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PB G5 -- coming within next 14 days - Page 2

post #41 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by Amorph
It would be a stretch to say that I know Greek, but some dribbles of the ancient Greek that I learned in college (15 years ago!) have stuck around. I'm much better at recognizing Greek cognates in English words than I am at reading Greek—which is not saying much.

I guess then you know what your nickname means .

Quote:

Actually, I shoulder the blame for that on IBM. Their early literature on the 970 made a lot of claims about embedded and notebook use based on remarkably low-voltage designs (0.8v, as I recall)—which didn't survive the debacle that was the transition to 90nm.

Yeah, I remember. There was some rumbling about the so called PowerTune technology. Never heard again since then.
post #42 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah
This is bollocks.

very subtley put dude
post #43 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
Why are you folks talking about the PB being due for an update? The current model started shipping in early February (announced Jan. 31 to start shipping in a week).

That's 3 1/2 months ago. When WWDC rolls around that will have been 4 months. According to the MacRumors Buyer's Guide, the average update time is 6 months. But even that includes adding models, rather than just updating existing models. It's more like 8 months - the last update took 9 months. It simply doesn't make economic sense to replace a computer after only 4 months or so.

Just because they announce something at WWDC doesn't mean it will ship immediately. Remember w hen they announced the g5 at wwdc 2003? Took 2-3 months later to really ship out.

Either way, there has been a time when the powerbooks were updated in 3 months...... the powermacs were updated in 2 months (powermac 1.42->g5 2.0)

Anything can happen if the market demands it.

 

 

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post #44 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by emig647
Just because they announce something at WWDC doesn't mean it will ship immediately. Remember w hen they announced the g5 at wwdc 2003? Took 2-3 months later to really ship out.

Either way, there has been a time when the powerbooks were updated in 3 months...... the powermacs were updated in 2 months (powermac 1.42->g5 2.0)

Anything can happen if the market demands it.

Anything is possible, and I'd love to see it, as I'd probably buy one. But it's still highly unlikely to follow the identical pattern to the PowerMacs in 2003, and it's inaccurate to state, as several people in this thread have, that the PowerBook timeline suggests an imminent update.
post #45 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
Anything is possible, and I'd love to see it, as I'd probably buy one. But it's still highly unlikely to follow the identical pattern to the PowerMacs in 2003, and it's inaccurate to state, as several people in this thread have, that the PowerBook timeline suggests an imminent update.

what are you talking about? why is inaccurate?
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post #46 of 220
For those who care:



So is 5 months out of the question? I don't think so. Time will tell.
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post #47 of 220
Thanks for the chart Rhumgod. I think what it shows is that there is no pattern. It suggests only that one can reasonably expect some update (minor or major) every 6-9 months.

What will irk me if Apple doesn't produce a new PB closer to the 6 month end of the range is that the PB and iBook are lagging behind other aspects of Apple's hardware and software offerings. With the PB it seems to be an HD issue. With the iBook its the GPU. With both there's a screen resolution and FSB issue. In short it seems apparent to many that the laptops are behind the curve, so regardless of whether one feels the last PB update was recent or not, that update is now insufficient with regard to the OS and/or upcoming apps. It would seem Apple is impelled to address this imminently.
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post #48 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by surfacenuts
Thanks for the chart Rhumgod. I think what it shows is that there is no pattern. It suggests only that one can reasonably expect some update (minor or major) every 6-9 months.

What will irk me if Apple doesn't produce a new PB closer to the 6 month end of the range is that the PB and iBook are lagging behind other aspects of Apple's hardware and software offerings. With the PB it seems to be an HD issue. With the iBook its the GPU. With both there's a screen resolution and FSB issue. In short it seems apparent to many that the laptops are behind the curve, so regardless of whether one feels the last PB update was recent or not, that update is now insufficient with regard to the OS and/or upcoming apps. It would seem Apple is impelled to address this imminently.

Excellent points. This 9-month bump was really ludicrous. The team working on the scroll-pad thing must have been laughing their asses off thinking this will entice users on the brink of buying. Wow them with software when the hardware is increasingly lacking.

I think whatever comes out of WWDC, one thing is for sure: the G4 has a very short life expectancy.

<edit> After studying the graph I posted, I just realized that the G4 in Apple's portables is 4.5 years old (not to mention the nearing-six-year life span of the G4 itself - Motorola must be laughing all the way to the bank!</edit>
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post #49 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by PB
Yeah, I remember. There was some rumbling about the so called PowerTune technology. Never heard again since then.

PowerTune is present in all the current G5s that are released. Isn't really good enough to get the chip into PowerBooks but iMacs and top end Powermacs certainly have it present and usable.
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post #50 of 220
pretty sure the life of the G4 on the powerbook is near end.
The last update clearly shows the G4 hit a wall and cannot move forward anymore. Next revision must be G5 at WWDC.
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post #51 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by Rhumgod
For those who care:



So is 5 months out of the question? I don't think so. Time will tell.

Well, it will only be slightly over 4 months at WWDC. If the whole line is updated then it will be the shortest real, normal update on the chart by two months. Thanks to the chart, I'm firmly in the no full-line update at WWDC camp.

Once we hit WWDC, however, we are at the point of being closer to the next update than the last one. One thing to remember, the last titanium powerbook showed that apple has waited for another double-digit month period to update a powerbook model, a fact unfortunately missing from the chart. Add that fact in and take out the 2 & 3 month flukes (both special cases) and the average would probably rise roughly a month.
post #52 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by gugy
pretty sure the life of the G4 on the powerbook is near end.
The last update clearly shows the G4 hit a wall and cannot move forward anymore. Next revision must be G5 at WWDC.

There are 2ghz g4's present today that you can upgrade to... 1.67 is not the threshold... but very close...

2ghz g4

As you see... these are 2ghz 7447... not sure if a or b model however. I was shocked to see apple didn't go higher than 1.67... Perhaps they knew they would need a few more g4 bumps and held back a bit in light of waiting for the next generation of processors?

 

 

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post #53 of 220
Just hope G4 is gone for good on the Powerbook.
time to move on!
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post #54 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by giant
Well, it will only be slightly over 4 months at WWDC. If the whole line is updated then it will be the shortest real, normal update on the chart by two months. Thanks to the chart, I'm firmly in the no full-line update at WWDC camp.

Once we hit WWDC, however, we are at the point of being closer to the next update than the last one. One thing to remember, the last titanium powerbook showed that apple has waited for another double-digit month period to update a powerbook model, a fact unfortunately missing from the chart. Add that fact in and take out the 2 & 3 month flukes (both special cases) and the average would probably rise roughly a month.

If you look back at the processor jump revisions (G3 -> G4) there was quite a lag time - I think Apple waited until the last minute before this past MWSF 2005 to bump the PowerBooks. When they didn't make it, they bumped them on Jan 31st. So, it wouldn't shock me to see another processor jump about WWDC.

Also, back then, Apple was heavily into the MWNY (mid summer schedule) conferences, so WWDC pushes that schedule up, being a bit sooner than the mid-July MWBoston.
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post #55 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by gugy
what are you talking about? why is inaccurate?

It's inaccurate to say that the timeline shows the PowerBook is due for an update because the average update has been 7+ months, but it will be exactly 4 months between WWDC and the time the last update shipped. If you want to come up with some other rationale for why there might be a PowerBook G5, or if you want to just hope, then good for you. But it's not "due" according to the calendar.
post #56 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
It's inaccurate to say that the timeline shows the PowerBook is due for an update because the average update has been 7+ months, but it will be exactly 4 months between WWDC and the time the last update shipped. If you want to come up with some other rationale for why there might be a PowerBook G5, or if you want to just hope, then good for you. But it's not "due" according to the calendar.

The bottom line is: The usual 6 months upgrades no longer are valid. as you can see in the chart from Rhumgod there is not a time frame that has been consistent at all. Just because the average is 7 months that doesn't mean we can't see something earlier.
Look at the Powermac G5, everybody thought in 6 months we would see an update. It took almost a year and it was a minor update. The Powerbook last update, 9 months and minor update.
We can't expect these 6-7 months time frames or calendars to be accurate anymore. Apple seems to be announcing things on the market demand or product availability.
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post #57 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by gugy
The usual 6 months upgrades no longer are valid.

6 months was never usual. The accurate average is about 8 months. We'll be at the 4 month mark with WWDC, half of the average and two months shorter than the next shortest full update.

Also don't forget that the one thing apple is pretty consistent with is disappointing users when it comes to updates.
post #58 of 220
What I am trying to say is that is very possible to see a powerbook update at WWDC. Just because it doesn't fall into the 6-7-8-9 month category doesn't make it unlikely. As we can see even in 2 months we saw updates or as long as 1 year. So there isn't any "rule".
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post #59 of 220
I should have never made the chart.

Anyway, there have been shorter times (2 months, 3 months) when they received updates. Granted the PDQ update was due to bus speed issues and multiple screen size supply problems, but the 3 month update was for the 12" and 17" aluminum intro.

The "schedule" is pretty much open ended. Depends on how many current PowerBooks are in the channel. My guess is that they didn't have enough so they bumped what specs they could in a short period of time.

Either that or MWBoston will see PowerBook updates.

Paris, then?
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post #60 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by Rhumgod
Anyway, there have been shorter times (2 months, 3 months) when they received updates. Granted the PDQ update was due to bus speed issues and multiple screen size supply problems, but the 3 month update was for the 12" and 17" aluminum intro.

Which is why neither one really counts. Look at how people have been calling for new powerbooks just 2-3 month in from the last update. If all apple does is add an HD powerbook without touching the current line until november will it really count as an update? I don't think it really does or that most folks will be content and, as someone who bought a 15" powerbook in nov 02 (the only kind of powerbook that existed at the time) that didn't get updated for 10-11 months, I don't think that counts as a 2 month update. It's not just your chart; that period has been cited in every discussion everywhere from people hoping to get the whole line updated.

All that said, I'm itching to buy both a new powerbook and ibook as soon as both are updated, and I'm hopeful that the reports of Q2 shipments are at least partially correct. I see nothing preventing apple from releasing a new model or updating the line, but apple is relatively consistent when it comes to disappointing users expecting updates, particularly big ones.

I expect end of summer/early fall, but I hope to be wrong. If it's another g4 update I wouldn't expect it at an event.
post #61 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by gugy
The bottom line is: The usual 6 months upgrades no longer are valid. as you can see in the chart from Rhumgod there is not a time frame that has been consistent at all. Just because the average is 7 months that doesn't mean we can't see something earlier.
Look at the Powermac G5, everybody thought in 6 months we would see an update. It took almost a year and it was a minor update. The Powerbook last update, 9 months and minor update.
We can't expect these 6-7 months time frames or calendars to be accurate anymore. Apple seems to be announcing things on the market demand or product availability.

I'll chalk that up to "just hope" then.

Look, it just doesn't make economic sense to manufacture a new machine only to sell it for a few months. And that two month update time wasn't a new model, it was the intro of the 12" and 17" models alongside the existing model.

Anything is possible, and maybe they'll do with the PowerBook what they did with the PowerMac two years ago - give the G4 one last update in January and then announce the G5 at WWDC. But that's just hope, and it's not based on the timeline of updates, and it's not based on any reliable information about a new G5 like there was with the PowerMac. More likely, I think they'll pull a Pismo and extend the life of the last G4 PowerBook until a new G5 is ready.

I'll bet ya on this. No new PowerBook at WWDC. Either way I win - if I'm wrong, I can get a new PowerBook, and if I'm right, I win the bet.
post #62 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
And that two month update time wasn't a new model, it was the intro of the 12" and 17" models alongside the existing model.

The existing model was a 15" Titanium model, remember? They were brand new.

Apple History
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post #63 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by Rhumgod
The existing model was a 15" Titanium model, remember? They were brand new.

Apple History

Hmm? The 12" and 17" were added to the existing 15". The 15" wasn't updated at that time. It had been around for a few months. So that release wasn't a bump, it was an addition.
post #64 of 220
Additions are welcome too.

My biggest complaint about the current powerbook is the lowend doesn't have upgradeable video. If I could get a 15" 1.5 with 128mb vram I'd be all over it.

 

 

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post #65 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
Hmm? The 12" and 17" were added to the existing 15". The 15" wasn't updated at that time. It had been around for a few months. So that release wasn't a bump, it was an addition.

Fine. My point was that the "line" got changed. Whether or not it was the exact same size, etc they were brand new PowerBook models and the PowerBook line was updated just 2 months prior.
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post #66 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
I'll chalk that up to "just hope" then.

Look, it just doesn't make economic sense to manufacture a new machine only to sell it for a few months. And that two month update time wasn't a new model, it was the intro of the 12" and 17" models alongside the existing model.

Anything is possible, and maybe they'll do with the PowerBook what they did with the PowerMac two years ago - give the G4 one last update in January and then announce the G5 at WWDC. But that's just hope, and it's not based on the timeline of updates, and it's not based on any reliable information about a new G5 like there was with the PowerMac. More likely, I think they'll pull a Pismo and extend the life of the last G4 PowerBook until a new G5 is ready.

I'll bet ya on this. No new PowerBook at WWDC. Either way I win - if I'm wrong, I can get a new PowerBook, and if I'm right, I win the bet.

Well. Hope, maybe. I want a new powerbook! G5!

Regarding the economic sense of it, then i disagree. The fact is the last update was very minor. Apple need to keep people buying G4 Powerbooks. Just 167mhz update is a joke after 9 months. IMHO this was just an update to fill the gap until WWDC. People were not buying PB and the sales still very low in comparison to other updates. Apple knows that. So they need to launch something good soon because they are hurt by the current sales. that's why it makes sense for them to come up with a G5 now to boost their sales in the portable market.
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post #67 of 220
True gugy, but a g5 may not be ready by wwdc or even this year. Fact is we dont' know wtf is going on. It could have been finished last month and started production then. There could be thousands of g5 powerbooks waiting to be launched at WWDC...then again... the g5 may not be done and we may have to wait till 2006 or 2007 or maybe never at all. Perhaps the powerbook will NEVER get a g5 and go straight to the 7448 and e600mp... I feel apple would release the powerbook g5 as soon as it was available for us.

 

 

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post #68 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by emig647
True gugy, but a g5 may not be ready by wwdc or even this year. Fact is we dont' know wtf is going on. It could have been finished last month and started production then. There could be thousands of g5 powerbooks waiting to be launched at WWDC...then again... the g5 may not be done and we may have to wait till 2006 or 2007 or maybe never at all. Perhaps the powerbook will NEVER get a g5 and go straight to the 7448 and e600mp... I feel apple would release the powerbook g5 as soon as it was available for us.

I agree. we don't know anything!
Let's hope for the best. i makes very hard to spend my money in the current line up. Same for the powermac. it just feels you are not getting the machine you deserve for the money you are paying for.
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post #69 of 220
This is the current lineup:
Code:


0999 1.2 GHz iBook 12
1299 1.3 GHz iBook 14
1499 1.3 GHz iBook 14
1499 1.5 GHz Powerbook 12
1699 1.5 GHz Powerbook 12
1999 1.5 GHz Powerbook 15
2299 1.7 GHz Powerbook 15
2699 1.7 GHz Powerbook 17


I don't see anything wrong from a business point of view if Apple updates the notebook lineup to the following at WWDC:
Code:


0899 1.33 GHz iBook G4 12
1099 1.42 GHz iBook G4 14
1299 1.42 GHz iBook G4 14
1399 1.33 GHz Powerbook G4 12 1024x512
1499 1.50 GHz Powerbook G4 13 1152x768
1699 1.50 GHz Powerbook G4 13 1152x768
1899 1.50 GHz Powerbook G4 15 1280x864
2099 1.67 GHz Powerbook G4 15 1280x864
2499 1.67 GHz Powerbook G4 17 1440x900
2699 1.80 GHz Powerbook G5 15 1280x864
2999 2.00 GHz Powerbook G5 17 1440x900

+$200 for 15" 1680x1120 screen
+$200 for 17" 1920x1200 screen


The laptop market is going to be the major bread winner for Apple, any PC manufacturer, in the foreseeable future. Apple will need to serve as many markets as possible, including the ultra-mobile and desktop replacements markets.

An ultra-mobile w/o optical Powerbook G4 12 (mini) that is ~3.5 lb and ~0.9" thick with a 12" 1024x512 resolution screen would be a very tempting second computer for me. It would make a nice writing and traveling companion.

A desktop replacement Powerbook G5 that is ~1.5" thick would be Apple's high-end desktop occupying the >$2700 laptop market.

A new iBook G4 revision would get a slight performance upgrade and slight price drop. The current Powerbook G4 lineup gets a much needed price drop with the old Powerbook 12" turning into a Powerbook 13" so as to make it more familial to the 15 and 17 inch.

Resolution options for 15 and 17 inch laptops for those who want it and are willing to fork over 200 dollars.

Everyone will get what they want. This lineup is set for evolutionary upgrades, waiting on dual-core processors from Freescale and IBM to fill up the lineup in 2006. If IBM can't manufacture a 970gx with DSL, low-k and low voltage (<1.0V), than the Powerbook G5 will be heavy and hot with a 970fx, but that will be ok since it is a desktop replacement. Of course, since this satisfies everybody, Apple will never do it.
post #70 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by gugy
I agree. we don't know anything!
Let's hope for the best. i makes very hard to spend my money in the current line up. Same for the powermac. it just feels you are not getting the machine you deserve for the money you are paying for.

The current PowerBooks are brilliant - the bus speed is pathetic and it's not a G5 but it's a great machine. I'm glad I went for the update in January. I was so fed up of G5 hoping - it looks like it was the right choice.
post #71 of 220
Wasn't the xserve introduced at a special event a week or so after thre 2002 WWDC?
post #72 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by gugy
Sorry, completely disagree. The latest Powerbook update was minor.

The fact we have not heard any hints from Apple recently and that they always say it's too hard to bring a G5 into Powerbook makes me think the announcement is imminent. They need to get rid of all the Powerbooks g4 they can.
It's been almost 2 years since the introduction of G5. So the timing is perfect for such announcement.

No. Think about product. Think about retail. Minor updates recently or not. Hate to burst your bubble or spoil your summer... but it will be at least 6 months.
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post #73 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by clonenode
No. Think about product. Think about retail. Minor updates recently or not. Hate to burst your bubble or spoil your summer... but it will be at least 6 months.

Thank god I have more things happening in my life than spoil my summer because the G5 powerbook might not be announce. It's just a computer after all folks.
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post #74 of 220
What if a special coprocessor chip is unveiled at WWDC. Would you go for a G4 PowerBook if it had this sweet new chip too?
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post #75 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by Xool
What if a special coprocessor chip is unveiled at WWDC. Would you go for a G4 PowerBook if it had this sweet new chip too?

That depends. Does this sweet new chip have numchuck and bo staff skills?
post #76 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by Xool
What if a special coprocessor chip is unveiled at WWDC. Would you go for a G4 PowerBook if it had this sweet new chip too?

I will settle for nothing less than a G10
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post #77 of 220
I am going off to art college in July. I am going to get a powerbook to take with me because, well, wow. I have never owned an Apple before but I have wanted one for about 3 years, literally. I have not had the money to keep a PC and an Apple with my high school budget but with Graduation etc, I will be able to pull it off.

I plan to go big and get the 17in with all the goods but I do not want to buy it and a week later see the G5 release. I know that no one knows but, does anyone have an IDEA when this could happen?

Of course we want it to happen at WWDC but it doesn't look likely and even as someone said, they may just announce it and actually start shipping months later. I really want to take that beast to college with me but, I will wait if there is any chance the G5 will release within the next 2-3 months.

Please give me some opinions. I am not asking for facts because I know that it's all speculation at this point.

Thanks and as you can tell, this is my first post. I have been reading these forums for about a month, just never registered.
post #78 of 220
Quote:
Originally posted by ryanschmidt
I am going off to art college in July. I am going to get a powerbook to take with me because, well, wow. I have never owned an Apple before but I have wanted one for about 3 years, literally. I have not had the money to keep a PC and an Apple with my high school budget but with Graduation etc, I will be able to pull it off.

I plan to go big and get the 17in with all the goods but I do not want to buy it and a week later see the G5 release. I know that no one knows but, does anyone have an IDEA when this could happen?

Of course we want it to happen at WWDC but it doesn't look likely and even as someone said, they may just announce it and actually start shipping months later. I really want to take that beast to college with me but, I will wait if there is any chance the G5 will release within the next 2-3 months.

Please give me some opinions. I am not asking for facts because I know that it's all speculation at this point.

Thanks and as you can tell, this is my first post. I have been reading these forums for about a month, just never registered.

Well, in theory if you bought today then two weeks would not see a new one! I think we're safe from a G5 till at least August - but it's up to you.
post #79 of 220
I would wait until WWDC, then after you are safe for awhile.
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post #80 of 220
Hello and welcome to the forum ryan

I'm waiting for the next PB upgrade (G4 or G5), since I think the price-power ratio in the current models are out of order. As someone else already said - the PB is a midlevel laptop dressed up to look like a highend model.

But I can afford to wait, since I don't have an urgent need for a new PB.

Just be careful not to be caught in the waiting game, like so many else!!!
"Do Androids Dream Of Electric Sheep" Philip K. Dick
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"Do Androids Dream Of Electric Sheep" Philip K. Dick
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