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Shares of Apple reach highest-ever closing price as 'iPhone 6' & 'iWatch' hype builds

post #1 of 61
Thread Starter 
After meeting some resistance at the $100 mark, shares of Apple stayed in three-digit territory and closed above their previous all-time high in Tuesday afternoon trading, setting a new record for the company's stock.


The New York Stock Exchange, credit Carlos Delgado via Wikipedia.


Having overcome the $100 threshold, shares of AAPL stock went as high as $100.68, which was just below the company's highest ever intraday share price in post-split trading. When the market closed at 4:00 Eastern, Apple finished the day at $100.56.

Apple's previous split-adjusted closing record high was $100.30.

The record comes as hype is building for an anticipated Sept. 9 event where the company is expected to announce its next-generation "iPhone 6" smartphone in two screen sizes: 4.7 inches and 5.5 inches. In addition, the company is also heavily rumored to be planning an October event where it could unveil a wrist-worn "iWatch," along with refreshed iPad models featuring Touch ID fingerprint sensors.

Apple's gains on Tuesday were helped by a ringing endorsement from analyst Katy Huberty of Morgan Stanley, who issued a note to investors laying the case that it's an ideal time to buy in to the company ahead of a strong product launch cycle this fall. In particular, Huberty has high hopes for an anticipated "iWatch," predicting that the company will sell 41 million units in its first year alone.

Although Apple reached a record share price on Tuesday, the company remains well behind its highest-ever market capitalization of over $665 billion. As of Tuesday, Apple's market cap was valued at just over $602 billion.
post #2 of 61
Expected. I thought it would have come later.

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Congratulation to Samsung Galaxy S5 for winning CNET's Best Android Phone of the Year 2014

 

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post #3 of 61
Mm-mmm...

I might also note that the stock CMG (Chipotle Mexican Grill) has been going absolutely insane for the past year. I had a buy order for that one, but my level was just a bit too low at the time. Would've been a great one to own.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #4 of 61
Although Apple reached a record share price on Tuesday, the company remains well behind its highest-ever market capitalization of over $665 billion. As of Tuesday, Apple's market cap was valued at just over $602 billion.


thats because apple retired the shares it bought back. less shares to multiple against the stock price.
post #5 of 61
I believe that the all time intraday high was the equivalent of $100.72.
post #6 of 61
I was shocked it didn't drop like a brick after hitting 100! Not that I am complaining of course.
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post #7 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by hngfr View Post

Although Apple reached a record share price on Tuesday, the company remains well behind its highest-ever market capitalization of over $665 billion. As of Tuesday, Apple's market cap was valued at just over $602 billion.


thats because apple retired the shares it bought back. less shares to multiple against the stock price.

Not my area ... but shouldn't there be some sort of formula that corrects for that, else how can you ever compare different companies let alone situations like this?
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post #8 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Mm-mmm...

I might also note that the stock CMG (Chipotle Mexican Grill) has been going absolutely insane for the past year. I had a buy order for that one, but my level was just a bit too low at the time. Would've been a great one to own.

Ugh! I was going to buy Tesla last year, and GT this year. Laziness got the best of me. I did buy Netflix earlier this year, but sold it late last week.
post #9 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Not my area ... but shouldn't there be some sort of formula that corrects for that, else how can you ever compare different companies let alone situations like this?

So many large companies buy shares that it would be a real pain to do. But I don't find total worth to be of value, other than for fun.

Besides, they're worth whatever they're worth depending on the number of current shares.
post #10 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


Not my area ... but shouldn't there be some sort of formula that corrects for that, else how can you ever compare different companies let alone situations like this?

 

You don't.

 

The smart people know you compare PE ratio not stock price.

 

Shares outstanding is constantly changing, even with companies like Google because of employee stock options.

post #11 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Mm-mmm...

I might also note that the stock CMG (Chipotle Mexican Grill) has been going absolutely insane for the past year. I had a buy order for that one, but my level was just a bit too low at the time. Would've been a great one to own.

 

I bought CMG at under $300 at the end of 2012 but sold it way too early.

post #12 of 61
Share price is irrelevant. Market cap is the issue and with the current shares outstanding the share price would need to reach about $110 to meet the previous market cap high.
post #13 of 61
At the all time high capitalization price of 665 and taking into account Apple's share repurchase the split adjusted price was $110. We still have room to go to reach that record.
post #14 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple Believer View Post

At the all time high capitalization price of 665 and taking into account Apple's share repurchase the split adjusted price was $110. We still have room to go to reach that record.

 

But you need to take into account dividends paid also

post #15 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

I was shocked it didn't drop like a brick after hitting 100! Not that I am complaining of course.

100 has been a resistance point that is why the last few months when it got close it immediately pulled back now that it over it should stay unless other factors in the market which will pull it down again.

post #16 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by hngfr View Post

Although Apple reached a record share price on Tuesday, the company remains well behind its highest-ever market capitalization of over $665 billion. As of Tuesday, Apple's market cap was valued at just over $602 billion.


thats because apple retired the shares it bought back. less shares to multiple against the stock price.

 

Finally the analysts are catching on to what I've been saying all along.  A new closing high in the share price, yes, but not a new high in the company's valuation. When Apple closed at $702.10 on Sept 19, 2012, the market had valued the company at about $665 billion, considering the 945 million shares outstanding at the time. With all the shares bought back since, the market would have to assign a share price of about $110 to assign Apple the same overall valuation of $665 billion it assigned it two years ago. I fully expect the market to do just that in the weeks to come.

 

http://fortune.com/2014/06/08/apple-splits-7-to-1/


Edited by RadarTheKat - 8/19/14 at 1:58pm
I have enough money to last the rest of my life. Unless I buy something. - Jackie Mason
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I have enough money to last the rest of my life. Unless I buy something. - Jackie Mason
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post #17 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post


Ugh! I was going to buy Tesla last year, and GT this year. Laziness got the best of me. I did buy Netflix earlier this year, but sold it late last week.

Been there done that, the new fertile grounds are Biotech. Apple is not moving that fast even at $100 it not going to go to $110  that fast too many shares outstanding. The good thing about having Apple it props up the investment portfollio since it now not going to rocket up and down like it was doing so it time to find other crazy stocks to take advantage of the ups and down and GT may be one of them.

post #18 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Mm-mmm...

I might also note that the stock CMG (Chipotle Mexican Grill) has been going absolutely insane for the past year. I had a buy order for that one, but my level was just a bit too low at the time. Would've been a great one to own.

Buy Huy Fong Sriracha stocks instead...lol

Congratulation to Samsung Galaxy S5 for winning CNET's Best Android Phone of the Year 2014

 

"From the owner of iPhone 6+, Best Smart Phone of the Year 2014"

Reply

Congratulation to Samsung Galaxy S5 for winning CNET's Best Android Phone of the Year 2014

 

"From the owner of iPhone 6+, Best Smart Phone of the Year 2014"

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post #19 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

The smart people know you compare PE ratio not stock price.


Better to find an adjusted market cap based on [market cap - liquid assets + liabilities] and use that to compute an adjusted P/E ratio.

For example, Apple market cap [602B] - 
                     June 28 current assets [68B] - 
                     June 28 long term investments [126.7B] +
                     June 28 total liabilities [101B] = 508.3B

So adjusted price per share is 508.3B/5.99B = 84.86

Adjusted trailing P/E = 84.86/5.96 = 14.24

 

45 2a3 300b 211 845 833
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45 2a3 300b 211 845 833
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post #20 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


Not my area ... but shouldn't there be some sort of formula that corrects for that, else how can you ever compare different companies let alone situations like this?

 

You compare on metrics like P/E, which by itself may be too simplistic, but does provide a level ground upon which to compare different companies and is constantly adjusted to the most recent financial information available for each company.   If Apple retired half it's shares tomorrow (and made that information public) the earnings per share would double and the P/E would be cut in half.  You'd see this metric update immediately.  You'd also see the debt on the company's books skyrocket, and that information factors into other metrics that you can use to compare companies.  Etc.

I have enough money to last the rest of my life. Unless I buy something. - Jackie Mason
Never own anything that poops. - RadarTheKat
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I have enough money to last the rest of my life. Unless I buy something. - Jackie Mason
Never own anything that poops. - RadarTheKat
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post #21 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by sog35 View Post
 

 

But you need to take into account dividends paid also

 

And then you need to take into account cash flow, retained earnings, debt, debt-to-equity, etc.  Those dividends were not paid from a static nongrowing pile of cash.  In spite of paying the dividends and buying back shares, Apple has continued to grow its net cash on the books, albeit more slowly.

I have enough money to last the rest of my life. Unless I buy something. - Jackie Mason
Never own anything that poops. - RadarTheKat
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post #22 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

100 has been a resistance point that is why the last few months when it got close it immediately pulled back now that it over it should stay unless other factors in the market which will pull it down again.

Anecdotally I've heard and read many saying as soon as it hit 100 they'd sell, especially those that had just bought in, and got caught by not selling, when AAPL went over 700 last time. The fact 100 didn't trigger a sell off was a relief to me.
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post #23 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by RadarTheKat View Post

Finally the analysts are catching on to what I've been saying all along.  A new closing high in the share price, yes, but not a new high in the company's valuation. When Apple closed at $702.10 on Sept 19, 2012, the market had valued the company at about $665 billion, considering the 945 million shares outstanding at the time. With all the shares bought back since, the market would have to assign a share price of about $110 to assign Apple the same overall valuation of $665 billion it assigned it two years ago. I fully expect the market to do just that in the weeks to come.

http://fortune.com/2014/06/08/apple-splits-7-to-1/

The valuation just isn't that important when it reaches these levels. When it's much lower, even $100 billion, or so, it's ripe for a takeover, if there's enough cash. But no organization can afford to buy the biggest companies.
post #24 of 61
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post
... shares of AAPL stock went as high as $100.68 ...

 

And if investors act as they always do, AAPL should dip during or after the iPhone announcement.

Then it'll gradually recover over a few months, especially after the October earnings call.

Happens nearly every time.  Not because of any particular business logic.

Just because of the old saying: "Buy on rumor, sell on news."

Sent from my iPhone Simulator

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Sent from my iPhone Simulator

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post #25 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Anecdotally I've heard and read many saying as soon as it hit 100 they'd sell, especially those that had just bought in, and got caught by not selling, when AAPL went over 700 last time. The fact 100 didn't trigger a sell off was a relief to me.

The last major selloff happened because of several factors. We can't consider a few percentage points as a selloff. Not really. The market wanders up and down. Normal stuff. It was over 99 recently, then dropped to the high 94's. Some was market fears of Ukraine, and another was the Gaza conflict, and the rest was the Ebola scare.

But the selloff from 700 was due, in the beginning, to investment firms selling some of their fully loaded Apple portfolio by the end of the year for tax purposes, as it had gone up so much. Then that resulted in a broader market drop as the stock slid because of the institutional selloff earlier. That, combined with lower Apple margins and net, continued the slide. Fear generates fear, and the stock continued to slide.

The situation is different now. Institutions are building up their Apple portfolios slowly, and aren't near being fully loaded. Apple is looking good, and a couple of forward looking quarter's are ahead. I doubt we'll see that selloff at the end of this year.
post #26 of 61

Now where's Constable Odo when you need him? :)

post #27 of 61
post #28 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by hngfr View Post

Although Apple reached a record share price on Tuesday, the company remains well behind its highest-ever market capitalization of over $665 billion. As of Tuesday, Apple's market cap was valued at just over $602 billion.


thats because apple retired the shares it bought back. less shares to multiple against the stock price.
 
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


Not my area ... but shouldn't there be some sort of formula that corrects for that, else how can you ever compare different companies let alone situations like this?

 

In a rational world, the value of a company wouldn't depend on how much stock there is: it would depend just on how well it's doing in the marketplace!  In that "rational world", if there's less stock the same value is divided up among fewer people: each owns more! That's why they say that a share buyback (which retires the shares bought) returns capital to the shareholders. If we pretend the world is rational, the formula you're looking for is  

 

(comparable peak price) = (peak value of company) / (number of shares now)

 

As of the end of June, AAPL had 5.989 billion shares outstanding.  For the company value (market cap) to again reach its peak of  $658.15 billion from two years ago, the price per share would have to be about $110.  That's the "comparable peak price" that we need to beat.


Edited by NormM - 8/19/14 at 3:15pm
post #29 of 61

Yawn.  Doooomed (tm).  meh.

 

Seriously, though, the funny thing is I think I'm more interested intellectually and from a problem-analysis-solution perspective than I am interested in actually buying either an iPhone 6 or an iWatch (although I'm sure I'll eventually end up doing one or both).  I just love to see the product of all that hard work and careful thought.  It's somehow intrinsically rewarding to see people striving for great things.

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post #30 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

The last major selloff happened because of several factors. We can't consider a few percentage points as a selloff. Not really. The market wanders up and down. Normal stuff. It was over 99 recently, then dropped to the high 94's. Some was market fears of Ukraine, and another was the Gaza conflict, and the rest was the Ebola scare.

But the selloff from 700 was due, in the beginning, to investment firms selling some of their fully loaded Apple portfolio by the end of the year for tax purposes, as it had gone up so much. Then that resulted in a broader market drop as the stock slid because of the institutional selloff earlier. That, combined with lower Apple margins and net, continued the slide. Fear generates fear, and the stock continued to slide.

The situation is different now. Institutions are building up their Apple portfolios slowly, and aren't near being fully loaded. Apple is looking good, and a couple of forward looking quarter's are ahead. I doubt we'll see that selloff at the end of this year.

Good to know. I am holding for the long run. Heck I get great interest on my money in AAPL even if it never goes up.
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post #31 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by NormM View Post

In a rational world, the value of a company wouldn't depend on how much stock there is: it would depend just on how well it's doing in the marketplace!  In that "rational world", if there's less stock the same value is divided up among fewer people: each owns more! 
That's why they say that a share buyback (which retires the shares bought) returns capital to the shareholders. If we pretend the world is rational, the formula you're looking for is  


(comparable peak price) = (peak value of company) / (number of shares now)

As of the end of June, AAPL had 5.989 billion shares outstanding.  For the company value (market cap) to again reach its peak of  $658.15 billion from two years ago, the price per share would have to be about $110.  That's the "comparable peak price" that we need to beat.

Thanks, that's interesting. My reason for buying a lot of AAPL way back when was simply faith in the company after Steve's return, not anything to do with numbers. So far so good 1smile.gif
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post #32 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hngfr View Post

Although Apple reached a record share price on Tuesday, the company remains well behind its highest-ever market capitalization of over $665 billion. As of Tuesday, Apple's market cap was valued at just over $602 billion.


thats because apple retired the shares it bought back. less shares to multiple against the stock price.

Not my area ... but shouldn't there be some sort of formula that corrects for that, else how can you ever compare different companies let alone situations like this?

It only makes sense to compare share price changes (i.e., returns) over time, not changes in market cap. (If we can argue that two shares are risk-equivalent, we can compare a multiple such as the PE ratio; but that can be questionable in many instances). The market cap is, to some extent, irrelevant to the individual shareholder since all that matters is the number of shares (s)he owns multiplied by the share price. The market cap will automatically decrease -- all else equal -- when cash leaves the company via dividends and share repurchases.

 

(Added stuff).

post #33 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple Believer View Post

At the all time high capitalization price of 665 and taking into account Apple's share repurchase the split adjusted price was $110. We still have room to go to reach that record.

This is irrelevant unless you sold shares back to Apple from your holding in proportion to the amount that Apple repurchased.

post #34 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by RadarTheKat View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hngfr View Post

Although Apple reached a record share price on Tuesday, the company remains well behind its highest-ever market capitalization of over $665 billion. As of Tuesday, Apple's market cap was valued at just over $602 billion.


thats because apple retired the shares it bought back. less shares to multiple against the stock price.

 

Finally the analysts are catching on to what I've been saying all along.  A new closing high in the share price, yes, but not a new high in the company's valuation. When Apple closed at $702.10 on Sept 19, 2012, the market had valued the company at about $665 billion, considering the 945 million shares outstanding at the time. With all the shares bought back since, the market would have to assign a share price of about $110 to assign Apple the same overall valuation of $665 billion it assigned it two years ago. I fully expect the market to do just that in the weeks to come.

 

http://fortune.com/2014/06/08/apple-splits-7-to-1/

Please stop posting (and linking to) nonsense.

post #35 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torrid Foster View Post

I LOVE it when the winners, win.

I side with the winning team, always.  Never the losers.  Therefore an Apple stock price of $100 means I want MORE apple products!

Next year when the stock price is $300 I'll even want MORE!

Because I judge a product on the companies stock price.

And did I mention that Samsung copied apples 4.7" screen?  Because they did.

Strange comments.

Do you ever invest? If so, do you have joy when you investments go down? Yes? Well, then that is strange.
post #36 of 61

Yes, well, several analysts have been saying this for awhile now.
post #37 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

It only makes sense to compare share price changes (i.e., returns) over time, not changes in market cap. (If we can argue that two shares are risk-equivalent, we can compare a multiple such as the PE ratio; but that can be questionable in many instances). The market cap is, to some extent, irrelevant to the individual shareholder since all that matters is the number of shares (s)he owns multiplied by the share price. The market cap will automatically decrease -- all else equal -- when cash leaves the company via dividends and share repurchases.

(Added stuff).
Of course, with all the talk about what makes a share worth what it is, ultimately, share prices are irrational. So we look at the average P/E in the industry, and it think it's about 17.5. Apple's is lower, so it could lead to a higher share price to meet that average. But what does that average really mean? Well, not much. In reality, it's just a feeling that P/E should be priced at where it is.

And how does one account for Amazon, with it's 830 P/E. Surely, irrational exuberance.
post #38 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Of course, with all the talk about what makes a share worth what it is, ultimately, share prices are irrational. So we look at the average P/E in the industry, and it think it's about 17.5. Apple's is lower, so it could lead to a higher share price to meet that average. But what does that average really mean? Well, not much. In reality, it's just a feeling that P/E should be priced at where it is.

And how does one account for Amazon, with it's 830 P/E. Surely, irrational exuberance.

Amazon is, indeed, ridiculously valued. When there are thousands of stocks traded, there are always outliers here as anywhere else (Tesla is another one, IMHO).

 

A few examples like that do not necessarily extrapolate to irrationality in relation to the market as a whole, or to relatively more mature businesses.

post #39 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

It only makes sense to compare share price changes (i.e., returns) over time, not changes in market cap. (If we can argue that two shares are risk-equivalent, we can compare a multiple such as the PE ratio; but that can be questionable in many instances). The market cap is, to some extent, irrelevant to the individual shareholder since all that matters is the number of shares (s)he owns multiplied by the share price. The market cap will automatically decrease -- all else equal -- when cash leaves the company via dividends and share repurchases.

Defining relative market cap is relevant to the individual shareholder as an indication of equivalency when large numbers of shares are being bought back. Saying AAPL hit "a new all-time high" without clarifying what you're talking about is disingenuous at best.

That said, I agree that market cap is a worthless indicator of value. That doesn't stop people from using it to attack the stock, though - "Law of Large Numbers" and all that rot.
post #40 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Amazon is, indeed, ridiculously valued. When there are thousands of stocks traded, there are always outliers here as anywhere else (Tesla is another one, IMHO).

A few examples like that do not necessarily extrapolate to irrationality in relation to the market as a whole, or to relatively more mature businesses.

I keep waiting SpaceX to go public.
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