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Longtime Apple PR head Katie Cotton officially retires - Page 4

post #121 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

No, not at all, but I'm of the opinion that it is better to keep a closed mouth and be thought a fool, than to open it and be proven one.

If you think that is good advice, you should heed it.
post #122 of 140

Well all this arguing aside, cotton has still gone through one of the most prosperous periods of Apple's history. So she must have been doing something right, or just riding other people's good ideas...

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Edited by briancphy - 7/1/14 at 1:46pm
post #123 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


Jon Fortt of CNBC tweeted this:
I'm not convinced this is going to add to Apple. I've seen some articles on Medium that Apple is going to try and save the music industry. Ben Thompson wrote on his blog Stratechery that this may be another signal that Apple is moving in the direction of a fashion company that just happens to sell technology. And the latest article from the NYTimes claims Apple is buying up 'tastemakers', essentially a group of people replacing what Steve Jobs was.

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/05/30/what-the-beats-deal-says-about-apple-it-loves-tastemakers/?_php=true&_type=blogs&hpw&rref=technology&_r=0

I personally think this is Apple basically admitting they're way behind when it comes to music. But they're going to have to work fast because the competition isn't sitting back doing nothing. I'll be curious id they attempt to create a YouTube competitor.

 

That's exactly my point, too - with Cook, the world's greatest COO and NOTHING else in charge, Apple has gone from being the world's trendsetter in all things music-related (i.e., iPod and iTMS) as well as the sheer epitome of "cool" to a mere follower of fads such as Beats, with its overhyped, low quality headphones and its stupid gangsta-style fashion.

 

So let me state the same thing in other words: Apple has gone from practically CREATING the digital music market to just being another "me-too/let-me-buy-you-with-my-cash" company - there is absolutely no other reason for buying Beats, as already acknowledged by Apple itself:

 

“The addition of Beats will make our music lineup even better, from free streaming with iTunes Radio to a world-class subscription service in Beats, and of course buying music from the iTunes Store as customers have loved to do for years.”

 

So there you go: subscription music costs USD 3 billion now.

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post #124 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

No, not at all, but I'm of the opinion that it is better to keep a closed mouth and be thought a fool, than to open it and be proven one.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

If you think that is good advice, you should heed it.

 

      See what I mean? 🌻

See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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post #125 of 140

When are people going to think of another excuse for retiring other than "spend more time with my family"? It's the most hackneyed, insincere phrase there could be. Do these people suddenly think to themselves, "My goodness, I've got such a great family, why on earth have I been neglecting them for all these decades? I know! I’ll give my work up and spend lots more time with them!" No. Their work is over, voluntarily or otherwise, and they have no imagination, so they resort to the tired cliché.

"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
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"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
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post #126 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Frost View Post

When are people going to think of another excuse for retiring other than "spend more time with my family"? It's the most hackneyed, insincere phrase there could be. Do these people suddenly think to themselves, "My goodness, I've got such a great family, why on earth have I been neglecting them for all these decades? I know! I’ll give my work up and spend lots more time with them!" No. Their work is over, voluntarily or otherwise, and they have no imagination, so they resort to the tired cliché.

How do you get "[I've] been neglecting [my family] for al these decades" from a desire to spend more time with them?

I remember in my youth I used to go out pretty much every night and then work the next day. Every now and then I'd take a night off to recoup but I can't do that these days. These days, going out past my normal bedtime means I need to plan around not having to work the next day and that's even without staying up as late or drinking, literally just staying up and socializing. I'm not even close to the typical retirement age so why can't a person that use to work 50 hours a week plus another 10 hours in commuting, plus another 5 hours for lunch in their younger years have still been more active when they got home at night or on the weekend than they are after decades of working for the same company. The work hours, commute, and lunch times aren't likely to change but the time you sleep or need rest is probably going to increase gradually and therefore cut into your free time. Absolutely nothing about it says they are neglectful spouses, parents, siblings, or offspring.

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post #127 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Frost View Post

When are people going to think of another excuse for retiring other than "spend more time with my family"? It's the most hackneyed, insincere phrase there could be. Do these people suddenly think to themselves, "My goodness, I've got such a great family, why on earth have I been neglecting them for all these decades? I know! I’ll give my work up and spend lots more time with them!" No. Their work is over, voluntarily or otherwise, and they have no imagination, so they resort to the tired cliché.

How do you get "[I've] been neglecting [my family] for al these decades" from a desire to spend more time with them?

I remember in my youth I used to go out pretty much every night and then work the next day. Every now and then I'd take a night off to recoup but I can't do that these days. These days, going out past my normal bedtime means I need to plan around not having to work the next day and that's even without staying up as late or drinking, literally just staying up and socializing. I'm not even close to the typical retirement age so why can't a person that use to work 50 hours a week plus another 10 hours in commuting, plus another 5 hours for lunch in their younger years have still been more active when they got home at night or on the weekend than they are after decades of working for the same company. The work hours, commute, and lunch times aren't likely to change but the time you sleep or need rest is probably going to increase gradually and therefore cut into your free time. Absolutely nothing about it says they are neglectful spouses, parents, siblings, or offspring.

Of course! I agree with everything you say! You're reading far too much into my post.

 

The problem with the phrase 'spending more time with the family' is that it isn't the whole truth. Cotton has done a long stint with Apple and has obviously earned her retirement. It would just be nice to see some acknowledgement of the other side of things - that she's had a good innings and some reflection on her work. That way we, the reader, get a more balanced and honest view of her retirement. It's almost as those people feel that they need to justify why they are leaving a job. Why should they? 

 

And re getting old: I entirely sympathise with you! I'm only middle-aged, but get stupidly tired, although a large part of that is due to a big accident I had.

"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
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"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
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post #128 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by brlawyer View Post

That's exactly my point, too - with Cook, the world's greatest COO and NOTHING else in charge, Apple has gone from being the world's trendsetter in all things music-related (i.e., iPod and iTMS) as well as the sheer epitome of "cool" to a mere follower of fads such as Beats, with its overhyped, low quality headphones and its stupid gangsta-style fashion.

So let me state the same thing in other words: Apple has gone from practically CREATING the digital music market to just being another "me-too/let-me-buy-you-with-my-cash" company - there is absolutely no other reason for buying Beats, as already acknowledged by Apple itself:

“The addition of Beats will make our music lineup even better, from free streaming with iTunes Radio to a world-class subscription service in Beats, and of course buying music from the iTunes Store as customers have loved to do for years.”

So there you go: subscription music costs USD 3 billion now.

You can't believe the tripe you just write, can you? Cook oversaw the most profitable period in Apple's history. How does spending < 3% of available cash on Beats define Apple as a "me-too/let-me-buy-you-with-my-cash" company?
post #129 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Frost View Post

When are people going to think of another excuse for retiring other than "spend more time with my family"? It's the most hackneyed, insincere phrase there could be. Do these people suddenly think to themselves, "My goodness, I've got such a great family, why on earth have I been neglecting them for all these decades? I know! I’ll give my work up and spend lots more time with them!" No. Their work is over, voluntarily or otherwise, and they have no imagination, so they resort to the tired cliché.
Hackneyed and insincere, eh? Then maybe you'll take notice of a couple quotes when Peter Oppenheimer announced in early March that he was stepping down:

Tim Cook: "Peter is also a dear friend I always knew I could count on. Although I am sad to see him leave, I am happy he is taking time for himself and his family."

Peter Oppenheimer: "I love Apple and the people I have had the privilege to work with and after 18 years here, it is time for me to take time for myself and my family. For quite some time, I have wanted to live on the central coast of California and get more involved at Cal Poly, my alma mater; spend more time with my wife and sons; travel to interesting parts of the world; and something I have wanted to do for years— finish the requirements for my pilot's license."

It's so easy to toss off comments here and make assumptions that one has no grounds to make. Do you have any direct idea what Cotton or Oppenheimer or anyone else at Apple might have given up over the years to get their jobs done? Some of them have no doubt shown the stamina of mules, carrying workloads that might well kill you or me or other ordinary mortals. But there is often a heavy price to pay. Google Peter Oppenheimer's current photo for example, and compare it to the one he authorizes for Apple's website. Frankly, I hope that now he'll have a chance to take better care of himself before he's cut down by a heart attack or a stroke. (And did you know, BTW, that when Katie Cotton started with Apple 18 years ago, she could have been a contender for Playmate of the Year? 1biggrin.gif)

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post #130 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kibitzer View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Frost View Post

When are people going to think of another excuse for retiring other than "spend more time with my family"? It's the most hackneyed, insincere phrase there could be. Do these people suddenly think to themselves, "My goodness, I've got such a great family, why on earth have I been neglecting them for all these decades? I know! I’ll give my work up and spend lots more time with them!" No. Their work is over, voluntarily or otherwise, and they have no imagination, so they resort to the tired cliché.
Hackneyed and insincere, eh? Then maybe you'll take notice of a couple quotes when Peter Oppenheimer announced in early March that he was stepping down:

Tim Cook: "Peter is also a dear friend I always knew I could count on. Although I am sad to see him leave, I am happy he is taking time for himself and his family."

Peter Oppenheimer: "I love Apple and the people I have had the privilege to work with and after 18 years here, it is time for me to take time for myself and my family. For quite some time, I have wanted to live on the central coast of California and get more involved at Cal Poly, my alma mater; spend more time with my wife and sons; travel to interesting parts of the world; and something I have wanted to do for years— finish the requirements for my pilot's license."

It's so easy to toss off comments here and make assumptions that one has no grounds to make. Do you have any direct idea what Cotton or Oppenheimer or anyone else at Apple might have given up over the years to get their jobs done? Some of them have no doubt shown the stamina of mules, carrying workloads that might well kill you or me or other ordinary mortals. But there is often a heavy price to pay. Google Peter Oppenheimer's current photo for example, and compare it to the one he authorizes for Apple's website. Frankly, I hope that now he'll have a chance to take better care of himself before he's cut down by a heart attack or a stroke. (And did you know, BTW, that when Katie Cotton started with Apple 18 years ago, she could have been a contender for Playmate of the Year? 1biggrin.gif)

 

Ah yes, but Oppenheimer expands on the theme, so we see a very genuine-sounding yearning for a release from the treadmill of life. Note also that he first looks back to his work at Apple. I guess my main criticism was the brevity of her statement - thing is, it's often the case with, say, politicians, that when they are forced to resign, they often put brief statements out saying the spend time with family thing. In order to distance herself from that, it might have been wise for Cotton to be more expansive like Oppenheimer. Anyway, she's going to have a story or two to tell!

"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
Reply
"If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth."
- African proverb
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post #131 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Frost View Post

Ah yes, but Oppenheimer expands on the theme, so we see a very genuine-sounding yearning for a release from the treadmill of life. Note also that he first looks back to his work at Apple. I guess my main criticism was the brevity of her statement - thing is, it's often the case with, say, politicians, that when they are forced to resign, they often put brief statements out saying the spend time with family thing. In order to distance herself from that, it might have been wise for Cotton to be more expansive like Oppenheimer. Anyway, she's going to have a story or two to tell!
Or it may be that Katie Cotton doesn't give a rat's patootie about "distancing herself from that" ... let alone what you or I or her hairdresser may think! I'm with you in one respect - I bet she could write a fascinating insider's memoir about the great growth era of Apple.
Edited by Kibitzer - 6/1/14 at 6:38pm

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post #132 of 140
Originally Posted by Benjamin Frost View Post
When are people going to think of another excuse for retiring other than "spend more time with my family"?

 

Maybe, just maybe, 90 hour work weeks at Apple would keep someone away from their families.

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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post #133 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Maybe, just maybe, 90 hour work weeks at Apple would keep someone away from their families.

A 90 hour work week gives credence to his trumped up claim that these people have been neglecting their families for decades.

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #134 of 140
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
A 90 hour work week gives credence to his trumped up claim that these people have been neglecting their families for decades.

 

 

In before “I neglected my family during my tenure at Apple and all I got was this lousy shirt.”

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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post #135 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

[image]

In before “I neglected my family during my tenure at Apple and all I got was this lousy shirt.”

That's nearly 13 hours of work per day 7 days a week. That doesn't include lunch, commute, or any other work related chores that you don't get paid. That's also 50% more hours than Foxconn workers are allowed to work.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #136 of 140
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
That's nearly 13 hours of work per day 7 days a week. That doesn't include lunch, commute, or any other work related chores that you don't get paid. That's also 50% more hours than Foxconn workers are allowed to work.

 

That’s the story.

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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post #137 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

That’s the story.

That's very different. Even if we assume that the folklore.org article is accurate it states 1) they were trying to meet a deadline so it wasn't something expected of them constantly, and 2) that were young "with few family obligations to distract us."

At one point in my life I worked 2 full-time jobs for only 72 hours a week of pay. One was a typical 8am to 5pm job with an hour off for lunch and the other was a weekend only where I pulled double shifts so I would work 16 hours on both Sat and Sunday from 3pm to 7am, no time off for lunch so you brought it. I did that for 6 months. I was young. I wasn't neglecting any close family members or pets. I didn't go out with friends. t saved a lot of money. I was a walking zombie.

There is no way I could do that now and I'm not even close to the 62yo retirement age. There is no way that would be done at Apple today and no way that one could do that for decades on end as @Benjamin Frost suggests.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #138 of 140
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
There is no way that would be done at Apple today…

 

Well, not without it being a decision made by the people in question, certainly. And no; I imagine he’s just being facetious anyway.

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
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post #139 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark View Post


You can't believe the tripe you just write, can you? Cook oversaw the most profitable period in Apple's history. How does spending < 3% of available cash on Beats define Apple as a "me-too/let-me-buy-you-with-my-cash" company?

 

That was exactly my point - he oversaw it as a great COO, i.e. no need to have vision or anything of the sort; as a CEO he is unfortunately going the way of Nokia.

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post #140 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by mpantone View Post

Good riddance, part of the Steve Jobs era that really deserves to be shown the door and handed her hat.

She has been an unabashed, unapologetic and crushingly unconvincing liar on behalf of the company (primarily for Steve).

She fulfilled an important role in the company at the time, although she largely fell silent about a year before Steve's passing, probably because no one sane would believe what she uttered, like the "Steve is out with a virus" B.S. which because increasingly shrill and ludicrous.

But hey, high tech public relations is one of the most soulless careers on the planet, it's rather surprising that anyone can survive nearly two decades in such a soul-sucking role. Hopefully there's something still left in her heart.

I sincerely wish her the best of luck on her future endeavors. For everyone's sake, let's hope it has nothing to do with public relations.


If what you say about Cotton is correct, I suggest she did her job very well !!!

 

Also she knew when it's time to go.

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