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DeLay's going DOWN. - Page 2

post #41 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by e1618978
Who did he insult? His gay-bashing "assclowns" term earlier was a bit offensive, but I couldn't see much wrong with the post you objected to.


I am so tired of blanket statements to describe a group of people as though the individual making such statements has some great insight even though he may not know anyone of which he speaking of.
Life is not measured by the breaths you take, but the moments that take your breath away. - GC
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Life is not measured by the breaths you take, but the moments that take your breath away. - GC
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post #42 of 247
The thing I have seen happening to this country over the past two decades is that special interest groups have segregated the populace not just the politicians. I have no particular party affiliation myself, to that extent I consider an independent voter. Here in Houston I voted for a Democratic mayor and a Republican congressman. I also voted for President Clinton the first time and Bob Dole on President Clintons re-election. I felt that a president should hold the office to a certain amount of standards. So the same consideration should be held to Tom Delay. I personally have my own feelings on if he is guilty but the position that he holds deserves a certain amount of respect. With all that being said he should step down as majority leader not because he is guilty but rather he doing the position a disservice.

From what I know (with only of the small group of people that I know) that average Americans are not so terribly far apart. It is only a few issues that drive the wedge between them. I also have notice that people are no longer willing to compromise at all; it is My way or the highway as I have heard it termed. This IMHO is the biggest problem in our country to day as far as getting anything accomplished.
Life is not measured by the breaths you take, but the moments that take your breath away. - GC
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Life is not measured by the breaths you take, but the moments that take your breath away. - GC
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post #43 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by DGNR8
I also have notice that people are no longer willing to compromise at all; it is My way or the highway as I have heard it termed. This IMHO is the biggest problem in our country to day as far as getting anything accomplished.


They're just looking up to their leader:

'You're either with us, or against us.'
'L'enfer, c'est les autres' - JPS
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'L'enfer, c'est les autres' - JPS
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post #44 of 247
Thread Starter 
Indictment issued.
Delay is no longer majority leader - replaced by Rep. David Dreier of San Dimas (insert obligatory Bill & Ted reference here).

http://news.google.com/?ncl=http://w.../3373567&hl=en
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post #45 of 247
Nothing will come of this.
Moe has left the building
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Moe has left the building
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post #46 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by Moe_in_Texas
Nothing will come of this.

We know the republicans are untouchable, but it makes us grabby. They can commit crimes at will and really nothing is stopping them so why not?
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
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"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
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post #47 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by Moe_in_Texas
Nothing will come of this.

Funny, I would have thought that being forced to step down as majority leader after being indicted for obstruction of justice would qualify as "something'.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #48 of 247
He was indicted, not convicted. Everything I hear is that this will go nowhere in court. This appears to be nothing but a political attack.
Moe has left the building
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Moe has left the building
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post #49 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by Moe_in_Texas
He was indicted, not convicted. Everything I hear is that this will go nowhere in court. This appears to be nothing but a political attack.

Have any evidence that this a "political attack"?

You are aware that 11 out of 15 of the politicians previously prosecuted by Ronnie Earl, the DA who sought the indictment, were Democrats?

Perhaps you can explain how that suggests partisan tendencies on the part of Mr. Earl.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #50 of 247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Moe_in_Texas
He was indicted, not convicted. Everything I hear is that this will go nowhere in court. This appears to be nothing but a political attack.

Sure, 'cause everyone with a brain knows that grand juries are nothing more than partisan political tools...


Though I'm hearing that Democrats hope the case doesn't move too fast... they're afraid that if he's convicted too quickly, the amnesiacs in the voting public will have forgotten all about it by the '06 midterms.
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post #51 of 247
Moe has left the building
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Moe has left the building
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post #52 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by Moe_in_Texas
Nothing will come of this.

Wow. Just wow.
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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post #53 of 247
Look at the charge! It is a very soft case.
Moe has left the building
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Moe has left the building
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post #54 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by Moe_in_Texas
He was indicted, not convicted. Everything I hear is that this will go nowhere in court. This appears to be nothing but a political attack.

I read the indictment and listened to the pundits. I just don't see how this is going to stick. There is absolutely no evidence presented against Delay in the indictment. All legal pundits I've seen today say the case is thin at best.

All that said, it looks even more dubious when one looks at the prosecutor's history of politcally motivated prosecutions. No reasonable person can question his rabbid partisanship. In May, he went to a democratic fund raiser and talked about Delay personally. He can go to funraisers, but he can't talk about subjects pertaining to ongoing investigations. He could be disabarred for such conduct. Then of course there was his pursuit of Kay Baily Hutchinson...but let's not even go there.

What further makes me think the indictment is bunk is the way Pelosi and Dean jumped on it and tried to expand it to all Republicans. It just smacks of a carefully planned strategy.

Pelosi:
Quote:
"The criminal indictment of Majority Leader Tom DeLay is the latest example that Republicans in Congress are plagued by a culture of corruption at the expense of the American people," the House minority leader, Nancy Pelosi, Democrat of California, said in a statement.


Dean:

Quote:
Howard Dean, chairman of the Democratic National Committee, said the indictment was further evidence that "alleged illegal activity reaches to the highest levels of the Republican Party."

(Source: NYT)


Sounds like the opening salvo for the 06 midterms to me.
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post #55 of 247


The happy couple, Common Man and SDW, again taking their posting cues from the indicted man himself.
post #56 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by addabox
Have any evidence that this a "political attack"?]

Well, umm....Rush said so...so it must be true.
Quote:
Perhaps you can explain how that suggests partisan tendencies on the part of Mr. Earl.

lol It's bizarro world man. Black is white and white is black. Is there a smiley for scratching one's head?
post #57 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by SDW2001
I read the indictment and listened to the pundits. I just don't see how this is going to stick. There is absolutely no evidence presented against Delay in the indictment. All legal pundits I've seen today say the case is thin at best.

As we know, pundits are rarely wrong.

Quote:
All that said, it looks even more dubious when one looks at the prosecutor's history of politcally motivated prosecutions. No reasonable person can question his rabbid partisanship. In May, he went to a democratic fund raiser and talked about Delay personally. He can go to funraisers, but he can't talk about subjects pertaining to ongoing investigations. He could be disabarred for such conduct. Then of course there was his pursuit of Kay Baily Hutchinson...but let's not even go there.

Again, how is it that a rabid partisan is in the habit of going after Democratic office holders? Maybe he's yet another "operative" who was laying the groundwork for this day by just pretending to put the law over party affiliation.

Don't ya'll ever stop and wonder about how every person who in any way goes against the Bush White House and its surrogates somehow turns out to be driven by irrational hatred? What I mean is, don't you ever get sick of listening to your own bullshit, transparent and predicable as it is?

Quote:
What further makes me think the indictment is bunk is the way Pelosi and Dean jumped on it and tried to expand it to all Republicans. It just smacks of a carefully planned strategy.

Pelosi:


Dean:



(Source: NYT)


Sounds like the opening salvo for the 06 midterms to me.

Well of course. The fact that the politicians would want to score political points from the leader of the opposite party being indicted certainly proves the whole thing is a put up job. I can't see how you could read it any other way.

Unless, of course, the Republican leadership actually has gone off the rails, and a great many of them seem to be in corruption trouble of some kind.

Ala : Digby:

Quote:
So, we have a federal probe implicating the president's number one political advisor and the vice president's chief of staff in the violation of laws protecting CIA agents and possibly lying to federal investigators.

We have a multi-pronged investigation into a lobbyist who happens to be a very close associate of Tom DeLay,Grover Norquist, Ralph Reed, Karl Rove and the entire Republican leadership going back to their youth as members of the College republicans. This lobbyist is now implicated in a mafia murder plot and has been arrested on charges affiliated with that crime.

A member of the Bush administration who is a good friend and associate of all of the above was arrested this week for lying to the Feds about his good friend the lobbyist.

The majority leader of the Senate is now officially under investigation by the SEC and federal prosecutors for insider trading involving potentially many millions of dollars.

The majority leader of the House was just indicted by a Texas Grand jury for violating laws prohibiting the use of corporate money in campaigns.

Of course, all of that must because the Justice Department and SEC are such hot-beds of partisan Democratic operatives, and the Democrats in general have so much clout these days they can make entirely fabricated, trumped-up charges stick just by going on all the cable news talk shows they control and repeating their baseless charges without being called on it.....

Oh, wait.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #58 of 247
You guys don't think you just like to argue, do you?

I mean -- really -- prognosticating Grand Jury indictments? When you get done with your Crystal balls, could you FedEx them to me -- I need them for my kids stock picks.

look into my eyes --->

BTW, isn't "politician under an indictment" redundant?

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

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In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

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post #59 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by dmz
BTW, isn't "politician under an indictment" redundant?

Don't minimize his alleged crime.
post #60 of 247
There is much more to come, much more...
post #61 of 247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
DeLay called the prosecutor's investigation "partisan" and "frivolous."

"Being called vindictive and partisan by Tom DeLay is like being called ugly by a frog," Earle responded.

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post #62 of 247
From a 9/29 poll by Rasmussen Reports
Quote:
Fifty-five percent (55%) of Americans say that DeLay is about as ethical as most politicians. Eight percent (8%) say he is more ethical than most, 21% say less ethical. Those numbers are similar to perceptions of Bill Clinton in the late 1990s.
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post #63 of 247
Tom DeLay isn't going anywhere. He's not going down. The old boy network will kick in and ranks will close.

You don't have to be clairvoyant to predict this.

Just watch....
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #64 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by sammi jo
Tom DeLay isn't going anywhere. He's not going down. The old boy network will kick in and ranks will close.

You don't have to be clairvoyant to predict this.

Just watch....

Maybe, but I've seen another analysis:

The entire DeLay machine is built on shaking down corporate contributers, pay for play style.

For the corporate contributers, this is just business, not ideological.

When the DA comes sniffing around, and it becomes clear that they can either cut DeLay loose or face being drawn up into the scandal, ratting him out is, again, just business.

Moreover, DeLay is actually rather different in this then many of his true believer cohorts, who can expect to get at least some coverage from the faithful. He's never been anything other than an old style ward heeler whose value to the party lay in his skills at strong arm tactics, fund raising and working the system, rather then his political bona fides.

If he starts to look like liability I don't think that the born again wing of the party, for instance, is going to try that hard to make his case for him.

That's the problem with strictly for profit style corruption-- when the trouble starts, you don't really have any friends, and odds are you've made quite a few enemies.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #65 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by ShawnJ


The happy couple, Common Man and SDW, again taking their posting cues from the indicted man himself.

Come on Shawn. Love Delay or hate him, you can't possibly believe this indictment is going to go anywhere. There is no evidence whatsover that Delay was involved. Beyond that....from what I understand of the finance laws on this, what was done was not even a crime. Both parties do it. Speaking of both parties, you mean to tell me that you don't find it just slightly too coincidental that Pelosi and Dean jumped right on this with nearly identical comments?
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #66 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by addabox
As we know, pundits are rarely wrong.



Again, how is it that a rabid partisan is in the habit of going after Democratic office holders? Maybe he's yet another "operative" who was laying the groundwork for this day by just pretending to put the law over party affiliation.

Don't ya'll ever stop and wonder about how every person who in any way goes against the Bush White House and its surrogates somehow turns out to be driven by irrational hatred? What I mean is, don't you ever get sick of listening to your own bullshit, transparent and predicable as it is?



Well of course. The fact that the politicians would want to score political points from the leader of the opposite party being indicted certainly proves the whole thing is a put up job. I can't see how you could read it any other way.

Unless, of course, the Republican leadership actually has gone off the rails, and a great many of them seem to be in corruption trouble of some kind.

Ala : Digby:



Of course, all of that must because the Justice Department and SEC are such hot-beds of partisan Democratic operatives, and the Democrats in general have so much clout these days they can make entirely fabricated, trumped-up charges stick just by going on all the cable news talk shows they control and repeating their baseless charges without being called on it.....

Oh, wait.


1. When the vast majority of people analyzing it agree it's a ridiculous and basless indictment, you ignore them? I've listened to several lawyers on this, and not one thinks the indictment has merit.

2. True, the man has gone after Democrats as well. That doesn't mean he's not a partisan.

3. I think you should investigate who this guy is before you attribute the response to a Bush sponsored political assasination. Look up his statements last May at the Dem fundraiser. For starters, he said "I'm the guy who is going to get Delay". As I said, this statement might just get him disbarred. Just watch.

4. Political points: Honestly, you think that their comments were fair? They called the entire GOP corrupt. The whole party! And their comments were nearly identical. I suppose in your world Pelosi and Dean just were giving their honest reaction. I mean, it's not like this is a plan or anything.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #67 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by SDW2001
1. When the vast majority of people analyzing it agree it's a ridiculous and basless indictment, you ignore them? I've listened to several lawyers on this, and not one thinks the indictment has merit.

Yes! Because what's important is that we listen to pundits and lawyers and not pay attention to the simple fact that a grand jury indicted him.

Quote:
2. True, the man has gone after Democrats as well. That doesn't mean he's not a partisan.

Yes, and that has a direct bearing on whether or not Delay has been indicted and whether or not Delay committed any crimes.

Quote:
3. I think you should investigate who this guy is before you attribute the response to a Bush sponsored political assasination. Look up his statements last May at the Dem fundraiser. For starters, he said "I'm the guy who is going to get Delay". As I said, this statement might just get him disbarred. Just watch.

Because this has a direct bearing on whether or not Delay committed a crime.
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post #68 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by FormerLurker
"Being called vindictive and partisan by Tom DeLay is like being called ugly by a frog," Earle responded.

Earle's in big trouble.

Taking down this DeLay guy is one thing, but both Democrats and Republicans will rally around Kermit.
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #69 of 247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by SDW2001
There is no evidence whatsover that Delay was involved.
...
1. When the vast majority of people analyzing it agree it's a ridiculous and basless indictment, you ignore them? I've listened to several lawyers on this, and not one thinks the indictment has merit.

The prosecutor has evidence, and it will be shown at trial, rather than being detailed in the indictment. Just because you don't know about it (yet), doesn't mean it doesn't exist. The grand jury, OTOH, has most likely been presented with the merits of the case - otherwise, they would not have issued the indictment requested by the prosecutor (unless you think the entire grand jury is populated with partisan political operatives).

After his failure to convict Hutchison, it seems to me that going after DeLay means he has a much tighter case - otherwise he's risking a career-ending defeat.

Unless you believe he's the political equivalent of a suicide bomber, your flimsy case theory just doesn't make sense. If he loses the case, the prosecutor just sacrificed his career just to inflict a temporary inconvenience on DeLay.


Quote:
Speaking of both parties, you mean to tell me that you don't find it just slightly too coincidental that Pelosi and Dean jumped right on this with nearly identical comments?

"Speaking of both parties," indeed. God forbid the DNC and one of their highest profile elected officials should be presenting a unified message. You've got a point, though - they should try to individualize a little, so they don't look as slavishly devoted to Talking Points as the Republicans do, to those of us who pay attention to such things.

Quote:
2. True, the man has gone after Democrats as well. That doesn't mean he's not a partisan.

Other than one speech at a fundraiser (how many fundraiser speeches has Delay made, anyway?), and the fact that The Hammer Says He Is Partisan, what evidence to you have that he is any more partisan than any other elected politician? Do you think he's any more partisan than DeLay himself? Is it possible to be partisan, and still be motivated more by things like doing your job and enforcing the law?

I love it when partisan Republicans assume that their opponents place partisanship above honor, law, ethics, and duty, as much as they do. Perhaps if more Democrats behaved the way Republicans did, our country would be a lot better off.
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post #70 of 247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Frank777
Earle's in big trouble.

Taking down this DeLay guy is one thing, but both Democrats and Republicans will rally around Kermit.

Forget them - he's going to have to face the wrath of Miss Piggy.
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post #71 of 247
From an Esquire article on Earl:

Quote:
And he became even more determined, putting corruption at the core of his philosophy. "Ethics abuse at the top trickles down like acid rain," he wrote in an essay in a Texas criminal-justice journal. "Just as an untended garden keeps on producing weeds, our eroded communities sprout crop after crop of criminals."

Then, in 1993, he indicted his first important Republican, Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison. It was the typical thing, using state telephones for campaign purposes. But Hutchison had a political consultant named Karl Rove, and soon it was Earle who was in for the fight of his life. Bumper stickers appeared all over Texas denouncing the Earle of Injustice. Republicans began accusing him of everything from conflict of interest to leaking to the press to "Gestapo-like tactics." For weeks they kept up a wave of hostile press releases and telephone calls, even pushing the legal limit by contacting every single member of his grand jury. One Republican called it a "scorched-earth policy."

But it worked. Having stirred up so much publicity, Hutchison claimed there was too much publicity and got the case moved to a Republican district near Fort Worth. When the new judge made an order that would have resulted in Earle having to go through a separate hearing on each piece of evidenceand there were hundreds of pieces of evidencehe lost hope and dropped the case. His friends were puzzled. His enemies crowed: Bizarre! Flaky!

It was the low point of his career.

But that's not going to happen again, he swears, not this time.

Huh. Funny, how the latest round of smear mongering forgets to mention that little detail about Rove being Hutchison's political consultant, and how his typical shit storm of attack strategies had something to do with the case being dropped.

Hey, and look: having created the "scandal" in the first place, it can now be trotted out as evidence of partisanship! It's a twofer!

Say, you don't suppose that Earl's vociferousness in this matter might have something to do with having once been "roved"? I guess you get the enemies you deserve.

At any rate, as has been pointed out before, we are now entering new territory for Karl's dog and pony show: the courtroom.

The Rove technique operates in the arena of public opinion and punditry. There, you are free to make up any version of reality you want, the only question being how well you can make it stick. There are no standards of evidence, no accountability, nobody's under oath.

But of course in a court of law there is a requirement of evidence, there are standards of evidence and accountability, and you are under oath.

You can stand up before a judge and cry "Your honor, my client stands accused by a vicious partisan monster", but that will mean precisely nothing unless you can present some actual evidence that this partisan monster has failed to make his case. And it all gets recorded, so you can't play the memory hole game where yesterday's wild rantings are casually contradicted by today's scurrilous libels, but no one notices because everyone is shouting at once. Everyone notices. People are speaking one at a time. The other guy always gets a chance to refute you, without being mocked and silenced.

Innuendo, whisper campaigns, hit pieces, outright fabrications, character assassination, gossip, outraged punditry, and all the braying right wing bloggers and their credulous amen corner don't mean shit once it goes trial.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #72 of 247
So what you're saying, addabox, is that the democrats need to run better smear campaigns?

Tell me, would you be less likely to support the indictment of Delay by AD Earle if you learned that Earle had fathered an illegitimate black child?
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #73 of 247
Mmm. Push-polling.
post #74 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by midwinter
So what you're saying, addabox, is that the democrats need to run better smear campaigns?

Absolutely. Fuck this high road shit, it obviously leads to ruin. In fact, in that vein, I here quote in its entirely KOS's response to one those take-no-prisoners, if-it-take-a-bloodbath-let's-get-it-over-with type "how dare they try to fuck with us bit of chest beating over the DeLay indictment at some right wing blog or another.

Quote:
Mark... may I call you Mark? I feel when someone has shown me the insides of their own rectum, we're pretty much on a first name basis... I have some words for you.

Whitewater. Rush Limbaugh. "Drug Dealer" Bill Clinton. Swift Boats.

Vince Fucking Foster.

Playing with fire, you say? Because the indictments ringing Tom DeLay finally reached up that one, final step from his ring of closest advisers to DeLay himself? Because the SEC has launched a formal investigation into the same behaviors by Bill Frist that put Martha Stewart recently in prison? Because one of the single most visible, highest profile Republican money men has been indicted for fraud, is being investigated for client shakedowns, and has his close business associates being investigated for a mob-connected murder?

What utter cowardice. What pathetic anti-American pedantry. What laughable protestation. The crimes of campaign money laundering, of fraud, of conspiracy, the violation of the laws of the nation, to be answered with stern visions of potential gunfire if Democrats have the audacity to pursue it.

This is the world of the Republican Party, split open like a rotting pumpkin. Crime after crime after crime being investigated, all revolving around the Republican money machine. Every seed connected by the strands of money they share between them. Barely-laundered campaign money passed in the palm of every flabby handshake. Every player in boldface, underlined print in the Rolodex of every other.

And still, this same bottom-tier world of flag-waving supporters still obsessed over an extramarital sex act, but offended to the point of sad, blustering threats at the notion that crimes by gilded and worshipped Republicans are really still crimes.


Your party has set aflame the entire political landscape, and now, once burned, you warn sternly from the branches of a burnt-out tree about "playing with fire". You used the ashes of one of the great liberal cities of America, New York City, as war paint for your own sick, racist dreams. You shudder at a burning flag, yet are willing to snip-and-cut basic tenets of the Constitution as needed or convenient.

And now, you're outraged, not by any of the rest of it, not by anything that has come before, but because a few prominent Republican faces have -- shock of shocks -- been indicted in probes that have spanned years of investigation, and interrogation, and deposition. That, you say, represents the underpinnings of a civil war.

You poor, hollow, blood-painted clowns. Cheering the trials and failures of your country with the same pennants and giant foam hands that you wave at your favorite sports teams. Willing to accept the most outrageous of lies, if they are spoken from your favorite talking heads, and soothe your own notions of America for you, and only for you.

And as for the audacity of Democrats speaking up during this process... the redfaced, flatulent fury with which you declare Republicans off-limits to that which you so gleefully hurl yourself...

Welcome to the world of the politics of personal destruction, you tubthumping, chin-jutting, Bush humping gits. Welcome to the nasty and partisan world that Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Michelle Malkin, Hugh Hewitt, Grover Norquist, Newt Gingrich, Tom DeLay, and a legion of insignificant lowest-rung toadies like yourselves nurtured into fruition daily with eager, grubby hands, and now look upon with dull-faced faux horror.

I know you hate me, and anyone else who dares disturb the thin strands of alternate reality in which George W. Bush is an intellectual giant, Saddam really was responsible for 9/11, the economy is getting better by the minute, and we capture the most very important members of al Qaeda on a weekly basis.

But here's some advice. You'd better start hating me more. This is the world you forged and, unfortunately for you, I'm beginning to take a fancy for it. Welcome to the politics of your own party, finally sprouting from the ground on which you planted the seeds and shat upon them.

Step back from the edge? You poor boy, asleep in the back of the car the whole trip, finally waking up and wondering where you're at.

Swift boats. Aluminum tubes. Niger uranium. "Mushroom clouds". Whitewater.

Vince Fucking Foster.

You can't even see the edge from here. You left it behind a hundred miles back.

So don't give me chest-thumping crap about civil wars, if your politicians are indicted. Don't give me visions of a lake of fire, if all those who find you loathsome refuse to suck at your teats of scientific ignorance in the name of religion, racism in the name of freedom, and corruption in the name of the New World Order.

Get used to the world you have created, and the stench your worshipped heroes have unleashed.

Works for me.

Quote:
Tell me, would you be less likely to support the indictment of Delay by AD Earle if you learned that Earle had fathered an illegitimate black child?

Only if it turned out that Bill Frist was, in fact, that child.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
post #75 of 247
As soon as I read that piece of Hunter's, I emailed it to a bunch of people. Good stuff.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
post #76 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by midwinter
Yes! Because what's important is that we listen to pundits and lawyers and not pay attention to the simple fact that a grand jury indicted him.



Yes, and that has a direct bearing on whether or not Delay has been indicted and whether or not Delay committed any crimes.



Because this has a direct bearing on whether or not Delay committed a crime.

A Grand Jury can indict just about anyone for anything. It doesn't mean shit. Have you even read the indictment? It was the first thing I did. Delay is mentioned exactly one time in the indictment, other than where he waives the statute of limitations. I challenge anyone to read that document and then, based soley upon it, tell me what is he is actually accused of.

Keep in mind...I don't like Delay. This isn't about the party I'm a member of...it's about an indictment that is clearly not justified.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
post #77 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by SDW2001
A Grand Jury can indict just about anyone for anything. It doesn't mean shit. Have you even read the indictment? It was the first thing I did. Delay is mentioned exactly one time in the indictment, other than where he waives the statute of limitations. I challenge anyone to read that document and then, based soley upon it, tell me what is he is actually accused of.

Keep in mind...I don't like Delay. This isn't about the party I'm a member of...it's about an indictment that is clearly not justified.

Delay is being accused of using his PAC to take corporate monies, funnel them through the RNC, and then pass that money back out to needy republican candidates in TX, which is a violation of Texas election law.

My God, the talking points are so fucking chintzy. Partisan! Only one count! Ham sammich! Meanie!

Delay has been indicted and he will stand trial.

And soon Rove and Libby and Frist. Corrupt bastards all.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
post #78 of 247
I could care less about Delay but I remember posting about the 527's obviously funnelling soft money into areas where only hard money was allowed to be used and just about everyone here justified and didn't give a hoot as long as it helped their side.

This is why the only campaign finance laws should be no limits, no timelines, full disclosure. Pass enough laws regarding campaign finance and eventually everyone is a criminal.

Nick

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Reply
post #79 of 247
DELAY INDICTED FOR MONEY LAUNDERING. BREAKING NEWS.
post #80 of 247
Quote:
Originally posted by ShawnJ
DELAY INDICTED FOR MONEY LAUNDERING. BREAKING NEWS.

"A Texas grand jury on Monday indicted U.S. Rep. Tom DeLay on a new charge of money laundering.

A different grand jury whose term ended last week indicted him on a conspiracy charge, forcing DeLay to temporarily step down as House majority leader.

Both indictments accuse DeLay and two political associates of conspiring to get around a state ban on corporate campaign contributions by funneling the money through the DeLay-founded Texans for a Republican Majority Political Action Committee to the Republican National Committee in Washington. The RNC then sent back like amounts to distribute to Texas candidates in 2002, the indictment alleges."
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
Reply
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