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Osama's back.....

post #1 of 129
10/29/04 at 2:21pm
Thread Starter 
BBC link.

So, no October Surprise - unless this is it.

Maybe it's time to remember why Osama is still on the loose....
What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
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What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
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post #2 of 129
10/29/04 at 2:24pm
Now pay attention to the GOP PR machine...

A VOTE FOR JOHN KERRY IS A VOTE FOR BIN LADEN!

They won't say it in those words. But that is what they'll mean.

A VOTE FOR JOHN KERRY IS A VOTE FOR THE TERRORISTS!

A VOTE FOR JOHN KERRY IS A VOTE FOR SADDAM!

Of course, a vote for John Kerry couldn't mean DEMOCRACY in action.
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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post #3 of 129
10/29/04 at 2:28pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Northgate
Now pay attention to the GOP PR machine...

A VOTE FOR JOHN KERRY IS A VOTE FOR BIN LADEN!

They won't say it in those words. But that is what they'll mean.

A VOTE FOR JOHN KERRY IS A VOTE FOR THE TERRORISTS!

A VOTE FOR JOHN KERRY IS A VOTE FOR SADDAM!

Of course, a vote for John Kerry couldn't mean DEMOCRACY in action.

It's tough to call though - what the effect will be apart from the already 'converted'.

Anyone want to hazard an opinion how this will play amongst the undecided voters ?
What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
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What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
Reply
post #4 of 129
10/29/04 at 2:51pm
....does anyone have a full transcript of this tape?

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

Reply

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

Reply
post #5 of 129
10/29/04 at 2:56pm
Quote:
Originally posted by dmz
....does anyone have a full transcript of this tape?

I have not seen a full translation yet. I think it is still being translated.
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post #6 of 129
10/29/04 at 2:58pm
  • Anders
  • Feared and Biased Moderator
Ladies and gentlemen: Kerry just lost the election.
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
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"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
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post #7 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:00pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Anders
Ladies and gentlemen: Kerry just lost the election.

Bullshit.
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post #8 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:05pm
Full(?) Transcript

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

Reply

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

Reply
post #9 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:05pm
Gee . . . . one week before the election . . . . how perfect.

Either the tape has been in American hands till now,
or,
OBL is on the payroll,
OR,
OBL really does want Bush to win.

In all cases its absurd
"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
--George W Bush

"Narrative is what starts to happen after eight minutes
--Franklin Miller.

"Nothing...

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"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
--George W Bush

"Narrative is what starts to happen after eight minutes
--Franklin Miller.

"Nothing...

Reply
post #10 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:05pm
  • Anders
  • Feared and Biased Moderator
Quote:
Originally posted by Akumulator
Bullshit.

I bet you 10 bucks this is going to cost Kerry shitloads of votes.
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
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"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
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post #11 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:09pm
Quote:
Originally posted by dmz
Full(?) Transcript

Why does that sound so fake?!?!
"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
--George W Bush

"Narrative is what starts to happen after eight minutes
--Franklin Miller.

"Nothing...

Reply
"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
--George W Bush

"Narrative is what starts to happen after eight minutes
--Franklin Miller.

"Nothing...

Reply
post #12 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:12pm
I dunno, guys he hit most of Micheal Moores talking points. I'd say he is trying to throw the election Kerry's way.

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

Reply

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

Reply
post #13 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:13pm
Quote:
Originally posted by segovius
It's tough to call though - what the effect will be apart from the already 'converted'.

Anyone want to hazard an opinion how this will play amongst the undecided voters ?

Those who are driven by unthinking fear might very well run to Daddy for help, Daddy being Bush in this case.

Anyone with half a brain will realize that if anyone is to blame for Osama still being around to taunt Bush about My Pet Goat, it's Bush, and they'll vote for Kerry.

Anyone with a full brain is already voting for Kerry, so for them the tape won't make any difference.
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
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We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
post #14 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:15pm
  • Anders
  • Feared and Biased Moderator
Quote:
Originally posted by dmz
I dunno, guys he hit most of Micheal Moores talking points. I'd say he is trying to throw the election Kerry's way.

It depends on what the meaning of the word 'he' is
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
Reply
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
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post #15 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:18pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Anders
Ladies and gentlemen: Kerry just lost the election.

Nah. This tape can be used for good 'ol Republica fear-mongering, but it's hardly all that good for Bush. Kerry can easily capitalize on this tape by pointing out how it demonstrates Bush's failure to finish the job in Afghanistan and his failure to go after OBL harder.

Each side can spin this to rev up their base, but the effect is probably a wash on undecideds.
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
post #16 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:27pm
The election belongs to Bush. This is worth 2% points to the Security President right across the board. There's not a swing voter in the land who's not going to turn to the Commander in Chief faced with the sight of frigging Osama bin Laden on his TV.

SHIT SHIT SHIT.
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post #17 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:34pm
  • Anders
  • Feared and Biased Moderator
Early voters are trying to withdraw their Kerry vote. 23 voting locations have already been stormed in Florida
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
Reply
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
Reply
post #18 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:37pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Anders
Ladies and gentlemen: Kerry just lost the election.

-----------------------------------------------------------
" Americans go to the polls in four days, but Bin Laden says their security depends on neither George W Bush nor John Kerry, but on US foreign policy. "

-----------------------------------------------------------

I don't think so.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #19 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:38pm
Thread Starter 
So who reckons they've been sitting on this tape for months - it's the October Surprise.
What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
Reply
What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
Reply
post #20 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:39pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Anders
Early voters are trying to withdraw their Kerry vote. 23 voting locations have already been stormed in Florida


ifakedit.com?
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #21 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:40pm
Quote:
Originally posted by segovius
So who reckons they've been sitting on this tape for months - it's the October Surprise.

I wouldn't be surprised. At this point they'd try anything.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #22 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:44pm
  • Anders
  • Feared and Biased Moderator
Quote:
Originally posted by jimmac
ifakedit.com?

But of course I did. Its only in the local news here and you don´t understand danish. So I had to fake the URL.
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
Reply
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
Reply
post #23 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:54pm
If we vote for Osama he won't attack us.
And he seems pretty level headed, comes from a good family and already has a lot of friends in the administration.
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post #24 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:56pm
You would've thought Osama directed this at foreigners. Look at them panicking on this thread alone. Get a grip.
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post #25 of 129
10/29/04 at 3:58pm
Quote:
Originally posted by dmz
I dunno, guys he hit most of Micheal Moores talking points. I'd say he is trying to throw the election Kerry's way.

Care to expand on those Moore talking pointS, plural, that Osama "hit"?
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post #26 of 129
10/29/04 at 4:01pm
A VOTE FOR JOHN KERRY IS A VOTE FOR OSAMA BIN LADEN!

(Edit: Oops.)
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
Reply
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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post #27 of 129
10/29/04 at 4:09pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Northgate
A VOTE FOR JOHN KERRY IS A VOTE OF OSAMA BIN LADEN!

Of?
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post #28 of 129
10/29/04 at 5:34pm
Even bin laden criticized Bush for sitting on his ass reading a book to school kids on 9/11!!!

Quote:
OBL: We agreed with Mohamed Atta, god bless him, to execute the whole operation in 20 minutes. Before Bush and his administration would pay attention and we never thought that the high commander of the US armies would leave 50 thousand of his citizens in both towers to face the horrors by themselves when they most needed him because it seemed to distract his attention from listening to the girl telling him about her goat butting was more important than paying attention to airplanes butting the towers which gave us three times the time to execute the operation thank god.


This will get some play. This will cost Bush dearly. Bush fear of frightening the children--more like Bush was a chicken shit child himself--gave the nare-do-wells more time to execute their plane.
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...




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"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...




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post #29 of 129
10/29/04 at 5:49pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Anders
Ladies and gentlemen: Kerry just lost the election.

Read the debate transcripts. Look for mentions of OBL. Kerry dropped OBL's name as ofen as he could while Bush only addresses OBL when confronted. Why, because OBL's freedom is NOT good for Bush's reelection. This is a negative for Bush. The American people see OBL is still alive, still free, still threatening the US while we putz around in Iraq. The recent reports of 377 tons of high explosives added to this will tank Bush for sure. No doubt about it.
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...




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"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...




Reply
post #30 of 129
10/29/04 at 5:51pm
Add this too: http://homepage.mac.com/njenson/movi...concerned.html
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...




Reply
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...




Reply
post #31 of 129
10/29/04 at 5:55pm
I know these aren't scientific surveys, but online polls for both CBS and NBC are both showing as of now about an 87% rating for "Hurts Bush" vs. "Helps Bush" regarding the new OBL video.

Besides reminding everyone that OBL is alive and wasn't captured by Bush, the fact that hated enemy Osama himself is mocking Bush for reading "My Pet Goat" while he knew the his own country was under attack is not doing Bush any good at all.

I was a bit worried when I heard about this story at first, but the War of Spin in our media right now seems to be in Kerry's favor.
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
post #32 of 129
10/29/04 at 5:55pm
This is going to help Bush, which is probably OBLs wish. I think OBL wants Bush in power because he wants war. He is ready for his last stand and he wants to go down fighting Bush, the absolute symbol of what the world hates about the US. Also, the F911 quotes are major fuel for the ulta right's fire. Savage (as nut sas he is) is calling for the arrest of MM. These are strange times we live in.
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post #33 of 129
10/29/04 at 5:57pm
Quote:
Originally posted by faust9
Even bin laden criticized Bush for sitting on his ass reading a book to school kids on 9/11!!!


It's pretty cool when you realize Micheal Moore and the big O are on the same page.

Ladies and gents, in poker, it's really cool when you rattle your oponent -- and if you can do it on International TV, all the better. Too bad W didn't give that ragheaded c**ksucker the pleasure. GWB knew exactly what he was doing.

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

Reply

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

Reply
post #34 of 129
10/29/04 at 5:59pm
Does anyone yet have any idea when this tape was made, and where?

It is strange how bin Laden first denied any involvement with 9-11, then secondly, this morphed into "having advance knowledge" on the previous Thursday that the attacks had been authorized, presumably by aniother party, to now, actually ordering the attack personally. He's either a flip flopper, incredibly inconsistent, or an outright liar.

Any "bin Laden" tapes have to be treated with the utmost skepticism, especially after December 2001 Kandahar video, which was phoney, and a really poorly done fake at that.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. The latter is beyond lacking.

(added later...edit)

Bin Laden is a huge asset in justifying the war on terror. Even if he is dead, he will be kept alive for years and years. Without that unmistakeable image popping up on everyone's TV screens from time to time, the "war on terror", phoney as it is, will be far harder to justify, even to the sheep.
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #35 of 129
10/29/04 at 6:03pm
Quote:
Originally posted by dmz
It's pretty cool when you realize Micheal Moore and the big O are on the same page.

Ladies and gents, in poker, it's really cool when you rattle your oponent -- and if you can do it on International TV, all the better. Too bad W didn't give that ragheaded c**ksucker the pleasure. GWB knew exactly what he was doing.

324 characters of utter nonsense!?! What are you talking about? M.Moore pointed out that Bush did nothing. OBL pointed out that Bush's doing nothing allowed for more misdeeds.

The second part of your post is a major candidate for the "out in left filed" category BTW. No clue what you're getting at or talking about for that matter.
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...




Reply
"[Saddam's] a bad guy. He's a terrible guy and he should go. But I don't think it's worth 800 troops dead, 4500 wounded -- some of them terribly -- $200 billion of our treasury and counting, and...




Reply
post #36 of 129
10/29/04 at 6:07pm
These days it seems like both sides agree on the facts but draw opposite conclusions.

I do not understand this.

How can you be anything but angered at Bush after terrorists steal 395 thousand TONS of high explosives?

How can you not be angered when a free OBL posts videos willy nilly encouraging people to attack us?

These are the facts. Bush is Commander in Chief. He did not send enough troops to "win" in Iraq. In fact they should never have been there because they should have been in Afghanistan. He waited two months to even START looking for Osama. These are facts. How can you support Bush foreign policy with facts like these? dmz, et al, there is no room.

Americans are incredibly stupid when they say sure OBL is still out there, but Bush is "making tough choices and sticking with them." Would he have never pulled out of Vietnam, if he was President then? Or would just have skipped it entirely to smoke up... OK that was bad, no more needless jabs. Regardless, I am puzzled by the way people are "debating" the "meaning" of "facts" and drawing conclusions in this election year. I don't think it has ever been like this. The polarization is incredible. And bad. It must go. We need a uniter, not a divider. I am not sure if Kerry is the man to do it. I have a feeling Edwards is. We shall see. Kerry so far has shown incredible thoughtfulness in his career. Or as some would call it, flip-flopping.
"Overpopulation and climate change are serious shit." Gilsch
"I was really curious how they had managed such fine granularity of alienation." addabox
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"Overpopulation and climate change are serious shit." Gilsch
"I was really curious how they had managed such fine granularity of alienation." addabox
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post #37 of 129
10/29/04 at 6:17pm
If only during the debates Kerry had constantly referred to Bush's turning his attention from OBL to SH. If only Kerry had talked about how Bush allowed OBL to escape. If only Bush hadn't said he wasn't concerned with OBL. If only Bush hadn't said that he hadn't said he wasn't concerned with OBL.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #38 of 129
10/29/04 at 6:17pm
Quote:
Originally posted by dmz
Ladies and gents, in poker, it's really cool when you rattle your oponent -- and if you can do it on International TV, all the better. Too bad W didn't give that ragheaded c**ksucker the pleasure. GWB knew exactly what he was doing.

LMAO.

Plane crashes into the world's most important financial center. President decides to go ahead with a photo-op.

DMZ considers this proof that Bush is a great leader.

Bizarro world.
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post #39 of 129
10/29/04 at 6:25pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Aquatic
These days it seems like both sides agree on the facts but draw opposite conclusions.

I do not understand this.

What's going on mostly in this thread is people who've already decided that Bush is a Bad Thing getting worried that stupid people (there are a lot of them out there, and some of them vote) will see the OBL video and irrationally panic and run for the illusory safety of Dubya. They've seen so much rapant stupidity based on emotional rhetoric it's easy to get worried that practically anything sensational somehow plays into Bush's hands.

I feared this a little myself about the OBL tape. But those fears have faded fast. This is starting to play out badly for Bush in the American media.

As far as I'm concerned, the only real downside to the tape is that it crowds out other bad news for Bush, like 100,000 dead Iraqi civilians (doesn't look like US invasion and occupation is much healthier for the longevity of the Iraqi people than Saddam was), the 380 tons of high explosives fiasco, more Halliburton scandal, etc.
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
post #40 of 129
10/29/04 at 6:25pm
Quote:
Originally posted by dmz
Too bad W didn't give that ragheaded c**ksucker the pleasure. GWB knew exactly what he was doing.

Did you just call OBL a "raghead"?
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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