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Rev. Jesse Jackson & Rainbow PUSH Coalition praise Apple for releasing detailed workforce... - Page 2

post #41 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post
 

 

In fairness, Romney was a horrendous non-alternative and a sitting president typically wins their second term. Ron Paul would've been the right candidate to run against Obama, because Romney's and Obama's positions were largely the same. No one kicks out a president in favor of a nearly identical replacement.


I'll agree with you there. I was and still am 100% behind Ron Paul. I wish more Americans were then we wouldn't be in the shithole we are now.

post #42 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post
 

 

Who cares what you are?

 

Some of the worst racists and players of the race card are white males. Just because you claim to be a white male, that does not give you a pass on being a racist who is playing the race card, which you do in most of your posts.

 

give me an example of my racism.....

 

All i said is Jackson liked Cooks press release and most of the white males here didn't.

 

How is that racists?  That is a FACT.

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post #43 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

Jackson liked Cooks press release and most of the white males here didn't.

 

How is that racists?  That is a FACT.

 

You are displaying unprecedented levels of ignorance.

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post #44 of 114
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

That is a FACT.


lolno.

post #45 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post
 

 

You are displaying unprecedented levels of ignorance.

 

huh?

 

Read the other thread about Cooks announcment.

Most people don't like it in the thread.

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post #46 of 114

So has Rainbow Push released their diversity numbers? Do they have enough whites to be considered diverse? Inquiring minds want to know.

 

What are they doing about promoting IT training to minority youth and careers in the IT field? If there are few minorities graduating in these fields, how do you expect employers to increase the percentage of minority workers?

 

Ah well, once we're all bodiless entities living inside a computer/robot and we have no race, gender, religion, etc, everything should be great.

post #47 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Amhran View Post
 


I'll agree with you there. I was and still am 100% behind Ron Paul. I wish more Americans were then we wouldn't be in the shithole we are now.

 

I like Ron Paul, too.  At the time I thought some of his foreign policies were...odd...but now look at where we are.  He isn't as nuts as a few people in the media like to portray him to be.

post #48 of 114
Don't no why the Latin population or still being view as minorities but that's for another post. Despite Jesse track record which I find irrelevant, his push is a step in a good direction. There is a logical reason why the technology sector is not diverse. To change this we must address root issues that have long been ignored and not get entangled with "white man" this or that. No technology firm should hire people based on their color or ethnicity while overlooking talent or the lack thereof.
post #49 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Large companies live and die internally on politics. The nice thing about Jobs was he instilled enough internal fear in the organization that no one felt safe in their job.
The biggest complaint was work/life balance; that you're basically on call 24/7. I wonder what Cook is doing about that.
post #50 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


The biggest complaint was work/life balance; that you're basically on call 24/7. I wonder what Cook is doing about that.

 

I don't see that as a problem, to be honest. If a person is in an upper level position, they are on call 24/7. If they don't like it, they shouldn't take the position. If you own your own business, you are on call 24/7 also. 

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post #51 of 114
Yes ur right. With a dominant white male workforce. Of course there is a reason for that and it's not racially motivated as some on this thread are going to assume, but the availability of talent. Consider the school systems in suburban and urban communities and you will see the connection with race and ethnicity. It's only logical if u have as a result particular groups dominating particular fields. (I.E. MEDICAL)
post #52 of 114

I seen some comment is other threads along this line, You can not hire someone no mater what their background is if they do not exist.

 

I been part of organizations who were trying to diversify for very good reason since different people from different background can bring ideas which a homogeneous group may fail at seeing. I can tell you ever single time they fail to achieve their goal. It was not because they did not try hard, they did. They even went into the communities which they were trying to hire from and promote getting the necessary skills to make them marketable. These people are not interested in being Techie, engineering scientists and so on.

 

In the end they still failed and Apple is destine to do the same in spite of what Cook will like to see happen. The reason is you can not hire what does not exist. People who work for Tech Companies have set of skills which not everyone in the world possess. You have to be good in math and science and most people are not good at this so it leaves a very small group of people who excel in this space. Then you have every tech company in world looking to hire that same group of people and thus the reason they get paid so well.

 

For the very few minorities who happen to fit the bill, they end up getting over paid since they have 10 or more companies all trying to hire them to meet these goals. in the end 9 companies fail to hire the person and the company that wins has and over price worker which they eventually figure out and find a way to get rid of them.

 

I agree every person should have ever opportunity to get the best job, but saying that every company should minor society is unrealistic, since some company do not match society in their make up and Apple is one of them. To say they could hire them in their stores is stupid, would you want someone waiting on you who have no clue or does not understand technologies when you have technical question. My experience with apple store people is they know their stuff and they are not their to just process your order, like someone at McDonald's.

post #53 of 114
LOL! Don't know where that came from but it is something to consider. Had he been black growing up in south central or Compton I don't think he would have been in a garage building computers. Not impossible but highly unlikely.
post #54 of 114

I'm going to apply at apple now. 

post #55 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post
 

 

I don't see that as a problem, to be honest. If a person is in an upper level position, they are on call 24/7. If they don't like it, they shouldn't take the position. If you own your own business, you are on call 24/7 also. 

Agreed. I pretty much expect to be in a situation where I could be called to work at anytime. That's standard. If I need to get something done. I just want to be able to get it done even if it means staying late to meet a deadline or something. It's part of the job IMO.

post #56 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I don't see that as a problem, to be honest. If a person is in an upper level position, they are on call 24/7. If they don't like it, they shouldn't take the position. If you own your own business, you are on call 24/7 also. 
I have no idea if these were upper level positions or not.
post #57 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Amhran View Post
 


I'll agree with you there. I was and still am 100% behind Ron Paul. I wish more Americans were then we wouldn't be in the shithole we are now.

Nope. I considered Ron Paul in 2004 but his economic policies made no sense upon further study of The Great Depression. I agreed with Ron Paul's foreign policy but disagree with him on economic, women's health issues and other civil rights issues. I think the government does have a place as it relates to protecting the people from big business etc... I think Ron Paul is too much theory and not enough reality which is why many see him as a cook. Young people are drawn to him but I'm not exactly sure why they are drawn to him tbqh. Much of his theories have been tried before and failed spectacularly with the exception of his measured foreign policy ideas. What Ron Paul does not seem to understand is that lower taxes and no government/regulation does not necessarily a great economy make. 

 

Take California and Kansas for instance. California raised taxes to pay for the things they need and their economy improved. Kansas cut taxes and cut the things they need and their economy tanked. Government regulation exists to help out businesses not hurt them. Sure some of the regulations might be ideal. However, he argues that regulation as a whole and government as a whole is bad and that is as much a part of the reason we are in a "shithole" as we are in as anything else one might point to. Economics is complex. It's not some simple crap about no government and low taxes will somehow magically make the economy improve. That has never happened. The Economy/Businesses need the government regulations. We saw what happens when there is too lax regulation in 2008. Bill Clinton signed a bank deregulation bill he shouldn't have and now we have 2008 8 years after he's left office. 

 

The government's job is to first protect the rights and liberties of the people. Everything else is secondary to that goal. Business goals are not always in line with the government's job protect the rights and liberties of the people.

post #58 of 114
As an "African American", I too do not agree with all of Jackson's tactics but we shouldn't lose the importance of the message. We have an imbalance of diversity in the U.S. when it comes to privilege. I understand how "European Americans" may not see it, but tell me what it feels like to be a kid and 98% of your superheroes look nothing like you, or 98% of the most beautiful people in the world look nothing like you, or 98% of your senators look nothing like you. Can this damaging to your self value? So yes, talent should be the driving force in selecting people for IT positions but when you live in a country where as a "minority" (13%), 50% of the people that are incarcerated do look like you, you wonder if the system is actually working against you to achieve the "American Dream" to include being able to work for a celebrated company like Apple.
post #59 of 114

LOL... When Jesse Jackson is for you... you know you're doing it wrong.

post #60 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdonisSMU View Post
 

Nope. I considered Ron Paul in 2004 but his economic policies made no sense upon further study of The Great Depression. I agreed with Ron Paul's foreign policy but disagree with him on economic, women's health issues and other civil rights issues. I think the government does have a place as it relates to protecting the people from big business etc... I think Ron Paul is too much theory and not enough reality which is why many see him as a cook. Young people are drawn to him but I'm not exactly sure why they are drawn to him tbqh. Much of his theories have been tried before and failed spectacularly with the exception of his measured foreign policy ideas. What Ron Paul does not seem to understand is that lower taxes and no government/regulation does not necessarily a great economy make. 

 

Take California and Kansas for instance. California raised taxes to pay for the things they need and their economy improved. Kansas cut taxes and cut the things they need and their economy tanked. Government regulation exists to help out businesses not hurt them. Sure some of the regulations might be ideal. However, he argues that regulation as a whole and government as a whole is bad and that is as much a part of the reason we are in a "shithole" as we are in as anything else one might point to. Economics is complex. It's not some simple crap about no government and low taxes will somehow magically make the economy improve. That has never happened. The Economy/Businesses need the government regulations. We saw what happens when there is too lax regulation in 2008. Bill Clinton signed a bank deregulation bill he shouldn't have and now we have 2008 8 years after he's left office. 

 

The government's job is to first protect the rights and liberties of the people. Everything else is secondary to that goal. Business goals are not always in line with the government's job protect the rights and liberties of the people.

 

It would take more time than I am willing to take to tear your arguments apart, but I'll relate that nearly every bias expressed here against Ron Paul is wrong to one degree or another. The positions you've related are based on media spin against him and have nothing to do with his actual positions.

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post #61 of 114

I can't believe the kind of uproar this diversity report is causing on this website.  Are you kidding me?
 

1.  No company is putting diversity above talent if they want to be competitive.  No where did Cook say that they are considering less talented minorities for jobs in the name of diversity.  

2.  I am a hiring manager of a tech company and we are similarly conscious about our workforce's diversity.  There are goals for diversity that the company set for ourselves.  But every hiring manager understands that you only make a hiring that improves on diversity when it doesn't compromise the talent.  Yes my company has a big majority of white males but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for diversity.  

 

It's true that besides encouraging diversity through the hiring process, companies should also work at the root of the problem and promote more diversity in engineering programs.  My company holds events to encourage greater participation of minorities and women in engineering.  

 

What Apple is doing will only improves on its branding.  When you are the #1 company in the world, these are the kind of things you need to do to improve your brand.  So Apple is not only synonymous with quality hardware/software but is also admired as a green company with great diversity and etc.  It gives people more reasons to admire the company and buy the products.  When it was near the brink of bankruptcy in the 90s, it doesn't need to worry about such things because it has other more immediate problems.  Tim is a great CEO because he is improving Apple in various facets simultaneously.  Steve Jobs was the perfect CEO to get Apple to become the #1 company in the world but I think Tim Cook is the perfect CEO to keep it there.  

post #62 of 114
how about releasing diversity data for online bloggers, LOL!
post #63 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by quanster View Post
 

I can't believe the kind of uproar this diversity report is causing on this website.  Are you kidding me?
 

1.  No company is putting diversity above talent if they want to be competitive.  No where did Cook say that they are considering less talented minorities for jobs in the name of diversity.  

2.  I am a hiring manager of a tech company and we are similarly conscious about our workforce's diversity.  There are goals for diversity that the company set for ourselves.  But every hiring manager understands that you only make a hiring that improves on diversity when it doesn't compromise the talent.  Yes my company has a big majority of white males but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for diversity.  

 

It's true that besides encouraging diversity through the hiring process, companies should also work at the root of the problem and promote more diversity in engineering programs.  My company holds events to encourage greater participation of minorities and women in engineering.  

 

What Apple is doing will only improves on its branding.  When you are the #1 company in the world, these are the kind of things you need to do to improve your brand.  So Apple is not only synonymous with quality hardware/software but is also admired as a green company with great diversity and etc.  It gives people more reasons to admire the company and buy the products.  When it was near the brink of bankruptcy in the 90s, it doesn't need to worry about such things because it has other more immediate problems.  Tim is a great CEO because he is improving Apple in various facets simultaneously.  Steve Jobs was the perfect CEO to get Apple to become the #1 company in the world but I think Tim Cook is the perfect CEO to keep it there.  

At last sanity.

post #64 of 114
Originally Posted by quanster View Post

No where did Cook say that they are considering less talented minorities for jobs in the name of diversity.  

 

What else would you consider “I’m not satisfied with the numbers” to mean?

 
There are goals for diversity that the company set for ourselves.  

 

Why.

post #65 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by quanster View Post

I can't believe the kind of uproar this diversity report is causing on this website.  Are you kidding me?

 
1.  No company is putting diversity above talent if they want to be competitive.  No where did Cook say that they are considering less talented minorities for jobs in the name of diversity.  
2.  I am a hiring manager of a tech company and we are similarly conscious about our workforce's diversity.  There are goals for diversity that the company set for ourselves.  But every hiring manager understands that you only make a hiring that improves on diversity when it doesn't compromise the talent.  Yes my company has a big majority of white males but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for diversity.  

It's true that besides encouraging diversity through the hiring process, companies should also work at the root of the problem and promote more diversity in engineering programs.  My company holds events to encourage greater participation of minorities and women in engineering.  

What Apple is doing will only improves on its branding.  When you are the #1 company in the world, these are the kind of things you need to do to improve your brand.  So Apple is not only synonymous with quality hardware/software but is also admired as a green company with great diversity and etc.  It gives people more reasons to admire the company and buy the products.  When it was near the brink of bankruptcy in the 90s, it doesn't need to worry about such things because it has other more immediate problems.  Tim is a great CEO because he is improving Apple in various facets simultaneously.  Steve Jobs was the perfect CEO to get Apple to become the #1 company in the world but I think Tim Cook is the perfect CEO to keep it there.  

+1 Very well stated!
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post #66 of 114
Jesse Jackson is nothing but a racist biggot ass! Apple Insider should be ashamed of including him on any news release!!!!!
post #67 of 114
How can a company, as brilliant as Apple has demonstrated themselves to be; be so gullable as to believe that they are missing out on all the "benefits" of diversity?

Focus on your key values, re-think how things have always been done, polish to perfection. Hire the best and the brightest.

Sitting back and saying "we are not hiring inferior employees, and we need to do this in order to succeed" is fiscal suicide. Can anyone name 1 company that improved their business model by stratifying their workforce? Countries with stratified/diverse backgrounds NEVER do well. Canada has French/English pockets; and despite being a great place, they are not a business superpower, neither is India. Yet, according to the "diversity gods" these places should be leading the world. They aren't, never have, and likely never will. Places with a highly uniform workforce or population have done very well. The English Empire reigned the world for several hundred years, China is doing very well, the Roman Empire ruled the known world. Historically speaking, throughout time - a uniform group has triumphed against a diversified group.
post #68 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

 

What else would you consider “I’m not satisfied with the numbers” to mean?

 

Why.

 

Ask Tim Cook. Don't try to read his mind.  What did you want him to say?  "I'm satisfied with the results!  We are perfect with diversity and we have nothing to improve on!"  If he said that Apple would have faced big time criticism.

 

Cook never said he was going to hire less White Males.

 

Who knows?  Maybe he has an inside tract on how Apple hires.  Could be that many hires are simply part of the 'old boys network' and are being hired not because of skill/ability but by who they know.


Edited by sog35 - 8/13/14 at 6:35am
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post #69 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by quanster View Post
 

I can't believe the kind of uproar this diversity report is causing on this website.  Are you kidding me?
 

1.  No company is putting diversity above talent if they want to be competitive.  No where did Cook say that they are considering less talented minorities for jobs in the name of diversity.  

2.  I am a hiring manager of a tech company and we are similarly conscious about our workforce's diversity.  There are goals for diversity that the company set for ourselves.  But every hiring manager understands that you only make a hiring that improves on diversity when it doesn't compromise the talent.  Yes my company has a big majority of white males but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for diversity.  

 

It's true that besides encouraging diversity through the hiring process, companies should also work at the root of the problem and promote more diversity in engineering programs.  My company holds events to encourage greater participation of minorities and women in engineering.  

 

What Apple is doing will only improves on its branding.  When you are the #1 company in the world, these are the kind of things you need to do to improve your brand.  So Apple is not only synonymous with quality hardware/software but is also admired as a green company with great diversity and etc.  It gives people more reasons to admire the company and buy the products.  When it was near the brink of bankruptcy in the 90s, it doesn't need to worry about such things because it has other more immediate problems.  Tim is a great CEO because he is improving Apple in various facets simultaneously.  Steve Jobs was the perfect CEO to get Apple to become the #1 company in the world but I think Tim Cook is the perfect CEO to keep it there.  

 

Great points.

 

There are a few special people on this board who think being aware of diversity means hiring any minority that apply no matter how unqualified they are. 

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post #70 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

Great points.

There are a few special people on this board who think being aware of diversity means hiring any minority that apply no matter how unqualified they are. 

How "diverse" is the makeup of the Rainbow Coalition? Are all colors of the rainbow equally represented or is it a monochromatic rainbow?

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post #71 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


How "diverse" is the makeup of the Rainbow Coalition? Are all colors of the rainbow equally represented or is it a monochromatic rainbow?

 

keep to the subject

 

you are using the classic lawyer talk - diversion

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post #72 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

keep to the subject

you are using the classic lawyer talk - diversion

And your responses are classic PT Barnum...a real 3-ring circus featuring a big clown.

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post #73 of 114
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
What did you want him to say?  "I'm satisfied with the results!

 

Yeah, that would have been nice. They’re awfully diverse already; how about highlighting how proud they are of that instead of insinuating something else?

 
If he said that Apple would have faced big time criticism.

 

From idiots only.

post #74 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 

 

Yeah, that would have been nice. They’re awfully diverse already; how about highlighting how proud they are of that instead of insinuating something else?

 

From idiots only.

 

Are you for real?

 

Tim Cook:  We are 100% satisfied with our diversity survey.

 

You really think that would look good in the Media?

 

Headline:  Apple satisfied with 70% White Male demographic

 

i mean really? this is the real world.  You really need to take a class on public relations.

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post #75 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


And your responses are classic PT Barnum...a real 3-ring circus featuring a big clown.

 

I'm not the one talking about rainbows......

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post #76 of 114
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
Tim Cook:  We are 100% satisfied with our diversity survey.


Yeah, notice I didn’t quote that part.

 
You really think that would look good in the Media?

 

Who gives a frick?

 
Headline:  Apple satisfied with 70% White Male demographic
 

 

Conclusion: Apple diversity represents reality.

 
You really need to take a class on public relations.

 

Nah. I’ll stick with not wanting diversity for its own sake.

post #77 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
 


 

 

Who gives a frick?

 

 

Of course Apple needs to be concerned about public perception and be sensitive about what the media may say.

 

they are a publicly traded company.

 

Headline:  Tim Cook Satisfied with Diversity Survey.  70% White.

 

Time for you to be reasonable.

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post #78 of 114
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
Of course Apple needs to be concerned about public perception and be sensitive about what the media may say.

 

They don’t really care about such things, or haven’t you been paying attention?

 
Headline:  Tim Cook Satisfied with Diversity Survey.  70% White.

 

Headline: America 70% white.

 

Time for YOU to be reasonable.

post #79 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by quanster View Post
 

I can't believe the kind of uproar this diversity report is causing on this website.  Are you kidding me?
 

1.  No company is putting diversity above talent if they want to be competitive.  No where did Cook say that they are considering less talented minorities for jobs in the name of diversity.  

2.  I am a hiring manager of a tech company and we are similarly conscious about our workforce's diversity.  There are goals for diversity that the company set for ourselves.  But every hiring manager understands that you only make a hiring that improves on diversity when it doesn't compromise the talent.  Yes my company has a big majority of white males but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for diversity.  

 

It's true that besides encouraging diversity through the hiring process, companies should also work at the root of the problem and promote more diversity in engineering programs.  My company holds events to encourage greater participation of minorities and women in engineering.  

 

What Apple is doing will only improves on its branding.  When you are the #1 company in the world, these are the kind of things you need to do to improve your brand.  So Apple is not only synonymous with quality hardware/software but is also admired as a green company with great diversity and etc.  It gives people more reasons to admire the company and buy the products.  When it was near the brink of bankruptcy in the 90s, it doesn't need to worry about such things because it has other more immediate problems.  Tim is a great CEO because he is improving Apple in various facets simultaneously.  Steve Jobs was the perfect CEO to get Apple to become the #1 company in the world but I think Tim Cook is the perfect CEO to keep it there.  

 

 

The above does not work, I have been in the tech industry come up on 30 yrs and watch many companies do exactly that. They been trying for more than 30 yrs to increase diversity in the technology and engineering field at the root of the problem. I can tell you even today my son who went into engineering his class make up is almost exactly the same as it looked like when I got my engineering degree, mostly white guys which look like they have no social graces to deal with people around them and a few women and very few of any things else, with one exception, more Asian than you can shake a stick at.

 

my son figure out what I figure out later get out of engineering, since the real money in on the business side so he change, and guess what, more diversity there.

 

Long and short you can not get women to go into engineering most have absolutely no interest in it because it fill with people who just think way differently then an engineer. The same it true for other races and cultures, you can not make someone who does not have the engineering aptitude into an engineer. It is like teaching someone to sing who can not hear the beat in the song. 


Edited by Maestro64 - 8/14/14 at 6:22am
post #80 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by quanster View Post

I can't believe the kind of uproar this diversity report is causing on this website.  Are you kidding me?

 
1.  No company is putting diversity above talent if they want to be competitive.  No where did Cook say that they are considering less talented minorities for jobs in the name of diversity.  
2.  I am a hiring manager of a tech company and we are similarly conscious about our workforce's diversity.  There are goals for diversity that the company set for ourselves.  But every hiring manager understands that you only make a hiring that improves on diversity when it doesn't compromise the talent.  Yes my company has a big majority of white males but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for diversity.  

It's true that besides encouraging diversity through the hiring process, companies should also work at the root of the problem and promote more diversity in engineering programs.  My company holds events to encourage greater participation of minorities and women in engineering.  

What Apple is doing will only improves on its branding.  When you are the #1 company in the world, these are the kind of things you need to do to improve your brand.  So Apple is not only synonymous with quality hardware/software but is also admired as a green company with great diversity and etc.  It gives people more reasons to admire the company and buy the products.  When it was near the brink of bankruptcy in the 90s, it doesn't need to worry about such things because it has other more immediate problems.  Tim is a great CEO because he is improving Apple in various facets simultaneously.  Steve Jobs was the perfect CEO to get Apple to become the #1 company in the world but I think Tim Cook is the perfect CEO to keep it there.  

+1 Very well stated!

Seconded!

I usually avoid posting to threads like this, but it is interesting to note that out of Apple's first 10 employees they had:

1 female
2 males with Hispanic surnames
1 male communist (English surname)
1 male Finnish descent
1 male Polish descent
1 male Syrian descent
3 males with English surnames

http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2011/06/the-first-10-apple-employees-where-are-they-now/240020/#slide1

That's pretty diverse for 1978 in Silicon Valley ...


FWIW, I met most of these people in the early days -- but only the communist came into our home ... but that's another story 1biggrin.gif
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