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Adobe 'committed to helping' Aperture customers migrate to Lightroom after Apple announcement - Page 2

post #41 of 92

It's working fine in 10.10 for me too. I suspect Apple will keep it working, fixing any crash bugs, until Photos comes out early next year. They won't give loyal users a reason to jump ship to Adobe. Same thing with iPhoto.

post #42 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Apple and Adobe have traditionally collaborated. Apple licensed PostScript for their early LaserWriters, and Apple licenses DisplayPDF for OS X.

 

Adobe also didn't support OS X at first, Jobs never quite forgave them for that.

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Too many Apple products to list...Long on AAPL, so take what I say with a bucket of salt.

You are only relevant...if your customers love you.

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post #43 of 92
Guess a lot of us could sense this was coming but I'm grateful Apple made the announcment now, it allows time to formulate coping strategies rather than finding out next year when Yosemite appears.

I test each new version of lightroom but stick with Aperture for many reasons despite having Lightroom for free with CC/CC2014. My normal workflow was mainly possible with iPhoto and Photoshop, it's the management abilities and slickness of Aperture that will be missed and Adobe's cloud offerings are not very inviting compared to the ease of use of Apple's photostreams IMHO.

If Apple nailed the Photoshop intergration of Photos.app over Aperture's indifferent performance (in that aspect) and maintained robust file handling I'd be glad to skip Lightroom's cumbersome interface. I suppose Lightroom is OK if all you know is PCs but it's not very slick and unless they seriously improve the image "development" workflows flexibility LR will remain something of a last resort.

Despite looking forward to the upcoming iCloud photo storage, another concern is just how iCloud/Photos.app will cope with large libraries that would swamp any iDevice many times over. I hope Apple make some concessions to their ex-Aperture users by making this facet work in a useful and flexible manner that does not drive us in to the tentacles of Adobe.

Will development of LR slow to make it even more clunky now that it will effectively have no viable alernative? Wouldn't be surprised, despite Adobr's claims...
post #44 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by techguy911 View Post

Apple basically won the mobile flash argument so they probably don't consider Adobe to be an enemy anymore.  As long as Adobe is making pro software for OSX, Apple keeps selling computers.  

Seems Apple is actually embracing Lightroom. Probably good news for Lightroom development.
post #45 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

Apple clearly spent alot of time in building this product, updating it, advertising it, and integrating it. It's an excellent product, and financially, it's a net positive for them. It has a ton of loyal users, including Pros (and myself). Yet, in spite of this, they're willing to axe it, and even help people transition to a competitors product.

Apple...is still willing to make seemingly self-harming moves like this, when it truly believes its in the greater good. And that greater good is FOCUS. Apple, for better or worse, has decided that the baggage of maintaining the software, and making sure it plays well with their rebuilt photos app, is not the best use of their resources- especially when its for a limited user base. They made the calculation that marketing the product, and putting the energy and resources into meaningfully differentiating it from their upcoming photos app, is not in their best interest or that of most consumers. And thus, they answered the "does it deserve to exist" question. And that answer was "no". 

Actually, losing Aperture is the result of poorly written base code and years of mismanagement. It could never be upgraded with more advanced feature sets without a complete rewrite. Perhaps the will was not there because of an overarching plan to merge the iPhoto and Aperture platforms, but more than likely, it was the best option considering the long smoldering problems.

None the less, if you take the time to learn Lightroom you will find it to be a beautifully designed program, for photographers, by photographers. It puts aperture to shame. The "library" module is brilliantly flexible. The adobe camera raw program built into the "develop" module is far more elegant, and functional than aperture ever was, with compare windows and soft proofing built in. The learning curve is a bit steep, but highly worth the time and effort.
post #46 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post
 

Sadly, I subscribed to Adobe's suite a few days ago.  It was all because of the uncertainty of Aperture.  Apple really left it on the vine to rot and the general feeling from the user community is that Apple stopped updating it.

It's really too bad.  I don't like Adobe, and I'm certainly not a fan of its subscription model.  For the most part, they are the 800-pound gorilla in the room for the time being.

I preferred Apple's more polished, native app than Adobe's java nonsense.

I'm going to keep a very close eye on what Apple does.  I'm getting very deep back into professional photography and I couldn't wait to see what Apple was going to do.  I hope they integrate all of Aperture's more "professional" components into iPhoto, including RAW support.

I suspect for Adobe, it's a limited moment of joy.

 

Good luck with one of the worse software companies in existence, right up there with Autodesk.

post #47 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by igamogam View Post

Guess a lot of us could sense this was coming but I'm grateful Apple made the announcment now, it allows time to formulate coping strategies rather than finding out next year when Yosemite appears.

I test each new version of lightroom but stick with Aperture for many reasons despite having Lightroom for free with CC/CC2014. My normal workflow was mainly possible with iPhoto and Photoshop, it's the management abilities and slickness of Aperture that will be missed and Adobe's cloud offerings are not very inviting compared to the ease of use of Apple's photostreams IMHO.

If Apple nailed the Photoshop intergration of Photos.app over Aperture's indifferent performance (in that aspect) and maintained robust file handling I'd be glad to skip Lightroom's cumbersome interface. I suppose Lightroom is OK if all you know is PCs but it's not very slick and unless they seriously improve the image "development" workflows flexibility LR will remain something of a last resort.

Despite looking forward to the upcoming iCloud photo storage, another concern is just how iCloud/Photos.app will cope with large libraries that would swamp any iDevice many times over. I hope Apple make some concessions to their ex-Aperture users by making this facet work in a useful and flexible manner that does not drive us in to the tentacles of Adobe.

Will development of LR slow to make it even more clunky now that it will effectively have no viable alernative? Wouldn't be surprised, despite Adobr's claims...

 

Lot of if's and maybe's there.

post #48 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post
 

 

Adobe also didn't support OS X at first, Jobs never quite forgave them for that.

 

It took Adobe ten years to natively support the new software tools available for OS X, also notice the lackluster programs on iOS, and not just from Adobe but Autodesk too. Neither company will be Swift or petal to the Metal in any Mac or mobile software development.

post #49 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

The only thing that would cheer me up right now is news Apple are buying Adobe. Making all the software have a true OS X GUI and closing down production for Windows. That last part is just for laughs.

 

That would be a massive waste of money, Apple however should gotten Freehand before the black hole of Adobe killed them.

post #50 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by freediverx View Post

I've been reading numerous comments from some who expect the new Photos app will incorporate a lot of Aperture's power, rather than being a wimpy iPhoto refresh. I sure hope they're right. Note that Apple didn't say anything about customers having other options and they mentioned migrating to Photos. I think it would be pretty crass of Apple to suggest customers can migrate from Aperture to Photos if the latter will just have iPhoto-level features.

I hate to sound like a rerun of the Final Cut Pro 7 v X debate ... which wasn't as clear cut as it seemed at first, just terribly implemented by Apple. That said ... I don't see Photos being even close to what Aperture was or could have been for pros. I suspect Apple is ceding the pro photography ground to Adobe and others here. I can't see cloud storage satisfying a pro photographer let alone those simplistic preset corrections. Don't get me wrong, it's all great for the home user but it's not going to work for pros with multiple and massive client portfolios, massive storage requirements and the need of plug-ins, batch processing, HDR manipulation and and complex RAW controls. The fact it is a year off nearly, yet being talked about now by Apple, is like a red flag or perhaps 'ample warning' to anyone who has a business depending on Aperture and Apple know that. Any pro will have to parallel work flow in Aperture and something else for a while and ease in the learning curve and conversion process, it's not something you could just do over night if it turns out Photos is purely a home user product.

Meanwhile Aperture seems to work just fine in beta Yosemite so nothing will hopefully fail over night for anyone upon 10.10's release.
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post #51 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danox View Post

That would be a massive waste of money, Apple however should gotten Freehand before the black hole of Adobe killed them.

Well I wasn't being serious but I hear you on Freehand ... not to mention Aldus itself.
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post #52 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post

Adobe also didn't support OS X at first, Jobs never quite forgave them for that.

Me and many others didn't either. There was a time it was all Apple, Aldus and Adobe and there was happiness in graphics town ... then something went evil ... Gates backed by IBM stole Mac OS and then the prince of darkness screwed over IBM, unleashing Compaq, Dell and Gateway et al ... 20 something years of beige crap and malware followed. This should be made into a movie filmed in New Zealand ... 1biggrin.gif
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post #53 of 92

So, so furious about this.  I have used Aperture since day 1.  Now I will have to learn Lightroom, Bridge(?) and lose my edits or engage in a long and painful export process, or have a 14 year photo library split between the new Photos app (when it gets here) and whatever the Adobe organizational app is.

 

I have been using mac for 14 years and my whole home is Mac centric.  Multiple Macs, iPhones, iPad, Apple TV etc.

 

REALLY, REALLY ANGRY!

post #54 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Ouch ... but .. for Photography pros that's not a big deal, no one is suggestion iPhoto users get it 1wink.gif Then again I do want that Canon 70-200mm f/2.8L EF IS II USM Telephoto Zoom Lens soon and that comes first ... 1biggrin.gif

Funny. I'm eyeing myself buying the exact same lens this year. That lens is about as perfect as one can get. 1smile.gif
post #55 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danox View Post
 

 

Good luck with one of the worse software companies in existence, right up there with Autodesk.


So you're good at complaining about everything, yet offering zero on alternatives.  What options are there?  Stick with a forgotten product like Aperture and go on blind faith that Apple will get iPhoto (or whatever) more current?  If not Adobe, then whom?  

I already pointed out that I'm not a fan of Adobe, but they are the only real game in town.  They have the product, it's used by a gazillion people, and most importantly, it's supported.  

What other option is there?  

post #56 of 92

I hope some 3rd party jumps to the call here to fill Aperture's shoes and allow people to not move to Adobe.  Perhaps Pixelmator Pro X?  Heh heh...

 

I want to play with web design right now, but can't find anything simple and robust other than Muse, which is really frustrating.  Maybe I haven't looked hard enough.  I can't code at all:

 

10 print "I can't code"

20 goto 10

 

That is my level.  Tumult Hype is doing good things for me, but I want to push it a little further.

 

This is off topic, so I will end it there...   But, it is leading somewhere:  

 

I want to play with website design.... Muse might do (except I cannot use it to create a stand alone file without a web address???)

I want to manage my photos and edit and such....  Lightroom is looking really attractive, with PS

I do artwork regularly....  actually own and use Illustrator CS6...  

 

In short, you can eventually talk yourself in to signing up for Adobe.

 

Please, other developers: create great stuff.  But then, we don't know much about Photos, yet...


Edited by Bergermeister - 6/28/14 at 12:27am

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply
post #57 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleysm View Post

It's working fine in 10.10 for me too. I suspect Apple will keep it working, fixing any crash bugs, until Photos comes out early next year. They won't give loyal users a reason to jump ship to Adobe. Same thing with iPhoto.

No reason to make (valid) assumptions: Apple already stated they will create a migration tool for users to switch over to LR, together with Adobe. Plus they are going to make it 100% compatible with 10.10. And they also stated that their other Pro apps will continue to be updated and are not being discontinued.
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post #58 of 92
If I have to migrate my libraries to Lightroom I'm not too bothered, as long as Adobe provides a straight forward way to do this. It's been the better product for a while now anyway. What worries me is that they'll only provide that via their subscription model and not via the standalone version of Lightroom you can still currently purchase without the need for a subscription. If that ends up being the case I'm not doing it! I don't want to subscribe to Adobe, and will have to look around for an alternative, or simply not upgrade to Yosemite. I'm perfectly fine with Mavericks for the time being.
post #59 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1983 View Post

If I have to migrate my libraries to Lightroom I'm not too bothered, as long as Adobe provides a straight forward way to do this. It's been the better product for a while now anyway. What worries me is that they'll only provide that via their subscription model and not via the standalone version of Lightroom you can still currently purchase without the need for a subscription. If that ends up being the case I'm not doing it! I don't want to subscribe to Adobe, and will have to look around for an alternative, or simply not upgrade to Yosemite. I'm perfectly fine with Mavericks for the time being.

Apple has already stated they will update Aperture to be fully compatible with 10.10
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post #60 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


I hate to sound like a rerun of the Final Cut Pro 7 v X debate ... which wasn't as clear cut as it seemed at first, just terribly implemented by Apple. That said ... I don't see Photos being even close to what Aperture was or could have been for pros. I suspect Apple is ceding the pro photography ground to Adobe and others here. I can't see cloud storage satisfying a pro photographer let alone those simplistic preset corrections. Don't get me wrong, it's all great for the home user but it's not going to work for pros with multiple and massive client portfolios, massive storage requirements and the need of plug-ins, batch processing, HDR manipulation and and complex RAW controls. The fact it is a year off nearly, yet being talked about now by Apple, is like a red flag or perhaps 'ample warning' to anyone who has a business depending on Aperture and Apple know that. Any pro will have to parallel work flow in Aperture and something else for a while and ease in the learning curve and conversion process, it's not something you could just do over night if it turns out Photos is purely a home user product.

Meanwhile Aperture seems to work just fine in beta Yosemite so nothing will hopefully fail over night for anyone upon 10.10's release.


I would love for the Aperture story to unfold in the same was as Final Cut Pro X. That transition just pissed off a lot of people who were accustomed to the old software's arcane UI and user flows. The new product is vastly superior in terms of usability and performance, and as far as I'm aware they've caught up on functionality missing in its initial release.

 

But I think you're right that Photos is not likely to be a true Aperture replacement, since there will no longer be separate apps for casual/pro users and we all know which group Apple will focus on with a single app. With new extensions capabilities in iOS 8 and Yosemite, however, I suspect Apple is going to give the developer community the option to extend Photos' capabilities,  with limitless potential. So I'm less worried about editing tools and more about the overall cohesiveness of the product and its flexibility to let users manage their image libraries in their own way. 

 

 

Re: Photos in the Cloud, I think some people are misunderstanding its purpose. I don't think they will prevent you from doing anything you already do today in terms of local storage and archiving. It's simply going to add the ability to automatically store and sync all photos taken with an iOS device via the cloud. 

post #61 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post
 

 

Adobe also didn't support OS X at first, Jobs never quite forgave them for that.

 

There is no shortage of reasons to dislike Adobe and Adobe products. Disloyalty to the Mac community is the least of them. 

post #62 of 92

When the Photos announcement was made at WWDC, I did wonder what would become of Aperture/iPhoto. Now we know. I really don't want to migrate to Adobe so I trust Apple will move the most often used features of Aperture over to Photos.


Edited by JackTheRat - 6/29/14 at 12:36am
post #63 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by igamogam View Post

Despite looking forward to the upcoming iCloud photo storage, another concern is just how iCloud/Photos.app will cope with large libraries that would swamp any iDevice many times over.
 

 

At WWDC, they clearly stated that iOS devices would automatically delete locally stored images when local storage was running low, but you would still see your entire image library in the cloud as thumbnails.

 

Again, very similar to how iTunes Match currently works, where you can browse and stream your entire music collection from the cloud with the option to download specific songs or albums for offline usage.

post #64 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


Seems Apple is actually embracing Lightroom. Probably good news for Lightroom development.

 

How is Apple embracing Lightroom?

 

Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post


Apple already stated they will create a migration tool for users to switch over to LR, together with Adobe.

 

Where is everyone getting this idea? Please share a link to any reference to Apple making such a comment.


Edited by freediverx - 6/28/14 at 3:54am
post #65 of 92

Some of you are talking like your copy of Aperture will suddenly stop working.

iPhoto was crap, the new photo app will probably be based on Aperture but will be free like iPhoto but more powerful.

post #66 of 92
Aperture and iPhoto libraries were made share-able a couple of years ago; so I guess the writing was on the wall. If the new software is close to Aperture in capability, I'd probably be happy with that. But I pity the (real) pro-users who don't fancy LightRoom (which, from my brief acquaintance, is fast and quite OK, but out-of-step with the Apple way of doing stuff).
post #67 of 92

Capture One Pro 7 - worth every penny.

http://www.nomadlens.com/raw-converters-comparison

post #68 of 92

I've been using Photoshop since version 2, was an Adobe Photoshop sysop and co-authored a third party manual on it, plus I have written a good number of reviews of Adobe products over the years, so I know my way around the app, as well as all the master collection apps. When Lightroom came out I bought it. And then I tore my hair out trying to make productive use of it. The interface is of the kind that some people love and others hate. I'm among the latter. After repeated attempts over most of a year to get into it, I blew it off. It was nice to have an alternative to Lightroom, but that is no longer the case.

Once Adobe switched to the rental model (which effectively holds your intellectual property hostage - an outrageous situation from my point of view) I soured on Adobe. So have most of the corporate graphic folks I know. This is an unabashed expression of greed and of contempt for their customers, wrapped in tons of spin. I have no respect for Adobe whatsoever and I'm certainly not interested in sending Adobe an endless series of dole checks  

 

I'll keep using CS6. I no longer have an interest in whatever development Adobe does. As long as they retain the subscription-only model, they can get by without me. And this includes Lightroom.

post #69 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by TYancy View Post

I've been using Photoshop since version 2, was an Adobe Photoshop sysop and co-authored a third party manual on it, plus I have written a good number of reviews of Adobe products over the years, so I know my way around the app, as well as all the master collection apps. When Lightroom came out I bought it. And then I tore my hair out trying to make productive use of it. The interface is of the kind that some people love and others hate. I'm among the latter. After repeated attempts over most of a year to get into it, I blew it off. It was nice to have an alternative to Lightroom, but that is no longer the case.


Once Adobe switched to the rental model (which effectively holds your intellectual property hostage - an outrageous situation from my point of view) I soured on Adobe. So have most of the corporate graphic folks I know. This is an unabashed expression of greed and of contempt for their customers, wrapped in tons of spin. I have no respect for Adobe whatsoever and I'm certainly not interested in sending Adobe an endless series of dole checks  

I'll keep using CS6. I no longer have an interest in whatever development Adobe does. As long as they retain the subscription-only model, they can get by without me. And this includes Lightroom.

Completely agree that Adobe has abandoned their users in favor of a rental/cloud model that NO ONE wanted. Personally sticking with CS5.

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post #70 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by freediverx View Post
 

 

$400

Uhm… it's $150 on their site. And even if it was $400, so what? It's for professionals.

post #71 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by TYancy 
I'll keep using CS6. I no longer have an interest in whatever development Adobe does. As long as they retain the subscription-only model, they can get by without me. And this includes Lightroom.

Lightroom is still available as a boxed retail product. You can buy the latest version for about $100 on Amazon.
post #72 of 92
The only thing Adobe is dedicated to is strong-arming as many people as possible into subscription plans, regardless of what customers actually want and need. And of course the existing customers obeyed and started subscribing, because what else could they do in a "free" market...
post #73 of 92
Hello! I agree with you! Lightroom is fine. Works perfectly. It takes some time to adapt to, but such is life! Adobe is not good at UIs, but their software works splendidly and that is what I find most important. Lots of people seem to hate Adobe, but personally I am very grateful about the company. The CC is very important to me and to many people, certainly to you as well. Apple is a hardware company but it makes a few pieces of software. MacOSX is wonderful. Some people say they will buy Windows machines now that Apple has said goodbye to Aperture. But other companies, including Adobe, software makers, they will continue to make software for Apple. The forthcoming eco system of Apple will make it even more attractive to do that. And I am sure Adobe and Apple will collaborate, each one doing what it is best at! I think we need to see the big picture here and be ready to change when needed. Those who are not able to change will not survive in this industry. At least this is my opinion.
post #74 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post
 


So you're good at complaining about everything, yet offering zero on alternatives.  What options are there?  Stick with a forgotten product like Aperture and go on blind faith that Apple will get iPhoto (or whatever) more current?  If not Adobe, then whom?  

I already pointed out that I'm not a fan of Adobe, but they are the only real game in town.  They have the product, it's used by a gazillion people, and most importantly, it's supported.  

What other option is there?  

 

Aside from learning to code there isn't any, and that is what makes it so bad for the end users.

post #75 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post


Lightroom is still available as a boxed retail product. You can buy the latest version for about $100 on Amazon.

 

End of life product too.

post #76 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by freediverx View Post
 


I would love for the Aperture story to unfold in the same was as Final Cut Pro X. That transition just pissed off a lot of people who were accustomed to the old software's arcane UI and user flows. The new product is vastly superior in terms of usability and performance, and as far as I'm aware they've caught up on functionality missing in its initial release.

 

But I think you're right that Photos is not likely to be a true Aperture replacement, since there will no longer be separate apps for casual/pro users and we all know which group Apple will focus on with a single app. With new extensions capabilities in iOS 8 and Yosemite, however, I suspect Apple is going to give the developer community the option to extend Photos' capabilities,  with limitless potential. So I'm less worried about editing tools and more about the overall cohesiveness of the product and its flexibility to let users manage their image libraries in their own way. 

 

 

Re: Photos in the Cloud, I think some people are misunderstanding its purpose. I don't think they will prevent you from doing anything you already do today in terms of local storage and archiving. It's simply going to add the ability to automatically store and sync all photos taken with an iOS device via the cloud. 

 

If Apple sets up Photos like a OS where it can expanded, that can work over time, if developers can increase functionally within the program. 

post #77 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danox View Post
 

 

End of life product too.

Also available as a perpetual license right from Adobe’s website.

 

https://www.adobe.com/cart.html?marketSegment=COM&#

 

The boxed license is en of Life but so was the box of CS6.  I think the only way to get that was from Adobe too.

post #78 of 92

Another slant from ApertureExpert:  http://bit.ly/1nRqCNE

post #79 of 92
I'll just continue using Aperture for at least two more years to come. Screw Adobe, Aperture is an incredible Application and maybe Apple's consumer grade App is really good.
post #80 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by freediverx View Post

Where is everyone getting this idea? Please share a link to any reference to Apple making such a comment.

Read it here:

http://techcrunch.com/2014/06/27/apple-to-cease-development-of-aperture-and-transition-users-to-photos-for-os-x/

and it was later redacted:

"Article updated to clarify that there is no official workflow for migrating to Lightroom."

Guess I shouldn't read that site, nor posts.
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