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Star Wars Episode 3 - Page 4

post #121 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by johnq
You boys ought to see some Kurosawa films if you think Lucas is dismemberment happy.

Jedi are mostly Samurai, don't forget.

Not to mention that Lucas is a huge fan of Kurosawa.
post #122 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by BuonRotto
Not to mention that Lucas is a huge fan of Kurosawa.

Naturally, Hidden Fortress = A New Hope. It's crammed with Star Wars-inspiring details.

Even the the logo for the Galactic Empire is from the back of the robe of the main baddie. You can see it clearly near the end.

The 2 villagers that inspired R2/3PO are great too.

Even the Death Star trench = the horse chase down the long path.

Those movies are great on their own of course. Some are totally shocking and elegant.
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post #123 of 225
It's interesting that people often criticize lucas for ripping off X,Y,Z, but then when someone like quentin tarantino does it he's a genius. I guess it comes down to how much lucas acknowledges the shoulders he stands on, but ultimately you know he's paid his dues and respect to those that he would imitate whether or not he publicly raves about it, so it's a pretty lame point imo.
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post #124 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
It's interesting that people often criticize lucas for ripping off X,Y,Z, but then when someone like quentin tarantino does it he's a genius. I guess it comes down to how much lucas acknowledges the shoulders he stands on, but ultimately you know he's paid his dues and respect to those that he would imitate whether or not he publicly raves about it, so it's a pretty lame point imo.

Did you mean me or just "people"?

I delight in all the various things he draws on for inspiration. He's perfectly welcome, in my opinion, to make a mix of Westerns, Samurai, WW2, Buddhism, Tolkien, world myths/Joseph Campbell-ish attitudes and put a sci-fi Flash Gordon/Metropolis spin on things. Why the hell not? Somebody ought to. And at least he does his homework more than the myriad other true hacks. *cough* Battlefield Earth*cough*

If nothing else, he exposed me to countless other fields of interest that I wouldn't have otherwise explored. Seeing various influences rolled into Star Wars just makes me smile when I see them.

Only a fool is going to get all anal and bitchy about him utilizing all this stuff. That's just jealousy.
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post #125 of 225
Definitely not you, but I do hear such criticism fairly regularly when people start discussing the merits of star wars and more specifically lucas' skills as a filmmaker.
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post #126 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Definitely not you, but I do hear such criticism fairly regularly when people start discussing the merits of star wars and more specifically lucas' skills as a filmmaker.

Yeah that binary attitude is too boring to bear. He doesn't suck, nor is he a god.
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post #127 of 225
Bear with me while I play around/toss around my Star Wars/Chakras theory...(Note Campbell is deeply into Hinduism and Lucas isn't at all ignorant of the subjects)...

A quick sketch:

(Crown Chakra/Sahasrara: n/a; not always included with the others; Chakras is "six wheels" anyway)...so six episodes!

Chakra VI: Ajna
Episode VI: Return of the Jedi
(Light/Lightning white; mind)
[Death Star 2]
Command, balance of powers/energies, liberation, wisdom

Chakra V: Vishuddha
Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back
(Space/Ether)
[Space/Asteroid belt and Bespin]
Space and Bespin; psychic energy, clarevoyence, speech without words

Chakra IV: Anahata
Episode IV: A New Hope
(Air)
[Death Star (hey, it *is* just a bubble of air in space)
Male and Female united (Luke and Leia)

Chakra III: Manipura
Episode III: Revenge of the Sith
(Fire)
[Mustafar, burning Jedi Temple]
Immortality, power, selfishness, betrayal (Palpatine is immortal, Anakin/Vader and Palpatine rise to power, Anakin betrays Jedi and Obi-Wan), personal power
Petals: 1 spiritual ignorance; 2 thirst; 3jealousy; 4 treachery; 5 shame; 6 fear; 7 disgust; 8 delusion; 9 foolishness; 10 sadness

Chakra II: Swadhisthanna
Episode II: Attack of the Clones
(Water)
[Kamino/Naboo lakes region]
Creation (Clone armies and Anakin & Padme concieve the twins), sexuality

Chakra I: Muludhara
Episode I: The Phantom Menace
(Ground/soil)
[Tatooine/Naboo]
Greed (Jabba, Watto, Neimoidians, Palpatine), security

Anyway, that's just for fun. Probably a coincidence. It's just neat when it does come close.

But we must avoid becoming like this gentleman:

http://www.mcn.org/greatbear/star2.htm
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post #128 of 225
Maybe Lucas is also a fan of the excellent B movie 'Samurai assassin', which has the tagline of 'It's impossible to keep a bodycount'. Outrageous amount of dismemberment I seem to recall. Not quite in the same league as Kurosawa though.

There was a story in the paper a couple of days ago about two people who were in a wood playing with a homemade lightsabre. Only this was a fluorescent strip light tube, which they filled with petrol and then lit. Unsurprisingly, it exploded. One bloke now in hospital with 40% burns.

Had forgotten that part-built DS2 in ep6 was meant to be operational. Didn't look in best shape for pressurising the inside though. And how did they get gravity inside a DS? Some kind of flangy 'gravity generator' I guess, as I don't think I saw a DS spin.
post #129 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by brandnewfatboy
..... And how did they get gravity inside a DS? Some kind of flangy 'gravity generator' I guess, as I don't think I saw a DS spin.

eh? wtf..? all ships in starwars have gravity generators... from naboo cruisers to general grevious' ship to corellian transports to the millenium falcon

'gravity plating' for something that destroys a planet is easy-peasy
post #130 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
eh? wtf..? all ships in starwars have gravity generators... from naboo cruisers to general grevious' ship to corellian transports to the millenium falcon

'gravity plating' for something that destroys a planet is easy-peasy

Particularly needed on a death star.

The outer onion-like surface shells have a planet like gravity, pointing to the center, but internal levels are vertically stacked along the axis. At some point there need to be gravity transition zones.

Not unlike the millennium falcon's 3 gravity zones:

Han and Luke standing vertically on the Falcon's horizontal floor. But then Han goes up the tube to the gun port and now gravity is at a 45 degree (I think) angle.

And Luke goes down his tube and his gravity is also rotated.

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post #131 of 225
Gravity gaffes are one of the things I'm very quick to allow in sci-fi. That said, Babylon 5 rules!
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post #132 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Gravity gaffes are one of the things I'm very quick to allow in sci-fi. That said, Babylon 5 rules!

because it actually spins?

and the inside is way cool

when you are on the inside gardens you can see all the other stuff like around you and above you

best use of gravity in a sci-fi story ever...!!
post #133 of 225
Let's not forget; best movie tie-in to mass/crass/commercialism...

Mmm, Burger King and Star Wars were made for each other.
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post #134 of 225
I just got back from seeing Episode 3 again. It was even better this time than the first time. I really enjoyed it. Even some of the cheesier lines and moments were forgivable because I saw them coming and could zone out accordingly.

I'm shocked to say this, but... RotS might become my favorite star wars movie(next to a new hope that is)

I have to watch the original trilogy again though, it's been too long.
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post #135 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
because it actually spins?

and the inside is way cool

when you are on the inside gardens you can see all the other stuff like around you and above you

best use of gravity in a sci-fi story ever...!!

Yup, I love B5, such an amazing series. I was just thinking about watching one of the made-for-tv movies for it actually.
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post #136 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Yup, I love B5, such an amazing series. I was just thinking about watching one of the made-for-tv movies for it actually.

yup, visual effects are not necessarily "cinema quality" but shows you what you can really do with good writing and LightWave3D.

also one of the few sci-fi things, besides the gravity issue, is looking at space combat where inertia is actually a factor...

oh and unlike the star trek universe where every bloody alien is from an earth-like environment and can all meet and talk face to face in the same room, aliens require different environments

oh and also one of the few sci-fi series where you can actually "wait" in hyperspace" .... yes star trek has shown stuff happening while "at warp" but they are still considered to be in the current 'dimensional space', in babylon 5 hyperspacing - involves accessing different? multi-dimensional spaces wherein point a to b is shorter... i think hyperspace was Red in colour in babylon5 if IIRC -- again, not just stars streaking by.

oh and much better use of psy-powers in babylon5, instead of bloody deannaTroi in sttng with "i'm feeling something is not right" well of course something is not right if not there wouldn't be an episode about whatever the hell was not right...!! as a teenager i was probably mainly just checking out here b**bs... before sevenOfNine took a more 'fulfilling' role in Voyager... bleah... hated voyager, again, i was probably mainly just checking out seven's b**bies

well, hmm i might have started a nerd war here if the trekkies get onto this
post #137 of 225
So anyway, star wars and junk.
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post #138 of 225
<yodavoice>Must go to Burger King, order Double Whopper you will. first you must see Star Burger Wars King...hmmm. Make Lucas richer, you will.</yodavoice>

You know, what's interesting about our country is that for years we were isolated from the world by two great oceans, and for a while we got a false sense of security as a result of that. We...
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post #139 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by hardhead
<yodavoice>Must go to Burger King, order Double Whopper you will. first you must see Star Burger Wars King...hmmm. Make Lucas richer, you will.</yodavoice>


<yodavoice>
buy episode 4,5,6 , you also will. price matters not, dvd will you see.
</yodavoice>

so what are y'all ideas on how many clone troopers are still operating in episode 4, 5, 6? can we tell?

i know there are a lot of regular joes who signed up to the Empire and all, but like the hardcore snow troopers that stormed the Hoth base with vader for example, they could be elite clones still...?

just when i thought i knew everything (and gave up) on star wars,
episode 3 at least salvages the whole thing for me


well, hope lives
........................
post #140 of 225
s.r.,
You know, what's interesting about our country is that for years we were isolated from the world by two great oceans, and for a while we got a false sense of security as a result of that. We...
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You know, what's interesting about our country is that for years we were isolated from the world by two great oceans, and for a while we got a false sense of security as a result of that. We...
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post #141 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by brandnewfatboy
And how did they get gravity inside a DS? Some kind of flangy 'gravity generator' I guess, as I don't think I saw a DS spin.

Well, depending on how big it actually is, it could have enough mass for it's own gravity feild.

However.

Remember in the opening sequence when the ship R2 was on and the ship tipped on it's side? Why in the HELL did everything fall down sideways? The gravity generator should keep everything falling towards the ground, and if it failed, then everything would start floating because they are in outer space. Simply inexcusable dumb filmaking.

And by the way, Lucas is a pretty shitty director/writer/filmaker. The only reason the original trilogy was so good, was because of the hot shit animators / designers that worked on it. Do you think Lucas designed darth vador? Do you think he coreographed the falcon flying through asteroids. No. The guy has made a shit load of money, and has accomplished a lot. He is no film maker, and the complete right offs that episode 1 and 2 where proves it.
post #142 of 225
Actually, if I remember correctly Lucas did design vader. \

And if Vader and the asteroid flight scene are the only worthwhile moments in the whole series for you, why should anyone listen to you?
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post #143 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by the cool gut
Well, depending on how big it actually is, it could have enough mass for it's own gravity feild.

However.

Remember in the opening sequence when the ship R2 was on and the ship tipped on it's side? Why in the HELL did everything fall down sideways? The gravity generator should keep everything falling towards the ground, and if it failed, then everything would start floating because they are in outer space. Simply inexcusable dumb filmaking......

well, not as bad as you think.

1. grevious' ship was f8cked. so let's assume the gravity generator went 'offline'
2. the ships were in space, but we don't know if they are actually in orbit
3. thus, it is possible that when the ship is falling, it IS falling towards the ground because it is 'low enough' in the 'atmosphere' that it all the shit on the ship would be falling in the direction of the planet surface

.....
to me in that sense it's excusable
.....
post #144 of 225


post #145 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman



Wasn't it in the news that one of those was stolen by some teenagers? They were caught b/c they only lived 2 blocks away and people saw them bring it home.
post #146 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
well, not as bad as you think.

1. grevious' ship was f8cked. so let's assume the gravity generator went 'offline'
2. the ships were in space, but we don't know if they are actually in orbit
3. thus, it is possible that when the ship is falling, it IS falling towards the ground because it is 'low enough' in the 'atmosphere' that it all the shit on the ship would be falling in the direction of the planet surface

.....
to me in that sense it's excusable
.....

Sorry, the shots showed it clearly in orbit. If it wasn't in orbit, it would be burning up and crashing to earth. That happened much later. And another thing - remember that General guy? He had actual organs under his metal plates - when he jumped into outer space - they would have exploded.
post #147 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by the cool gut
Sorry, the shots showed it clearly in orbit. If it wasn't in orbit, it would be burning up and crashing to earth. That happened much later. ......

ahhh sh1t i was hoping you wouldn't remember that point

edit: although, one could get into a massive nerd battle here, and we'd have those in the 'it was in orbit' and 'it was not in orbit' camps...

because it depends on the atmospheric conditions and gravity of Coruscant.

just because it starts to burn up later doesn't necessarily mean that it was not already plummeting to the ground ~ it would only start burning up when the atmosphere got denser and as it caught up speed
post #148 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by the cool gut
Sorry, the shots showed it clearly in orbit. If it wasn't in orbit, it would be burning up and crashing to earth. That happened much later. And another thing - remember that General guy? He had actual organs under his metal plates - when he jumped into outer space - they would have exploded.

Not necessarily. They could have been treated somehow to survive in space. And people don't "explode" in space either... though it's not exactly healthy for you. There are lots of space fallacies. Like it's 'cold'. There's nothing in space to transfer heat to. So really you end up getting warmer since your body isn't radiating any of the heat that it's producing. There's other stuff too. I can hunt up some links if anyone is interested.
post #149 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by pyr3
Not necessarily. They could have been treated somehow to survive in space. And people don't "explode" in space either... though it's not exactly healthy for you. There are lots of space fallacies. Like it's 'cold'. There's nothing in space to transfer heat to. So really you end up getting warmer since your body isn't radiating any of the heat that it's producing. There's other stuff too. I can hunt up some links if anyone is interested.

pyr3 what is your view on whether grevious' ship was in orbit or not? (see my edit above)

goddamn nerds!! don't we have anything better to do...
post #150 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by pyr3
Wasn't it in the news that one of those was stolen by some teenagers? They were caught b/c they only lived 2 blocks away and people saw them bring it home.

i think this is the stock standard 'inflatable darth vader' burger king thingy they ship around the world, 'coz you're in michigan and i'm in a place called kuala lumpur

f8ck i'd love to f8cking steal it though one day ~ if i had my old college buddies around or something it'd be a fun late night caper

edit: fun late night drunken caper
post #151 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
pyr3 what is your view on whether grevious' ship was in orbit or not? (see my edit above)

goddamn nerds!! don't we have anything better to do...

Grevious' ship was probably in a high orbit. Whether or not the planet had enough gravity to pull the ship in from that orbit is another question. I wasn't paying very detailed attention when I saw the movie, but some of the ships thrusters could have malfunctioned, plunging it toward the planet.

I'm not so sure about the ship breaking in half on the way down though. Especially the way that it broke. IIRC when the break happened, the stern section folded downward... away from space. If they were entering orbit at an angle that had the top of the ship facing away from the ground, then the stern should have broken away toward space, not toward the ground.

As far as the gravity thing, if the gravity controls have the power to make all the gravity on the ship go in certain directions, then it's possible that it was just a gravity generator mafunction that changed the direction of gravity. I'm pretty sure that the Star Wars universe has these capabilities... I mean at least in episode 6 and beyond the Empire has Interdicter class starships with gravity wells that can be directed to prevent ships from jumping. I'm sure they probably had most of the tech back in the old Republic times. For onboard gravity. If you really want to be technical... If ships have good enough inertial dampeners to prevent people from liquifying when they jump to lightspeed, you'd think that being hit by enemy fire shouldn't knock them off their feet.
post #152 of 225
sunilraman:
Quote:
i think this is the stock standard 'inflatable darth vader' burger king thingy they ship around the world, 'coz you're in michigan and i'm in a place called kuala lumpur

f8ck i'd love to f8cking steal it though one day ~ if i had my old college buddies around or something it'd be a fun late night caper

edit: fun late night drunken caper

I didn't mean that specific one... but I heard about a 'Darth Vader inflatable' being stolen on the radio recently. I don't believe it was necessarily in Michigan as opposed to somewhere else.
post #153 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by brandnewfatboy


Query: in Ep2, never really worked out who commissioned all the clones. And who got clones and who got droids. Not really the wiser after Ep3. clones seem to go from bad guys to good guys to bad guys again. Are droids always with bad guys? and who are the separatist fellas? confused.

[/B]

Okay, didn't see anyone else answer this: Palpatine commissioned the clones. He said he was someone else, but he set it up. Thus, Palpatine has control of the clones. Whether they are "good" or "bad" depends on how Palpatine is acting. Palpatine started the whole "separatist" uprising as well. He started the whole war so he could step in and assume power with a large army in place to assure the strength of his position. Think Rome.
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post #154 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by Fangorn
Think Rome.

Think the United- oh dear. We aren't in AO/PO...I'm sorry.
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post #155 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Actually, if I remember correctly Lucas did design vader. \

Well, he "commissioned" people to design the various things anyway.

Ralph McQuarrie essentially defined Vader:

http://www.nasm.si.edu/exhibitions/S...y/u16l5s5b.jpg

I wish E3 Vader actually had this more primitive look. It'd fit the prequel look 'n' feel so well.

Oh well!
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post #156 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by pyr3
Not necessarily. They could have been treated somehow to survive in space. And people don't "explode" in space either...

Well don't they de-pressurize rapidly? Just like how certain sea creatures expand (fatally, even messily) when brought up from the vast depths?
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post #157 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by pyr3
sunilraman:


I didn't mean that specific one... but I heard about a 'Darth Vader inflatable' being stolen on the radio recently. I don't believe it was necessarily in Michigan as opposed to somewhere else.

oh okay... i understand now
damn i got to get me an inflatable vader
post #158 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by johnq
Well, he "commissioned" people to design the various things anyway.

Ralph McQuarrie essentially defined Vader:

http://www.nasm.si.edu/exhibitions/S...y/u16l5s5b.jpg

I wish E3 Vader actually had this more primitive look. It'd fit the prequel look 'n' feel so well.

Oh well!

i agree... also a bit of echoes of grievious with the slightly more elongated face
post #159 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by pyr3
Wasn't it in the news that one of those was stolen by some teenagers? They were caught b/c they only lived 2 blocks away and people saw them bring it home.

note to self:
i should deflate the Vader before stealing it should i decide to do so
post #160 of 225
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
just because it starts to burn up later doesn't necessarily mean that it was not already plummeting to the ground ~ it would only start burning up when the atmosphere got denser and as it caught up speed [/B]

For the sake of galactic peace, I will accept that arguement. (Although there where ships BELOW that seemed to be doing just fine )
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