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Apple announces OS X 10.10 Yosemite with new interface, enhanced apps & continuity - Page 3

post #81 of 131
Am I the only one who see this as the beginning of the merger between OS X and iOS?

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post #82 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by einsteinbqat View Post

Am I the only one who see this as the beginning of the merger between OS X and iOS?

Oh, you're not the only one, but you're not correct. There is absolutely no way that a windowed UI will ever be the same UI as on an iOS-based iDevice, and vice versa. Even the iPad and iPhone have unique UIs despite both being based on CocoaTouch.

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post #83 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by einsteinbqat View Post

Am I the only one who see this as the beginning of the merger between OS X and iOS?

Oh, you're not the only one, but you're not correct. There is absolutely no way that a windowed UI will ever be the same UI as on an iOS-based iDevice, and vice versa. Even the iPad and iPhone have unique UIs despite both being based on CocoaTouch.

But it could happen, no? I suppose that Apple will figure out a way.

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post #84 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by einsteinbqat View Post

But it could happen, no? I suppose that Apple will figure out a way.

How? Cocoa and CocoaTouch are still separate and the iPad and iPhone UIs are still separate and yet we're to expect Apple to be able to put the exact same UI as found on a Mac on an iPhone and vice versa? Not going to happen! Apple's goal is to build idealized UIs for each device that seamlessly interconnect with other, not to make one OS UI that is a compromise on every HW it's on. That's MS' goal and they're failing at it.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #85 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by einsteinbqat View Post

But it could happen, no? I suppose that Apple will figure out a way.

How? Cocoa and CocoaTouch are still separate and the iPad and iPhone UIs are still separate and yet we're to expect Apple to be able to put the exact same UI as found on a Mac on an iPhone and vice versa? Not going to happen! Apple's goal is to build idealized UIs for each device that seamlessly interconnect with other, not to make one OS UI that is a compromise on every HW it's on. That's MS' goal and they're failing at it.

 

True. That sounds more logical than trying to merge everything together. 

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post #86 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by einsteinbqat View Post

Am I the only one who see this as the beginning of the merger between OS X and iOS?

You means Windows 8? LOL

 
Where's the new Apple TV?
 
And still waiting for SolipsismX to prove his accusation:
"And yet they haven't loved Google Wallet which you claimed was the exact same thing and kept posting...
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Where's the new Apple TV?
 
And still waiting for SolipsismX to prove his accusation:
"And yet they haven't loved Google Wallet which you claimed was the exact same thing and kept posting...
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post #87 of 131
Hopefully looks better on Retina displays. Not so hot on a 1080p monitor
post #88 of 131
My biggest take away from this is that they've finally gotten rid if that God awful 3D dock.

I wonder how long it will take Adobe to butcher the new UI and bolt on an abortion of an interface?
OK, can I have my matte Apple display, now?
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OK, can I have my matte Apple display, now?
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post #89 of 131

I have to say iCloud Drive looks to be a huge leap forward in moving between devices — which is one of the things I've been looking for since installing Mavericks. 

 

I'm also, like some others here, not that keen on Helvetica as a font for OSX. I don't like it in documents and I won't like it on screen. It has just become so overused, like Times at 12 pt. Both ruined by all the amateur usage in Word documents. Still, I expect the look of the modern computer screen has become fixed as having a particular style — and that has converged on Helvetica. Maybe Ive could have put in a good word for Gill Sans.

 

Also agree that Federighi did an awesome job. Lots of charisma, tons of great jokes — some of which went by maybe a little too quickly.

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AppleInsider = Apple-in-cider. It's a joke!

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post #90 of 131

Jedem das seine: I like the new look of Yosemite.

 

Just disappointed that iTunes is still what it is. I hoped it would be broken down to several apps. Ah well. 

post #91 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

This x1000

The guy has stunningly good presentation skills, and seems like a genius to boot. Couldn't be happier that he now is in charge of both OSX and iOS. He basically owned the entire keynote. I can see this guy being Apple's next CEO, if he wants it. He certainly has the perspective, wisdom, and skills. The fact that Frederighini is given such a chance to shine is also a testament to Cook's leadership skills. 

Actually, compare Federighi to Satya Nadella and there is no comparison in their presentation styles. Federighi rules.

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post #92 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackzig1984 View Post

Does anyone know the hardware requirements for Yosemite?

Glacial basin, approximately 3000 sq. km.

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post #93 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by photoeditor View Post

I'm not keen on the typography on Yosemite. I hope I will like it better in practice, but it looks like the iPad, and I've had to bold that for legibility as it is. My belief is that legibility is best served by a fairly even and not too tightly leaded typeface like the one we have now, and like the one on the new federal highway signs in the US for example -- both the current Apple one and the new Federal Highway Administration one having been chosen through exhaustive testing and focus grouping for a reason. Unfortunately, unlike FHA with its safety inspectorate pushing for signage that motorists can read as quickly as possible, Apple have moved towards a "look" as opposed to usability. It's especially ironic given that as they're helping users by decluttering the graphics, they're hindering them by turning the text into a graphical element instead of, er, text. The new Apple font is like an overleaded Helvetica, prettier in graphical appearance but slower in practice to read, better than the current one from the point of view of having a font that looks good on screen and in ads, lousy from the point of view of actually using the computer. I can only hope they'll let us keep the old one . . . shouldn't be too hard if they're serious about a scalable UI and using vector support. But I probably should have taken iTunes 11 as a warning sign of where Apple were heading with this.

iOS8 I am very keen on. So much so that they *might* have done enough to get me to switch from Android, which I didn't think I'd ever consider. No real distinction on fonts here as both Apple and Google have fallen for the lure of the overcooked Helvetica, but in other areas it looks like Apple are serious about opening a real lead on Android for usability. Opening up the OS to extensions is fantastic; it solves one of the big problems for me on iOS, the lack of trace typing such as Swype. And in combination with the WiFi feature it might solve the other, the lack of user choice in tethering applications and configuration. If that one is solved as well, the iPhone will finally meet my needs without jailbreaking, and so I'll at last have an open choice between the two platforms. And just for kicks they went one better and added some decent configurability to the home page as well. So it's looking like a platform that can finally add competitiveness in features to its advantages in security and hardware.

Lucida Grande, Helvetica—what's the difference? I certainly can't tell them apart. The real problem is that sans-serif fonts in general cause brain damage. Or are caused by brain damage, I'm not sure.
post #94 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Messiah View Post

My biggest take away from this is that they've finally gotten rid if that God awful 3D dock.

I wonder how long it will take Adobe to butcher the new UI and bolt on an abortion of an interface?

 

The dock on my Mac isn't 3D. Just place the dock on either the left or right edge of the screen (where it was on NeXTSTEP) and it reverts to 2D flat.

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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #95 of 131

Why do the icons in OSX have to be different from the icons in iOS?

 

I mean, Why can't we have rounded square icons like we have with iOS? I am not so fond of the circular OSX icons.

 

Also, How come the mail icon in OSX - an eagle on a stamp - still looks different to the beautiful simple mail icon in iOS?

 

It'd be great to have one unified look across all devices.

post #96 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr O View Post

Why do the icons in OSX have to be different from the icons in iOS?

I mean, Why can't we have rounded square icons like we have with iOS?

Also, How come the mail icon in OSX - an eagle on a stamp - still looks different to the beautiful simple mail icon in iOS?

It'd be great to have one unified look across all devices.

I agree. If you want to get more Mac adopters I think it's best to make the comparable elements as uniform as possible.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #97 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDog View Post

Buy a new Mac?  Get 5 free calls to Dr. Dre during normal rapper hours.
Which is only 2 times a day. 4:20 and 4:20pm

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2014 27" Retina iMac i5, 2012 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air 2, iPad Mini Retina, iPhone 6, iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
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post #98 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by einsteinbqat View Post

True. That sounds more logical than trying to merge everything together. 
I agree. If they sync up perfectly and seamlessly, there truly is no need to merge iOS and OSX. It's a perfect 1-2 punch currently.

I feel bad for people in the windows world... They just don't know how easy computing can and should be. Disk defragment... Really?

2014 27" Retina iMac i5, 2012 27" iMac i7, 2011 Mac Mini i5
iPad Air 2, iPad Mini Retina, iPhone 6, iPhone 5S, iPod Touch 5
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post #99 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr O View Post

Why do the icons in OSX have to be different from the icons in iOS?

I mean, Why can't we have rounded square icons like we have with iOS? I am not so fond of the circular OSX icons.

Also, How come the mail icon in OSX - an eagle on a stamp - still looks different to the beautiful simple mail icon in iOS?

It'd be great to have one unified look across all devices.

I thought the same thing. Mail, safari, calendar, maps- why not the iOS versions?
People complaining about the UI are just whiners. The icons themselves barely changed. Blue iTunes to red iTunes was a bigger change than any of the icons for Yosemite

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post #100 of 131
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post


Glacial basin, approximately 3000 sq. km.

 

 

Nice one!

 

 

Interesting to see people who are actually trying it out complaining already about the font and translucency.  Please send feedback to Apple.

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #101 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post


Nice one!


Interesting to see people who are actually trying it out complaining already about the font and translucency.  Please send feedback to Apple.

People will literally complain about anything.

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post #102 of 131
Has soon as I saw this I thought Milk by Max Rudberg!
post #103 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


People will literally complain about anything.

 

 

I am glad they are complaining.  Did you see my first comment about Yosemite?  Translucency is horrible.  I am not a dev so I don't get the beta today; signed up for the public beta and didn't get an error that too many had signed up so I might make it into that program.  

 

Looking over things again, lots of the functionality looks great... There are some visual tweaks that I think are truly needed; options would be fine, but as is now it is not polished.  It's not as bad as iO7, but they are certainly going that way.  Too white.  Not enough separation between elements (mostly contrast).  This is just based on looking at Apple's site, so I will have to wait and see it in person.  Fortunately, I have a spare Mac mini just for testing purposes, so I am ready to go.

 

The new trash can reminds me of the Dark Lord from Star Wars (I'm a Trekkie so I'm not sure of exactly which SW character it is but the can looks evil!)...  How many multi-millionaires spent how long designing that thing?  Looking at the images on Apple's site, it just doesn't fit on the menu bar.


Edited by Bergermeister - 6/3/14 at 4:27am

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply
post #104 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by pazuzu View Post

Federighi should be running Apple. At least he knows to tuck the shirt in not like the other 4 Bozos who still think it's 2004.

 

I'm never going back to tucking in my shirt when I don't have to. Sometimes fashion makes an advance that improves our lives, and we should stick with it. 

 

If ties were ever to go out of fashion for "serious business," for example, I would resist ever wearing one again. They're barbaric instruments of torture...much like many women's work shoes.

post #105 of 131

"Continuity" is simply GENIUS!:

 

  1. It turns all of your Apple devices into a phone* …
  2. … without the need of having a subscription plan for every separate device you use.
  3. It actually renders the iPhone 5.5" useless. Your iPad mini could function as a phone as well.
  4. And as a bonus: having your phone in your bag instead of holding it next to your head will make you less exposed to potential hazardous radiation levels. It will actually reduce radiation levels by at least 95%**!

 

(*) If you have an iPhone.

(**) This is what Hulger claims.

 

Did I already mention that "Continuity" is simply GENIUS?!


Edited by mr O - 6/4/14 at 12:53am
post #106 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post
 

 

I'd settle for character!

 

On Topic:  I wonder what the age of the average Mac OS user is?  Would this have bearing upon the design of the UI?

 

I suppose you mean OS X user.

 

I don't know if there is any relation between the two (age of majority or average age of users - UI design) but I believe that there could be. The UI has to have an appeal for most of the users, current and potential ones. The new interface looks quite juvenile to my eyes. I don't like the color choice as seen in the pictures, but I will hold my judgment until I see the new system in person. And contrary to many people's criticism, I will welcome the return of the 2D Dock in its default (bottom) position. Let's not forget that before Leopard the Dock was also flat.

post #107 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by initiator View Post
 


My sentiments exactly. Didn't we already do translucency? They're making it sound like it is this new revelation.

 

Indeed, the first Mac OS X iterations made a great use of translucency, where the foreground window was completely opaque and the background ones had translucent title bars. Together with two levels of shadow depth, it helped usability in a very nice way.

 

Now what exactly translucency is supposed to do? If it affects all the windows simultaneously, then it may get in the way and become annoying. Can anyone describe how it works in Yosemite?

post #108 of 131

Amazing keyboard. Love the new icons in 10.10. All beautiful.

 

The UI aka toolbars need some work to be considered beautiful. Not a big big fan of translucency on the Mac.

 

EDIT: but won't make a final judgement until I use the GM.


Edited by Ireland - 6/3/14 at 4:02am
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #109 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by pazuzu View Post
 

You means Windows 8? LOL

 

Just go will you.

Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #110 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boltsfan17 View Post
 

Just a heads up, the OS X Yosemite beta sign up is live. First million who sign up get in on the beta. 

 

Wow, I missed that tidbit. But got in on the beta yesterday anyway:

 

 

Back on 10.9.3 now.

Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #111 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by PB View Post
 

 

Indeed, the first Mac OS X iterations made a great use of translucency, where the foreground window was completely opaque and the background ones had translucent title bars. Together with two levels of shadow depth, it helped usability in a very nice way.

 

Now what exactly translucency is supposed to do? If it affects all the windows simultaneously, then it may get in the way and become annoying. Can anyone describe how it works in Yosemite?

Yep, Craig can. just re-watch the keynote and he demonstrates this about six times in various apps like finder, mail, safari, etc..

 

:)

-PopinFRESH

post #112 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by tronjheim67 View Post
 

Jedem das seine: I like the new look of Yosemite.

 

Just disappointed that iTunes is still what it is. I hoped it would be broken down to several apps. Ah well. 

I've thought this in the past as well, but I'm sure it's hard to let go of such a major branding piece. What would be interesting is that if they consolidated the software naming to something like how AppleTV is, the (Apple logo)TV. So for example (Apple Logo)Music, (Apple Logo)Movies, (Apple Logo)Radio, (Apple Logo)Books, (Apple Logo)Pictures... and (Apple Logo)TV for the TV app and re-brand the AppleTV hardware iStream or something that is more modern than "TV" that really fits what the hardware does.
 

Then (as I'm sure this is already all the same iTunes system on the backend) consolidate all the stores into an (Apple Logo)Store. Within that Apple Store, all those silos would be sort-able and filterable. So if I want to look for a Movie to buy, I'd open the Store app and choose (Apple Logo)Movies. It would then dive in to an optimized Movie browsing experience for that device. If I choose (Apple Logo)Music, I would be presented with what you'd expect from the iTunes Music store.

 

Break the various media apps into functional silos, and converge the stores into a single consolidated experience. This would allow Apple to really optimize the UX based on the media being consumed rather than cramming everything into what was originally built as a music jukebox. These smaller apps that would be more focused on the content they are delivering would also be more likely to be unified across Apples platforms and services like they are doing with the iLife and iWork apps. "(Apple Logo)Pictures" is already basically being done. Imagine having an (Apple Logo)Movies app that is on OS X, and iOS, as well as having an iCloud app. You could have a movie you buy download to your iPhone, iPad, iStream (AppleTV) and Mac and also be available to stream directly from a browser on iCloud. So you could be watching on your Mac and then go to a friends house that has a PC, open up a browser and login to iCloud.com and continue watching right where you left off.

 

Anyway, enough dreaming... maybe we will get there someday, but not today. I am really excited that iCloud Family Sharing is at least a major step in the right direction at least!

 

-PopinFRESH

post #113 of 131

How do you get in touch with Apple to give them feedback?  The thought of being stuck with Helvetica Neue instead of Lucida Grande is really bothering me from a legibility standpoint.  Mac is not supposed to have inferior typography to Windows.  Steve Jobs is probably rolling in his grave.  We're moving from a font that looks great on Retina and good on standard definition, to a font that looks barely OK on Retina and horrible on standard definition.  I at least want the option to stay put.  That surely shouldn't be too hard, right?

 

I've already had to "tame" Helvetica Neue on my iPad by choosing the bold version.  But on a desktop OS the font is far more significant.  Surely we ought to be able to choose.

post #114 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post


I am glad they are complaining.  Did you see my first comment about Yosemite?  Translucency is horrible.  I am not a dev so I don't get the beta today; signed up for the public beta and didn't get an error that too many had signed up so I might make it into that program.  

Looking over things again, lots of the functionality looks great... There are some visual tweaks that I think are truly needed; options would be fine, but as is now it is not polished.  It's not as bad as iO7, but they are certainly going that way.  Too white.  Not enough separation between elements (mostly contrast).  This is just based on looking at Apple's site, so I will have to wait and see it in person.  Fortunately, I have a spare Mac mini just for testing purposes, so I am ready to go.

The new trash can reminds me of the Dark Lord from Star Wars (I'm a Trekkie so I'm not sure of exactly which SW character it is but the can looks evil!)...  How many multi-millionaires spent how long designing that thing?  Looking at the images on Apple's site, it just doesn't fit on the menu bar.

I'm confident your preferences settings will allow you to minimize translucency, just like in iOS.

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post #115 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

I agree. If they sync up perfectly and seamlessly, there truly is no need to merge iOS and OSX. It's a perfect 1-2 punch currently.

I feel bad for people in the windows world... They just don't know how easy computing can and should be. Disk defragment... Really?

Apple has been coming at this form the two viable sides. One from using the same base code and using the same IDE so that developer only need to idealize the UI for each device type, and by making the experience more intuitive so that the user doesn't even rea
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I'm confident your preferences settings will allow you to minimize translucency, just like in iOS.

I have yet to find anything except for the Menu Bar translucency


"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #116 of 131
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
I have yet to find anything except for the Menu Bar translucency

 

Drop ‘em a line and they’ll probably add it in a later beta.

post #117 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by einsteinbqat View Post

Am I the only one who see this as the beginning of the merger between OS X and iOS?

 

When Cook noted that combining a toaster and a fridge was a bad idea it wasn't just a jab at MS for getting it wrong.  Apple also knew what 'getting it right' looks like, and Continuity is it.  Integration and consistency of user experience is far different than trying to merge two OS's (which have different modalities and use cases they are tailored to address) without regard for whether the end result was good at doing either thing the separate offerings were intended for.

 

When Gatekeeper was announced I remember thinking that as far as a desktop OS goes, OSX was basically 'there' and that while this was a nice feature that there wasn't anything really 'left to do' other than minor tweaks and fixes and modest improvements.  Apple surprised and delighted me by showing/reminding us that they really get that any software, including an OS is a means to an end.  In Apple's view, that end is a fantastic user experience.  In MS's view, that end is selling Windows licenses.

 

So, no, they won't likely merge.  But I expect we'll see continued opening up of integration and seamlessness of experience.  Which is a win.

You did not come into the world to fail. You came into the world to succeed.

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post #118 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by PopinFRESH View Post
 

Yep, Craig can. just re-watch the keynote and he demonstrates this about six times in various apps like finder, mail, safari, etc..

 

:)

-PopinFRESH

 

I have not watched the keynote. For some reason it does not load properly. Since you seem to know, could you describe in a few words how it works and, most importantly, if it is invasive/annoying?

post #119 of 131

Hi All,

 

Like one early commenter, I have significant performance issues. I get the spinning ball on almost everything I do but particularly when switching apps. Its driving me nuts and will force me to switch back to Mavericks soon - something I want to avoid as I like Yosemite already for multiple reasons.

 

Is everyone experiencing this? I have an i7 MacBook pro (retina) with 8GB of memory and it doesn't looked like a performance issue if Activity Monitor is anything to go by.

 

If others are not experiencing this I might try a clean install.

 

Thanks

Cheers

 

Richard

post #120 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by PB View Post
 

 

I have not watched the keynote. For some reason it does not load properly. Since you seem to know, could you describe in a few words how it works and, most importantly, if it is invasive/annoying?

Sure. The side bar of things like Mail, Finder, Reminders, etc.. is translucent (like smoked glass) similar to Control Center on iOS 7. I don't find it invasive or annoying, its like it's white but translucent enough to pickup the color behind it. The top bar "menu" bar in things like Mail, Safari, Reminders, etc.. is similar but imagine a solid white sheet under the content of the window and then the smoked glass on top of that. So that when you slide the content up "under" the "menu" bar picks up the color from the content. Again, I don't personally find this invasive or annoying. It definitely brings OS X inline with iOS's new UI elements. They demoed (at least for the contextual menu bar) a Dark Mode that basically made the context menu look like black smoked glass (so a dark grey translucent look) instead of a white smoked glass.

 

If you ever used Windows Vista, the translucency is similar to Aero Glass but without the stupid fake looking "gloss sheen" lines. This should help you watch the Keynote so you can judge for your self.

 

To watch it on any iOS 6 or later device just go to this link on the device

http://www.apple.com/apple-events/june-2014/

 

To watch on a PC you'll need to make sure you have the latest update to Quicktime installed and the plugin active in your browser. So download Quicktime from the following link and then close out of all your browsers while you install it. Then proceed to the link to the Keynote on Apple.com

http://www.apple.com/quicktime/download/

http://www.apple.com/apple-events/june-2014/

 

Or you can watch it on YouTube which should work for you without Quicktime.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w87fOAG8fjk&list=PLHFlHpPjgk713fMv5O4s4Fv7k6yTkXwkV

 

-PopinFRESH

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