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Briefly: Mac OS X 10.4.1, Apple tablet, Xbox 360 photos and specs

post #1 of 49
Thread Starter 
First Tiger Update May Be Near Completion

Based on information already present on several internet web sites, it is believed that Apple has seeded the second external build of its Mac OS X 10.4.1 Update.

Specifically, reports point to a 36MB Mac OS X 10.4.1 build 8B13, which now includes over three dozen bug fixes to the retail version of Mac OS X 10.4 "Tiger" that went on sale late last month.

According to reports, this latest build lists only one known issue, which pertains to USB Lexmark inkjet printers.

It's believed that Apple could be ready to release the update around May 17th, when the company is also expected to begin shipping its new Final Cut Studio video production suite.

DVD Studio Pro 4, a component of Final Cut Studio, will require Mac OS X 10.4.1, according to an inadvertent post on Apple's own Web site, which has since been removed.

Tablet Mac Patent Granted in the US

The United States Patent and Trademark Office granted Apple this week with a patent for the tablet-based Macintosh design that made headlines on the internet about a year ago, TMO is noting.

Apple had previously applied for a European design trademark on the device. However, sources believe it's unlikely that this product will ever see the light of day.

Apple has also recently received design patents for the Mac mini's power adapter and the iPod belt clip.

Xbox 360 Photos

Microsoft intends to preview its new gaming console, dubbed Xbox 360, to the world on Thursday via an MTV special, according to The Associated Press. The Redmond, Wash.-based company reportedly invited 200 people to attend the Los Angeles taping and asked them not to reveal what they saw until the show's broadcast. Fat chance.

Photos of the much anticipated next-generation gaming console are now plastered across the internet.

(TeamXbox Photo/ File)

Each Xbox 360 will be powered by a custom IBM PowerPC-based CPU sporting 3 symmetrical cores running at 3.2 GHz each, 2 hardware threads per core, 1 VMX-128 vector unit per core, and a 1 MB L2 cache.

The units will also sport 3 USB 2.0 ports, WiFi, a detachable 20GB drive, 512 MB GDDR3 RAM, a custom ATI graphics processor with 10 MB of embedded DRAM and a customizable face plate interface to change the console's appearance.
post #2 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by AppleInsider
Photos of the much anticipated next-generation gaming console are now plastered across the internet. The Xbox 360 will reportedly come in two distinct models: a grey-colored version (visible in the photos) will require no subscription to Microsoft's Xbox Live online gaming environment, while a gold version will offer subscription benefits.

As far as I know, there is only one colour for the system (to be supplemented with skins). You are confusing the specs for the system with the rumoured 'Silver' & 'Gold' membership levels for XBox Live.
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post #3 of 49
And the current rumor shows different levels of involvement in the Live community; the difference is not all or none like the article implies. audiopollution seems to have it, though.

That said, the Live approach, if true, is very aggressive. Unlike Live subscriptions now, everyone gets a piece to see what online gaming is like without a PC. The rumor even suggests free gaming on the weekends for non-paying members for 360-era XBL.
post #4 of 49
IBM 3.2ghz chips.

This is coming out in 2008?

post #5 of 49
great now how can we run tiger on it??

IBM obviously will sell the chips to the redmond guys first and we get what is left over...

Grrr!

post #6 of 49
I hate to say it since I love the company, but the bugs in Tiger are disgraceful.

It obviously needed at least a couple more months of serious debugging. I used to build software for a living and I know the difference between, "every app has bugs" and something that was shoved out the door to make a deadline.

Tiger was shipped to a deadline. Totally unacceptable.


Sure, I am happy 10.4.1 is shipping so soon--which proves out my point.

What worries me is the size of the update. A few dozen bug fixes? I have booked hundred to Apple which should never, ever, been in shipping software. 36MB? This update should be 200 MB worth of patches.

I hate to be so negative, and I really love Tiger, but I really wished Apple would of waited until late June.
post #7 of 49
3.2 GHz triple-core PowerPC? So can we now implement that rule; all games published be designed for HDTV. No need to make excuses, full 1080i. Fun times will be had by all.
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post #8 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by BWhaler
I hate to say it since I love the company, but the bugs in Tiger are disgraceful.

It obviously needed at least a couple more months of serious debugging. I used to build software for a living and I know the difference between, "every app has bugs" and something that was shoved out the door to make a deadline.

Tiger was shipped to a deadline. Totally unacceptable.


Sure, I am happy 10.4.1 is shipping so soon--which proves out my point.

What worries me is the size of the update. A few dozen bug fixes? I have booked hundred to Apple which should never, ever, been in shipping software. 36MB? This update should be 200 MB worth of patches.

I hate to be so negative, and I really love Tiger, but I really wished Apple would of waited until late June.

I agree. I've been saying this on other threads on the site, but have been shot down by "fans". I think it could, and should have been released for the dev. conv. in June. That's when it was expected anyway. I can't see what the rush was all about.
post #9 of 49
so in service for MS they're not only able to master 3 GHz but w a SOLID margin!
post #10 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by TednDi
great now how can we run tiger on it??

IBM obviously will sell the chips to the redmond guys first and we get what is left over...

Grrr!


I agree with you completely. What a bunch of crock!!
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post #11 of 49
You guys should be thankful others are buying IBMs chips or we would stay sub 3ghz for much longer.
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post #12 of 49
Can someone explain why MS can get a 3.2GHz PowerPC into an XBox and we can't get one in ANY Mac. We're still 500MHz below and these have three cores!
post #13 of 49
Because it won't be out for a year or so. If apple were to announce powermacs now that were due out that far in the future then surely they would have multicore 3hz+ processors. Its not about microsoft getting stuff first.
post #14 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by jonnycherry
Because it won't be out for a year or so. If apple were to announce powermacs now that were due out that far in the future then surely they would have multicore 3hz+ processors. Its not about microsoft getting stuff first.

Xbox 360 is out in November, so it's not a year away.
post #15 of 49
So, I guess this means we can expect Steve Jobs to make some "surprise" PowerMac announcement at WWDC in June.
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post #16 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
Can someone explain why MS can get a 3.2GHz PowerPC into an XBox and we can't get one in ANY Mac. We're still 500MHz below and these have three cores!

Less complex chips. They will likely be in order execution, issue less instructions per cycle and each core won't have the execution resources of a single G5 core. End result is each core will actually run notably slower than a G5 in reality.
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post #17 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by Anders
You guys should be thankful others are buying IBMs chips or we would stay sub 3ghz for much longer.

We´re not stupid, we ARE thankful. It's GREAT MS also takes on the latest & greatest of chip-technologies, it makes for a viable prosperous platform.
post #18 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by Telomar
Less complex chips. They will likely be in order execution, issue less instructions per cycle and each core won't have the execution resources of a single G5 core. End result is each core will actually run notably slower than a G5 in reality.

In addition, these are optimized for the purpose. THey are cheaper chips as well.

MS is also losing $1.2 Billion a year on their game division according to the NY Times, almost $3.5 billion since the XBox came out.

Apple can't afford those losses.

This is what a large monopoly can do. If they were anyone else, they would have exited the market.
post #19 of 49
> If they were anyone else, they would have exited the market.

Microsoft established from the beginning that the Xbox is a long-term investment. They never claimed to be profitable in the short-term.

It takes a lot of cash to catch up with Sony and Nintendo, who have both been in the industry for much longer. Nintendo's been in the business forever. Sony's been in it for 15 years. Microsoft? No more than 6-7 years.
post #20 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by sabnetwork
> If they were anyone else, they would have exited the market.

Microsoft established from the beginning that the Xbox is a long-term investment. They never claimed to be profitable in the short-term.

It takes a lot of cash to catch up with Sony and Nintendo, who have both been in the industry for much longer. Nintendo's been in the business forever. Sony's been in it for 15 years. Microsoft? No more than 6-7 years.

True. But no one else would to attempt to compete after those losses.

MS has a larger strategy than just video games for this.
post #21 of 49
Good news for the tiger update. I found that Tiger is a little too buggy for the moment.
I hope that this update will fix most of these problems.
post #22 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by BWhaler
I hate to say it since I love the company, but the bugs in Tiger are disgraceful.

I still say no big surprise there.

To some degree the best way to find bugs is to put the software out there for the public at large to use.

Wisdom has taught or should have taught us not to upgrade on X.0. If you do its to your own peril.

18 months or so from now we'll be having this same conversation with 10.6.
post #23 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by TenoBell
I still say no big surprise there.

To some degree the best way to find bugs is to put the software out there for the public at large to use.

Wisdom has taught or should have taught us not to upgrade on X.0. If you do its to your own peril.

18 months or so from now we'll be having this same conversation with 10.6.

What happened to 10.5 - or is it like Longhorn - a fantasy?
post #24 of 49
I like the idea of a Mac Tablet.

For my work I could really use something like a Tablet.

I don't care for Palm.

I would much rather have a portable that I can write on by hand without the need for a keyboard or mouse and runs OS X with my usual apps.
post #25 of 49
Whoops I meant 10.5.
post #26 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by TenoBell
I like the idea of a Mac Tablet.

For my work I could really use something like a Tablet.

I don't care for Palm.

I would much rather have a portable that I can write on by hand without the need for a keyboard or mouse and runs OS X with my usual apps.

I would love a PDA made by Apple - bit bigger than the Palm PDAs - with the whole thing a screen with a light version of OS X. I have no desire for a tablet - there a bit big to draw on etc!
post #27 of 49
Someone remember that delivering of PowerMac G5 to Redmond?

Well, i guess it was for testing their games...
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post #28 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by locomacg6
Someone remember that delivering of PowerMac G5 to Redmond?

Well, i guess it was for testing their games...

That's old news. We knew that years ago.
post #29 of 49
PDA's are too small for my needs.

I don't think Apple has any desire to get back into the PDA market. Especially with the currently situation, many of the OEM's are backing out.

If I have a surface to write on I need to dispaly a full sheet of paper.
Essentially an electronic notebook.

It also needs to be very thin and very lite.
post #30 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by TenoBell
PDA's are too small for my needs.

I need to dispaly a full sheet of paper.

Essentially an electronic notebook.

I think they should make both.
post #31 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by tak1108
IBM 3.2ghz chips.

Why the hell don't we have these?
post #32 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by sabnetwork
> If they were anyone else, they would have exited the market.

Microsoft established from the beginning that the Xbox is a long-term investment. They never claimed to be profitable in the short-term.

It takes a lot of cash to catch up with Sony and Nintendo, who have both been in the industry for much longer. Nintendo's been in the business forever. Sony's been in it for 15 years. Microsoft? No more than 6-7 years.


Correction... M$ has been in the gaming business for a very looong time. Ever buy a PC game..... and then wonder why they never offer to send it to OSX.... Windows has been in the gaming business forever.
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post #33 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by Placebo
Why the hell don't we have these?

We all know Apple is especially secretive and real information about G5 development have been particularly quiet.

I imagine when it finally comes it will be better than the Xbox chips.
post #34 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by Tazznb
Correction... M$ has been in the gaming business for a very looong time. Ever buy a PC game..... and then wonder why they never offer to send it to OSX.... Windows has been in the gaming business forever.

They may have been, but the gaming industry is split into segments. They are a long time computer game maker but their are still in their infancy in the console market. That is what I believe parent was referring to.
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post #35 of 49
so every Xbox 360 game should have this logo on it right?




YEAH....!!!111!!11!
post #36 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by iGroucho
We´re not stupid, we ARE thankful. It's GREAT MS also takes on the latest & greatest of chip-technologies, it makes for a viable prosperous platform.

it's f8cking brilliant. M$ throwing heaps of resources at IBM actually should benefit PowerPC and Power-computing in the long run. ATi is probably sitting sweet as well...

Overall this means continued and increased possibility of juicy PowerPC and ATi chips for Mac down the line. Few years down the line iPods will probably be running G4 chipsets and consumer to pro-level Macs will be running (IBM + ATi cpu/gpus (the line on that blurring more and more through the years with core image, etc, becoming more important)

now these are all just my guesses, feel free to say i pulled it all out of my a55.

WWDC 2005. "next gen g5s" strategy WILL be announced.
post #37 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by BWhaler
I hate to say it since I love the company, but the bugs in Tiger are disgraceful.

It obviously needed at least a couple more months of serious debugging. I used to build software for a living and I know the difference between, "every app has bugs" and something that was shoved out the door to make a deadline.

Tiger was shipped to a deadline. Totally unacceptable.


Sure, I am happy 10.4.1 is shipping so soon--which proves out my point.

What worries me is the size of the update. A few dozen bug fixes? I have booked hundred to Apple which should never, ever, been in shipping software. 36MB? This update should be 200 MB worth of patches.

I hate to be so negative, and I really love Tiger, but I really wished Apple would of waited until late June.


1. i agree it was a risky, un-apple move
2. i agree Tiger was shipped to a deadline, not shipped to a "acceptable bugs" standard
3. the reasons for this is purely economic.
a: newsworthiness. here is apple with Tiger while longhorn languishes in drying pastures
b: there are two full months, May and June, for Tiger to drive profits and revenues
c: there are two full months, May and June, for Tiger to drive sales of Macs by advertising that 'comes with tiger'

4. in this case apple has taken the following risks:
a: 'leet' users getting 10.4.0 will live with bugs for the joy of getting a piece of the next generation OS
b: consumer users would not experience the high level of bugs reported due to their more 'general, learning-curve' type usage
c: professionals running important or mission critical stuff will be very satisfied with 10.3.5 to 10.3.9 and very well know that they can't blame apple if they do a mission critical Mac upgrade to 10.4.0

edit:
4(d): apple is betting that by the time the hype dies down and people start realising how buggy it can be, voila... 10.4.1 by end of May
post #38 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by TenoBell
We all know Apple is especially secretive and real information about G5 development have been particularly quiet.

I imagine when it finally comes it will be better than the Xbox chips.

You guys should read earlier posts.

I'll repeat. These are not the same chips Apple uses. These are simpler, cheaper chips.

Just as the Cell is able to get to 4 GHz with a PPC core chip on it, these can get to 3.2 GHz by not being full general purpose cpu's, but rather simple, highly optimized versions.

Apple can't use these.
post #39 of 49
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
1. i agree it was a risky, un-apple move
2. i agree Tiger was shipped to a deadline, not shipped to a "acceptable bugs" standard
3. the reasons for this is purely economic.
a: newsworthiness. here is apple with Tiger while longhorn languishes in drying pastures
b: there are two full months, May and June, for Tiger to drive profits and revenues
c: there are two full months, May and June, for Tiger to drive sales of Macs by advertising that 'comes with tiger'

4. in this case apple has taken the following risks:
a: 'leet' users getting 10.4.0 will live with bugs for the joy of getting a piece of the next generation OS
b: consumer users would not experience the high level of bugs reported due to their more 'general, learning-curve' type usage
c: professionals running important or mission critical stuff will be very satisfied with 10.3.5 to 10.3.9 and very well know that they can't blame apple if they do a mission critical Mac upgrade to 10.4.0

edit:
4(d): apple is betting that by the time the hype dies down and people start realising how buggy it can be, voila... 10.4.1 by end of May

All this may be true but it still isn't a good excuse.

How many of these new users are going to be soured by a bad first experience?

When the update does come out, how many know enough NOT to download it from the Software Update panel, but to start with their DVD, check the HD, repair permissions, go back to the Software Update panel, install the update, and then repair permissions again?

Hell, how many OLD Mac users know that they have to do that?

Apple states that this should be done, but then does not mention it when the update comes down. It just updates.

I hate to think that tens of thousands of new Mac users are going to go through that just a few weeks after they bought their new machine.

If the bugs were minor, fine, but reports are coming in about data corruption, failed upgrades because of SCSI cards, the reappearance of upgrade Firewire problems, security lapses with Dashboard, etc.

These problems should NOT BE HERE! These are the things that a proper beta program is designed to catch, and proper development is supposed to fix.

Sales numbers shouldn't determine when an OS upgrade is fit for release. We are talking of perhaps $50-75 million additional this quarter, hardly major. They would make the sales up 30 days later.

I have a fair amount of Apple stock, and it's getting hammered lately for lots of reasons. I don't want to read in Forbes that new purchasers are unhappy with Apple.

Obscure bugs, fine, I'll grant that. But not major ones such as these.
post #40 of 49
will quartz 2d extreme be enabled?
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