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post #681 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Lemmingway
Stick to what they said they'll announce or showcase, and you won't go wrong.

But wheres the fun in that
post #682 of 771
The Apple WWDC page has this bit of text:

"This is the one you don't want to miss!

"Get an in-depth look at the future of the Mac platform and a preview release of the next major version of Mac OS X, codenamed "Panther", at Worldwide Developers Conference 2003, June 23-27, in San Francisco."

Now maybe I'm so addled by all the rumors that I'm grasping at straws here...but it seems that the focus is the future of the Mac Platform and the Panther preview is an additional major goodie (to me, "platform" is more indicative of hardware [or hardware and software combined] not software alone - so maybe this is an oblique pointer at the 970, hypertransport etc. - the future Mac platform).

Or maybe I'm just losing it - oh well, not too much longer till we find out - I just hope all this frothy self-induced anticipation is at least partially fulfilled on the 23rd.
post #683 of 771
yes maybe i should hold off watching the hulk till after the 23rd.

No 970! AAAAAAAAAAAA! !!HULK WILL SMASH!!
post #684 of 771
Hulk will smell bad too!

Future of the Mac Platform...sounds like Apple's way of saying they'll talk about what they expect to happen over the next year or two, like Mr Jobs usually does when he speaks. He goes on about how this technology will do blah and blah, and this, when it is finished, will go bleh and bleh and do guh and buh, and maybe he'll give examples, like they did with that there wireless communication a few shows back.

It doesn't say that they're announcing anything new to be for sale within a month or two, it sounds more like "the future" which means showcasing things like what I said above, and probably not new hardware. Only "What we expect Apple to be doing over the next few years."
post #685 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Lemmingway
Hulk will smell bad too!

Future of the Mac Platform...sounds like Apple's way of saying they'll talk about what they expect to happen over the next year or two, like Mr Jobs usually does when he speaks. . .

I think the quote is, "Get an in-depth look at the future of the Mac platform . . ." In-depth usually means going into quite a bit of detail.
post #686 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Reductionist
The Apple WWDC page has this bit of text:

"This is the one you don't want to miss!

"Get an in-depth look at the future of the Mac platform and a preview release of the next major version of Mac OS X, codenamed "Panther", at Worldwide Developers Conference 2003, June 23-27, in San Francisco."

Now maybe I'm so addled by all the rumors that I'm grasping at straws here...but it seems that the focus is the future of the Mac Platform and the Panther preview is an additional major goodie (to me, "platform" is more indicative of hardware [or hardware and software combined] not software alone - so maybe this is an oblique pointer at the 970, hypertransport etc. - the future Mac platform).

That is the description of almost every WWDC. They ALWAYS talk about the future of the Mac platform.
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post #687 of 771
Quote:
yes maybe i should hold off watching the hulk till after the 23rd.

No 970! AAAAAAAAAAAA! !!HULK WILL SMASH!!

That's more like it...

Lemon Bon Bon
We do it because Steve Jobs is the supreme defender of the Macintosh faith, someone who led Apple back from the brink of extinction just four years ago. And we do it because his annual keynote is...
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post #688 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Escher
IDG just announced that Greg Jozwiak will hold the MWCPNY keynote. IMO, this signals that the Steve Jobs keynote at WWDC will focus (almost) exclusively on software, i.e. Panther, and Jozwiak's MWCPNY keynote will focus on (new) hardware. What do you guys think?

Escher

That's it! I think this is the BEST indication yet that there will be some big NEW hardware announcement by Steve at WWDC! Why?

Steve always does the big keynote announcement and then Phil is the follow up keynoter to give the RDF-free vision and demonstrations that gets to the practical aspects of the technology. This is the pattern for Jaquar, FCP and most other new significant features. The fact that a hardware guy is the next big keynote means that he HAS to have something to talk about and that something HAS be announced by Steve!

This is as close to a "confirmed" that Apple ever gives out and this is the first time I feel confident that some cool new hardware will be announced.
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post #689 of 771
For those thinking that IBM will partner with Apple in the server market while Apple buys out SGI, here is the kind of thing that will put the two squarely at odds...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/b...ection=general

Here IBM is working specifically in the field that Apple is ostensibly focusing on. Here is a digital shop that is using Apple products (Shake) and is able to buy $5-million at a crack. Here is where IBM is pricing "aggressively." Anyone think IBM will let Apple crank out blades or big-iron servers to compete for these contracts? IBM gets money either way, but it is the service contracts and the long-term business relationships that give that market its best margins and stability.
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post #690 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by MacGregor
The fact that a hardware guy is the next big keynote means that he HAS to have something to talk about and that something HAS be announced by Steve!

The fact that "Joz" is keynoting the gutted carcass of the former MWNY is indeed a confirmation of hardware at WWDC. More accurately, it's confirmation that WWDC is MWNY this year.
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post #691 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by MacGregor
The fact that a hardware guy is the next big keynote means that he HAS to have something to talk about and that something HAS be announced by Steve!

I think you're right, MacGregor. I didn't really think this through before posting. Judging by history, Jobs wouldn't let Jozwiak make significant, groundbreaking hardware announcements. How many times has Jobs announced new software at MWNY only to have Schiller rehash the announcements at Seybold? I imagine Jozwiak will give more details about the new hardware, run some more demos with 64-bit apps, and say: "The PowerMac G5 is now shipping in large quantities."

Can I hold my breath for seven days?

Escher
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post #692 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Escher
I think you're right, MacGregor. I didn't really think this through before posting. Judging by history, Jobs wouldn't let Jozwiak make significant, groundbreaking hardware announcements. How many times has Jobs announced new software at MWNY only to have Schiller rehash the announcements at Seybold? I imagine Jozwiak will give more details about the new hardware, run some more demos with 64-bit apps, and say: "The PowerMac G5 is now shipping in large quantities."

Can I hold my breath for seven days?

Escher

Actually that would go much more along with the rumour about Steve resigning at WWDC that was debated a couple of days ago (was it here or at macnn? ars?). Resign in front of those making the transition to X possible (the developers) and let someone who know about his stuff tell the ones who are supposed to buy it (the customers).

Even if I love Schiller as a teddy bear I would not want him to present the new toys.

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post #693 of 771
(me, playing devils advocate)
re: Mr. Jozwiak's Keynote

Or, it's like many people here are suggesting, that any Apple computers using IBM's 970 won't be available until September. Therefore, no need for Mr. Jobs @ Macworld's CreativePro Expo. Mr. Jozwiak extols the virtues of the digital hub and Apple's integrated hardware strategy.

WWDC may very well be for Panther, with Mr. Jobs casting his best RDF over the developers

Possibly some minor upgrades and/or a new 15" Powerbook with the same G4 and features found in the 12"/17" Powerbooks at either WWDC or Macworld's CreativePro Expo - take your pick.

Here's hoping Macwishpers and other sites or right and Moki is wrong, but I doubt it.

By the way Moki, how would a September intoduction of Apple computers with IBM's 970 be "sandbagging", makes no sense to me.
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post #694 of 771
new xserve is probably a given

so some of those 970 chips may go there...or not....is this the heavy moki mentions...

g
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post #695 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by thegelding
new xserve is probably a given

so some of those 970 chips may go there...or not....is this the heavy moki mentions...

g

OSX server....not xserve.

PS rickag, yer a downer.
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post #696 of 771
yes but hes saying if OSXServer panther is 64 bit there will be 970 xserves
post #697 of 771
Moving to TI...
post #698 of 771
There are reports of deliveries to Apple-selling stores of two types of boxes, one laptop sized and one bigger. Might the "laptop-sized" one actually hold new Xserves, given that laptops and Xserves have a similar form factor?
post #699 of 771
Quote:
From MacRumors.com
Interestingly enough, Apple Stores are also receiving palettes this week which are not to be opened until Monday afternoon (June 23rd). These reports indicate that at least some new products with immediate availability after WWDC's opening day.

***CONFIRMED***
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post #700 of 771
How can 970s not be released?

If Apple demos it and says release wont be till September then no one would buy the current Power Macs, maybe only if Apple slashed the prices in half, but we know that wont happen.

Or the other possibility is that Apple will have no mention of Power Macs, but that seems to slim regarding the avalanche of rumors, even at grains of salt they can have mountainous truth!

So we're getting 970s in less than a week!

I'm officially iNsANe :P
post #701 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by MajorMatt
How can 970s not be released?

If Apple demos it and says release wont be till September then no one would buy the current Power Macs.

One word: preorders.
There's a very good chance you'll be able to buy a 970 next week. When you get it is another question entirely.
post #702 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by thegelding
...is this the heavy moki mentions...

Ya know g, the bases on those new adjustable Cinema Displays are going to be pretty damn heavy as well...even heavier than pscates' lamp base.
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post #703 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by qazII
There are reports of deliveries to Apple-selling stores of two types of boxes, one laptop sized and one bigger. Might the "laptop-sized" one actually hold new Xserves, given that laptops and Xserves have a similar form factor?

Holy crap man, have you ever seen an Xserve? An Xserve has the same form factor as a 50" Plasma TV. The box is huge - about four feet long.

Plus, nobody would stock many if any Xserves. They don't sell in any volume. That's not a hit on the Xserve, rather, it's a specialized item with a limited market, and with 3 models + BTO options, you'd be damn lucky to have what anyone wanted in stock.
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post #704 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by MajorMatt
How can 970s not be released?

Because they have something else up their sleeve and the PM970 won't be availble until CreativePro nee MacWorld?

Maybe Apple's going to announce an entertainment center based on a Tivo box and a Studio display?

Or maybe just a humongous display? Who knows? A week will tell.
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post #705 of 771
I don't know if the translation is correct (saw it on Spymac) but this is a German invitation:



"APPLE Germany invites you in the heart of Europe to an event to steal your breath. Come to attend a satellite retransmission of Steve Jobs' opening keynote for the WWDC in San Francisco.
For the professionals in the Audio, Video, Publishing and Media, it will be an unforgettable event. Innovations await which will exceed your hopes regarding speed. Be ready for a new computer age on June 23, 2003... "

New computer age, eh?
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post #706 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by MacGregor
For those thinking that IBM will partner with Apple in the server market while Apple buys out SGI, here is the kind of thing that will put the two squarely at odds...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/b...ection=general

Here IBM is working specifically in the field that Apple is ostensibly focusing on. Here is a digital shop that is using Apple products (Shake) and is able to buy $5-million at a crack. Here is where IBM is pricing "aggressively." Anyone think IBM will let Apple crank out blades or big-iron servers to compete for these contracts? IBM gets money either way, but it is the service contracts and the long-term business relationships that give that market its best margins and stability.

You know I proposed a long time ago, that instead of Apple building their own "big iron" servers from scratch, that they may instead enter into a cooperative relationship with IBM. This would involve co-branded servers buildt by IBM sold by both Apple and IBM and "serviced" by IBM, but customized by Apple to the specialized markets and running OS-X. This makes a whole lot more sense to me, then Apple trying to get into the markets in competition with IBM. This way both parties stand to profit generously without either side having to invest in in additional resources that they don't currently have.

Of course maybe that is too simple of an idea to be popular.
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post #707 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by MacGregor
...but it is the service contracts and the long-term business relationships that give that market its best margins and stability.

Exactly.

That is why Apple with it's Xserves or whatever is not going to run IBM, HP or SUn out of business anytime soon.

True, to macheads, nothing compares to Xserves or even inexpensive Linux/Xeon blades, but big contracts or large accounts usually measure up other factors - like service contracts, discounts and long term business relationships.

That is why Apple has much to benefit from the SGI brand and sales & marketing engine, if it wishes to persue the high end market.

And if it does, going it alone won't work.

Apple will spend more than SGI's $250 million price tag to establish customers, business relationships, not to mention establish its BRAND and sales and marketing teams at the high end.

Apple bought PowerSchool for $62 million (IMHO, not worth it).

Roxio will cost twice that at least...but online music business is a new and emerging market. It's up for grabs...if Apple wants to invest in it, it should be on getting a iTunes port out the door ASAP. Alternatively getting another Windows client to work with the iTunes Music Store web service. So Roxio IMHO is another UMG rumor.

SGI (actually depreciated since the last i looked) is now $230 million in market cap. Not even twice that of Roxio and half that of NeXT.

It is obvious that there will be some conflict of interest between IBM and SGI/Apple if Apple were to aquire them. However, IBM will benefit by the extending the market of the Power4 platform once SGI adopts it for Mac OS X workstations and possibly super servers.

Also i imagine that Apple/Steve Jobs will choose to focus SGI (or Silicon Graphics) on the media, graphics and 3D markets again.

That could only be good for IBM.
So perhaps IBM will lose out its (few) media, film and 3D customers to SGI, but will gain the (few) commercial IT, enterprise customers from SGI. That doesn't sound too bad to me.

IMHO there is a strong argument for Apple to aquire and direct SGI.
Although it would expand Apple's hardware business, i think it will be an important move in order to secure Apple's position in the media and 3D markets both at the low end and high end.

(Besides the $230 million price tag includes Alias|Wavefront which alone must be worth $100 million at least?)
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post #708 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Shaktai
You know I proposed a long time ago, that instead of Apple building their own "big iron" servers from scratch, that they may instead enter into a cooperative relationship with IBM. This would involve co-branded servers sold by both Apple and IBM and "serviced" by IBM, but customized by Apple to the specialized markets and running OS-X. This makes a whole lot more sense to me, then Apple trying to get into the markets in competition with IBM. This way both parties stand to profit generously without either side having to invest in in additional resources that they don't currently have.

Of course maybe that is too simple of an idea to be popular.

This idea makes a lot of sense for all parties involved. Though possibly too much sense for it to become a reality.
post #709 of 771
My predictions:
Hypertransport demo
Panther demo
The 'boxes' showing up at apple stores are speed bumped 15.4 inch powerbooks
The 'mystery' boxes are promotional materials for panther

Read: a buzz kill
post #710 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Bioflavonoid
I don't know if the translation is correct (saw it on Spymac) but this is a German invitation:

"APPLE Germany invites you in the heart of Europe to an event to steal your breath. Come to attend a satellite retransmission of Steve Jobs' opening keynote for the WWDC in San Francisco.
For the professionals in the Audio, Video, Publishing and Media, it will be an unforgettable event. Innovations await which will exceed your hopes regarding speed. Be ready for a new computer age on June 23, 2003... "

New computer age, eh?

This is fairly significant if it's not a fabrication, but it doesn't seem like it's a fabrication at all really -- the use of melodramatic words is in Apple's style.

We could very well be looking at a "breath-robbing" day on the 23rd. Do you know how simply ecstatic Steve's got to be at this point? I mean, to know all this and to know that Macs will be on top again, without excuses! This is wonderful!! The audience is going to go crazy (with or without new hardware actually); for those of you privileged enough to go -- scream for us if there's good news. And if not, just kind of sulk for us, too.
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post #711 of 771
You know I just thought of something. If Apple were NOT going to intro new hardware at WWDC wouldn't they just come out and say it? They did exactly that at Mac Expo Paris awhile back. It would be even easier to justify this time around as it is a "developer" conference. The press release would go something like this.

"Apple is looking forward to a great WWDC this year where we will showcase the stunning new OS X 10.3 Panther. Developers will receive advance copies to begin optimizing their software offerings. As we intend to concentrate on this milestone software achievement, we will not be introducing any new hardware products."

Steve knows the expectations have been sky high for weeks. If he wanted to throw cold water on the rumors he could. He's done it before, why not now???
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It's shameful how grammar on the Internet is losing its accuracy.
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post #712 of 771
I don't buy these rumors about myster boxes with "DO NOT OPEN" tags on them. Utter nonsense.

Imagine, working at a store with a corporate logo of an apple with a bite taken out of it. Then along comes some real forbidden fruit and nobody eats it? Yeah, right.

If Apple were shipping out Powermac G5 boxes with "do not open" tags, you can bet that someone, somewhere would rip that motherfscker open, fill a few flash cards with hot pics, and upload them to the internet faster than....well, pretty darn fast. Stores need display models, right? So a manager cracks open a box for the display model, keeps it locked in his office, no problem.

No G5 Powermacs at WWDC.
post #713 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by qazII
There are reports of deliveries to Apple-selling stores of two types of boxes, one laptop sized and one bigger. Might the "laptop-sized" one actually hold new Xserves, given that laptops and Xserves have a similar form factor?

displays
PowerMacs

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post #714 of 771
Why so skeptical? If I remember correctly, this (or something similar) has happened in the past with iBooks. Remember when they introduced the 14" at MWSF? They already had them at the Apple Retail Stores and opened them up after the event.
post #715 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by qazII
There are reports of deliveries to Apple-selling stores of two types of boxes, one laptop sized and one bigger. Might the "laptop-sized" one actually hold new Xserves, given that laptops and Xserves have a similar form factor?

First of all, congratulations on not being stupid by calling them X-Serves or xServers or something equally incorrect. I am also confident that you would know that Apple's 3U RAID array product is the Xserve RAID as well, and not the Xraid or x-RAID or something also equally idiotic. People should not claim to be a fan if they don't even know the so-simple-my-dead-grandma-can-understand-it product name scheme.

If you look at the Xserve spec pages, they are 17.6" wide and 28" deep. In other words, that's about 5 and a quarter 12" PowerBooks. I have seen the laptop boxes, they are not oversized enough to contain an Xserve. However, the "eyewitness" may not know what he or she is seeing and may mistake an Xserve box for a laptop one, as the boxes are too narrow to be PowerMacs.
post #716 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Shaktai
...that instead of Apple building their own "big iron" servers from scratch, that they may instead enter into a cooperative relationship with IBM. This would involve co-branded servers buildt by IBM sold by both Apple and IBM and "serviced" by IBM, but customized by Apple to the specialized markets and running OS-X.

Even if IBM were to purchase Apple and persue this it would be be difficult.

I know cos i've worked for both Apple and IBM.

IBM is an incredibly bureaucratic company.
It has much internal competition and conflict that sometimes hinders innovation. (Though the internal competition within IBM benefits customers. i.e they get better service and sometimes more than one bid/proposal from IBM for the same tender).

From IBM's point of view, there isn't much of a market for Mac OS X Servers and even if so, why should it contribute to a platform that would encroach on it's own AIX/Linux, OS/400 and pleathora of mainframe systems.

So i know this would never happen...or if it does it would hardly succeed.

This is not just about making Mac OS X servers...it's about producing high performance computing solutions for the media, 3D and film industry.

That is best served with a company capable of producing high performance hardware and software (Apple, Alias|Wavefront) and a brand and sales force capable of selling and supporting customers in that market (SGI).
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post #717 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Bioflavonoid
I don't know if the translation is correct (saw it on Spymac) but this is a German invitation:

and here a pic of the 'Adlon Palais'-room....



Not SF, but the place to be in Europe, when the 970 roll in, after Steve's keynote....
post #718 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by MacGregor:
For those thinking that IBM will partner with Apple in the server market while Apple buys out SGI, here is the kind of thing that will put the two squarely at odds...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/...section=general

Here IBM is working specifically in the field that Apple is ostensibly focusing on. Here is a digital shop that is using Apple products (Shake) and is able to buy $5-million at a crack. Here is where IBM is pricing "aggressively." Anyone think IBM will let Apple crank out blades or big-iron servers to compete for these contracts? IBM gets money either way, but it is the service contracts and the long-term business relationships that give that market its best margins and stability.

If Apple wanted SGI's assets they would have made their move a year or so ago, when SGI stock was selling for $.50 a share. Your link to the Weta purchase, MacGregor shows the complimentary relationship that can exist between Apple and IBM.

Shaktai, as you said:
Quote:
... instead of Apple building their own "big iron" servers from scratch, that they may instead enter into a cooperative relationship with IBM.

I can definitely see a cooperative relationship between Apple and IBM, but "co-branded servers built by IBM sold by both Apple and IBM and "serviced" by IBM", Are unlikly, unless IBM's blade server chassis has a sticker on it saying "OSX inside". IBM doesn't need Apple's help to build and sell big iron. But offering and supporting yet another operating system option to it's customer base could be a win for both IBM and Apple.

In this thread I made the following points:
Quote:
Partner with IBM on Darwin
~ It already runs on xx86 and would make a great hedge for the Linux IBM servers in light of all the M$-SCO FUD. Regardless of the merits, the case will be drug out (with M$'s money) for years. A Gartner report recommends holding off on Linux until the issues are resolved.

Think about it. IBM offers Windows, AIX and Linux now on their hardware, adding Darwin support and development would give their customers more choice, and a way to avoid the epic M$~proxy attacks on Linux for the rest of the decade.

Partner with IBM on OSX Server
Taking the IBM~Apple partnering to it's logical conclusion would bring OSX Panther, server version only, to IBM hardware, with Marklar versions for the xx86 crowd.

Partner with IBM on Aqua ~ lite
IBM could build the minimalist desktops and thin clients for the Fortune 500, perhaps with a licensed version of Aqua as a front end, but without the iApps. IBM could then port their own applications and office suite to their own chips (970's assumed).

As for Apple, having IBM's endorsement will open the doors to the Fortune 5000 and create a level playing field in business accounts with M$FT for the first time. Choice is a good thing.



Aphelion ...
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post #719 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by reactor
Not SF, but the place to be in Europe, when the 970 roll in, after Steve's keynote....

In Europe? What no satellite feeds in Paris, UK or elsewhere?

What about Tokyo? IIRC Japan alone accounts for more Mac sales than all of Europe.

Why Berlin? What's the tie-in? Are they announcing a German localized Panther? Is some German company respobsible for one of the products to be unveiled?

Why Berlin?
"Spec" is short for "specification" not "speculation".
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"Spec" is short for "specification" not "speculation".
Reply
post #720 of 771
Quote:
Originally posted by Tomb of the Unknown

Why Berlin?

Because Germany is the third largest economy worldwide. Consequently webcasts to special VIP events in Tokyo and Berlin.
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