Originally posted by midwinter
Did GHWB in his first run? I'm honestly asking.
GHWB lost is second term. He raised taxes. He didn't seem immune to circumstance. He went along with the Democrats who were in power.
So you're basically saying that the right hated Clinton because he didn't have a mandate and yet he bothered to govern? How does that explain the fact that for 8 years Clinton and his entire family were treated as if they were enemies of the state?
No I'm saying the exact opposite, that he governed much, much better and was able to pass legislation much better than someone who got so little of the vote. People say of Bush that he governs like he got a mandate when he only was elected with an electoral college victory. Clinton got 43% and the first thing he did was come in and attempt to nationalize health care, and raise taxes. Then after 94, he fought hard enough with the Republicans to shut down the government and spun it so they received all the blame.
People wouldn't hate incompetence with Clinton or Bush. What they hate is how effective the are when they have a view that the shouldn't even be in office. It makes the sting that much worse.
Well, I often make my fellow lefties mad when I tell them that Bush isn't a moron. It's part of his overall strategy. Lower expectations. That's the name of the game.
I can't think of a Republican president who hasn't been labeled stupid by Democrats. I don't think it is a Bush strategy, I think it is simply their own stereotyping coming back to bite them in the ass.
This still does not explain why the right hates Clinton so much. And I'm serious here. I don't like Bush. I think his decisions are bad. I think he's made the world less safe. I think he's done damage to the economy. I think his cronyism is criminal.
Right and when you believe all that and then think, "And this asshole wasn't even popularly elected, and now he is going to get a second term" it starts to turn from disdain into pure hate.
Clinton had two terms. You think Bush hasn't been hated on enough, just wait until a second term when the left goes nuts. I've predicted this election will be Bush 49%-46%.
But so many on the right simply seem to hate Clinton for utterly vague reasons that have nothing to do with policy. What, precisely, did he DO that pissed people off?
He was teflon. Slick Willie. He could say something, do something else and never seem to have it questioned. (I'm sure people on the left are thinking, "But yeah that is true of Bush, well no kidding, that is why you HATE him.") He could propose secret socialized medicine, have his party lose the house, shut down the government over a fight that he WINS and then still come back even stronger.
Wait, here is the simpliest way to put it. Clinton could grab your own language, your own ideals, hit you over the head with them, and come out smelling like roses while you come out smelling like crap.
^^^^^^ Pure hatred right there... and that is what inspires it from Bush as well. I saw this crystalized pretty well watching Real Time with Maher a couple days ago. He was basically saying "9/11 wasn't our proudest moment, it was a gigantic fuck up, and now he is using what should be proof of incompetence to WIN OFFICE."
Clinton for example NEVER projected a balanced budget. He projected deficits for his entire time in office. He was dragged into a spending fight that shut down the government and he came out smelling great. Then the fights continued with Clinton fighting every dollar of reduced growth in government spending. Yet every reduced dollar actually increased his popularity even while he was portraying the Republicans as pure evil, heartless bastards for doing it. He took all the credit, they took all the blame.
Welfare Reform is a perfect example. He finally signed the third fully passed version of Welfare Reform. He was dragged into signing it and yet the before the ink even dried he was off crowing about his accomplishment and how thank god he protected the poor from all those evil Republicans. Then he gets to take CREDIT for the savings from that reform without somehow being accused of "leaving children behind" "tossing the elderly in the streets", etc. Instead it is the Republicans who want those things, but Clinton got all the credit for the savings.