or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Samsung to challenge $120M damages award in Apple patent suit
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Samsung to challenge $120M damages award in Apple patent suit

post #1 of 45
Thread Starter 
South Korean electronics giant Samsung will reportedly challenge the $120 million in damages awarded to Apple as part of the companies' most recent courtroom battle, with Samsung's lead attorney saying the verdict was "unsupported by evidence."



"Of course we're pleased that the jury awarded Apple 6 percent of what they were asking for," Samsung attorney John Quinn said in a statement obtained by Bloomberg. "But even that can't stand, because Apple kept out all the real world evidence and didn't produce anything to substitute for it, so you have a verdict that's unsupported by evidence -- and that's just one of its problems."

Apple had asked the court for more than $2 billion after alleging Samsung infringed on five patents --?including swipe-to-text, universal search, and data detectors -- while a Samsung counterargument sought just over $6 million for two patents of its own. A jury found both parties guilty of infringement but ordered Samsung to pay just $119.6 million and Apple to deliver only $158,000 to its rival.

Following what was described as a "clerical error" that left Samsung unpenalized for at least one infringing handset, the jury subsequently revised individual payouts but left the total award unchanged.

Appealing the verdict would be a sound financial decision for Samsung, according to Villanova University law professor Michael Risch. "At this stage an appeal is cheap, even if the total can be reduced by $10-$20 million," Risch said.

Samsung has already lost more than $900 million to Apple after falling in two previous lawsuits. An unsuccessful appeal of this most recent skirmish would push Samsung's total losses to the iPhone maker over the billion dollar mark.
post #2 of 45
I wish Samsung would just go away already and stick to making TVs and refrigerators. They're getting tiresome now.
post #3 of 45
Step 1: Admit you infringed on Apple patents
Step 2: Lose
Step 3: Appeal the verdict....even though the damages were ~5% of the original amount

Why does Apple bashing and trolling make people feel so good?

Reply

Why does Apple bashing and trolling make people feel so good?

Reply
post #4 of 45
Here's an interesting article on Samsung and how they work:

http://www.vanityfair.com/business/2014/06/apple-samsung-smartphone-patent-war.print

Any Samsung fans should have a good read about the company that makes their choice of smartphone/tablet.

(Thanks to Sol for passing this on.

EDIT: AND EricTheHalfBee for posting this yesterday!)
Edited by GTR - 5/6/14 at 1:50pm
The problem with posting nude photos of Jennifer Lawrence on the internet is that it takes away all the mystique...
Reply
The problem with posting nude photos of Jennifer Lawrence on the internet is that it takes away all the mystique...
Reply
post #5 of 45

@GTR - that is such a great article.

 

 

Quote:
The reason why they are analysts is because they failed at running businesses.

 

Reply

 

 

Quote:
The reason why they are analysts is because they failed at running businesses.

 

Reply
post #6 of 45

Ugh... No other words..

post #7 of 45
"Of course we're pleased that the jury awarded Apple 6 percent of what they were asking for"

Ugh John Quinn, the jury only awarded you 2.6% of what you were "asking for". Are you please the jury awarded you half of what they did Apple? Still want to try and spin your loss..
post #8 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Here's an interesting article on Samsung and how they work:

http://www.vanityfair.com/business/2014/06/apple-samsung-smartphone-patent-war.print

Any Samsung fans should have a good read about the company that makes their choice of smartphone/tablet.

(Thanks to Sol for passing this on to me)

 

It's just a shame that not every one has the wherewithal to stand up to Samsung.

 

http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/17/5418616/samsung-sues-dyson-following-intolerable-copycat-claims

 

In this case, I guess Dyson realised they had to drop the suit or face mounting legal fees.

 

Here's their statement. 

Quote:
 "Dyson pioneered cyclonic vacuum cleaners and digital motors – and has been developing them ever since. We patent our technology, and naturally defend it. It is surprising that a company over 100 times bigger than Dyson is so worried. The patent system offers us some protection, but not enough: with an army of lawyers, hidden prior art is occasionally found and ways to design around existing patents identified."

 

As the Vanity Fair article has shown, the tactic has worked well for Samsung - and until one of the judges handling the appeal agrees to an embargo or ban of their products, they will continue to produce new models, make more money all the while holding up the damages in appeals and appeals.

post #9 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Here's an interesting article on Samsung and how they work:

http://www.vanityfair.com/business/2014/06/apple-samsung-smartphone-patent-war.print

Any Samsung fans should have a good read about the company that makes their choice of smartphone/tablet.

(Thanks to Sol for passing this on to me)

 

Having read that article, I've resolved not to buy a single Samsung branded product ever again (not much I can do about components). Talk about corrupt!

 

I am very glad none of the TVs in my house are Samsung (Sharp, Toshiba and Sony here). When the time comes to replace the fridge I certainly won't be getting a Samsung again either. 

post #10 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Here's an interesting article on Samsung and how they work:

http://www.vanityfair.com/business/2014/06/apple-samsung-smartphone-patent-war.print

Any Samsung fans should have a good read about the company that makes their choice of smartphone/tablet.

(Thanks to Sol for passing this on to me)

 

 

I didn't look but I hope Sol put this link into the thread where someone more or less said he was crazy for thinking that this showdown cost anything near $120 million. The attached article says close to a billion.

na na na na na...
Reply
na na na na na...
Reply
post #11 of 45
Attorneys on fire. They can't help themselves. It's what they do.
A.k.a. AppleHead on other forums.
Reply
A.k.a. AppleHead on other forums.
Reply
post #12 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by doggiehowser View Post
 

 

It's just a shame that not every one has the wherewithal to stand up to Samsung.

 

http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/17/5418616/samsung-sues-dyson-following-intolerable-copycat-claims

 

In this case, I guess Dyson realised they had to drop the suit or face mounting legal fees.

 

Here's their statement. 

 

As the Vanity Fair article has shown, the tactic has worked well for Samsung - and until one of the judges handling the appeal agrees to an embargo or ban of their products, they will continue to produce new models, make more money all the while holding up the damages in appeals and appeals.

Oh boy - queue the DED article.....1.2.3.4....

post #13 of 45

PAYMENT IS DUE IMMEDIATELY, SAMSUNG!

post #14 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Here's an interesting article on Samsung and how they work:

http://www.vanityfair.com/business/2014/06/apple-samsung-smartphone-patent-war.print

Any Samsung fans should have a good read about the company that makes their choice of smartphone/tablet.

(Thanks to Sol for passing this on to me)
It's funny how they say there's no evidence yet it's in their own code. Thanks for the link.
post #15 of 45
To me this is a clear inditement on how screwed up the system is. Samsung sticking to its game plan. Business as usual.
post #16 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Here's an interesting article on Samsung and how they work:

http://www.vanityfair.com/business/2014/06/apple-samsung-smartphone-patent-war.print

Any Samsung fans should have a good read about the company that makes their choice of smartphone/tablet.

(Thanks to Sol for passing this on to me)
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post

Vanity Fair has an article that I'm sure Samsung won't be happy with.

Smartphone War

Yes it is good, which is why it linked it yesterday. 1smile.gif1smile.gif

The really pathetic part of this article is the writer didn't list ALL the things Samsung has been caught doing, just the main ones.

Author of The Fuel Injection Bible

Reply

Author of The Fuel Injection Bible

Reply
post #17 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post


Yes it is good, which is why it linked it yesterday. 1smile.gif1smile.gif

The really pathetic part of this article is the writer didn't list ALL the things Samsung has been caught doing, just the main ones.

There weren't enough pages to list all of them...
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
post #18 of 45
Whatever. Where are all the trolls who claimed Apple spent more on attorneys' fees than they won in this judgment? Even though Quinn Emanuel and partners charged Samsung a higher hourly rate (across the board) than Apple's lawyers. And now Samsung is going to spend even more to reduce or eliminate the $120M judgment on top of what they've already spent on both trials which they lost, and yet all the trolls wanna focus on is Apple's supposed "pyrrhic victory"? Please. Do the math. Apple is 2 for 2.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #19 of 45
Samsung should be pleased with the ridiculously low damages awarded. The appeal court can just as easily raise the damages as they can lower them.
post #20 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by CogitoDexter View Post

I wish Samsung would just go away already and stick to making TVs and refrigerators. They're getting tiresome now.

 

Getting? I think they passed that stage a long time ago.

 

For the record, when we bought a new washer and dryer, I specifically excluded Samsung from the list even though their models topped most reviews. Their behavior towards Apple (stealing their designs and their mocking commercials topping the list) demonstrates a level of unethical behavior that I'm just not willing to support in any way. A refrigerator is probably next, and it won't be Samsung either.

post #21 of 45
Oh shut up samsung company and to pay your **** bills
post #22 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by EWTHeckman View Post
 

 

Getting? I think they passed that stage a long time ago.

 

For the record, when we bought a new washer and dryer, I specifically excluded Samsung from the list even though their models topped most reviews. Their behavior towards Apple (stealing their designs and their mocking commercials topping the list) demonstrates a level of unethical behavior that I'm just not willing to support in any way. A refrigerator is probably next, and it won't be Samsung either.

 

I'm generally a tolerant man, but my patience has rather run out.

 

Actually, when it came to replacing the washer last year, it was a choice between a high end Samsung and a high end LG. I chose the LG, despite the shorter warranty. I now feel good about myself :) Also the LG has an induction motor (rather than one with brushes) so it's incredibly quiet - the only one I'm aware of on the market. No doubt another idea for Samsung to pinch...

post #23 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Whatever. Where are all the trolls who claimed Apple spent more on attorneys' fees than they won in this judgment? Even though Quinn Emanuel and partners charged Samsung a higher hourly rate (across the board) than Apple's lawyers. And now Samsung is going to spend even more to reduce or eliminate the $120M judgment on top of what they've already spent on both trials which they lost, and yet all the trolls wanna focus on is Apple's supposed "pyrrhic victory"? Please. Do the math. Apple is 2 for 2.

Someone asked the question regarding attorney fees, they weren't making a statement. If your going to do the math then Apple got 5% of what they were asking for in this trial. In the first trial also fell short. Damages are the only math that matter. Everyone is trying to spin in their head how Apple is winning they aren't. 

 

The massive judgement and damages the world has ever seen is never going to come. Samsung clearly has a set strategy they will continue to pound Apple with appeals while making more money then they pay out. 

 

Apple and Samsung need to agree on a settlement and move forward. 

post #24 of 45
Waiting for a bigger screen iPhone now!
post #25 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlApple View Post

Someone asked the question regarding attorney fees, they weren't making a statement. If your going to do the math then Apple got 5% of what they were asking for in this trial. In the first trial also fell short. Damages are the only math that matter. Everyone is trying to spin in their head how Apple is winning they aren't. 

The massive judgement and damages the world has ever seen is never going to come. Samsung clearly has a set strategy they will continue to pound Apple with appeals while making more money then they pay out. 

Apple and Samsung need to agree on a settlement and move forward. 
They need to agree on a settlement but Samsung will never do that. The longer they can draw this out and make Apple look like the bad guy more interested in litigating than innovating (again NOT my opinion but the media spin that's out there) the better it is for them. I'm sure Samsung lawyers had a huge smile on their faces when the jury foreman questioned why Apple isn't suing Google instead.
post #26 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Whatever. Where are all the trolls who claimed Apple spent more on attorneys' fees than they won in this judgment?

IIRC it was SolipsismX that brought it up here first. I don't think you or anyone else would consider him a troll. In fact he's one of the more balanced posters here IMO.

That "troll" meme is being used so much at AI it barely has any meaning or impact anymore. Seems as tho it's more often used simply as a lazy attempt at being dismissive when a rational considered response is just too much of an effort.
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
post #27 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlApple View Post
 

Someone asked the question regarding attorney fees, they weren't making a statement. If your going to do the math then Apple got 5% of what they were asking for in this trial. In the first trial also fell short. Damages are the only math that matter. Everyone is trying to spin in their head how Apple is winning they aren't. 

 

The massive judgement and damages the world has ever seen is never going to come. Samsung clearly has a set strategy they will continue to pound Apple with appeals while making more money then they pay out. 

 

Apple and Samsung need to agree on a settlement and move forward. 

 

I don't think it's about the money to Samsung, it's about crushing their competitors. Pay the money to the lawyers. Pay the money to the courts. But whatever you do, avoid paying money to the people you've stolen from.

post #28 of 45
The google to sue samsung for their crappy touchwiz android software. I don't like samsung's touchwiz android software. So please shut up samsung and to pay damn your bills.
post #29 of 45

Thanks GTR for the article, amazing!  What if all of the big players who have been getting ripped off by Samsung got together to fight Samscum collectively?

post #30 of 45

People keep thinking this is all about Samsung vs. Apple, which is far from the truth.  This is more about Samsung's business plan to profit by stealing everyone's IP, and tie up lawsuits in court while they continue profiting from those products.

To-date, no one has had wallets deep enough to stand up to Samsung for the long term.  Now, Apple is in the perfect position to do just that. Apple is representing not just themselves, but the the Bosches, Dysons, and Pioneers of the world too.  Someone is finally standing up and saying "enough is enough".  

Good for Apple.  I truly hope Apple takes it to the very end, scorching Samsung in the process.  They certainly deserve it.

That vanity fair article simply proved what many people already know about Samsung.  When it comes to purchasing any kind of product, be it electronics or appliances, Samsung is immediately not included in our purchasing decisions.  I will not directly purchase anything with their name on it.  Screw those degenerates.

post #31 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Whatever. Where are all the trolls who claimed Apple spent more on attorneys' fees than they won in this judgment?

 

I'm not sure about here, but I've seen figures bantered around from over $100 million to as high as $600 million.

 

The first case cost Apple somewhere around $60 million. They applied to the court to have Samsung pay a portion of the fees, and had to provide an accurate account of the expenses.

 

I'm quite sure this case cost them significantly less. The first case involved a lot of discovery, and I'm sure that a good portion of the evidence they dug up the first time around would have been applicable to this case. When lawyers are looking for evidence, they don't know where it is or what they'll find - they simply get as many documents as possible and then sift through them looking for items that pertain to the case at hand. Any juicy bits they find not related to the trial (but possible related to other infringement) would simply get documented and filed away.

 

So it's quite reasonable to assume that this case cost them less than $60 million. By how much we don't know.

 

So even with a $119 million payout, Apple still comes ahead financially even thought the most important aspect is chalking up a win.

Author of The Fuel Injection Bible

Reply

Author of The Fuel Injection Bible

Reply
post #32 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post
 

People keep thinking this is all about Samsung vs. Apple, which is far from the truth.  This is more about Samsung's business plan to profit by stealing everyone's IP, and tie up lawsuits in court while they continue profiting from those products.

To-date, no one has had wallets deep enough to stand up to Samsung for the long term.  Now, Apple is in the perfect position to do just that. Apple is representing not just themselves, but the the Bosches, Dysons, and Pioneers of the world too.  Someone is finally standing up and saying "enough is enough".  

Good for Apple.  I truly hope Apple takes it to the very end, scorching Samsung in the process.  They certainly deserve it.

That vanity fair article simply proved what many people already know about Samsung.  When it comes to purchasing any kind of product, be it electronics or appliances, Samsung is immediately not included in our purchasing decisions.  I will not directly purchase anything with their name on it.  Screw those degenerates.

 

It's an exercise in futility. Take this lawsuit as an example. 100 million? That's fucking pennies to Samsung, and it's going to get appealed and possibly even lowered. Samsung has gotten the message that it can get away with this- and it has done so. Doesn't help that most jurors do not really understand this shit, nor do they have proper context of technological history- and Samsung is great and obfuscating the issues and muddying everything by throwing counter-accusations and lawsuits.  Even if Apple was awarded the full $2.2Billion (VERY reasonable damages, given how much Samsung has profited) it would still be nothing. The only positive thing about this is that Apple is forcing Samsung to burn a fuckload of money on legal fees. Thats literally the most damage I see being done. 

post #33 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

That "troll" meme is being used so much at AI it barely has any meaning or impact anymore. Seems as tho it's more often used simply as a lazy attempt at being dismissive when a rational considered response is just too much of an effort.

 

Now you're just being racist.  ;)

Just say no to MacMall.  They don't honor their promotions and won't respond to customer inquiries.  There are better retailers out there.
Reply
Just say no to MacMall.  They don't honor their promotions and won't respond to customer inquiries.  There are better retailers out there.
Reply
post #34 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

Here's an interesting article on Samsung and how they work:

http://www.vanityfair.com/business/2014/06/apple-samsung-smartphone-patent-war.print

Any Samsung fans should have a good read about the company that makes their choice of smartphone/tablet.

(Thanks to Sol for passing this on to me)

And this right here says it all:

I represented Samsung and they couldn’t tell the truth if their lives depended on it.” - Sam Baxter, a patent lawyer who once handled a case for Samsung.

 

The Apple vs Samsung goes to show how useless the USPTO and the FTC can be when faced with a company that has no regard for the law.  Apple should invest in a baseball bat and aim for the knees.

bb
Reply
bb
Reply
post #35 of 45
Samsung is as shameless as it gets. The problem with this trial is it had nothing to do with Samsung. All the patents used are all core to android not touchwiz.
post #36 of 45

Juge Koh has demonstrated that she will not grant an injunction against Samsung's products, no matter what. Her application of a ridiculous and extreme interpretation of the 'causality link' guidance provided by the Appeals court showed that. Her refusal to grant an injunction even after the Appeals court clarified its guidance and her application of a standard that no innovator could ever meet, sent Samsung a clear message that they could do whatever it wanted without consequences. This, coupled with her complete indifference to Samsung's lies and disregard for the court's rules, has eliminated any pretense of impartiality in her courtroom.

 

​It is time Apple filed a motion to remove Koh from this case and get a Judge with a spine. 

post #37 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


They need to agree on a settlement but Samsung will never do that. The longer they can draw this out and make Apple look like the bad guy more interested in litigating than innovating (again NOT my opinion but the media spin that's out there) the better it is for them. I'm sure Samsung lawyers had a huge smile on their faces when the jury foreman questioned why Apple isn't suing Google instead.

The Google issue is a good way and will continue to be a good way to confuse a jury, or I should say to cast doubt which is really all Samsung needs to do. Just my opinion but I think Samsung is going to drag this out and ride on the back of Apple until they can get away from using their modified Android OS and move over to a platform they design. Honestly if you look at Samsung's UI over Kit Kat it looks like Windows 8. 

 

Not sure how long this will go on but a settlement would be nice, Samsung makes high quality components and I would rather see them as a supplier over LG or Sharp. 

post #38 of 45
Justice system in USA is broke,
Period!

Crime pays and money talks !

post #39 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlApple View Post

Someone asked the question regarding attorney fees, they weren't making a statement. If your going to do the math then Apple got 5% of what they were asking for in this trial. In the first trial also fell short. Damages are the only math that matter. Everyone is trying to spin in their head how Apple is winning they aren't. 

The massive judgement and damages the world has ever seen is never going to come. Samsung clearly has a set strategy they will continue to pound Apple with appeals while making more money then they pay out. 

Apple and Samsung need to agree on a settlement and move forward. 

No. If you had bothered to read the Vanity Fair article that someone linked, you would see that settlement is Samsung's end game. Settlement means Apple accepts and condones infringement of its IP rights. Nice try.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #40 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

No. If you had bothered to read the Vanity Fair article that someone linked, you would see that settlement is Samsung's end game. Settlement means Apple accepts and condones infringement of its IP rights. Nice try.
What I say I am going bust the samsung's rear. I don't like any Samsung products because the samsung products are garbage.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPhone
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Samsung to challenge $120M damages award in Apple patent suit