Originally posted by NaplesX
Is english your first language?
The reason I ask is, you seem to be getting a totally different translation of what I am saying.
I specifically said I am not defending these actions. And yes these actions, helped those who want to harm us. I agree with you on that totally.
If any of these soldier's superiors were supporting these kinds of things, they should also be held to task, as far up as it goes. So, I think we can agree on that. Right?
How far up should
it go? Let's assume, for the sake of argument, that all 6 of the accused soldiers are found guilty. Does it stop there or should it continue up the chain of command to Wolfowitz? To Rumsfeld? To Bush? I'm willing to entertain the notion that the soldiers aren't wholly responsible for their actions.
Further, I'm willing to entertain the possibility that these photos are, in fact, real. If you'll indulge me in that, I think you'll see the reason for the outrage. Up to this point, I think my reaction to your posts are that you're not willing to believe the nearly incontrovertible evidence that detainees have been abused. We don't know how far up the chain it goes - were the soldiers "just following orders"?, was it negligence on the part of the DoD?, were there political motives behind not
providing the soldiers the support they needed (as a few soldiers have suggested)?, etc.
I just don't see any benefit for anyone to presume the guilt of everyone all the way up the long chain of command, to the president. Which by the way, he has taken the responsibility that is his and apologized for these actions, to the world.
These days an apology and a buck and a half will buy you a small cup of coffee. Apologies need to ring true for them to mean anything. For the president to NOT come out immediately and say something himself, rather than through his staff, makes the apology seem a little contrived.
If America is not just about following process, but about results (as Bush said in the SOTU address), we need to see some. NOW. That means people need to held responsible for their actions AND those of their charges. (Did you see the last episode of "The Apprentice"? Kwame was fired not because he wasn't competent, but because he didn't fire Omarrosa, one of his employees. There's a lesson to be learned there.)
I also am pretty sure it does not help the morale of soldiers to know that a huge chunk of this country has fallen into the trap of partisan politics and thinks they are all of that kind of people, that would do these things.
i personally like to believe that people are good and make the right decisions.
You can believe what you want.
Naples, I hope you really truly believe that. I mean for ALL people. The world isn't made up of "good guys" and "bad guys". And that's why the perpetrators of these crimes (war crimes, as Bush
said a while back when asked about the treatment of prisoners. I wish I had a link...) deserve the outrage they're seeing. People's belief in the US of Benevolent Action has been shaken. I'm not sure there's anyway to regain the world's trust any time soon.