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What Apple, Inc. gets from its new iOS partnership with IBM - Page 2

post #41 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Does Macy's tell Gimbals?
I apologize for being a bit dense today, but I don't see the allusion....

What you, I, most here, Wall Street, etc. would like, is for IBM and Apple to divulge [more detail about, and examples of] their plans before they do whatever they are going to do.

Not going to happen!

Rather, I suspect them to announce a fait accompli around the time iOS 8, Yosemite, Xcode and Swift become available -- or maybe when the public beta of Yosemite, Xcode and Swift become available.

Likely, Apple/IBM are opening the kimono, under NDA, to a few flagship accounts, so they have customer success stories up and running at announce. Kinda' like what Apple does with certain developers who present at WWDC.

There might be some anomalies in what they do announce due to unannounced hardware (TouchID on iPads, Enhanced AppleTV, iPad Pro) and/or missing software/services (IBM apps not ready yet, Cloud services not ready) ...

Once fully exposed, I suspect, that IBM (and the new Apple for enterprise) will make some generalized statements about future directions, a commitment to their current offerings -- to allow their customers to plan and budget.
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post #42 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob53 View Post
 

Either you grew up in a tiny cubicle doing nothing but data entry or you have a limited understanding of what other people do.

 

No cubicles in my history. I get my own room full of fancy toys that are supposed to allow me to be creative on demand!

 

As for what other people do, you could well be right. All I have for evaluation is observation of the people I've worked with over the years. For some of them a tablet might be a good alternative, but I don't think it would be welcomed by most of them. It might boil down to whether one's job primarily consists of getting stuff out of the system, for a which a tablet might be good, versus putting stuff into the system, for which a traditional layout might still be better.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob53 View Post
 

Employees need to be mobile, not tied to a big keyboard and monitor, so they can perform their work wherever it needs to be performed. Even a travel agent and a stockbroker has times where walking around helps them do their job better and allows more interaction with their customer. 

 

I think you overestimate the degree to which most employees interact with clients, and the relative value of workspace mobility compared to ease of use. Again, speaking only for the places I've worked, the majority of the people using computers are entering data in forms or writing. Neither of those requires going anywhere and both are easier with a laptop or desktop computer than a tablet. You CAN write a report just fine on an iPad, but it's easier on a laptop.

Lorin Schultz (formerly V5V)

Audio Engineer

V5V Digital Media, Vancouver, BC Canada

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Lorin Schultz (formerly V5V)

Audio Engineer

V5V Digital Media, Vancouver, BC Canada

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post #43 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post
 

I apologize for being a bit dense today, but I don't see the allusion....

 

Gimbels - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

post #44 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


Good questions!

Considering the way CloudKit was presented at WWDC, it appears that it could provide:
  • hosting on Apple's servers -- AKA iCloud
  • hosting on AWS -- AKA iCloud
  • hosting on MS -- AKA iCloud
  • hosting on IBM -- AKA iCloud Enterprise
  • hosting on ??? -- AKA iCloud Private/Local

Missed this feature. I can't remember if iCloud services is part of the Yosemite server beta (if it is, don't say, I'll just check my installation). I know Apple won't feature an enterprise server again but maybe IBM could produce an Apple-certified server running OSXServer and market it for a reasonable price for small businesses and schools. Everyone doesn't need an IBM BlueGene installation.

post #45 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorin Schultz View Post
 

I think you overestimate the degree to which most employees interact with clients, and the relative value of workspace mobility compared to ease of use. Again, speaking only for the places I've worked, the majority of the people using computers are entering data in forms or writing. Neither of those requires going anywhere and both are easier with a laptop or desktop computer than a tablet. You CAN write a report just fine on an iPad, but it's easier on a laptop.

 

Lorin Schultz (formerly V5V)

Audio Engineer

V5V Digital Media, Vancouver, BC Canada

Yes, laptops can do more than a tablet but tablet software is increasing in capabilities, even for audio engineers. I won't put where I used to work but many of the 6-8K employees I used to work with over 30+ years are now seeing iPads and iPhones as an important tool in their work. These people include scientists, engineers, and a wide variety of support personnel. They do much more than simply enter data and text, they interact with it. They continue to use desktops and laptops as well as some fairly extensive computer systems but are increasingly adding secure iOS devices to their tool set. They don't consider them toys (except for the diehard Microsoft IT managers being left out in the cold).

post #46 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob53 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Good questions!


Considering the way CloudKit was presented at WWDC, it appears that it could provide:
  • hosting on Apple's servers -- AKA iCloud
  • hosting on AWS -- AKA iCloud
  • hosting on MS -- AKA iCloud
  • hosting on IBM -- AKA iCloud Enterprise
  • hosting on ??? -- AKA iCloud Private/Local
Missed this feature. I can't remember if iCloud services is part of the Yosemite server beta (if it is, don't say, I'll just check my installation). I know Apple won't feature an enterprise server again but maybe IBM could produce an Apple-certified server running OSXServer and market it for a reasonable price for small businesses and schools. Everyone doesn't need an IBM BlueGene installation.

That would be great -- and consistent with Apple philosophy -- sell that, at which you excel and leverage that which you don't. Schools, chains, SMBs ...

Somewhere in the middle here is a home server -- I don't want to stream everything from the cloud. It'd likely be hardware from Apple along with logistical/cloud support from IBM -- Backup, Archiving, Staging (percolate up trickle down) ... FTFiTunes.
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"He who laughs, lasts!" - Mary Pettibone Poole -
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"He who laughs, lasts!" - Mary Pettibone Poole -
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post #47 of 56

Applesauce007: Tim is thinking BIG folks... way beyond the comprehension of the anal-ysts

 

I gather that self-proclaimed analysts, unaccountable for their failed past prognostications, are emboldened to issue similarly flawed assessments of what's going on here. Most of them seem shallow and lazy, pig-headed, and slyly serving a master other than truth.

 

Were I myself to join that tawdry trade, setting up shop as a tech analyst, I would at least do some homework on the principals before presenting a stupid analysis. In the present case, that should mean researching both IBM and Apple in the specific areas discussed by the two CEOs in their joint interview. Your list of IBM's solutions (helpful, thanks) would be my starting point.

post #48 of 56
Let's review a brief history of Wall Street/media takes on Apple, shall we?

%u2022 iPod - Didn't see any potential (Apple is doomed!)
%u2022 iPhone - It's just a phone ... and there's no keyboard (Apple is doomed!)
%u2022 iPad - It's just a big iPhone (Apple is doomed!)
%u2022 iOS 7 - Girly fonts! (Apple is doomed!)

Suffice it to say the lack of insight by analysts and reporters here is an excellent sign.
post #49 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by janeshepard View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

 
I apologize for being a bit dense today, but I don't see the allusion....

Gimbels - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Oh, I know what a Gimbel is, or am perfectly capable of looking it up. Thanks.
post #50 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


What you, I, most here, Wall Street, etc. would like, is for IBM and Apple to divulge [more detail about, and examples of] their plans before they do whatever they are going to do.

Not going to happen!

Rather, I suspect them to announce a fait accompli around the time iOS 8, Yosemite, Xcode and Swift become available -- or maybe when the public beta of Yosemite, Xcode and Swift become available.

Likely, Apple/IBM are opening the kimono, under NDA, to a few flagship accounts, so they have customer success stories up and running at announce. Kinda' like what Apple does with certain developers who present at WWDC.

There might be some anomalies in what they do announce due to unannounced hardware (TouchID on iPads, Enhanced AppleTV, iPad Pro) and/or missing software/services (IBM apps not ready yet, Cloud services not ready) ...

Once fully exposed, I suspect, that IBM (and the new Apple for enterprise) will make some generalized statements about future directions, a commitment to their current offerings -- to allow their customers to plan and budget.

We'll see soon enough if you're right. I hope you are.
post #51 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob53 View Post
 

Yes, laptops can do more than a tablet but tablet software is increasing in capabilities, even for audio engineers. I won't put where I used to work but many of the 6-8K employees I used to work with over 30+ years are now seeing iPads and iPhones as an important tool in their work. These people include scientists, engineers, and a wide variety of support personnel. They do much more than simply enter data and text, they interact with it. They continue to use desktops and laptops as well as some fairly extensive computer systems but are increasingly adding secure iOS devices to their tool set. They don't consider them toys (except for the diehard Microsoft IT managers being left out in the cold).

 

To be clear, I am absolutely NOT dismissing the viability of the iPad as a useful tool. There are many applications in which it is a better choice than a conventional computer.

 

All I was saying is that I don't think it's going to displace as many desktops as people here predict. Not that it matters to me either way, so it wouldn't bother me in the slightest to be wrong.

Lorin Schultz (formerly V5V)

Audio Engineer

V5V Digital Media, Vancouver, BC Canada

Reply

Lorin Schultz (formerly V5V)

Audio Engineer

V5V Digital Media, Vancouver, BC Canada

Reply
post #52 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


Oh, I know what a Gimbel is, or am perfectly capable of looking it up. Thanks.

 

Did not mean to insult your intelligence. This was merely my way of correcting Dick Applebaum's spelling. Gimbals ≠ Gimbels

post #53 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob53 View Post
 

Missed this feature. I can't remember if iCloud services is part of the Yosemite server beta (if it is, don't say, I'll just check my installation). I know Apple won't feature an enterprise server again but maybe IBM could produce an Apple-certified server running OSXServer and market it for a reasonable price for small businesses and schools. Everyone doesn't need an IBM BlueGene installation.

Well, I decided to check IBM's small market server products and guess what? They're transitioning the x86 servers them to Lenovo. So much for IBM supplying SMB servers configured with OSXServer. System Z servers are not small servers so IBM has given up on everything except large-scale computing servers, software, and specialized applications.

 

"The Lenovo acquisition will include System x racks and towers, x86 BladeCenter and x86 Flex System blade servers and integrated systems -- plus associated software, switching and maintenance operations. IBM will retain System z mainframes, Power Systems, Storage, Power-based Flex servers and PureApplication and PureData Systems."

 

http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/infrastructure/us/en/it-infrastructure/lenovo-acquisition.html

http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/z/

post #54 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorin Schultz View Post

I get the strategy, and here's hoping it works, but I just don't see tablets really taking hold for most workers. The form factor just isn't as good as a plain ol' keyboard and mouse with a big screen or two for either looking at stuff or inputting stuff.

Admittedly there are all kinds of opportunities for new applications, like retail floor staff and nurses, but for jobs that don't require carrying a computer around with you, like a travel agent or stockbroker, a tablet is just more hassle to work with than a traditional PC layout.

Maybe if Apple creates some kind of dock (for lack of a better term) that lets users tie it to a real keyboard and maybe an external monitor it could take a real crack at the desktop, but I just don't think a tablet is particularly well suited to cubicle dwellers.

Either way, it'll be fun to see how hardware for the post-PC era plays out, whether the hardware evolves to accommodate working styles besides stab-and-swipe while holding the device, or if people will just adapt to interacting with flat computers.

Tablets are significantly more useful for certain things, but it's also a slipperly slope for a few others, namely:
1) Fast food, sit down family restaurants, pubs/bars, and pretty much any place that typically suffers from "poor customer service" due to understaffing.
- I was once at a McDonalds where they had someone come out and take orders from the people in line using a portable device so that all they had to do was pick up the food, half way there McDonalds, half way...
- Microsoft's original Surface technology, was a projection underneath a table, which suggested use would be food establishments, Microsoft pretty much got no traction out of that.
2) Conventions. I can't tell you how much more useful an iPad is over anything else. It lasts an entire day as a POS terminal or slideshow, even letting potential readers browse content that isn't at the convention. It also works to get sales leads.
- Most art conventions don't have power at the table/booths, and handing your cell phone to a stranger for Square/Paypal is a bit of a risk. But cash is riskier.
- Convention goers likewise can use tablets more effectively to take pictures of stuff they are interested in, and with comic/anime conventions, even store reference data for the artist to use.
3) Management/Supervisory staff in a business can use tablet devices instead of pushing paper forms around. I find it really sad that despite everyone having email at a call center, they still use any paper at all. It seems like they only print out stuff they want their employees to memorize, and then turn around and collect+shred it so it doesn't leak out of the company by employees taking it home.
- Some people even had two desktops, one for customer data, one for call center management/inter-office communication. The second desktop was entirely unnecessary as the customer data was via a thin client already.
4) Staff out on call/delivery
- Pretty much all civil servants were using RIM blackberries, entirely for email and nothing else. They had to tow around a laptop to view building plans or bylaw documents that was synced from a central server in the morning and when they returned to the office, wasting time.
- The local power utility uses Windows Surface RT's to read meters of those who's smartmeters aren't working. They hate them.
- A delivery company uses a Windows Mobile based cellular pen-based-touch/scanner/gps device, and had to reboot it 5 times before it would accept a signature, and even then most of the signing area was "broken"

It's a slippery slope when some businesses switch to tablets to "cut costs" rather than "improve efficiency", replacing laptops with iPad's that run a thin client is probably the worst example of a business not knowing how to use them. Thin clients drain the battery life rather quickly. The purpose of a native "App" should be to take advantage of the hardware, otherwise it should be a HTML5 experience than can be used on all devices. There are plenty of "app" versions of websites (mainly newspapers) that the App offers no advantage over their website aside from maybe reducing the amount of non-relevant site cruft that shouldn't be there in the first place. Some Apps are used as a walled-garden mode for their website instead, which misses the point entirely of reading something on a tablet. I just want to pick up the device and use it, I don't want to have to login to every site just to read it.
post #55 of 56
I understand the logic that the two companies will at some time in the future learn from each other then separate, but the greater logic would be for the two to become one - a scary thought. A single company, to succeed would have to maintain the Apple philosophies. No 'Wha Wha, Wha, Wha'!!! thinking and performing stuff from chief executives. Apple is not a club like IBM, it is a highly professional, successful business. Also, who knew how powerful the iPad would become? who knows what the future will bring, and it will!
post #56 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorin Schultz View Post

I get the strategy, and here's hoping it works, but I just don't see tablets really taking hold for most workers. The form factor just isn't as good as a plain ol' keyboard and mouse with a big screen or two for either looking at stuff or inputting stuff.

Admittedly there are all kinds of opportunities for new applications, like retail floor staff and nurses, but for jobs that don't require carrying a computer around with you, like a travel agent or stockbroker, a tablet is just more hassle to work with than a traditional PC layout.

Lorin, I agree that we will continue to need stationary computing even as the world goes "mobile". But, I was intrigued by your mention of the cubicle workers and tried to imagine what going mobile might mean to them. I don't think we can assume it will be business as usual. Thinking about a common activity of theirs—data entry, report preparation—it would seem plausible that the workflow around those tasks will be handled differently once their sales and marketing colleagues, and even their customers, get mobile apps that are tied to their company's private cloud. I imagine that cubicle workers will see some disruption to their roles, and possibly even their employability(?).
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