Even more disapointing TS news - Page 6

PowerMacmini
PowerMacX2
QuadraMac
G6 PowerMacX4

or just a speed bump pre-loaded with Tiger

Good remark.

Maybe because Apple ships the hardware out to stores before the announcement, so there is instant availability?

I know some folks at an Apple store nearby, and they won't tell me squat. By their behavior and attitude, they either don't know anything, or know something bad. Hard to say which.

In all fairness to most of the Apple Store employees,
I'd say they're pretty fed up with the sales they've lost due to impending updates and rumors.

And people like me who know a bit too much

The folks at my local Apple Store are all aware that I'm not buying
diddly squat till I see the PowerMac updates, so except for a polite
hello, they're not wasting their time with me.

I know all too well what it's like to work on commission, so
I understand their perspective more than most people do.

TCG, And why is it they always have under 20 posts> like we are ready to trust their n000b @$$.

Just as I suspected.

except that Apple retail employees don't work on commission...

Oops, thanks for the correction.

looks like he knows something that might have some truth in it

The problem is, the Apple stores rarely if ever have new hardware before it's released...

so let's say iMacs are updated on tuesday of this week. none of the retails stores will have the new iMacs in stock until at least a few days later?

They rarely have it before it is announced, but they have it for sale on the day of release, ie, first day it is available for sale to the public.

Generally there's a lagtime between announcement and availability (release), but sometimes they're concurrent. It requires them to be a bit sneakier, but they manage it at times.

And when was the last time that happened for desktops? For the release of the last revision of Powermacs, iMacs, and the mini, none of them were available when announced. It's always taken a couple of weeks after announcement for the to show up at the Apple stores, even if they're available for order immediately at the online store. Why would this time be any different?

Just clarifying the terminology you were using. Released != announced. The way you said it, it made it sound like you couldn't go buy it at the Apple Stores when you *could* buy it elsewhere. T'ain't so. The first day you can buy an item, they'll have it. (iPod Shuffle excepted - that one was a strange rollout.)

That'll teach em.

I need to order 12 Towers next week for work and I'm just damn glad I'll be able to get the new ones.

I'm with JSNUFF1,

I'm not going to buy one even though I'm in the market. Now its either a used 12" 1.33ghz powerbook or a 15" 1.67ghz powerbook.

Bastards.

CONGRATS TS, YOU WERE RIGHT ONCE AGAIN!
I have to take my hat off to them. I was very skeptical but they nailed again.
Very sad Powermac upgrade. Specially after so long. I will wait again until WWDC and see what's going to happen there. My prediction is PowerBook G5 coming there. So maybe that's what I am going to buy.
What's Steve going to announce to amaze people? It must be a Powerbook G5 IMHO.

Man this is great! We haven't had a old fashined AI bitchfest in a while.

It's time to put on my "counseling hat" and help some people.


Folks don't worry. The Powermacs are ok. What you're missing is the "sizzle" but the steak is still there. There's nothing that these Macs cannot do. Even PCIe stuff can still work in a PCI-X slot in cases.

Remember you can BTO the graphics cards of "your" choice. Apple has to boil things down to the lowest common denom. Not everyone needs a 9800/6800 GPU.

We finally have fast DL DVD Burners. Let's give credit where credit is due. Apple has done well here. RAM is now 512MB standard. You're only 512MB from having a Gig of RAM.

The new Macs are blah...but there's no need for the vitriol and invective. There's not a person on these boards that cannot make great use of the new Powermacs. Not one!

You are right, they are OK, but what make people whining is the fact it took so long for a really small revision. Plus why they did not lower the 30" cinema display prices? plus the machines should be a little cheaper because the lack of substantial upgrade.

Why needs he to amaze? Anyway, Tiger is not already amazing?

May we have a disagreement here? I somehow try to understand the pricing scheme for the new Power Macs, since dual core is not yet a hot thing in the x86 world, but the graphics options are undoubtedly the weakest part in this update.

I agree Tiger is amazing, but is old news now. He will be announcing something. That's the general expectation. He's not going there just to talk about Tiger for the third time. Just look at the keynote history and you'll see that in the last few years he always intruduces products at MWSF and WWDC.

What do you mean it's not hot? (dual core) Have you tried ordering a SLI Nvidia Nforce4 Pro Opteron Motherboard from anywhere? Everyone is sold out. The chips are not available for a few more weeks, and all the good boards (tyan, and asus, others) have been gobbled up.
No it's not hot, but for some reason they are all on back order now.

Oh, boy. jsnuff1, if you're going to insult people, the least you could do is spell "idiot" right.

Well, I mean that we need to wait several months, most likely more than a year, to see production ramping up alongside large scale adoption and substantial price drops in the x86 dual core front.

He does have a point, and I have to say that this is definitely not going to give apple some magical boost in PowerMac sales either. (it's going to hurt them) If Apple was trying to look for an excuse to drop the pro machines, and cater to kiddies based on poor sales of their pro line up. (which may be what they are doing) This last update would do it. After this they will be able to "claim" that the superior design of the iMac, iBook, eMac mac mini, and iPod have engulfed all powermac sales. They could also "claim" that the increased # of iMac, and Mac Mini sales show that the powermac users have switched over to its superior design, and they will discontinue the line, and they have no more need for the PowerMac because all it's users are using their other machines. Would you be surprised if that happened?

Do you mean what I do understand? Drop the Power Mac line altogether?

Oh, please. The PowerMac line dies while Apple continues to update pro apps like FCP and Shake? Let's all take a serious break from the tremulous hand-wringing and dodgy pessimism. (Or maybe I just didn't detect the ludicrous irony ... )

Also ...

This English professor (yet another) notes the spelling of "professor."

I suspect that we will all look back at this update as akin to the 1.25 dual G4 bump to dual G4 1.42. It was disappointing and insufficient but followed with a major step. The larger issues, as you all have pointed out, have to do with more than just CPU speed: PCI-E, hard drive configurations sufficient for robust HDV editing, cooling requirements, and the like. Apple's next revision needs to address these matters head-on.

Apple made a big mistake by not making the dual 2GHz machine the low-end, and selling it for $1,499, if they were truly concerned about sales. Why are these systems so G.D. expensive?

I wonder if Bang & Olfusen goes through this kind of fan boy forum abuse when they come out with anything new. I think you guys have too many expectations from a company that has chosen such an exotic expensive CPU for its system. Compared to other PC manufactures that have a plethora of choices, Apple is at the mercy of one. While this might be a mute point when discussing things like PCI-E and better storage capabilities, its still the main bases on their slow updates. Since Steves return, Apples focus has turned to putting out cute boutique computers with complimenting accessories (i.e. iPod) for the home user. The days of Scully are no more; the bazillion different models to choose from have been replaced by the take it or leave it line up. We must drop this fantasy idea that Apple can compete on a hardware level with other PC manufactures. Except that Apple is the B&O of the industry, great design, easy to use and best of all, out of the reach of your average God fearing American. This might sound a bit portentous but I like feeling special, if not for a moment. When I see a guy next to me on the train to work typing away on his Gericom notebook from Walmart I cant help but feel superior.

Cutting edge users will never be happy with a Mac when it comes to the hardware. Try focusing on the USE of machine, focus on the APPEAL of the metal in the corner of your flat next to the B&O stereo.

<edit>Oh yeah, one more thing, if anything else be happy in knowing that Apple users are smarter then PC users -> linky . See don't you feel better with that new Powermac purchase, your I.Q. just got bumped up 10 points. </edit>

Sorry to ruffle your feathers, sport. Just noting the irony...

[...]


Will it hurt them? I suspect that you're right, and this isn't going to give them a sales boost. I think if they're lucky, their numbers will be in line with last year's numbers with these machines. So, yeah, if you define "hurt" as treading water, then it will hurt them. Personally, I don't think things will be all that bad-- despite what the chicken littles in this and other threads say about the new machines, they're still competitive with the high side of typical PC offerings. Apple's not going to do great with these machines this revision cycle, but they'll do OK.

I don't think I've seen anyone who's criticized the "doom and gloom" contingent in this (or any other thread) really heap praise on these machines. All (most of us) are saying is that this is an OK update. Not a great one, just OK. You guys, on the other hand, are implying that it's the end of the world... Death and disaster! Pestilence! Steve Jobs biting the heads off human babies! Oh the humanity! WHEN WILL IT ALL END?!?!?! <faints>

[...]


I think this hits it dead on. The update is just... meh. The hardware doesn't really stand out from the crowd in any particular way (other than the fact that the entire line is comprised of dual proc machines), but they'll get the job done. If you want to be wowed, wait for the next revision.

Amen... but I don't have a B&O stereo. (If I did, I'd sell it to pay for the dual 1.8 I just bought! )

[Edit-- oops... that was supposed to be an edit, not a reply!]

Pro's who utilize the pro apps line will always buy PM's (and perhaps XServes for rendering). The fan boys out there who want the "biggest and best systems", with the highest numbers probably come secondary in Apple's targets.

What about us who just want to buy cool and expensive computers, where do we fall. Wheres my 25th anniversary Mac for 10,000? Sure the loathly simply minded non-pro-consumer gets a friggen sock for his/her iPod but wheres my sock, my unnecessary gizmo for my pro needs, like uuuhh I dont know, maybe PCI-E!

(Ahem) I think it's time to close this thread, since the TS news has come true. Nothing more to see here.

I'd like to think I have a pretty good sarcasm detector, but I'm not entirely sure what to think of this. Call me stoopit!

I'm still waiting to see a handful of PCIe video cards that outpace the current AGP ones. I know they will eventually... but... at the same time the G5 was also supposed to hit 3ghz (along with AMD and Intel hitting other speeds). Theoretic speed limits are always interesting. In the short run, for Apple/IBM to redesign the motherboard to support PCIe would just bump prices, with no speed increases. To me, that sounds pretty silly.

Down the pipeline when a huge PM revision hits is when PCIe should come into play, not now.