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The best wars are civil: Republicans start shaking.

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
This is a good read for those of us who were formally republican and for the true beleivers alike. Essentially, republicans are split among two factions--surprise, surprise--those of us who are not pro-neocon (my own intrepretation) and the neo-cons. Now, religion and its use are also thrown into the blender to produce one divided party for the republicans. So, united they stand and come Nov 3 divided they will fall.

The author does a much better job of presenting a case than I, a lowely non-intellectual, so enjoy and comment away: http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/17/ma...gin&oref=login
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
post #2 of 18
appleinsider/appleinsider

or

macnn/macnn

should work as registration .
orange you just glad?
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orange you just glad?
Reply
post #3 of 18
Thread Starter 
Thanks for addressing the "I don't want to register" whining preemptively.
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
post #4 of 18
What is the point of linking to articles that require us to register?????????????

Hey!
post #5 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by MarcUK
What is the point of linking to articles that require us to register?????????????

Hey!

Quite bitching about having to register!!! You were given a frigg'n password and login for cripes sake!!! What's the poit? It's a good and powerful article addressing the divide within the supposidly "united" republican party.
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
post #6 of 18
Why the fuck do you take away my opportunity to whine about the need to register my email address?
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
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"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
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post #7 of 18
sarcasm is sometimes very easy to mis... but when it happens it is priceless
125/51041 (top .2449%)-Amie Street - awesome independent DRM-free music
People really have got to stop thinking there is only one operating system, one economic system, one religion, and one...
Reply
125/51041 (top .2449%)-Amie Street - awesome independent DRM-free music
People really have got to stop thinking there is only one operating system, one economic system, one religion, and one...
Reply
post #8 of 18
That was a good read. So much about the campaign summed up in the final two words:

"Easy certainty."
post #9 of 18
Quote:
Originally posted by Paul
sarcasm is sometimes very easy to mis... but when it happens it is priceless

LMAO
post #10 of 18
Thread Starter 
It's all fun and games until someone gets hurt huh?
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
post #11 of 18
I read the article,

someone send Bush to this forum so I can tell him how it really is
post #12 of 18
Just remember there is no liberal media.
post #13 of 18
Quote:
Originally posted by Scott
Just remember there is no liberal media.

most of the article is based on the minister that "birthed" the "born-again" President that is currently running for "re-"election. That minister is no longer invited to the white house.

The faith that the president is basing his campaign on is dead.

The new york times could have been MUCH more "liberal" with this piece. The fact that they try to portray the situation in a positive light (they really do) is a testament to the fact that there really is NOT a liberal media...

And to lump all of the media into the argument from one article in the new york times is ridiculous...

There is a capitalistic media, political ideology has very little to do with it. And in cases where it is clear that political ideology is being put before the almighty dollar (sinclair) they pay a monetary price that would generally outweigh any political gain...
125/51041 (top .2449%)-Amie Street - awesome independent DRM-free music
People really have got to stop thinking there is only one operating system, one economic system, one religion, and one...
Reply
125/51041 (top .2449%)-Amie Street - awesome independent DRM-free music
People really have got to stop thinking there is only one operating system, one economic system, one religion, and one...
Reply
post #14 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Paul
most of the article is based on the minister that "birthed" the "born-again" President that is currently running for "re-"election. That minister is no longer invited to the white house.

The faith that the president is basing his campaign on is dead.

The new york times could have been MUCH more "liberal" with this piece. The fact that they try to portray the situation in a positive light (they really do) is a testament to the fact that there really is NOT a liberal media...

And to lump all of the media into the argument from one article in the new york times is ridiculous...

There is a capitalistic media, political ideology has very little to do with it. And in cases where it is clear that political ideology is being put before the almighty dollar (sinclair) they pay a monetary price that would generally outweigh any political gain...

Why bother responding to scott when he comments like that? The article is a good one and I dare say scott didn't even take the time to read all 17'ish pages or he wouldn't have bothered commenting like that. Scott was trolling plain and simple.
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...
Reply
post #15 of 18
Quote:
Originally posted by Paul
most of the article is based on the minister that "birthed" the "born-again" President that is currently running for "re-"election. That minister is no longer invited to the white house.

...

Yea I know I read part of it. The thing is 10 pages long. I wonder why the times chose to run a 10 page slam piece on a republican president weeks before an election?

Remember there is no liberal media.
post #16 of 18
Quote:
Originally posted by Paul
most of the article is based on the minister that "birthed" the "born-again" President that is currently running for "re-"election. That minister is no longer invited to the white house.

The faith that the president is basing his campaign on is dead.

The new york times could have been MUCH more "liberal" with this piece. The fact that they try to portray the situation in a positive light (they really do) is a testament to the fact that there really is NOT a liberal media...

And to lump all of the media into the argument from one article in the new york times is ridiculous...

There is a capitalistic media, political ideology has very little to do with it. And in cases where it is clear that political ideology is being put before the almighty dollar (sinclair) they pay a monetary price that would generally outweigh any political gain...

Regardless of the messenger, I read the piece and it barely makes any sense. It seems like desperate hopes from Bushhaters combined with conspiracy theory de jour.

Nick

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Reply
post #17 of 18
Quote:
Originally posted by faust9
Why bother responding to scott when he comments like that? The article is a good one and I dare say scott didn't even take the time to read all 17'ish pages or he wouldn't have bothered commenting like that. Scott was trolling plain and simple.

The article is crap. It is barely even makes sense because most of us do not consider Bushhate to be logical reasoning.

Realize that Bush is probably going to win in a couple weeks. When that happens, and when the Republicans keep the house and the Senate, the Democrats will have been a true minority, and remain as such for almost 10 years. Out of seven presidential terms, they will have captured exactly two and those two will have been captured by a man who portrayed himself as a southern conservative bluedog type Democrat.

The much larger problem is going to be the desperation of the Democratic party after this election. I mean they have deluded themselves for so long that it can't possible be their ideals that drive people away. They are the "true believers" and must be right, moreso than any religious group. The only reason they weren't president is because of a stolen election, by their reasoning. However this time they will have put up a good, well financed candidate. They will have, via their own money and 529's spent more money than they EVER have on an election. They will have run against an incumbent that they consider to be a complete moron and easily demonstratable as incompetent, and they are going to LOSE.

Then they are going to realize, gee we've started losing the black vote because black folks really don't dig on homosexual marriage, neither do Catholics. Wow, half our union members vote for Bush even though we have a boondoggle to get all the union money. Wow we will have barely kept our advantage among women when we were scaring everyone to death by claiming Bush was going to hand out rusty coat hangers on Election day. They're going to realize that all they have left are the mindless sheep around the major media centers (Chicago, New York, LA) and that even that is starting to fall apart.

The Democratic party is very split. If Daschle goes down, then it will really hit the fan even more because it will show Democrats that they can't talk one way in Washington, and another way at home. The shit will hit the fan double if that comes to pass on election day.

I'm predicting, as I always have, Bush 49%- Kerry 46%. I'm also predicting that Daschle is going to go down and the Democratic party is going to split wide open.

Nick

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Reply

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Reply
post #18 of 18
Quote:
Originally posted by trumptman
Regardless of the messenger, I read the piece and it barely makes any sense. It seems like desperate hopes from Bushhaters combined with conspiracy theory de jour.

Nick



Barely makes any sense?

I do NOT hate Bush. Neither does the minister that "saved" Bush.
What the article is saying is that the White House CANNOT take criticism, and because of the nature of Bush's background (MBA from Harvard, bac) it is very easy to go in the wrong direction as a result. It is NOT a conspiracy theory, nothing criminal is being alleged.

Now, the article also mentions the Republican schism that this thread's title refers to, but I don't really think that is the main point of this piece. Or at least it shouldn't be.

What would concern you more: that the President confused Switzerland and Sweden-or that his CABINET refused to acknowledge the difference between them in the middle of a meeting about Palestine because the President refused to change his position that Sweeden was a historically neutral country and not Switzerland? (He was later informed of the issue, but in private).
It is the encouraged "yes man" attitude and use of facts only if they help the case, rather then to frame the case, that people have a problem with. The actual POLICY decisions of this administration are a different subject entirely...
125/51041 (top .2449%)-Amie Street - awesome independent DRM-free music
People really have got to stop thinking there is only one operating system, one economic system, one religion, and one...
Reply
125/51041 (top .2449%)-Amie Street - awesome independent DRM-free music
People really have got to stop thinking there is only one operating system, one economic system, one religion, and one...
Reply
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