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Beats deal defenders cite 'humanized' music subscription service as benefit to Apple - Page 2

post #41 of 243
If Apple goes through with this, my guess is Eddy Cue will no longer be overseeing iTunes. Which is fine because he has more than enough on his plate with iCloud, Siri, maps and the App Store.
post #42 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post
 

So, Apple paid around 400 million USD for NeXT, which basically got Apple a next gen operating system, which all of their devices are now based on, including all iOS devices, and some "Beats defenders" think that it's smart to pay 3.2 Billion for a "humanized" music subscription service?

 

I still think that this is a terrible idea.

 

 

Well it was music that brought Apple back with the iPod and the evolution of iPod to iPhone and iPad that has made them the most valuable company on the planet.  Your comment lacks perspective.  Apple's market cap in 1997 was 2.3 Billion.  That 400 million was actually 17.3% of their value and for a company without substantial revenue.  This deal for 3.2 billion is about 0.6% of their current market cap of 500 billion. The company made half of that amount last year which was a 300% increase from the year before.  This deal makes a lot more sense to me than paying billions more for a failing company who can't figure out how to get consumers to buy their stuff. (Google/Motorola, Microsoft/Nokia) 

post #43 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post
 

 

From what i've read the Beasts Music curation is largely human.  Whatever they've done they are ahead of the competition in quality...for now. 

http://www.digitalmusicnews.com/permalink/2014/01/21/beatsmusic

 

I really need great music curation.   Any service can slam me into the Top-40 stuff.  I want to feel as though i've got my own personal DJ on staff that knows what I like. 

 

I understand that part about a personal DJ. personally I think Pandora sucks for brand new users who refuse to train it. It took me literally years and years of training with thumbs up and down and also logging on to the Pandora website and adding names of artists, albums, and songs I like but it paid off. I may cheat on Pandora from time to time with iTunes, iHeart, LastFM but almost always come back to Pandora in the end. I think Pandora is very accurate as long as you really give it a lot of info to train it as to what you like. The other limitation with Pandora is I don't think they have quite as generous licensing terms as some of the competitors as far as their repertoire and catalogue of music that they can play. If Pandora could play any song they wanted I think they are the best out there as far as a personal DJ.

post #44 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by genovelle View Post

Well it was music that brought Apple back with the iPod and the evolution of iPod to iPhone and iPad that has made them the most valuable company on the planet.  Your comment lacks perspective.  Apple's market cap in 1997 was 2.3 Billion.  That 400 million was actually 17.3% of their value and for a company without substantial revenue.  This deal for 3.2 billion is about 0.6% of their current market cap of 500 billion. The company made half of that amount last year which was a 300% increase from the year before.  This deal makes a lot more sense to me than paying billions more for a failing company who can't figure out how to get consumers to buy their stuff. (Google/Motorola, Microsoft/Nokia) 

The value of another company is not based on how much money the purchasing company has.

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post #45 of 243
Cook = Ballmer

Bring back Scott Forstall.

Cook hasn’t done a thing in 2 years. No new product categories, just improved old products. And now he's buying fashion accessories for audiophools for overinflated prices.

While Facebook and Google are buying up the future, Tim Cook is buying 10 year old technology and red kitsch.

With that Burburry CEO hire, maybe Apple really is moving into BS area of overpriced luxury goods that perform worse than cheaper equivalents.
post #46 of 243
Is this the beginning of the dilution of the Apple brand? I don't see the Beat's designers bringing anything to the table that helps Apple.
post #47 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post
 

LOL, Bose is the Beats for old people. Overpriced crap that relies on marketing not quality. Any and I mean any audiophile site will confirm that. Companies like Sennheiser make quality products and also have a lot of IP protecting that. It seems Beats only has design type patents which are useless as trends change. All they did was use cheap Chinese OEM phones and added some bass and a big marketing campaign. 

 

 

But that's exactly the point. Stand around in and big box store and you'll see older person after older person with their money out with the already burned in notion that Bose is the best.  It's genius.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwmac View Post
 

 

Beats were also valued at only around $1B less than a year ago. What happened in the last 12 months to add another $2B?

 

 

Iovine is this decade's master of the Reality Distortion field.  


Edited by jlandd - 5/9/14 at 9:47am
post #48 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by bighype View Post

Cook = Ballmer

Bring back Scott Forstall.

Cook hasn’t done a thing in 2 years. No new product categories, just improved old products. And now he's buying fashion accessories for audiophools for overinflated prices.

While Facebook and Google are buying up the future, Tim Cook is buying 10 year old technology and red kitsch.

With that Burburry CEO hire, maybe Apple really is moving into BS area of overpriced luxury goods that perform worse than cheaper equivalents.

Even if Forstall was the genius you think he was (I am not sure I agree with that) he was by all accounts a complete ass that was despised by pretty much everyone else at Apple. How long do you think Apple could have prospered once his acrimonious style of leadership ran away all the senior management like Ive and many others that refused to work with him? Steve was also a bully at times but balanced that with charm, charisma, and a magnetism Forestall lacked. I don't miss faux pine bookcases and ugly green baize for my Apple apps. 

post #49 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by bspears View Post

Is this the beginning of the dilution of the Apple brand? I don't see the Beat's designers bringing anything to the table that helps Apple.

Their industrial design wasn't even done in-house.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #50 of 243
If this is true, Apple has become Google or FaceBook. $3B wasted on crappy, phony (no pun intended,) least common denominator branding bull 5h12. I'll need to reconsider my long term holdings of Apple stock.
post #51 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by bighype View Post

Cook hasn’t done a thing in 2 years. No new product categories, just improved old products.

No new product categories in 2 whole years? OMG! What an awful CEO¡ He's right up there with Steve Jobs who also didn't create a new product category every 2 years.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #52 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by bighype View Post

Cook = Ballmer

Bring back Scott Forstall.

Cook hasn’t done a thing in 2 years. No new product categories, just improved old products. And now he's buying fashion accessories for audiophools for overinflated prices.

While Facebook and Google are buying up the future, Tim Cook is buying 10 year old technology and red kitsch.

With that Burburry CEO hire, maybe Apple really is moving into BS area of overpriced luxury goods that perform worse than cheaper equivalents.

 

Say what you want about Burberry, but Ahrendts is very, very smart and someone who has a deep understanding of retail.  All you need do is look at what happened at Burberry during her tenure (hint: it became a much more valuable brand).

 

Some people will like the style, some won't.  That's the way fashion works.  And obviously, not everyone has $1,700 to drop on a trench coat or $180 for a pair of sunglasses.  But I've never had any problem with the quality of a Burberry product.  YMMV.

post #53 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post

Even if Forstall was the genius you think he was (I am not sure I agree with that) he was by all accounts a complete ass that was despised by pretty much everyone else at Apple. How long do you think Apple could have prospered once his acrimonious style of leadership ran away all the senior management like Ive and many others that refused to work with him? Steve was also a bully at times but balanced that with charm, charisma, and a magnetism Forestall lacked. I don't miss faux pine bookcases and ugly green baize for my Apple apps. 
What was so great about Forstall? iOS stagnated under his watch and he gave us the nice looking but error ridden maps application.
post #54 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


What was so great about Forstall? iOS stagnated under his watch and he gave us the nice looking but error ridden maps application.

Nothing was great about him which is my point. 

post #55 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac View Post
 

Nothing was great about him which is my point. 

 

Yep.

post #56 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

No new product categories in 2 whole years? OMG! What an awful CEO¡ He's right up there with Steve Jobs who also didn't create a new product category every 2 years.

Except that he did.
And actually it's every 3 years.
 
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post #57 of 243

Hmmm… in spite of my predilection to make a joke about overpriced form-over-function products at this point, I can't see any upside for Apple in this case. I've tried many products over the years, and by far the best bud-type solution is Apple's own. Beats, as the name suggests, are typical of modern base-heavy tuning that ruins the sound quality of anything other than hip-hop (and that too, but then it's a "good thing"). Apple has enough overpriced crap in it's lineup, it doesn't need this.

post #58 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by pazuzu View Post

Except that he did.
Actually it's every 3 years.

So NOT every 2 years? You can't even keep you lie straight with a less than 10 word response. Shameful.

And that 3 year difference between the iOS-based iPhone and iOS-based iPad was only ONCE, NOT the very 3 year occurrence you have claimed.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #59 of 243
It's the beginning of another of acquisitions Apple will buy that doesn't line up with Apple's past identity.

It's a bad buy because Apple doesn't need Beats. It shows Apple has become this part: Retail, advertising, marketing, and fashion based company when in reality they are selling hardware and software services.

Steve Jobs once said you can't become good at what you're doing if you become too involved in other things and not focused.

Apple has gotten rid of a lot of smart people or they left on their own and people they've hired and put in high spots are not people who are visionaries of Steve Job's original goal for the company.

Never follow..
post #60 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post
 

I will never buy any more Apple products if they ever came with a "beats" logo on it. That's it, I would be done with Apple, and that's saying a lot, coming from me.

 

At least certain "Apple ][" haters on this forum would be happy, because there would be no reason for me to post here again. 

Keep Calm and Allow Time for the Rumors to Die Down. Let us know if you're in real distress and we'll bring the smelling salts! ;)

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post #61 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kibitzer View Post
 

Keep Calm and Allow Time for the Rumors to Die Down. Let us know if you're in real distress and we'll bring the smelling salts! ;)

I'm trying to keep calm, but honestly speaking, this is the most distressing Apple rumor that I have ever read in my entire life.

 

I'm not sure what I'd do. I would obviously not switch to another platform like Android or anything like that. I guess that I have enough Apple devices that I've acquired throughout the years to last me until I drop dead, so I should be set.

post #62 of 243
Originally Posted by pazuzu View Post
Except that he did.

 

In absolutely no way is this statement defensible or provable. Why would you say it?

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post #63 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post
 

I'm trying to keep calm, but honestly speaking, this is the most distressing Apple rumor that I have ever read in my entire life.

 

I'm not sure what I'd do. I would obviously not switch to another platform like Android or anything like that. I guess that I have enough Apple devices that I've acquired throughout the years to last me until I drop dead, so I should be set.


your life is sad.  Its headphones for crying out loud.

post #64 of 243
I love hearing from all the people who assume that Apple does not know what it's doing, and that if things were just done their way, Apple would be better. I don't want to sound blind, but you don't become the wealthiest company in the world by being stupid - which includes taking pundits and analysts seriously.

At some point, people might want to consider the idea that maybe - just maybe - the folks at Apple actually know what they're doing and have a plan that they're not broadcasting to everyone else.
post #65 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 


your life is sad.  Its headphones for crying out loud.

 

And? Audio is very important to me. I'm a pro.

 

I refuse to be associated with any "beats" brand.

post #66 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by droslovinia View Post

I love hearing from all the people who assume that Apple does not know what it's doing, and that if things were just done their way, Apple would be better. I don't want to sound blind, but you don't become the wealthiest company in the world by being stupid - which includes taking pundits and analysts seriously.

At some point, people might want to consider the idea that maybe - just maybe - the folks at Apple actually know what they're doing and have a plan that they're not broadcasting to everyone else.

Maybe because even the Apple 'faithful' are wondering out loud what Apple is doing here?

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #67 of 243

Anybody hear seen the financials of Apple's and Beats' music business? How about Beats' headphones business?  No?  Then STFU!  You have no basis for judging whether $3.2B is too much.  I thought it felt like it was too much but you root around the internet and you find indications from pretty credible sources that 3.2 isn't an outrageous amount.

 

Once the white-person's-subconscious-panic over Dr. Dre's black face subsides we'll hear the more sober assessments.

post #68 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


Maybe because even the Apple 'faithful' are wondering out loud what Apple is doing here?

 

What you say doesn't matter at all.  Being an Apple faithful still doesn't make you better at running Apple than the people running Apple.

post #69 of 243
Horrible. Beats are poorly made headphones that fall apart, literally. The are skewed toward base and if one has an appreciation for any music beyond base heavy rap or dance tracks they are no good. The only reason they have such a following is the name "Dre" and that's just a testament to the power of marketing, not the power of quality. The public has been duped by the Beats brand and apparently so has Apple.
post #70 of 243

From a business perspective, Beats being a "premium" product like Apple's, (i.e. "nice margins") - it makes sense.  For as convenient as iTunes is for being "the world's catalog of music", their music store has been more of an encyclopedia of entries rather than a flavorful experience.  If Beats and their team can transform iTunes into more of an "experience" and people go there like a social network - it could have huge gains.  Where I see the problem with that idea is that music is art and when you get too many people together to discuss art, it almost always devolves into "turf war" or "pretentious snobbery".  When that happens, you are only left with "fans" and the "consumers" who don't care one way or the other to be involved up and leave.

 

The dynamic of iTunes needs to be a "Many to One" relationship and not an "Amongst" relationship with peers.  I think people's music taste is fairly private and they just want to know what other things are out there without the preachy opinions.

 

If Apple does buy Beats, you know Samsung will be "offended" and we'll see "Bumps by Samsung" within a year to compete.

 

post #71 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigmamatic View Post

Horrible. Beats are poorly made headphones that fall apart, literally. The are skewed toward base and if one has an appreciation for any music beyond base heavy rap or dance tracks they are no good. The only reason they have such a following is the name "Dre" and that's just a testament to the power of marketing, not the power of quality. The public has been duped by the Beats brand and apparently so has Apple.

This has nothing to do with headphones.
post #72 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigmamatic View Post

Beats are poorly made headphones that fall apart, literally. The are skewed toward base.

This isn't accurate.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #73 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

The media has been clamoring for a story like this for at least the last two years.

 

Remember the old days when absolutely everyone would jump on something that Apple was not ever, for any reason, going to do? iPhone mini? Apple Television? They were CERTAIN to happen, and so all media outlets reported them as certain, as well as giving their opinions on how this CONFIRMED product would save or destroy Apple…

 

A lot of pent up idiocy is being released over Beats. That’s good; it’ll keep the idiocy away from real future products. 

 

Love the "pent up idiocy" characterization. However, there'll be no "keeping it away from real future products," for the supply is infinite. It doesn't matter what Apple has done right or where it appears to be heading; the mantras "Apple is stupid and doomed", "Steve never would have let this happen," and "Tim Cook is in way over his head and the board needs to fire him NOW" are always a hair trigger away from release. This segment of the Apple community is like the student body of Greendale in the fictional "Community", a bit nuts, understanding nothing, and ready to tip over a garbage can and riot at a moment's notice.

post #74 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by tlevier View Post
 

From a business perspective, Beats being a "premium" product like Apple's, (i.e. "nice margins") - it makes sense.  For as convenient as iTunes is for being "the world's catalog of music", their music store has been more of an encyclopedia of entries rather than a flavorful experience.  If Beats and their team can transform iTunes into more of an "experience" and people go there like a social network - it could have huge gains.  Where I see the problem with that idea is that music is art and when you get too many people together to discuss art, it almost always devolves into "turf war" or "pretentious snobbery".  When that happens, you are only left with "fans" and the "consumers" who don't care one way or the other to be involved up and leave.

 

The dynamic of iTunes needs to be a "Many to One" relationship and not an "Amongst" relationship with peers.  I think people's music taste is fairly private and they just want to know what other things are out there without the preachy opinions.

 

If Apple does buy Beats, you know Samsung will be "offended" and we'll see "Bumps by Samsung" within a year to compete.

 

 

Wait a second.  This post was well-reasoned and looked at multiple sides of the discussion.

 

WTF are you doing in this thread?! :)

post #75 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
Does Iovine have ideas to make Apple's PodPhones better?

Not ones that won't cost as much as the iPhone itself.

post #76 of 243

The market is giving Apple a solid thumping today. Market values loss ~$6B.

 

I have little doubt that it's over this silly, ill-conceived 'strategy.'Let's hope Cook is listening to the massively negative commentary and stock market verdict before settling on anything.

post #77 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by tlevier View Post
 

From a business perspective, Beats being a "premium" product like Apple's, (i.e. "nice margins") - it makes sense.  For as convenient as iTunes is for being "the world's catalog of music", their music store has been more of an encyclopedia of entries rather than a flavorful experience.  If Beats and their team can transform iTunes into more of an "experience" and people go there like a social network - it could have huge gains.  Where I see the problem with that idea is that music is art and when you get too many people together to discuss art, it almost always devolves into "turf war" or "pretentious snobbery".  When that happens, you are only left with "fans" and the "consumers" who don't care one way or the other to be involved up and leave.

 

The dynamic of iTunes needs to be a "Many to One" relationship and not an "Amongst" relationship with peers.  I think people's music taste is fairly private and they just want to know what other things are out there without the preachy opinions.

 

If Apple does buy Beats, you know Samsung will be "offended" and we'll see "Bumps by Samsung" within a year to compete.

 

If you're telling me that a $500B company like Apple, a company responsible for one of the most radical reinventions and redefinitions of the music industry in decades, doesn't have the internal talent to take on a task like the one you're getting at any better than a headphones maker and start-up streaming service, then Apple has far worse problems that I thought.

post #78 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post

All the services let me listen to days and days of music but few really helped me discover new artists.   

Before the internet, that's what friends were for. 1smoking.gif

Well, one of the things ...
post #79 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post
 

The market is giving Apple a solid thumping today. Market values loss ~$6B.

 

I have little doubt that it's over this silly, ill-conceived 'strategy.'Let's hope Cook is listening to the massively negative commentary and stock market verdict before settling on anything.

 

Stock has been up almost $70B the last 2 weeks.  It was due for a slight correction.

 

No stock goes straight up.

post #80 of 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Maybe because even the Apple 'faithful' are wondering out loud what Apple is doing here?
Maybe Apple will buy them, keep them as a separate entity and just rake in the profits from their overpriced headphones. Maybe brand reputation gets thrown out the window if there's an easy way to increase revenue/profits. Though I'm still trying to understand how Cook will sell us on Beats having a quality product and fitting in with the culture of Apple. He'll need to do some massive spinning there.
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