Originally Posted by FreeRange
When are investors going to wake up to the insanity of this company? They don't make money, yet they want everyone else to give up their margin so they don't have to raise their prices. They are now in their own branded hardware business which loses money. They are in far too many businesses with no particular focus on profitability on any of them. And they now want retailers to use Amazon hardware and software for payments. Meanwhile Amazon is taking their customers through online sales, and losing money in doing so. Amazon is also putting tools in those retailers' customers' hands which allow the shopper to point their Amazon device's camera at the retailer's instore merchandise, then automatically and instantly find it on Amazon instead so the customer can order it cheaper. How else can you describe insanity? What retailer would want to feed their competitor's machine?
Follow your Grocery and retail companies. They have little margin. Amazon is purporting to take them over, and eliminate a huge amount of overhead, thus have a greater margin and a huge growth of market. Hence the huge P/E. Apple's P/E is low because there is no way their margins can increase, and 'no way' their market can increase without lowering margins.
Amazon will shrink a little in P/E because the market is now coming to realize that to take over everything in the fulfillment side is like building out a railroad. Huge capex up front, with little return, and then suddenly, you are the market. (until the interstate is built, but Amazon appears to be be making sure they control Gov'ts to ensure the competition is 'fair.')
A retailer who looks at a 1-3% per transaction savings up front will take it from a formless competitor. This is not like buying shovels from the guy across the street. It's like sharing the same accountant, and splitting the cost, and firing yours. If they survive the year, and that 3% (of a million in sales... 30,000), well that's the mortgage costs for a small business man. Next year is a new set of problems, but I got to survive this year, so make the deal with the devil.
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Is there anybody that Amazon isn't trying to put out of business?
Amazon is quite possibly the most 'take over the retail world' minded company. Investor's love(d) them as they continue to increase marketshare. Profits are plowed into infrastructure and further land grabs. It's a long game... that only they and Apple play well. Google is too scatter brained in their efforts, like a college research lab.
Originally Posted by Apple Believer
How crazy; brick and mortar retailers entering their sales data for Amazon to later analyze to see where they should focus next.
Dell gave their business the away to ASUS in the same manner.
Most small business think 6 mo - 1 year in advance, but never change their strategy, or optimize for the current, not the future. And old school econ was you hired accountants to do your books, shippers to ship, outsource assembly, get NCR or whomever in to setup your PoSale. and tie it to your Inventory system (set up by someone else) And you manage your market. Now your PoSale on the internet is a Big Data Analytics guru.
Walmart did the same, but not to it's competitors... to it's suppliers. MSRP became WSRP, based on Walmart's analytics.
Originally Posted by MidwestAppleFan
The company that claims to be the "Everything Store" is following through on that vision. What they will soon realize is that they are following in the footsteps of Sears. What they will learn is that trying to do everything will eventually mean they will do nothing very well.
Amazon is less Sears and more the Old Nieman Marcus/Dayton-Hudson model. Amazon isn't trying to Kroger you into buying their brand (save for endpoint devices, but that is purely a defensive stand against google and Apple), Amazon is trying to delight you with instant gratification (1 click buy, 2 day ship, reasonable assurance the price is 'okay').
Amazon's model is 'fulfillment' Quality of product is exposed to the retailer/maker. Amazon's is like the old department/grocery stores. A one stop shop, 'frictionless buying,' guaranteed delivery, a set pricing model, discounts to worthy patrons, and vicious competition for counter space.
This ain't Kenmore slapped on a GE washer, or Craftsman slapped on a Simplicity Mower. You're buying the GE washer, THROUGH Amazon, not FROM Amazon. And Amazon lets you know what everyone thinks about that GE washer.
Similar to Apple in their ITMS/App Store model. All apple/amazon wants is their cut of the deal. 2-30% of every transaction done everywhere.
2% of the worldwide GDP.... big number. Even split 3 ways;-).
It's Visa/Amex model... make the transaction happen, and get the money from the merchant, and if you can get some money from the buyer (Apple iTunes Match, iCloud, Amazon Prime).
So those complaining about amazon, should look at Apple In-App purchases and App Store limits and compare and contrast to Amazon.
They are more similar than different.
As I've been spouting all along Apple and Amazon want to be the bank. Apple is trying selling experience to the high end, Amazon to the people who need instant physical gratification. But in the end, they want 2% of everything you buy and sell. That's the end game.
Edited by TheOtherGeoff - 8/13/14 at 9:19am