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Doom3 to run on new iMac? - Page 2

post #41 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by onlooker
Why is that? They always sell like crazy, and will again soon. If you have not noticed the iMac has sold out before it's time had come to pass.

Huh? They always sell like crazy *for a couple months* or so.

The iMac 2 has indeed sold out - because they have stopped making it! Its sales were lousy - 60,000 - last quarter.
post #42 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by jouster
Huh? They always sell like crazy *for a couple months* or so.

The iMac 2 has indeed sold out - because they have stopped making it! Its sales were lousy - 60,000 - last quarter.

They never do that well n the last quarter because a bunch of @ss holes start rumors that new iMacs are coming. Other than that they do fine.
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post #43 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by onlooker
They never do that well n the last quarter because a bunch of @ss holes start rumors that new iMacs are coming. Other than that they do fine.

the iMac 2 has NEVER sold well. it's sales volume its entire life has been an embarrassment and a complete failure. it single handedly killed apple's consumer marketing
post #44 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by applenut
the iMac 2 has NEVER sold well. it's sales volume its entire life has been an embarrassment and a complete failure. it single handedly killed apple's consumer marketing

Prove it.
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post #45 of 248
Quote:
Yeah, you'll be set for a while with a 6800.

Thats what I thought a year ago when I bought my 9800 pro (128mb)... lol by next summer there will be some crazy game coming out that requires a gig of texture memory lol...

man, nothing ever lasts long enough in the computer world...
post #46 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by onlooker
Prove it.

o give me a break..

go look up the fucking 10K report and their other financial reports if you really have that much of a problem being wrong. i'm not about to waste time proving the obvious to you.
post #47 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by msantti
Rumor has it that a port for Doom II is in the works and the specs on the new iMac will just be enough to run it.


http://legacy.newdoom.com/
Works fine on a G3 800 iBook (well, fine as far as I am concerned).
post #48 of 248
iMac lcd has been a performance and sales dog hence Apple building a new iMac. sales were poor and so bad that Apple lumped Emac sales with imac and called them imac sales. Apple forgot performance and sales proved it. i love imac but hate slow & old G4 and bottom video fx5200. hard to build a big seller around those dogs. Doom3 will run on the new imac but what video chip are they going to use? thats the big question. we allready know a 1.6 or 1.8 G5 will be in it. another fx5200 and Apple can kiss goodby it being a sales hit.fx5200= cheap garbage.
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post #49 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by applenut
o give me a break..

go look up the fucking 10K report and their other financial reports if you really have that much of a problem being wrong. i'm not about to waste time proving the obvious to you.

Hey sorry, but it doesn't seem that obvious to me. iMacs seemed to be selling at an acceptable level IMO taking into consideration that the switcher campaign was drop in the bucket, and most already had their machines. Apple said it was the year of the portable, and their sales of portables reflected the switch from the consumer desktop demographic. I think they got what they expected. Other than less switchers than they had hoped for.
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post #50 of 248
yeah i bought my first mac not that long ago an 12" ibook g4 800mhz...I have always been a build my own pc guy...apple is a little expesive...

i love my ibook though... i have even looked at buying parts off ebay to build a Dual G4...

you guys think my ibook will handle Doom 3 lol
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post #51 of 248
Having received my copy of Doom 3 for the PC today, and after waiting years in anticipation, I can IMO say that this game is crap with a capital C.

Too dark, too frustrating, stupid controls, too difficult, lame graphics considering the hype, boring, linear, and no x-factor, I just lost interest several times and had to come back to it a few hours later.

Ive got a dual MP2600 and radeon 9700 pro, 1GB ram - thats about midrange, and in far excess of the minimum requirements. and probably in excess of the new imac. I can just about get a half playable game at 640*400 with medium settings, it doesn't look good, Id guess about 15-25 FPS. And I strictly keep my system lean and tidy.

OTOH, Farcry, by far a better game, 1280x1024, high/very high settings - absolutely beautiful BTW, with Full screen antialaising and filtering, definately a league ahead of Doom3. I lost count of the times I spent playing this till 4am. Completed it 3 times.

Doom 3 is a tech demo for people with Althon 64's 3500+ and Nvidia GF6800 Ultra's. At full setting the graphics might be the best in class, I have seen glimpses of genius, Expecting it to run on a 1.6GHZ iMac with Ultra 5200 graphics is a joke. Expect to be very disappointed. Even then, the gameplay might be pretty lame on such a system.

Waiting for half life 2, cant be any worse!
post #52 of 248
Strange, Doom 3 runs fine on my Athlon 2600+, 512MB RAM, 9800 non-pro. 30-45 fps constant on High settings and 1280x1024. Looks wonderful, though the game is a bit too dark.
post #53 of 248
How can that be? I have a 3200 Athlon XP Radoen 9800 pro, 1.5GB DDR333, and it runs on 1024x768 high settings and can get a little choppy sometimes. I get a weird snowy effect, anyone got an idea of what it's caused by? Got the latest drivers from ATi...

It is a dissapointment, not scary, pretty boring and the constant darkness isn't great, in fact it has started to piss me off, you don't need darkness to make a game scary... The graphics are good but the metal actually looks plastic in a lot of places, the 2d graphics are pretty neat though, hopefully Half Life 2 will be a great gaming experience, not a tech demo like this is...
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post #54 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by CaoCao
Strange, Doom 3 runs fine on my Athlon 2600+, 512MB RAM, 9800 non-pro. 30-45 fps constant on High settings and 1280x1024. Looks wonderful, though the game is a bit too dark.

How big is your nose today?

{EDIT} Searched google 'make doom3 run faster' found config edits at "the enquirer". Quite why ID decided to ship a game in the state its in is quite questionable. The edits make the game run much faster and look better, Im now getting framerates and resolution similar to CaoCao.

Sure though it dropped when I found 'William whats-his-names PDA' to enter AlphaLabs. Fuck-me this game is EVIL!
post #55 of 248
well I decided to have a doom 3 marathon last night now I have it running quite well.

After about level 5, it starts to get interesting, I started to feel like there was an actual game worth playing, something to do and something to achieve. The next few levels were quite exciting. The graphics, (im now on 1280x1024 - high with all options enabled except AA and v-sync) are probably the best Ive yet seen, certainly elements of the graphics such as the spawn of demons, heat haze, the growing bloody slime, console interactions and the lighting are exceptional, but the general fascia of the building can be a bit lame at times. It is scary, several places, [dead] things just rise up and launch themselves at you, combined with a truly evil soundtrack. Yes these elements of the game are good and unsurpassed.

But by about level 10, I was starting to get bored, the game consists of nothing more than dimly lit tight corridors. Heck one level, passing through Engineering is completly black, the illumination comes only from your guides lantern, or your torch, once he dies. You are given objectives to accomplish, but no help on how, and when you do reach the location, you normally find a 'problem' that prevents you do it, with a new task that requires you to backtrack across the whole level, only to backtrack again to solve the original problem. The corridors all look the same, so remembering where you saw something of value is not really possible, so it degenerates into random searching of a whole level (and they're quite large) to find something or some place.

The enemies are really quite stupid, and once you have a technique for dealing with a type, it works every time. Take the metal skeleton things firing dual rockets, they just stand still firing periodically at you, no problem at all. Ive encountered maybe 10 different enemies so far, all are dumb. Only the flying heads or cherubs pose a slight problem, if you dont manage to deal with them quickly.

So by the time I reached DeltaLabs, about level 11-12, Im so fed up with dark corridors, dumb enemies, false tasks, etc, that I decide to do something I've never done with a game Ive owned 2 days. The GOD mode. Yes Im this bored. I just wanna see the end now, lets get there as quickly as possible.

But there is still no progress. On Delta-lab level 2, Im told to search for a plasma inducer, an hour later, I have no such thing, I cant even find the room it's supposed to be in, but then Im given a new task, override the security system for a certain door, which might lead to the inducer, an hour later, I cant find the security system to override, I'd swear Ive been round every inch of this whole map 5 times now, searched every corner with my flashlight, I havn't even killed a baddie for hours - a sure sign im not going in the right direction. read every PDA, but nothing. I even search the net for the answer, but found nothing.

This sucks.

[UPDATE] Mind you, this all pales into insignificance once you reach the "HELL" level. That is worth the asking price alone!
post #56 of 248
Another update!

I've now finished doom3, I know Its lame to use God mode, but well, Im not really a gamer!. From the hell level to the end (mostly), this game just blows away anything else ever.

I take back all previous posts, I just wonder why iD had 10 levels of crap really.
post #57 of 248
post #58 of 248
Yeah... I loved the final levels of D3....

Great stuff...the beginning was ok but not awe inspiring.
post #59 of 248
Quake 3 on the IMAC pwns
post #60 of 248
Quakecon 2004 id Software Keynote Coverage


link to John Carmacks keynote thing at quake-con 2004

Quote:
A Mac "gamer" asked about the port to OS X. Apparently there is no current time for the release of a port. The game runs, but there is a lot of optimization, and currently they feel the Mac platform can not yet offer the same experience as the PC. Activision will not publish the Mac version of Doom 3. There is no publisher set currently.
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post #61 of 248
Possible translation: it would run on current Apple hardware, but it would suck, except on G5s and the most recent PowerBooks?
Possible inference: waiting until the iMac G5 is released?
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post #62 of 248
How many busloads of Mac gamers are there with the computer to run DOOM III?
With no SMP anything below 1.5 to 2 GHz CPUs are pretty useless so that leaves us with G5 gaming rigs...

With the low end pentium PCs starting at 2.6 Ghz or so and the AMD low end at least as good, the non G5 macs are still trailing.

IF, the port have very good SMP then dual G4 1.0-1.25-1.42 will work.

IF, the ports performance is unaffected by the very slow bus speed on the mac

IF, the port as good soundcard support (M-audio) of loading the CPU

IF, 10.4 open audio etc improves game support

Then the Mac DOOM III market looks better, but that is a lot of "Ifs"
post #63 of 248
I think Carmack has said it, its going to be awhile before Doom3 makes it to mac. in fact i would guess 2005 before we see it. the sad truth is most macs dont have the power so whats the point of making a mac version if there is no one who can run your game. Doom3 wont run on a current iMac and with the new imac reported to have fx5200 it wont be pretty on that machine either. Only reason i was wanting a 2.5 was for this. so I canceled my 2.5. that leaves one more machine for someone else. I ordered a Aurora last night with Amd3500 and 6800 in it. Macs are great for everything but........................gaming. guess ill just never hook it up to the net\
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post #64 of 248
Quote:
IF, the port as good soundcard support (M-audio) of loading the CPU

I thought that Doom 3's audio code is CPU based? Could it be done on the second CPU ?
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post #65 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by DrBoar


With the low end pentium PCs starting at 2.6 Ghz or so and the AMD low end at least as good, the non G5 macs are still trailing.


Thats a bad comparison because your saying higher MHz is faster performance. Wrong. Dual XEONs are way faster than entry level pentium processors at that speed, and if you recall old G4 comparison tests.

Quote:
What's the fastest PC in the world? Probably something with Dual Xeon's, according to Tom's Hardware. Speaking of Dual Xeon, you'll want to see this graph of a Dual Xeon versus Dual G4. Even though the Dual 2.8GHz Xeon has a 124% faster clock speed than the Dual 1.25GHz G4, it only runs the test suite 19% faster.

If those entry level 2.6GHz PC's are running DOOM 3, the 1.25, and 1.4GHz G4's should run it just as well. For this reason I think when Carmack says the app is not running fast enough on current hardware he is saying the Mac coding is incomplete IMO. That is all. There is no mystery in his statement. They are just not done with it.
They already said they would not finish it until the Linux, and XBOX versions were finished. It's that simple.
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post #66 of 248
Thread Starter 
i've been watching the tread go on and on..
But this still keep's me wondering why the Quicktime newsletter say's: If youre prepared for the horror, check out the Doom 3 game trailer.
post #67 of 248
Completed it, I don't see what all the fuss is about to be honest. Bring on Half Life 2.
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post #68 of 248
Onlooker
I do not claim that MHz equals performance, a 2.8GHz celeron gets spanked by 1.6 GHz AMD. Asn the Xeon is one hell of a performer at least in FPU (http://www.cox-internet.com/setispy/efficiency.htm)


But I claim that if you would take a 1.4 GHz Intel PIII and AMD Athlon and a G4 and a IBM 970 AKA G5 and they would be similar in CPU rellated tasks. (it will vary from task to task and with what variant of CPU and bus is used)


The PCs reached 1.4 GHz late 2000 that is allmost 4 years ago so there is a lot of several old PCs with that level of CPU performance the Mac got there 2003 and and only the G5 has gotten a bit past 1.5 GHz.

I hope I will see a Gx that makes it worthwhile to replace my old G4 AGP but the current crop is not good enough. I think I get a low end AMD box (2500) and use that for some applications not aviable for the mac, and games as well
post #69 of 248
Getting a decent video-card may be more important than we know today. As 99% of all the macgames is ported from the pc-platform, the demand on hardware is dictated on what kind of hardware the pc´s have.

http://www.insidemacgames.com/featur...?ID=300&Page=2

Releasing a consumer mac with a crippled or less than good videocard will make it harder for people like Glenda Adams to port games.

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post #70 of 248
i would like to get a dual G5, but a Dual opteron at the same price is much faster.

Apple needs to beat the PC's to dual core and release a PCI express chipset with DDR 2 support

multi-threading would be nice as well
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post #71 of 248
my main reason for not have a mac a my main pc is price alone
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post #72 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by ibookgeek
my main reason for not have a mac a my main pc is price alone

There is a reason why :

Tiffany diamonds cost more than other diamonds.
Mercedes cost more than Ford
Rolex cost more than Casio
Leica cost more than Sigma.


At every level there are products that are of superior quality. Some people choose to forgo on this but others see the beauty. I hope Macintosh stays a premium brand focused on giving a great experience to its end users.

As for DOOM III sounds very pretty but I'm not really hearing much raves about the gameplay. I think ID has developed a bit of fan boy'ism with people that are afraid to be honest and say ID doesn't really make great playing games but rather great "looking" games. In essence ID is the Apple of gaming. Style over substance.
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post #73 of 248
The game-play of Doom 3 itself can be said to not be the most important part. ID knows that a lot of people will buy their game, and the reasons may differ. One reason is the beautiful and great graphics, second might be that they believe or know that the game-play of Doom 3 is excellent (which ID games most often are), another reason might be future modifications (for multi-player) that will spring out for the game, just like they did for Half-Life and Quake 3.

Second, a lot of ID's income is based on licensing the game engine itself to other developers. Just look at how many Quake 3 based games there are. Some might argue that these games are better than Quake 3, although I personally maintain that Quake 3 is one of the best games ever. I predict that even more games will be based on the Doom 3 engine.

I think that the new iMacs need to handle (as in play it on at least medium quality, 800x600) the stuff I described in the first paragraph, while the stuff in the second paragraph might be so much different from the original game, both in hardware requirements and game-play, that the iMac does not need to handle them at all.

We have yet to see what kind of mac hardware that is needed to handle Doom 3.
post #74 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by hmurchison
Tiffany diamonds cost more than other diamonds.
Mercedes cost more than Ford
Rolex cost more than Casio
Leica cost more than Sigma.

At every level there are products that are of superior quality.

I get your point but I just needed to add one thing. Those brands on the left aren't necessarily higher quality than the ones on the right (except maybe the Mercedes). They just have more prestige and style.

IMO, Macs are actually superior in every way except raw speed and game availability.
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post #75 of 248
If you look at benchmarks for this game, proc. speed makes very little difference compared to the gpu.

There is no doubt in my mind this game will play on an imac unless apple ships with a craptastic videocard.

I don't understand all the bashing going on with this game...
What exactly were you expecting. I play tons and tons of PC games and after finishing Doom3, I have to say that it ranks very high in my book

Its the best looking game out there right now and the gameplay is fine (and i do own farcry which is not as good a game). Doom has always been about running around and shooting things...no more, no less. The game has scary moments and the darkness adds to that. Use the freaking flashlight and hot key it. It is very easy to switch out your last gun and the flashlight. People are so freaking picky about everything these days and cant seem to just enjoy something for what it is. I have had more fun playing Doom that a lot of games that have come out lately. People who call this a tech demo are morons or just using words they heard someone else say and thought it was catchy.

My PC is a 2.6 P4 with an Ati 9800 pro 128 and I have 1 gig or ram
Ran the game at high quality (even though they recommend 256mb of texture memory) at a res of 1280 by 1024 and the game ran pretty much smooth. The only time i had problems was when something onscreen was on fire, which would cause some slowdown.
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post #76 of 248
JH

My experience of modern games doesn't go back further than DukeNukem 3d for the mac, im not an avid gamer, the games I own could be counted on both hands.

I think your charge of calling me a moron for saying Doom3 is a tech demo is somewhat unjustified. I cant see any improvement in actual gameplay over my fav old game Duke Nukem. If you can, explain it to me.

Doom3's graphics, sound, atmosphere, physics, etc are all groundbreaking, but the level design, plot, gameplay, puzzles, and scripting or AI are all decidely average verging on monotonous. What is the point of the first 12 levels? They all look the same, all play the same.

It does get better around the time you reach DeltaLabs and to the rest of the game. But apart from the non-gameplay items, what is really that spectacular? IMO its DukeNukem with the most advanced game engine yet to date.
post #77 of 248
Quote:
Doom 3 is a tech demo for people with Althon 64's 3500+ and Nvidia GF6800 Ultra's. At full setting the graphics might be the best in class, I have seen glimpses of genius, Expecting it to run on a 1.6GHZ iMac with Ultra 5200 graphics is a joke. Expect to be very disappointed. Even then, the gameplay might be pretty lame on such a system.

Waiting for half life 2, cant be any worse!

Half Life 1 was/is the best first person shooter/game I've seen played to date.

It is THAT good. Shame the port never made it to Mac.

Doom 3. Hmmm. A good mate of mine lent it to me because he's finished it and doesn't want to touch it until he has a rig (3 gig plus with an Nvidia 6800 card) that can run it as it was meant to be.

His experience was a virtual slide show. Mine? A little smoother. He has a gig Athlon. Mine a 1.6 xp Athlon. Gig of Ram. Ati 8500 (aka Radeon 9600).

Getting 30-60s per second in 640 x 480 with no candy floss.

Sorry, your G5 1.6 aint going to run with baby with its lame ass 5200mxfxwhateveroutofdatenesscrap.

You should be getting a card in the 1600 price range that should allow the iMac G5 to run at 1200x1000 with some effects on. A Radeon 9700-9800 for the high end iMac.

Stupid not to at least have that option.

1.8 G5 and a 5200? If you make 40 frames per second with the game running naked? You'll have some fun.

Doom 3. I like it. But I don't think it's any better than Castle Wolfenstein 2. In fact, I think that's the better game.

Half Life 2 is...IS going to blow it away in game play. Environments are better lit and more varied and sumptious. The narrative makes Doom 3 look linear and sparse. The variety and GameA.I of Half Life 2 looks set to blow Doom 3 and Id' off the map.

Doom 3 has A nasty that pops up now and again.

Half Life 2 will hit you with a swarm of beasts that will have your head ringing.

And I think Half Life 2 will offer more intelligent gameplay, better physics...more varied interaction with the backgrounds...more horror...more atmosphere.

All without the aid of a flashlight.

Let's face it, Id paid Valve the ultimate complement with the rip offs of scenary, air vents, sound effects, scenario, talking, interaction...yeesh.

Doom 3 is putting better graphics on Half Life 1 and trying to be...

Doom 3 doesn't quite capture the fun or zest of the original Doom.

Mac gamers won't be able to appreciate this until they have a dual 2.5 with 6800 ultra with 2 gigs of ram.

And probably Open GL 2.

Mac owners? Relax. The iMac aint gonna cut it. Your G4 is not going to cut it.

Wait until you get you 3 gig MP Antares processor with a 6800 or Spring refresh graphics card. Put in 2 gigs of ram with Tiger.

Let's face it. Most PCs can't play Doom 3 as it was meant to. Full anisoptric and A.A and the ultra 6800 and 3.5 gig processor on the PC side is struggling at 1600x1200 to maintain a smooth 50-80 frames per second.

In that sense? They're in the same boat as we are.

Both Mac and PC guys are going to have to wait until June 2005 before a mainstream or high end system can comfortably play the next gen in games like Doom 3, Far Cry and Half Life 2...ie with all bells and whistles on.

We have much in common in that sense. Sure, 1.6 G5 is equivalent to a 2-2.2 gig Pentium 4. A 1.8 G5 is probably equivalent to a 2.2-2.4 gig Pentium 4. So, Apple are okay with that as entry. But as a high end consumer cpu? Apple should be putting in 2 gig and 2.5 early 2005 aka soon as possible.

2.5 gig = 3 gig Pentium 4. But Apple offers you two...so you probably got a fair Doom 3 rig with a 6800.

Come 'Tiger' hopefully with Open GL 2 and 'Antares'...whether Doom 3 runs well will be a mute point. I doubt Doom 3's interest level will last half as long as the original's.

Half Life 2.

I can see it having far more impact.

Lemon Bon Bon
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post #78 of 248
...and when you are attacked by an imp my rig falls to 15-30 frames per second.

Don't get me wrong. I think Doom 3 is incredible.

But I think it's ahead of itself in terms of what the machines can do.

To really appreciate it?

It's gonna cost you.

Mac owners...don't hold your breath.

Lemon Bon Bon
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post #79 of 248
Quote:
Originally posted by Lemon Bon Bon
Ati 8500 (aka Radeon 9600).

Sorry, that's wrong. The Radeon 9600 and the 8500 are totally different cards. The 9600 is much faster, especially the later offerings like the 9600 XT.
post #80 of 248
Yeah, I posted that knowing I was probably wrong...?

The 8500 was repackaged into a 9xxx series. Could you tell me which one? I know it was rebadged.

Perhaps you could link me to a benchmark showing a performance difference between the two?

Academic, because neither are going to give you a compelling doom 3 experience.

But it would still be nice for an iMac G5 top of the range machine to have at least a 9600xt. Rather a 9800xt for best part of two grand.

I know Apple. These new machines won't be priced any lower than the old iMac 2 and they'll wonder why sales peter out after 2 quarters.

Lemon Bon Bon
We do it because Steve Jobs is the supreme defender of the Macintosh faith, someone who led Apple back from the brink of extinction just four years ago. And we do it because his annual keynote is...
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We do it because Steve Jobs is the supreme defender of the Macintosh faith, someone who led Apple back from the brink of extinction just four years ago. And we do it because his annual keynote is...
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