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Microsoft Office 2004

post #1 of 193
Thread Starter 
I think MS could've picked a better speaker than Ros (ugh!), but so far looks like a pretty cool upgrade. I just hope the performance is the main improved feature.
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post #2 of 193
oh look... MS can badly imitate the search window that safari does better
oh look... built in excel print preview imitating PDF (admittedly editable)

still a closed format...

notice they didn't show powerpoint vs keynote


Roz sounds like she's been drinking cough syrup with Ellen Feiss.\
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post #3 of 193
Thank goodness this has finally been demoed...my QuickTime stream is choppy, but what I can gather this doesn't sound like an earth-shattering upgrade--I will use the note-taking ability, as i use Stickies for that now, but mainly I'm just glad to see that the MS Business Office has been working on something.

I just hope that searching within Entourage works faster--and I'd *really* love the app to stop using a giant, single database, but I'm not holding my breath.
post #4 of 193
Threads merged.
post #5 of 193
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by curiousuburb
Roz sounds like she's been drinking cough syrup with Ellen Feiss.\



Stage presence is definitely not her strong suit. Apple probably requested her by name to contrast with Steve.
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post #6 of 193
Stage presence is not a strong suit at tech companies, period...so I doubt there's anyone better who could have shown up for the keynote.
post #7 of 193
The Ho actually makes MS look almost human.
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post #8 of 193
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by mrmister
Stage presence is not a strong suit at tech companies, period...so I doubt there's anyone better who could have shown up for the keynote.

Well, I grant you that but I have seen speakers from Adobe and MS before who were not just a little better than Ros but *clearly* a LOT better. Even if they were just tech geeks. An obvious example is the guy who did the actual demo (a programmer apparently)... he was *much* better on stage than she was. Spoke more clearly, showed a natural enthusiasm for the subject-matter, etc.

Not saying he's the next great speaker on the corporate circuit but he was good for a tech guy. Ros was terrible.
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post #9 of 193
Doesn't matter who was up there--it was a remarkably content free demo of a new product. It would have been more interesting if MS had copped to Unicode support and real support for languages like hebrew and arabic. That would be much more interesting (AND USEFUL) than getting a window to display lines like binder paper or for the formatting palette to go translucent.

Office is a moribund piece of crap, but you can't sell new licenses for a piece of crap by fixing longstanding bugs or adding support for basic things (like long file names and Unicode).
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post #10 of 193
Agreed that we learned almost nothing...i bet we won't know what's in it until it actually ****ing ships.
post #11 of 193
And there;s not much more on the Microsoft website. They've added an Office 2004 "preview" which amounts to a brief description of the same points that were presented on stage. Check it out here. Still no mention of new PowerPoint features...

Even stranger is how, according to MacMinute VPC 7, which WILL work with G5s will be available first as part of Office. You'd think this could be mentioned elsewhere.
post #12 of 193
Gah, according to that page if you buy Office v.X before June 30th, you get a free upgrade to 2004. That tells me Office 2004 isn't anywhere near finished.

I can't wait until OpenOffice/Quartz comes out in 2006. For the moment, I'll stick with Mariner Write and Calc.

Barto
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post #13 of 193
So in spite of everyone's complaining, maybe we were just shown everything that was finished. Heck, maybe the two we saw on stage are the only people left in the MBU
post #14 of 193
"according to that page if you buy Office v.X before June 30th, you get a free upgrade to 2004. That tells me Office 2004 isn't anywhere near finished."

They mentioned April specifically in the Keynote--did anyone else hear that?
post #15 of 193
It looks like a skippable upgrade to me. I went from Word 5.1 to Office 98 (I bought Word 6, but never used it, it was so damn slow on my Centris). And I went from Office98 to Office X, skipping 2001, when I completed my OS X transition.

So here's wondering what Office '07 will bring.
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post #16 of 193
Thread Starter 
I'm hoping with the next big Java update that ThinkFree will release their long-overdue Office update. Or perhaps they're rebuilding it to not be dependant upon Java at all, which would be great. Maybe they were waiting for MS to show their cards, which might also explain why MS didn't. They know people are ready to pounce, including Apple possibly.

The MS "feel good" talk was so apologetic almost. It was like "And thank you for making this great OS so we can do what we lo... uh, we suck. Thank you."
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post #17 of 193
just please tell me that it uses Address Book and thats reason enough for me to buy this thing.
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post #18 of 193
Anyone know if there will be a Student and teachers edition?
Damned if i'd buy full price!
post #19 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by MiMac
Anyone know if there will be a Student and teachers edition?
Damned if i'd buy full price!

Pretty sure; at one point a slide was shwon quickly with 3 different boxes for office that look like updated versions of the present 3 boxes.
post #20 of 193
Let's see if it has TRUE Exchange support and not the half ass hack that Entourage Exchange support is right now.
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post #21 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by mrmister
"according to that page if you buy Office v.X before June 30th, you get a free upgrade to 2004. That tells me Office 2004 isn't anywhere near finished."

They mentioned April specifically in the Keynote--did anyone else hear that?

Macworld says, "Customers who purchase Office v. X from January 6, 2004 until 30 days after the release of Office 2004 will be eligible for a free upgrade -- you will be required to pay for the shipping and handling."
post #22 of 193
Thread Starter 
I remember Ros saying "Spring" but not April. Could be I missed it though. I was jumping back and forth to email during that segment.
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post #23 of 193
I would have killed to have this version of Office when I was a college. I used to do the notebook stuff by taking notes in Word and recording my lectures using Amedeus 2. It was a pain in the ass to record in AIFF then compress down to MP3. This is going to be a huge selling point for Macs in higher education.
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post #24 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by Barto
I can't wait until OpenOffice/Quartz comes out in 2006. For the moment, I'll stick with Mariner Write and Calc.

Barto

OpenOffice for Mac is vaporware. By 2006, North Korea may have nuked the world already.

The future is kOffice. That guy that got it ported to OS X should get a medal. Read that again. One guy. Lean codebase, as opposed to OpenOffice.

This is the exact same situation Apple was in when they chose khtml to build Safari. I hope that somebody, whether Apple, Nisus, Mariner or Omni picks this up fast and build a nice Mac user interfaceon top of the code.
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post #25 of 193
I'm with ZO, give me Entourage with hooks into Address Book and I'll be happy. I've set my Mom up with Mail on Panther and it just isn't "there" yet. Actually, the best solution is somewhere between the two.

I was sad to see those dorky buttons in the top lefthand side of Entourage, I don't like the interface.
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post #26 of 193
if you buy the student and teacher edition of X for $149 you can upgrade to pro (with VPC 7 and XP pro I assume) for another $129 (+ $10 shipping when 2004 ships)
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post #27 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by HOM
I would have killed to have this version of Office when I was a college. I used to do the notebook stuff by taking notes in Word and recording my lectures using Amedeus 2. It was a pain in the ass to record in AIFF then compress down to MP3. This is going to be a huge selling point for Macs in higher education.

Wouldn't using an iPod with a voice recorder be a more elegant solution? If you already have an iPod, buying a voice add-on is cheaper than buying Office 2004, even at the edu price.

And even with Office 2004 you're going to have to buy an external mic.

Personally I still like to take notes by hand. Typing on a keyboard uses both hemispheres of the brain. I can take notes manually and concentrate better on the discussion using only one hand.

If Apple had made an 8.5x11 Newton I'd have bought it in a heartbeat for that reason.
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post #28 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by curiousuburb

oh look... built in excel print preview imitating PDF (admittedly editable)

Actually this is a great feature. IE has it, and it is the one reason I keep IE around. Apple should copy Microsoft and put it into Safari.
post #29 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by Frank777
The future is kOffice. That guy that got it ported to OS X should get a medal. Read that again. One guy.

Porting a fairly standard Qt application to Mac, Linux or Windows (and whatever other platforms Qt is available on) isn't a noteworthy achievement. Making it polished on a different platform is. It does take some time, but it's not like you are actually porting the whole codebase to a different platform, just the 0.01% of code that isn't standard.

KOffice is NOT the future. Maybe on Linux, but I doubt anyone there thinks it is when OpenOffice is a million times faster, more compatible and has more features.

Right now, all the frameworks needed to make a good office suite are basically there in Mac OS X. It's mainly the user interface that needs building, and that is totally platform specific (or should be, anyway). Which is why OpenOffice is NOT porting 1.0 to Aqua, but waiting until 2.0 when the user interface code is rewritten, so they can create a truely native interface.

Barto
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post #30 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by mpls244
Wouldn't using an iPod with a voice recorder be a more elegant solution? If you already have an iPod, buying a voice add-on is cheaper than buying Office 2004, even at the edu price.

And even with Office 2004 you're going to have to buy an external mic.

Personally I still like to take notes by hand. Typing on a keyboard uses both hemispheres of the brain. I can take notes manually and concentrate better on the discussion using only one hand.

If Apple had made an 8.5x11 Newton I'd have bought it in a heartbeat for that reason.

I don't think the iPod is a more elegant solution for a number of reasons. First, I would need to add the files to the word document anyway so I can keep them synced. Secondly, iPod audio recorders didn't exist when I was in college. Thirdly, All of Apple's laptops have built in mics that are very good at picking up sounds from a lecture, so the need to carry an external mic is a non-issue. Fourthly, I can type faster and more accurately than I can write. I think this really is going to be a boon to college students.
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post #31 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by HOM
Thirdly, All of Apple's laptops have built in mics that are very good at picking up sounds from a lecture, so the need to carry an external mic is a non-issue.

Well my bad. I'm sitting here looking at my iBook 600 for a mic - I can't find it but something is definitely showing up in Sound Input.

But the noise I making while typing sends the input level to over half on the Sound Input meter.

I'm gonna have to try this out in a meeting and see if the noise of typing distracts or obscures the discussion.

But, hey, cool !!
Quote:
Fourthly, I can type faster and more accurately than I can write. I think this really is going to be a boon to college students.

I don't know - a class of 20 or 30 students, all taking notes on their laptops -- it might sound like my high school typing class.
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post #32 of 193
I think this is a pathetic upgrade on the part of MS.

It's a few of the new PC Office version features with NONE of the real Mac requirements (HELLO! FULL EXCHANGE SERVER SUPPORT IN ENTØURAGE!).

If they were fixing the Entourage weaknesses, it certainly would've been mentioned.
post #33 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by mpls244
Well my bad. I'm sitting here looking at my iBook 600 for a mic - I can't find it but something is definitely showing up in Sound Input.

incredibly enough, look at your screen... on the right (or left) hand side, in the middle or slightly up, on the bezel of course, you'll see a pinhole sized hole... THAT is your mic (believe it or not)
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post #34 of 193
Here's one amusing tidbit about MS Office 2004: One of the touted new "key features" is a fully-editable, live Page Layout view.

This feature has been in ClarisWorks/AppleWorks for 13 years. It's great to see that in Office 2004 has finally caught up with ClarisWorks 1991...

More info at http://www-swiss.ai.mit.edu/~bob/clarisworks.php .

Bob Hearn
post #35 of 193
I would not care if there was not one new feature provided that they fixed what was already there to make it work properly. Heck, I am desperate enough even to pay for such a fix.
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post #36 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by hearn
Here's one amusing tidbit about MS Office 2004: One of the touted new "key features" is a fully-editable, live Page Layout view.

This feature has been in ClarisWorks/AppleWorks for 13 years. It's great to see that in Office 2004 has finally caught up with ClarisWorks 1991...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH !!!!!!!



Quote:

wow, good read.

I remember writing my first papers(hah!)--book reports and all, on a computer in Claris Works for the IIGS (way back in 1992-3, 3rd grade... It was on manatees). What a great piece of software... I miss it.
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post #37 of 193
Is one of the new "key features" saving files with names more than 32 characters long?
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post #38 of 193
I think there may be a stolen feature in Office 2004.

There is a small 2 person company called Circus Ponies that makes a product called Notebook, View their product here

The similarity between Notebook from Circus Ponies and Word Notebook from Microsoft are too close to be a coincidence. You can view a demo of Word Notebook in the Keynote movie at apple: The relevant part is 16:45 into the Movie.
post #39 of 193
Quote:
Originally posted by Plague Bearer
I think there may be a stolen feature in Office 2004.

There is a small 2 person company called Circus Ponies that makes a product called Notebook, View their product here

The similarity between Notebook from Circus Ponies and Word Notebook from Microsoft are too close to be a coincidence. You can view a demo of Word Notebook in the Keynote movie at apple: The relevant part is 16:45 into the Movie.

Word Note is just a crap cut down port of MS OneNote 2003, wich may have been taken form Circus Ponies Notebook
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post #40 of 193
If that suite would come from any other dev team we all would run over each other to post how great it is and all that, but since it comes from ms, everyone tries to find something to bash it for.

Actually MBU has some great developers, and office is really good piece of software. Sure Microsoft is shit, but don't you think that those guys are macheads too?, just so happens that they work for MS.

Give them a break

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