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Apple shareholders re-elect Board as Jobs slams environmentalists

post #1 of 34
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At Apple Computer's annual shareholders meeting on Thursday CEO Steve Jobs took a swipe at Microsoft's upcoming Longhorn operating system and fired back at a group of environmentalists who recently attacked the company's policies on recycling.

As a first order of business, shareholders voted on resolutions, including the re-election of the current Board of Directors. According to a Yahoo News report, all current members of the board, including Fred Anderson, William Campbell, Millard Drexler, Al Gore, Steve Jobs, Arthur Levinson and Jerome York, were re-elected for another term.

Shareholders also voted on on a performance bonus plan, amendments to the employee stock option plan, and the ratification of independent auditors KPMG, according to the report. All passed the preliminary vote without comment from the shareholders, the report says.

On the other hand, a motion to implement a performance and time-based restricted share grant program for senior executives did not pass the preliminary vote.

Jobs also used the meeting to fire back at a group of environmentalists attacking Apples policies on recycling. Specifically, the group said Apple should collect unwanted computers at no cost, suggesting that PC makers like Dell and HP take back systems for free.

There is a lot of inaccuracy here Ill give you an example. Dell and HP dont do it for free, said Jobs, who noted that Apple currently offers a program to recycle computers for $30. HP charges $40 and Dell charges $20 we are right in the middle. Apple has a really strong environmental policy."

Jobs went on to address the all of groups charges one at a time, which included accusations that Apple uses prison or forced labor in the recycling programs, that it ships hazardous e-waste overseas, and that the iPod is a "time-bomb" for health and the environment because it contains toxic materials that will eventually wind up in incinerators or landfills.

Addressing the iPod charges, Jobs said there is a small amount of lead in the iPod but that the company was working to get that out. "To call the iPod an environmental time-bomb is just inexcusable, he said.

During the question and answer session, Jobs was asked about the release of Mac OS X Tiger and Microsofts Longhorn operating system.

They are shamelessly trying to copy us, said Jobs. I think the most telling thing is that Tiger will ship at the end of the month and Longhorn is still two years out. They cant even copy fast, Jobs said as the crowd cheered.

Additional details and a full list of Jobs' responses to the group of environmentalists is available in the Yahoo News report.
post #2 of 34
The board was re-elected. Now that's a surprise.!
post #3 of 34
"Jobs said there is a small amount of lead in the iPod but that the company was working to get that out."

Good for Apple, seeing to that change.

And good for the environmentalists, helping to make it happen! Whether Jobs likes the PR or not.

As for Jobs other responses... I suspect if you looked into the details, the environmental groups weren't really protesting only non-issues based on mistaken facts.

For instance: "We dont use any prison or forced labor in our recycling programs or anywhere else."

But that "we" doesn't answer whether they OUTSOURCE to companies that do. I certainly can't tell from Jobs' comment.

Basically half-answers as would be expected at such a meeting. (And is it really true that you can't recycle Dells and HPs for free? Many people seem to think you can.)

I hope the environmental groups don't let up on Apple or on any other corporations. And I hope those companies listen, as Apple seems to be doing.

We dont really know, but we think their goal is to use Apples visibility to gain publicity for their own group."

Exactly Doing anything else would be stupid, and the cause is an important one. People are ignorant, and sending out a memorable message can do some good.

I'm a fan of Apple products, but that doesn't change that some real issues CAN be improved on.
post #4 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by AppleInsider
...all current members of the board, including ..., Al Gore, Steve Jobs, ...


Is that THE Al Gore or just some dude with the same name?
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post #5 of 34
I'm really disappointed in jobs, as he didn't use the term "stinky hippies" in his decrying of the shameless environmental self-promotion.
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post #6 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by aplnub
Is that THE Al Gore or just some dude with the same name?

Al Gore, the former presidential candidate, is on the board at Apple.
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post #7 of 34
If led is such a consern, why havn't these wocko anti-American-commy-crackpot enviornmentalists gone after the manufacturers of pencils, they use led and trees, a double whammy!

but there is a certin irony to the fact that these envro-nuts are going after a company on whos board Al Gore sits...Earth in the balance indeed...
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post #8 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by a_greer
If led is such a consern, why havn't these wocko anti-American-commy-crackpot enviornmentalists gone after the manufacturers of pencils, they use led and trees, a double whammy!

Umm, pencil 'leads' are made from a graphite/clay mixture and have been for decades.
post #9 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by aplnub
Is that THE Al Gore or just some dude with the same name?

yup, THE ALGORE (aka Mister Roboto)
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post #10 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by PBG4 Dude
Umm, pencil 'leads' are made from a graphite/clay mixture and have been for decades.

Actually longer than decades.\
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post #11 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by PBG4 Dude
Umm, pencil 'leads' are made from a graphite/clay mixture and have been for decades.

Point to you!
post #12 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by a_greer
If led is such a consern, why havn't these wocko anti-American-commy-crackpot enviornmentalists gone after the manufacturers of pencils, they use led and trees, a double whammy!

but there is a certin irony to the fact that these envro-nuts are going after a company on whos board Al Gore sits...Earth in the balance indeed...

Lots of hate and emotion in our post, but alas...little fact or substance.
post #13 of 34
Past that, I've got a Dual 1ghz G4 with 1.5GBs ram and no DVD drive. Tiger?
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post #14 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by a_greer
If led is such a consern, why havn't these wocko anti-American-commy-crackpot enviornmentalists gone after the manufacturers of pencils, they use led and trees, a double whammy!

but there is a certin irony to the fact that these envro-nuts are going after a company on whos board Al Gore sits...Earth in the balance indeed...

You're sort of a creepy fellow, aren't you?
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #15 of 34
God, Jobs is such a douchebag. He's been a dick for decades and I really don't understand why the cult of personality is so strong.

Quote:
"HP charges $40 and Dell charges $20 we are right in the middle. Apple has a really strong environmental policy."

Say that in George W Bush's voice, it's perfect.

I don't think being 50% worse than Dell on the environment qualifies as "a really strong environmental policy".

As far as Longhorn, he has no room to be talking. OSX was release 5 goddam years ago and only now are they saying the underlying API is locked down.

What a prick. Jesus.
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post #16 of 34
Go troll somewhere else groverat.
post #17 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by Sabon
Go troll somewhere else groverat.

Groveat has got a point, Apple could be a lot more environmentally friendly and they should be, but Jobs is not a prick. It does sound like the 'bad' Jobs speaking though - he sounds angry.
post #18 of 34
Well in Europe, starting this August, practically the entire household electronics industry will have to start complying with the WEEE directive on recycling, re-using or safe disposal of electrical and electronic equipment - free of charge (although to be exact the 'charge' has been moved into the purchase price).

Apple mentioned this in one of its financial statements a couple of years ago but at the time just stated that the impact of the directive could be 'significant'.

I read the draft proposal a few years ago and it was quite a hardlined stance from the EU. Basically telling the industry that the 'we have no option but to use this cancer provoking, unstable long life substance because there is no alternative' would carry no weight and that the industry HAD TO find other alternatives.
post #19 of 34
I love how Jobs makes it sound as if he's taking the lead out of the iPod to be eco-friendly. Lead is being removed from all solder in PCBs to meet EU requirements. I forget the exact details, but there's a timetable in the near future. The lead free PCBs are just starting to trickel out there. It's not something Apple is doing out of the goodness of their heart. Apple has a fairly good environmental record for a major corporation. They have a nice page that details a lot of the in house projects they do, but they all benefit Apple financially by reducing costs. It's the Amory Lovins concept of natural capitalism in which you reduce your impact to reduce costs and increase profit. It works very well and Amory cosults with many of the top multinational companies. What Apple doesn't do is partake in environmental programs that don't benefit the bottom line.

A) The use of virgin plastic / metals in all products
- A lot of this is due to clear / translucent designs which require virgin plastics
B) The lack of promotion of their recycling program and the high cost of the program for the consumer
C) The outsourcing of production to countries with much lower environmental standards.
D) The use of none servicable parts on the iPod and the high service fees designed to encourage the user to simply buy a new model.


Apple is certainly better than many large corporations, but they are not a leader. I'd love to see them improve on this.
post #20 of 34
Before everyone hangs Jobs, who recycle's their garbage at home and work? Do you drive hybird vehicles? Are you collecting rain water from you gutters to water you plants? Do you live in a coke can/tire house (supplied by your local landfill)?

Let's give Steve-o a little slack here. My iMac does use less electricity than my wifes Win-Box. Offering a recycle program for $30 isn't that bad. It's a good start in the right direction. Sure there are problems, but who amoung shall cast the first stone? Not me...

Besides, Al Gore, and I had no idea he was on the board, sits on the board and he wouldn't allow such ungrateful enviromental activity to happen.
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post #21 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by aplnub
Before everyone hangs Jobs, who recycle's their garbage at home and work? Do you drive hybird vehicles? Are you collecting rain water from you gutters to water you plants? Do you live in a coke can/tire house (supplied by your local landfill)?

I recycle at home and at work. I use mass transit to get to and from work. Our lawn care provider uses only organic lawn care products. I live in a brick building. Brick is basically kiln-dried mud.
post #22 of 34
The people who can afford to buy and are attracted to hybrids also seem to be people who can afford and are attracted to buy Macs.

I live in a city that is at about 53% recycling and is targeting 60%. We all just need education and a little infrastructure. I would go to the Apple store in the area to take back old Macs and probably pick up software if they accepted drop offs. I know it could be a recipe for ungodly stacks of Performas in the back hall, but that would be another great service the stores could provide. It would also be an added service that would differentiate them from resellers.

Heck if switchers brought in old biege Dells for recycling when they pick up their Mini's just think of the images that could act as foil to the Dell kiosks in the malls.

Well maybe that ain't such a good idea.
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post #23 of 34
Quote:
I don't think being 50% worse than Dell on the environment qualifies as "a really strong environmental policy".

Those G5s are pretty heavy - if the average Mac is heavier than the average Dell, then Apple might be better per lb than Dell.
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post #24 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
God, Jobs is such a douchebag. He's been a dick for decades and I really don't understand why the cult of personality is so strong.



Say that in George W Bush's voice, it's perfect.

I don't think being 50% worse than Dell on the environment qualifies as "a really strong environmental policy".

As far as Longhorn, he has no room to be talking. OSX was release 5 goddam years ago and only now are they saying the underlying API is locked down.

What a prick. Jesus.

Being a Libertarian, here is a thought: You have old computers lying around, then get off your ass and see that they are properly disposed of since YOU OWN THEM.

Expecting or should I say whining to Washington D.C. that the corporation should do this is pathetic.

Should FORD, GM, Daimler-Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, so on and so forth collect unwanted cars and pay to have them removed from the premises of owners who no longer want them?

Recycle your own stuff, live within your means and just watch how much cleaner the environment will be if we all get off our asses and be self-reliant.

Regarding your warped view of Locked Down API ::

Background:

I worked at NeXT and Apple until I got fed up with the granola whiners not grasping the future.

View:

The API is now 'locked down' making it clear that with the inclusion of ObjC++ the collaboration of APIs implemented in C, C++, ObjC or Java now work cohesively under COCOA.

The major delay has been Carbon. Satisfying the past in order to painfully move them to the future was originally projected for 5 years and has turned into 8.

Apple is making it clear that the direction of their Frameworks are centered around Cocoa.

Developers know this and can't bitch. GCC4.0 gives you plenty of languages and Cocoa has exposed APIs to use C, C++, ObjC, ObjC++ and Java. Hell they even have PyObjC for Python Developers. Ruby and PHP I have no doubt will eventually have access if someone hasn't done it already.

CORE DATA :: Welcome to NeXT Developer 2005

http://developer.apple.com/macosx/tiger/coredata.html
post #25 of 34
Quote:
The major delay has been Carbon.

What does it matter what the delay has been? Did I say it was something else?
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post #26 of 34
yeah i love how these environmentalists are pissed that apple won't eat the costs of recycling computers when NO OTHER INDUSTRY HAS TO DO THIS. not even bigger industries that use more materials, like the automobile industry.

and again it is an issue of getting off your ass and recycling it if you really want to be environmental.

and OMG i guess that 1 gram (probably much less) of lead in the ipod is just going to destroy the environment.

seriously where do you think lead comes from? it's on the periodic table which it means it's SOMEWHERE in the environment already. one gram of lead from a freaking ipod wont make a difference even from 10 million ipods spread out across thousands of landfills.
post #27 of 34
I can see the reference in paleoanthropology lectures of the distant future...

"And then as you see in diagram 4a, we find in the Cupertino deposits, the famous W-i boundary. That point in the ancient landfills at the start of the third millenium when the predominantly Walkman culture was supplanted by the iPodosapiens culture. See how the strata changes from a metallic plastic to the glint of shiny steel and white? This boundary layer allows us to place all of the world's lost urban civilizations within a chronological continuity and is a primary indicator for the archeologist to study, to a high level of precision, the the spread of cool over that primordial landscape.

Some of this precision is at times confused at sites contaminated with dell-biege-onite, the ubiquitous substance weathered from the accumulation of vast areas of cheaply made disposable laptops.

Speaking of extinction rates, we find excellent examples in the South Dakotan badland sites labeled Gateway Headquarters on page 234 of your texts."
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post #28 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by a_greer
If led is such a consern, why havn't these wocko anti-American-commy-crackpot enviornmentalists gone after the manufacturers of pencils, they use led and trees, a double whammy!

but there is a certin irony to the fact that these envro-nuts are going after a company on whos board Al Gore sits...Earth in the balance indeed...

Thanks for the parody I didn't get it at first!


Quote:
Originally posted by aplnub
Before everyone hangs Jobs, who recycle's their garbage at home and work?

I do, and Steve might very well also


Quote:
Originally posted by akhomerun
NO OTHER INDUSTRY HAS TO DO THIS.

Some industries DO have to recycle by law, and the auto industry is one of them (car batteries, anyone? used oil?), but we're talking here about what SHOULD be done, not "has to."

Computer companies sell a product that:

a) Has high volume.

b) Contains a variety of both toxic waste and recyclable materials--and small amounts multipled by millions = large amounts.

c) Gets replaced often, breaks down often, and thus gets thrown away often.

d) Has high visibility and thus is useful for raising awareness.

So "going after" the computer industry makes good sense--and this may be Apple's turn but Apple is NOT the only one who faces these kinds of protests.

And of course, OTHER industries deserve such protests too--and they get them. The computer industry is not being singled out, and nor is Apple. We're talking about ONE protest here, not ALL environmental protects.

Remember the goal of these protests: it's not about hating Apple, it's about the greater good.
post #29 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by a_greer
If led is such a consern, why havn't these wocko anti-American-commy-crackpot enviornmentalists gone after the manufacturers of pencils, they use led and trees, a double whammy!

but there is a certin irony to the fact that these envro-nuts are going after a company on whos board Al Gore sits...Earth in the balance indeed...

Are you drunk?
post #30 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by mdriftmeyer
Being a Libertarian, here is a thought: You have old computers lying around, then get off your ass and see that they are properly disposed of since YOU OWN THEM.


I couldn't agree more with this sentiment. For example, there was plenty of bitching and moaning in the part of Canada that I live in when an electronics recycling tax was introduced (if you buy a certain size of TV you pay "x" dollars at the time of purchase at the retail store for your recyling fee).

In my opinion this is a good example of government doing something useful (for a change), in that the new item tax supports the recyling of the old discarded items, and people with the old discarded items will be much more likely to take them to the recycling depot (since it's free to do so).
post #31 of 34
Why doesn't the ipod have an EASILY replaceable battery? The answer: style over substance. Apple should send a pre-paid battery recycling envelope with every iPod it ships just like the makers of remanufactured inkjet cartridges.

Most people wouldn't go through the effort to do it, but Jobs would still come out looking like a hero, instead of sounding like a George W. defending his environmental record.

As far as computer are concerned, the environmentalist are missing the point. People do not throw away Macs. When you dispose of Macs you sell them on ebay 5 years after you bought them from about $5 less than what you paid for them . Seriously ever notice how Macs on eBay are more expensive than Mac from Apples refurb store?
post #32 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by nagromme
Some industries DO have to recycle by law, and the auto industry is one of them (car batteries, anyone? used oil?), but we're talking here about what SHOULD be done, not "has to."

Well Put.
post #33 of 34
Dell, being such a large company, is in a better position to be paying more out for old computers. Given that Dells computers look a lot alike from year to year, I would think that a lot of the parts are repackaged and sold overseas as new computers.

The fact that Al Gore is on the board shows that he is not a radical environmentalist but someone who can work within the bounds of what a business needs to do to balance production and environmental costs. Apple is working on the lead problem and will no doubt solve it.

Cell phones are going to be a much larger problem, and get far less attention that iPods are of late.

It's good to hear Steve sounding so confident lately. Taking very vocal and public swipes at Microsoft would suggest that he is highly confident about where Apple is going and the products that they have.

By the time Longtooth is ready, Apple will be able to release an update to Tiger that keeps them comfortably in the lead. At the very least, when Longtooth is finally released, Tiger will have been proven operating system technology for over a year (at least). If history is anything to go by, it will take Microsoft some time to work out all of the glitches, so Longtooth won't be complete for some time after it is released.
post #34 of 34
Quote:
Originally posted by nagromme
Some industries DO have to recycle by law, and the auto industry is one of them (car batteries, anyone? used oil?), but we're talking here about what SHOULD be done, not "has to."

Batteries, tires and oil? I would love to know what the big three contribute (dollar wise) to the recylce effort specifically. I would imagine the tire makers, oil makers, and battery makers carry those programs, not automakers.

Local yocal tire places collect a recycle fee at the time of new tire purchases in my state.
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