all reports of actual internet phone and tablet traffic; 80% to 85% being done from Apple iPhones and iPads seem to point to Apple clearly shipping the bulk of devices and making the bulk of profits.
Quote:
Thanks to this trial... we've seen the internal "confidential" emails from a worried Samsung written in 2011.

Is Samsung writing these same sorts of emails today? Or do they think they're the top dog?

Only Samsung knows what they are thinking, just as only Samsung knows what they are actually shipping. They are shaping up to be a den of thieves with not even honor among themselves. Witness the recent departure of several head rats.
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #18 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Tianao View Post
 

 

Comments like this I find amusing.  Clearly you are stating that Apple have a much larger profit margin for each phone - great for Apple, not so much for the consumer who will get more bang for their buck on Samsung who cram more stuff in there for the same price. Less profit for Samsung (like I care) but more for the customer (awesome!).

 

Umm, I've been an Apple smartphone consumer since the original in 2007, and an Apple consumer in general since about 2003 (not that long compared to many here, granted).

 

I have NEVER felt that could get more bang for the buck by buying Samsung and "cramming more stuff" in there.  I have all the apps I want, all the functionality I want, and I have one thing that Samsung will NEVER have: resale value.

 

When I upgraded from the 5 to the 5S, Gazelle gave me $34 more for my 5 than I paid for it.  OK, ATT charged me $36 to upgrade a year into my contract.  But guess what?

 

I went from a 32GB 5 to a 64GB 5S for ... $2.  TWO EFFING DOLLARS it cost me to upgrade my phone to the new version AND double the storage.  And if it weren't for ATT, I would have actually MADE money!

 

So don't you DARE come in here and pretend you understand the economics.  You don't.  You clearly don't.  When you do, come back.

post #19 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrections View Post

Apple has never made the most smartphones, either by total number or by platform. It has long made the most money though, and has had the most important and valuable mobile platform since it first opened the App Store.

If you think Samsung is more confident today than in 2011-2012, you might have missed:

A) their GS4 sold about as well as the GS3, disappointing investors
B) its stock is doing worse than Apple's, and Apple is extremely low right now
C) a series of executives are leaving STA (that was toward the end if the article)
D) GS5 is selling poorly even in Korea.
E) company is reporting to investors that its volume is mostly "carrier friendly good enough" phones that have very low profit margins
F) Galaxy Tab has never sold well
G) it will soon have no niche left at all as Apple moves into larger screen sizes and Chinese vendors dump cheap mass market phone on the market
H) it has lost lots of business from one of its largest and best customers: Apple
I) Galaxy Gear!

Thanks! That's exactly the information I was looking for.
post #20 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post


Thanks! That's exactly the information I was looking for.

 

I'll have to look for the link again, but there was a major Twitter dev asking why both devs and designers focus more on iOS when Android has 80% of the market share.  The answer was simple: iOS users spend WAY more money on apps and shopping and ads.

post #21 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post


Samsung is making money (the only profitable Android vendor) and they sell a lot of phones (#1 in the world). They're doing pretty good today.

The cell phone division is making money, as you say, but as recent as December 2013 they were barely making money. It seems the 13 Billion dollar advertising budget wiped out a lot of what should have been profits. Samsung's stock holders are not at all happy with the performance of the cell phone division and that was BEFORE the fabrication of numbers came out during this trial.

Samsung as a company is doing good... but the phone group is just getting by on paper...let's see if this trial forces some recalculating back home.
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #22 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macky the Macky View Post

Samsung ships a lot of low-end shit phones. If those are rolled in with their smart phones, then that an be an impressive number. Also, note that many of the analysts are shilling for Saqmsung, so any numbers being reported are suspect at best. Finally, even Samsung was over-stating their shipped numbers - even going so far as to lie to their shareholders.

Going back to what I wrote above. Samsung's actual numbers have been purposefully overstated due to several factors. Finally, since all reports of actual internet phone and tablet traffic; 80% to 85% being done from Apple iPhones and iPads seem to point to Apple clearly shipping the bulk of devices and making the bulk of profits.

Only Samsung knows what they are thinking, just as only Samsung knows what they are actually shipping. They are shaping up to be a den of thieves with not even honor among themselves. Witness the recent departure of several head rats.

Gotcha.

So from what you and Corrections have said above... Samsung is basically a bunch of liars whose best days are behind them. 1biggrin.gif
post #23 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronJ View Post

I'll have to look for the link again, but there was a major Twitter dev asking why both devs and designers focus more on iOS when Android has 80% of the market share.  The answer was simple: iOS users spend WAY more money on apps and shopping and ads.

Yeah... I've heard that too.
post #24 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macky the Macky View Post

The cell phone division is making money, as you say, but as recent as December 2013 they were barely making money. It seems the 13 Billion dollar advertising budget wiped out a lot of what should have been profits. Samsung's stock holders are not at all happy with the performance of the cell phone division and that was BEFORE the fabrication of numbers came out during this trial.

Samsung as a company is doing good... but the phone group is just getting by on paper...let's see if this trial forces some recalculating back home.

Wow... I didn't know all that!

Yeah it would be nice if they could at least give accurate numbers to their shareholders.

Gotta be honest (which seems to be a challenge for Samsung)
post #25 of 137
Samscum!
post #26 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronJ View Post

I'll have to look for the link again, but there was a major Twitter dev asking why both devs and designers focus more on iOS when Android has 80% of the market share.  The answer was simple: iOS users spend WAY more money on apps and shopping and ads.

In addition the SDK for producing iOS apps is superior to what is available for the Android platform. I can produce an iOS app in a fraction of the time it takes to do the same thing for an Android device. Furthermore the iOS app looks better on all the iOS devices AND I can write for the latest version of iOS. Something I can't do for Android as the latest version is running on a single digit percentage of Android devices. Finally, it costs me far less to support the iOS software. The Android share of the market is overstated; possibly drastically, with nowhere the penetration in the enterprise markets as iOS. It's so bad that only ONE modified Samsung phone is approved for US Federal government purchases out of all Android phones, and NO Android tablets made the cut.

More grist for the mill...
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #27 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macky the Macky View Post


In addition the SDK for producing iOS apps is superior to what is available for the Android platform. I can produce an iOS app in a fraction of the time it takes to do the same thing for an Android device. Furthermore the iOS app looks better on all the iOS devices AND I can write for the latest version of iOS. Something I can't do for Android as the latest version is running on a single digit percentage of Android devices. Finally, it costs me far less to support the iOS software. The Android share of the market is overstated; possibly drastically, with nowhere the penetration in the enterprise markets as iOS. It's so bad that only ONE modified Samsung phone is approved for US Federal government purchases out of all Android phones, and NO Android tablets made the cut.

More grist for the mill...

 

Gotcha.  Interesting.  As a person who knows about as much about code as he knows about cricket, this is interesting info. :)

 

Thanks.

post #28 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Tianao View Post

Comments like this I find amusing.  Clearly you are stating that Apple have a much larger profit margin for each phone - great for Apple, not so much for the consumer who will get more bang for their buck on Samsung who cram more stuff in there for the same price. Less profit for Samsung (like I care) but more for the customer (awesome!).

Apple's profits come from a lot of directions, but just because they pay far less for their superior components, doesn't mean they HAVE TO pass those savings on to the customer in the form of lower hardware costs. Yes they have to be competitive on pricing, but they also use some of those profits to offer Apple customers the number one customer service - after the sale service. Every touching point between Apple and their customer is better then any other manufacturer, plus the hardware and OS are designed better then other sources, The resale value is higher. The security is higher. The experience is even higher.
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #29 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Tianao View Post
 

 

So, if iOS is so great and superior, and iPhones are so much better, why bother wasting time trying to squash Samsung / Android in the courtroom, given noone would want to buy those inferior products surely?

 

Stealing is wrong, mmkay?

 

Samsung decided, a LONG time ago, that they would take Apple's designs and use them to their advantage.  Since then, they have been doing exactly that.

 

That's wrong.

 

The answer:  SQUASH them!  Beat on them like little roaches on the cement.  Don't ever give them cover, don't ever give them a way out, don't ever give them light.  Destroy, demolish, detonate.

 

They want to play with the big boys?  Good for them.  Let's get ready to rumble.

post #30 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Tianao View Post

So, if iOS is so great and superior, and iPhones are so much better, why bother wasting time trying to squash Samsung / Android in the courtroom, given noone would want to buy those inferior products surely?

Because Apple is making a statement by suing Samsung that says they are serious about protecting their IP. By doing so they can keep their products from becoming commodities and can retain their prestige product status. Samsung is shameless about knocking off competitor's products in any market well beyond communication devices. Samsung has been able to do this because they are huge and have deep pockets. Apple is the first company to defend themselves from such behavior by Samsung. If Samsung loses this case, it may open the floodgates of many other manufacturers suing Samsung and use this case to leverage their claims.

If you read the news, many manufacturers have sued counterfeiters and have been successful because the counterfeiters are usually very small. Samsung practically copied the Apple hardware look and software UI so completely that Samsung's own lawyers COULD NOT tell which was which when the judge held them both up... this is how a customer can be tricked into buying one brand when they asked to see another... and that's been criminally wrong for a long time.
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #31 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

Wow... I didn't know all that!

Yeah it would be nice if they could at least give accurate numbers to their shareholders.

Gotta be honest (which seems to be a challenge for Samsung)


Samsung's dishonesty starts from the very top. Their president is a multiple felon within his own country.
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #32 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Tianao View Post

No, I think people here are trying to find anyway possible to take a jab at Samsung and are over blowing this.

What did he state?  That Job's passing is getting people to look at Apple more during that time, which is unfortunate for Samsung. Yes, for Samsung from business viewpoint it could end up with less sales while people focus on Apple. 
He also, states this is the best opportunity to attack iPhone.. but I don't believe he meant Job's death was the best time - that would be quite stupid actually, as people would turn away from Samsung if there was even a hint of such callousness. Samsung was in the middle of the legal battle with Apple at the time, but still extended their sympathy for the loss of Steve.  No, if you look at the email trail, he was quoting from 4th October on the strategy of showing how advanced Samsung/Google are compared to iPhone (before Jobs death) and merely restates this as the best opportunity to attack iPhone the next day - not because of Jobs death, but because he keeps on trying to drum into the execs that they have to act now. 

He wasn't having a dig at the passing of Jobs. Merely continuing to do his job and try and find angles to promote Samsung.  That's what he is paid to do.

Exactly. The headline incites disgust, but the article suggests SJs passing was mentioned as a footnote.
post #33 of 137

Well, goodnight.

post #34 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Tianao View Post

Look, frankly I do agree the original Samsung Galaxy S was pretty much a direct copy of the iPhone.. to the point even Google told them to try and differentiate more.. Yes, call it slimey or whatever, that's what Samsung sometimes does. Well, Apple won and got $1b. Case closed. Since then though, Android has come into's it's own and the Galaxy phones have a much wider range of features etc.. they are DIFFERENT to iPhone. 
Did Apple really expect to be the only Smartphone player in town?  Wouldn't that be like the company with the first LCD TV trying to sue all others that stop using Cathode Ray tubes and move to LCD? ...  Not to mention there were good devices like the HP IPAQ about 5 years prior to iPhone which was good for the time.  
Google & Samsung came up with the 7" and 8" form factor, which Steve famously said he would never get into as you would need to sand paper your finger to be able to use it... Well Apple did follow into that market.. Should Samsung/Google have tried to block this new entrant to the market through the courts?  Samsung created the 'phablet' market which Apple is now also rumoured to be entering. Should they sue there too?

Apple is doing well and doesn't need to continue this thermonuclear war with Android. Keep innovating and competing with Android. Heck, pinch the best bits of Android and use it in iOS if you have to (which they are doing with notification bars etc) - we all benefit in the end.

These lawsuits aren't as much about "copying" as they are about infringing on Apple's IP.

What's the point of having patents, trademarks, trade dress and copyrights if you don't defend them?

Apple is free to enter any market they want... as long as they don't infringe on someone else's property.

If they do... or if anyone else does... that's for the courts to decide.
post #35 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronJ View Post

Stealing is wrong, mmkay?

Samsung decided, a LONG time ago, that they would take Apple's designs and use them to their advantage.  Since then, they have been doing exactly that.

That's wrong.

The answer:  SQUASH them!  Beat on them like little roaches on the cement.  Don't ever give them cover, don't ever give them a way out, don't ever give them light.  Destroy, demolish, detonate.

They want to play with the big boys?  Good for them.  Let's get ready to rumble.

I love sports! Not so much wrestling of today... but I'll take your cue and state what I would do if I was at Apple and would like to put the "hurt" on Samsung.

Here's a) Back Breaker, b) Body Slam, c) Rope Splatter(?)... and d) Full Nelson FTW:

a) bigger iPhones and yes 2 of them; rumors point to this and I tend to agree it's (about!) time. That marketing/ad point will be dead. = Dazed response from Samsung.

b) those 2 new sizes offered at the same price as iPhone 5s today, with only the starting storage being different i.e. 16gb (bigger size) or 32gb (smaller size)... essentially the "perfect choice conundrum" that would weed out the "question of which size consumers prefer" (completely different than the other "size" question... don't go there!). = Looking up from the canvas into a thunderous tornado (picture that @mstone... really picture it!) of iPhones desending from the heavens..." is that SJ throwing "Thunderbolts" at me?!"

c) iPhone 5s lives on... possibly with the same internals as today, maybe tweaked... bit the price drops $100. across the board. = Oh no... that's not thunderbolts he's throwing, it's a Ballmer, followed by a Andy Rubin, a Larry and Sergei candy confection... Heins, Chen, Balsillie... and Lazaridis with a hockey stick aimed for my throat(?!)

d) iPhone 5c becomes the "promotional" (free) iPhone that it has always been meant to be. 8gb gets dropped worldwide (a stupid idea really!) and 16gb installed as the starting price of $0/contract or $399 purchase. = After becoming pummeled by the weight of every other mobile device maker that Samsung helped to destroy, they will be put out of their misery trying to come up with any relevant ad campaign to counter this full frontal attack. In bare conscientiousness Samsung hits the mat 3 times and is relevated to being the "premier feature phone" supplier to those that want "good enough" or can afford not much else. I do wish them success in the "Ballroom Have Tights-Will-Travel League" ... The End... 1smoking.gif

"Creative Writing 101" aside... Apple has the ability to seriously hurt Samsung this year where it counts.... if they really, really want to.... that is their pocketbook.

It may mean Apple dropping their margins to 25% for a period of time... but they also have the ability to raise their profits by being able to purchase all of the unused capacity of memory, chips and other materials at bargain basement prices in the short and long-term. Plus add other "expensive" features and functions to their devices in the future, thus being able to elevate their margins by just staying consistent on the "new" selling prices.

*** One last thing (my favorite segment of all time!)... IF Apple also decides to get a bit more chummy with Microsoft and make them the "default services" (I called for a "tag team" yesterday... how prescient is that?)... they could also seriously burn Google at the same time, possibly forcing Google to pay for search services on the iDevices of the future or be left off of the "ad-serving" portion. And boy would I make them pay!!!! (I don't personally know how this works... but I do know that Google paying for search integration at Mozilla is what has them floating for so many years...?)
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #36 of 137

This is all part of the way business gets done: exploit whatever weaknesses, real, imagined, or contrived that you can to get ahead of the competition. As long as it's legal and ethical then all is fair in the world of competitive global business. It's very naive to think that these types of conversations, like exploiting the loss of a strong company leader like Steve Jobs or talks about "attacking" a competitors customers (like Apple did with the "I'm a Mac, you're a PC" campaign) don't take place behind closed boardroom doors on a regular basis - in every line of business imaginable and on every day of the week. It may be unseemly, ugly, classless, and dripping with sleaze - but that's exactly what happens inside the bowels of business strategy and execution on a regular basis.

 

Please remember that this is all business and the battles that are being waged are very far removed from anything that we as consumers should feel personally threatened or affected by. This isn't our battle or our war, this is business. It's no different than any of the many business battles and wars that have taken place over the ages: Tesla vs. Edison, Ford vs. Chevy, Boeing vs. Airbus, Microsoft vs. IBM, etc. When there's a big prize up for grabs like there is today in the smartphone business and fully connected ecosystems, you'd better expect that some mud is going to get slung. If you want to pick a side as a spectator and start brandishing moralities and talk of things like "fairness" and who's doing who wrong you'd better be careful. In the depths of the scrum pile it's every man for himself and everyone on every side is clawing and scratching - within the bounds of legal and ethical constraints of course, to come out with the ball. Don't be fooled by the pretty facades that the protagonists create for us to see while they wage their campaigns and fight their battles. Their battles, not our battles. Neither side is all-good or all-bad, they're just businessmen trying to come out on top. And don't be appalled or act surprised when the facade peels back for a second or two and we catch a fleeting glimpse of what's happening on the other side. Do you REALLY want to know how that hot dog gets made? 

 

Finally, if you really believe that the car you drive or the smartphone you use defines who you are as a person and your value to yourself, your family, and society then you should consider reevaluating your priorities. Or maybe just stepping back for a while from staring too closely behind the boardroom doors where the wars of others are being fought, lest you get drawn into a battle by proxy that has no real tangible outcome for you either way. Frankly, I would imagine that most of us have enough issues to deal with in our own lives and we don't need to adopt other people's problems, even at a highly abstract level that Apple vs. Samsung represents. 

post #37 of 137
"Ballroom-Have-Tights-Will-Travel League" could become "Have-T*Ts-Will-Travel"... because we all know "sex sells" and to my knowledge, Samsung hasn't tried this "naughty" trick yet.

"It's" the only thing... hopefully big... thing left in the Galaxy to exploit... 1biggrin.gif
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #38 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Tianao View Post
 

 

Ah, we are joined by the requisite, recently registered Samsung Astroturfer.

post #39 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by DewMe View Post

This is all part of the way business gets done: exploit whatever weaknesses, real, imagined, or contrived that you can to get ahead of the competition. As long as it's legal and ethical then all is fair in the world of competitive global business. It's very naive to think that these types of conversations, like exploiting the loss of a strong company leader like Steve Jobs or talks about "attacking" a competitors customers (like Apple did with the "I'm a Mac, you're a PC" campaign) don't take place behind closed boardroom doors on a regular basis - in every line of business imaginable and on every day of the week. It may be unseemly, ugly, classless, and dripping with sleaze - but that's exactly what happens inside the bowels of business strategy and execution on a regular basis.

Please remember that this is all business and the battles that are being waged are very far removed from anything that we as consumers should feel personally threatened or affected by. This isn't our battle or our war, this is business. It's no different than any of the many business battles and wars that have taken place over the ages: Tesla vs. Edison, Ford vs. Chevy, Boeing vs. Airbus, Microsoft vs. IBM, etc. When there's a big prize up for grabs like there is today in the smartphone business and fully connected ecosystems, you'd better expect that some mud is going to get slung. If you want to pick a side as a spectator and start brandishing moralities and talk of things like "fairness" and who's doing who wrong you'd better be careful. In the depths of the scrum pile it's every man for himself and everyone on every side is clawing and scratching - within the bounds of legal and ethical constraints of course, to come out with the ball. Don't be fooled by the pretty facades that the protagonists create for us to see while they wage their campaigns and fight their battles. Their battles, not our battles. Neither side is all-good or all-bad, they're just businessmen trying to come out on top. And don't be appalled or act surprised when the facade peels back for a second or two and we catch a fleeting glimpse of what's happening on the other side. Do you REALLY want to know how that hot dog gets made? 

Finally, if you really believe that the car you drive or the smartphone you use defines who you are as a person and your value to yourself, your family, and society then you should consider reevaluating your priorities. Or maybe just stepping back for a while from staring too closely behind the boardroom doors where the wars of others are being fought, lest you get drawn into a battle by proxy that has no real tangible outcome for you either way. Frankly, I would imagine that most of us have enough issues to deal with in our own lives and we don't need to adopt other people's problems, even at a highly abstract level that Apple vs. Samsung represents. 

Fantastic post!

Re: hot dogs = I had the "fun" and honor of taking a field-trip and tour of the Hormel plant in Austin, MN as a kid... and I still can't get the images nor the olfactory-memory out of my head. Traumatizing! I gave up hot dogs for home made German Wurst from my local butcher as therapy 1smile.gif
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #40 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Tianao View Post
 

 

Comments like this I find amusing.  Clearly you are stating that Apple have a much larger profit margin for each phone - great for Apple, not so much for the consumer who will get more bang for their buck on Samsung who cram more stuff in there for the same price. Less profit for Samsung (like I care) but more for the customer (awesome!).

 

The value a consumer gets from a product has little relation to the profit margins on that product. An iPhone 5S purchased last October will still be perfectly functional with up to date software in 3 years, part of a seamless ecosystem devoid of malware with a choice of the best quality apps on the market. Can you say the same about any Samsung phone, or any Android phone for that matter?

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