or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mac Hardware › Future Apple Hardware › G5 - The truth
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

G5 - The truth - Page 7

post #241 of 490
[quote]Dubbed Rosetta Stone (apparently in homage to the Blades former nom de drag queen), the software currently in development for Mac OS X is aimed at resurrecting the mummified remains of the handwriting-recognition technology behind Apples long-dead Newton PDA and putting it to work on forthcoming Mac lap- and desktops.
<hr></blockquote>

Uh, the code in the Newton OS for handwriting recognition was called Rosetta. It seems somebody got their rumor mixed up.

[quote]
According to the Blades jackal-headed informants, the first candidate for Rosetta Stone is the next-generation PowerBook Apple is planning to release early in 2001; if current plans hold, the systems trackpad will accommodate pen input as well as the usual repertoire of five-finger exercises.
<hr></blockquote>

If this rumor is true, and on the off chance that anybody from Apple is reading this, I've got one thing to say-- PLEASE DEAR GOD DON'T DO THIS. You'll be copying the worst user interface element from the Palm-- the bastard user input pad on the bottom of the screen. The Newton got this one right-- a computer that can recognize hand writing should have a touch/pen sensitive screen. Please don't send pen input to the purgatory of a trackpad... Do it right!
post #242 of 490
_______________________
[quote]Originally posted by 4fx:
<strong>Speculating about a G5 is fun and all...
but people, take a chill pill!

Why do you all care so much?
If Dorsal M or any other is correct what difference does it make to you? Are you going to buy one BEFORE Steve anounces it? ...

What will happen, will happen.</strong><hr></blockquote>
________________________

Exactly. I think there are two things that those of us outside of 1 Infinity Loop can do to keep MWSF speculation in perspective:

1. Examine the economics of the various hardware scenarios floating out there. This might be harder to do now than in the past, because there are news stories about the Apollo G4 and the G5. A lot of the speculation on this board centers around the CPU options.

I have no real knowledge of Motorola's chip operations, but I think common sense forces everyone to ask how Moto could make money off the Apollo G4 from Apple if Apple chooses to jump immediately to the G5. Another question to ask, although seems to be in opposition to the first question, is: when would Apple sell a G5-based machine if not in January? Wouldn't selling them in the spring be a bit early, cutting into G4 sales?

2. Look at past hardware trends from Apple and Moto. Granted, the G4 Mhz fiasco skews things, but I have the hunch based on following Apple's hardware offerings for almost ten years that Macs will always be roughly equivalent to Wintel boxes in real world performance. Sometimes the balance tips in Apple's favor--witness the first days of the G4 when Apple claimed its boxes could perform tasks at 2z the speed of a Wintel box. Sometimes the balance tips in favor of Wintel.

I know we all want revolutionary performance, but CPU and hardware advances take time and cost a lot of money. I have high hopes for MWSF--esp. because the last tower offerings were well short of most folks' expectations--but my guess is that a true G5 in January is premature.

Perhaps Apple will prove me wrong and sell G4 LCD imacs as well G5 towers. I *would* like to see a tower that's powerful enough to run Windows XP via VPC 5 at better than acceptable speeds. As far as I an tell, emulation on the Mac is the ultimate need for speed, even though many of us would rather not admit it.

Hey, so we'll all cross our legs for a month or so and fidget like we did as kids on Christmas morning. But isn't this a lot more fun than the dark days of '97?

[ 12-19-2001: Message edited by: kcar27 ]</p>
post #243 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by Codename:
<strong>The filling shall reveal a crust made from the Rosetta Stone.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Okay... so we sure seem to be talking about a tablet type system... Dolphin a water resistant portable replacement (how better to make it water resistant than remove the keyboard) how do you remove the keyboard?!?! With the aid of Rosetta Stone, thats how.

Maybe all that talk pre-MWNY about tablets wasn't total nonsence after all. Apple just needed to get all of it's ducks in a row... OS X 10.1 being the 'major duck' and then add the finishing touches to rosetta stone... In that time LCD's have continued to drop in price ( a good thing for both Apple and US).

Dave
Apple Fanboy: Anyone who started liking Apple before I did!
Reply
Apple Fanboy: Anyone who started liking Apple before I did!
Reply
post #244 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by Codename:
<strong>The filling shall reveal a crust made from the Rosetta Stone.

[ 12-19-2001: Message edited by: Codename ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

Speaking of filling....I think I need to change my underwear.
:eek:

Good God, could this "dolphin" (i.e. portable) be a Tablet?!?!?

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that the "revolutionary, and totally different" consumer product from Apple will be a Tablet with handwriting recognition and running OS X (full not some light version).

They're not gonna ditch the Keyboard on the iMac. I sware if they do, I will eat my hat and send the iMovie to all of you

Oh man, a new portable with Newtonie goodness. Ahhhhh I'm getting my hopes up too high again, someone knock me down.
Be quiet, Brain, or I'll stab you with a Q-tip
Reply
Be quiet, Brain, or I'll stab you with a Q-tip
Reply
post #245 of 490
Right, the keyboard would be the first thing to go in order to make a computer water-resistant, but I can't imagine totally doing away with keyboard input. Makes more sense to detach the monitor and be able to roam around with that, with HWR.

Are my dreams about to be answered?

[Edit: 4 replies all at once, all saying the same thing. Convergence!!! ]

[ 12-19-2001: Message edited by: chromos ]</p>
post #246 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by chromos:
<strong>4 replies all at once, all saying the same thing. Convergence!!! </strong><hr></blockquote>

Yeppers! Come-on Stevie boy we are ready for it... Oh and here is something worth re-reading... Codename is this (see below) on the right track?

Found on dejanews and written by Shane Anderson ( I think)
------------
I have been sitting on a bunch of info for over a year now, and as bits and pieces of it have come to light over the last few months, I think it is time to tell you a little of what I know.

I will firstly state that this must be considered only a rumor. I have no pictures. Most of the info I have is publicly available, it just isn't strung together in any coherent way that paints the big picture. No NDAs have been broken in getting this information.

Again, treat as rumor, take it with a pinch of salt. If you go buy Apple shares because I what I am about to say, you're a bl**dy idiot.

Rumor sites, if you use this, ATTRIBUTE THE STORY!!!

Apple is readying a new product that will fill the empty square, and in some way will replace the Newton MessagePad.

What I "know" about the device so far:

It is very similar to the iBook, and I even thought it may have been what I had been waiting for, but not quite. It does not have a keyboard attached, but uses a stylus for 'pen computing' like Newton. I have heard nothing of there being a keyboard for it, but it does have a USB port so you could easily attach one.

It has two USB, one FireWire. As far as I can tell it has no modem. I thought this odd, but it does have a Ethernet port. The screen is exactly the same size as the new iBook, screen resolution 1024x768, and all.

I have no idea of the weight, but it will be tremendously light. Think less than 3 pounds without doubt, maybe closer to 2 pounds. The screens sensitivity is very cool. You can gently glide the pen over the screens surface and your cursor will move with it, but you will not generate a click until you press down with the pen. The dock animation works really well in this regard.

Yes, it runs MacOS X. No, it does not run Classic.

One of the best features of this new device, is the built in ability to screen share to another MacOS X Server or Client. When used in this regard, even over the built in AirPort, you can not tell that you are running anything remotely. In other words, screen-share a 733MHz G4, and it will suddenly feel like your tablet has a 733MHz G4 in it.

You are able to screen-share over the internet too, and even then, it is still incredibly fast. How do you connect to the net without a modem? Who knows... I'm just telling you to the best of my knowledge.

An AirPort Card is not needed, it is built in.

Hand writing recognition is indeed built in, but it seem that in marketing the product Apple will be telling no one about this feature. Again, I have NO idea why!

Battery life was at 8 hours, but the goal is 10.

Processor, I don't know. I can only presume it is a G3. My best guess here would be a G3 500Mhz that steps down to a much lower speed to conserve power when full speed is not required. The fact that know one knows the processor though, leads me to ponder if it runs on a G3 or G4 at all. I don't see any other chip being feasible though.

I don't know the thickness, but one of the prototypes was VERY thick, too thick to have been the serious end product thickness. I will guess again that it will be much less than 1 inch thick.

It has no media bays. Initial prototypes did not have a removable battery, but this has been changed for some reason.

BlueTooth, well, I just plain don't know about that either. I doubt it, but it would be nice.

A PC card slot. This is what told me that this was not the new iBook. A PC card slot is an absolute necessity for this product for connecting to wireless net ISP.

I have no idea about RAM or HD size. I will guess again and say it will have 128MB soldered to the board and one slot free like the iBook, with a 10G Drive.

Durability is a major deal here. Dropping the tablet will not cause much harm to the device unless the screen itself is impacted.

Yes people have seen this new device, and working, and the response has been flat out disbelief when shown the screen sharing.

Well there you go. I truly hope this product becomes reality.

Please don't go emailing me asking if it has xyz feature. If I didn't say here, then I honestly don't know. Sorry.

If you know something I don't, let me know.

Regards,

Shane Anderson The Mac EvangeList List Dad
------------

Dave
Apple Fanboy: Anyone who started liking Apple before I did!
Reply
Apple Fanboy: Anyone who started liking Apple before I did!
Reply
post #247 of 490
codename.... are we on the right track here???
post #248 of 490
I am totally hooked on this riddle game. i really don't care if its true.. but its something that will definitely get us through to Jan 7th and add a little excitement along the way...

About this whole dolphin thing... i have LONG wondered why the hell <a href="http://www.mammals.org" target="_blank">www.mammals.org</a> points to the apple webpage... we all know dolphins are mammals. could apple be maybe aiming at a type of evolution in computing spin on all of this?
<img src="confused.gif" border="0">
post #249 of 490
That domain name has been registered to Apple for almost as long as this Dolphin rumor has been posted at AI I believe.

_aarons
post #250 of 490
I heard that the reason that apple had registered mammals.org was due to a future advertising campaign in which apple would portray macs as mammals and PCs as dinosaurs - going extinct.

Along the lines of this tablet mac - why would it need a keyboard as we know it today? Couldn't the keyboard layout just be printed onto the tablet/trackpad so that you would type on the pad?

Please go easy if I am stating the obvious, this is my first post - long time reader though.

[ 12-19-2001: Message edited by: sockboy ]</p>
post #251 of 490
Hmmm, Codename started a thread back on 12/6 on "Wearable Computers" that is an intersting tie-in to the current disscussion:

A wearable tablet computer??? :eek:
"Mathematics is the language with which God has written the Universe" - Galileo Galilei
Reply
"Mathematics is the language with which God has written the Universe" - Galileo Galilei
Reply
post #252 of 490
[QUOTE]Originally posted by kcar27:
[QB]_______________________

1. Examine the economics of the various hardware scenarios floating out there.

2. Look at past hardware trends from Apple and Moto.

Okay, well... 1. economics: what to do with G4s if there are G5s? PowerBooks and consumer models. Simple. There are many more iMacs, iBooks, and PowerBooks then there are PowerMacs. The first G5s will not be able to go into portables. The Apollo G4 should be workable for the PowerBook.

This transfer won't be glitch free, nor 100% profitable for Moto, but Apple has thrown many threats their way lately and they're still Moto's biggest customer for PowerPCs.

Also note that this is aided by Cisco using G4s in more networking products.

Also also note that the G5 will be expensive; G4s will become cheaper but will be sold in much higher numbers.

What happens to the G3? It is abandoned by Apple but still thrives in the embedded/network devices market.

2. Trends. The trend is leapfrog Intel substantially then drag around for 2-4 years. The G5 will do this again (whenever it comes out); hopefully, it will stay ahead. Another trend, PowerPCs and chip architectures are usually well known ahead of time, but the G4 PowerMac was still a huge shocker; it was announced but it was also kept under wraps. The only question is: is Apple important enough to Moto that they could actually keep the whole thing a secret from the semicon industry (which actually REQUIRES open product introductions and road maps)? Probably not, but who knows?

[ 12-19-2001: Message edited by: danaus plexippus ]</p>
"If you lived in any other country, you'd have died of starvation already." -Frank "Grimey" Grimes
Reply
"If you lived in any other country, you'd have died of starvation already." -Frank "Grimey" Grimes
Reply
post #253 of 490
Ooh ooh ooh, now I am getting excited...

LCD iMac...a given
1G+ G4's...a given

Oh and one more thing...a portable, ruggedised, touchscreen 1024/768 iPad, with handwriting recognition and networkable Quartz layer.

This would blow Bill Gates' mind; the PC Pad platform thing will look overweight and overpriced. Please let this be true!

His Steveness has confirmed (CNET) that a 'revolutionary consumer device' will be released MWSF

I'm too old for this amount of fun.
post #254 of 490
By the way Dorsal M's first post in this thread is starting to look mighty reasonable.
post #255 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by DaveGee:
<strong>

Yeppers! Come-on Stevie boy we are ready for it... Oh and here is something worth re-reading... Codename is this (see below) on the right track?

Dave</strong><hr></blockquote>

For anybody who's been wondering about the compromises in the interface which took place in OSX vs OS9 ... and what's up (with the) dock? This remote tablet rumor explains them.

The dock is ok on a desktop computer (though truth be told, my right hand to this day still goes to the upper right to switch between applications) - yet it always seems to be trying to do too much - it's a compromise, which combines many features of OS9 interface, and does none of them as well, but many of them ok.

But of course, if you're using a pen based interface, well - that's exactly what you need, since poking at large icon thingies at the bottom of the screen is industry standard on such things.

As for the rest of the article; sure it all makes sense, if you want remote access to your home computer so you can run your apps remotely (very much like Citrix Mainframe in the Windows world) you don't want to have to switch between a Pen based world on the road, and then completely change your method of working just to operate your home computer. Thus the compromise ... MacOSX was designed as much as possible to be navigated by a stylus as a mouse, local and remote, with one standard interface. Which explains the larger icons, the dock etc.

As for remote working (ie, actually running an app remotely, yet having it's interface show up real time on your remote machine, in such a manner that it appears the app is actually running on your box): anybody who's a NeXTie will tell you they were doing this kind of thing back in the early 90's ... it's was long ago built into the NeXT frameworks. I've not explored this aspect myself - but the NeXTies I know rave about it. It seems to be a large part of how they made their money.

And it just goes on from there.

Since the Cocoa frameworks in Obj-C are so highly objectified, sending lightweight interface messages back and forth between host and client machine should be a piece of cake (if it's anything like the NeXT way of doing things). Add to this the multitasking abilities of OSX for multiple sessions, the security features between users (two people could use the same powerful home machine at the same time. On person sitting in front of it, seeing his desktop and running his apps ... and one across the continent, logging in ... and running his apps and seeing his desktop) and you have a revolutionary combination, sure.

To be frank, I've been expecting something like this since early 2000 - I suppose Steve & Co wanted to wait until they could do it in a ubiquitous fashion, so that such a device would be a $1000 add on that all Mac users HAD to have, rather than be considered an over-priced Newton on steroids that only guys with a small pee-pee bought to impress.

Anyway, if we don't get a G5 - this will almost make up for it.
In life, as in chess, the moves that hurt the most, are the ones you didn't see ...
Reply
In life, as in chess, the moves that hurt the most, are the ones you didn't see ...
Reply
post #256 of 490
[quote]
On person sitting in front of it, seeing his desktop and running his apps ... and one across the continent, logging in ... and running his apps and seeing his desktop) and you have a revolutionary combination, sure.
<hr></blockquote>

It's called XWindows - and it works on MacOSX.

Not that I wouldn't like to see Cocoa apps be able to do this too, but hey, just pointing out that this already exists.
post #257 of 490
1. <a href="http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/features/2000/nov00/11-13tabletpc.asp" target="_blank">MS</a>

2. <a href="http://www.cesweb.org/conferences/keynotes.asp?menuItem=1&subMenuItem=1&tabName=Atte ndee" target="_blank">Gates</a>

3. <a href="http://maccentral.macworld.com/news/0112/12.keynote.php" target="_blank">Jobs</a>

"A rumor is not a rumor that doesn't die"

[ 12-19-2001: Message edited by: woudstock ]</p>
post #258 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by woudstock:
<strong>1. <a href="http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/features/2000/nov00/11-13tabletpc.asp" target="_blank">MS</a>

2. <a href="http://www.cesweb.org/conferences/keynotes.asp?menuItem=1&subMenuItem=1&tabName=Atte ndee" target="_blank">Gates</a>

3. <a href="http://maccentral.macworld.com/news/0112/12.keynote.php" target="_blank">Jobs</a></strong><hr></blockquote>


That is the most interesting article I've ever not read


Cool stuff tho, brings back the rumors from last summer about the new iMac being a headless mac where the monitor was a remvable wireless tablet type device.
All Your PCs Are Belong To Trash
Reply
All Your PCs Are Belong To Trash
Reply
post #259 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by zaustin:
<strong>

It's called XWindows - and it works on MacOSX.

Not that I wouldn't like to see Cocoa apps be able to do this too, but hey, just pointing out that this already exists.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I'm glad somebody brought this up:

First, where's the productivity apps in XWindows, next - where's the standardized interface designed for both pen and mouse computer and, even more importantly - a large set of productivity apps that adhere to that interface. Can you do basic productivity things with those apps in those environments, like, can you cut and paste between them without blowing everything up.

But it goes even further than that.

Where's the heavily objectified framework for display technology - nothing has anything like cocoa ...

But of course, let's forget about just the software angle ... where's the form factor gods? Who else out there is going to put together the necessary wireless technology, pen tech, and the G3 with a real killer os like Apple?

It hasn't happened before - there's been some rought attempts at this kind of thing - just like there were ruff attempts at a GUI in the PC world back around '90 ... but nothing to put all the pieces to Music.

And, if Gigawire is the rockin' wireless technology ...

whooooo moma.
In life, as in chess, the moves that hurt the most, are the ones you didn't see ...
Reply
In life, as in chess, the moves that hurt the most, are the ones you didn't see ...
Reply
post #260 of 490
It's simple Apple is going after the medical market again, the newton was huge in medical. It will be a dockable tablet mac that can be propted up and dock to become a imac of some sort. It will have build in wire less. <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
post #261 of 490
I've run accross the screen sharing rumor several times before. Could this have something to do with Gigawire? Sharing all types of data, very quickly, across various pathways (wireless, internet, etc. as described in the trademark application) because it really is just the screen display that is being shared. Everything is really happening on the host computer or server. If real, this and MPEG4 could really revolutionize internet video distribtution.
When they said "Think Different", I ran with it.
Reply
When they said "Think Different", I ran with it.
Reply
post #262 of 490
Codename,

Question for you...

When you said 'great desert' you were indeed speaking of Sahara, correct? BUT the Sahara you were speaking about ISN'T a reference to the new IBM G3 chip was it?

Am I getting close?

Dave
Apple Fanboy: Anyone who started liking Apple before I did!
Reply
Apple Fanboy: Anyone who started liking Apple before I did!
Reply
post #263 of 490
woudstock posted: [quote]1. MS

2. Gates

3. Jobs

"A rumor is not a rumor that doesn't die"<hr></blockquote>

Apologies if I'm slow on the uptake here, but is the implication that Jobs moved the keynote a day earlier to announce Apple's tablet hours before Gates announces Microsoft's at CES?

[ 12-20-2001: Message edited by: scottiB ]</p>
post #264 of 490
The more I think about it, the more iPad (with its mythical screen sharing technology ) seems to be the perfect way to crystallize the Digital Hub idea.

[ 12-20-2001: Message edited by: murk ]</p>
When they said "Think Different", I ran with it.
Reply
When they said "Think Different", I ran with it.
Reply
post #265 of 490
ok - get this... ipad = imac. Imac is docked ipad: you get the idea. Jobs demos this dope imac, shows osx... bla bla bla, some new stuff. then stands up and snatches the LCD off the table while still running/playing toy story 8/ showing quake 10... not likely... but would be cool.


Also, side note... good Apple provided remote display of OSX apps would go a LONG way towards making OSX more legit in UNIX circles...
i freebase user interface
Reply
i freebase user interface
Reply
post #266 of 490
New Lurker here.
I stumbled upon this forum by accident, but now can't unglue my eyes, funny stuff. This forum and AtAT's sarcastic parodies make daily reading enjoyable. Makes me anxious, can't wait to get my first Mac.

Toraq
'If these words were people, I would embrace their genocide.' - Maddox
Reply
'If these words were people, I would embrace their genocide.' - Maddox
Reply
post #267 of 490
Toraq,

You're hooked, buddy. At first it might seem like fun, but soon you'll be finding yourself more and more anxious as each MacWorld approaches. For some strange reason, you'll want someone to lie to you about what Steve will unveil. Oh, well, I suppose there are worse drugs.

[ 12-20-2001: Message edited by: murk ]</p>
When they said "Think Different", I ran with it.
Reply
When they said "Think Different", I ran with it.
Reply
post #268 of 490
Maybe the special offer regarding the apple LCD Displays doesn't mean that new sizes will be introduced, but new types of displays capable to do what have been discribed above will be launched...Why the Imac would be the only machine to be able to use this new technology?
I believe that if this kind of tablet is introduced at the expo it would be available for both Imac ans PowerMac.
And by the way the new airport technology have been introduced just few weeks ago...
Just my two cents..
post #269 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by Toraq_Quell RIP:
<strong>New Lurker here.
I stumbled upon this forum by accident, but now can't unglue my eyes, funny stuff. This forum and AtAT's sarcastic parodies make daily reading enjoyable. Makes me anxious, can't wait to get my first Mac.

Toraq </strong><hr></blockquote>

Ditto. I've been lurking for a bit as well. This forum is way entertaining. Thanks.
post #270 of 490
what would be the possibility of having a tablet like imac that has some of the basic features of the computer (CD drive, firewire ports, usb ports, ethernet, etc...) built into a small cube like enclosure. You wouldn't need to fit everything into the tablet... just the basic things to make it run (hard drive, video card, ram... blah blah blah....) the rest of the stuff could be enclosed in a small cube. When the tablet was "docked" it could use all these things seemlessly... but then you could grab the tablet... sit on the couch and surf....

I'm still trying to figure out codenames "return of the trinity"

And yes,,, I'm addicted to this thread as well... not the others... just this one.... it's those freakin' riddles that get me!!!
post #271 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by mackie9:
<strong>I'm still trying to figure out codenames "return of the trinity"</strong><hr></blockquote>I'm reluctant to even say this, but perhaps trinity refers to Kormac's "DNA."

Ah, hell, it's just gonna be a damn iMac.
post #272 of 490
To hell with any other threads or sites... I'm leaving my browser on this one for a while and refreshing.
Thanks to Dorsal and Codename(and everybody else) for making a real fun thread.
I've got 400 in savings so far, a week of PTO to cash out and my upcoming tax return to put towards a new duallie/tablet system next year.
Bring on the new toys, Steve. I'm ready.

Zack
I build things, I break things, I catch things on fire. I love my job.
Reply
I build things, I break things, I catch things on fire. I love my job.
Reply
post #273 of 490
funny zac.... that's what I've been doing all morning... refreshing and waiting for another comment from codename or dorsal....

I need a life.
post #274 of 490
<a href="http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2607921,00.html" target="_blank">Still relevant.</a>



post #275 of 490
I'm going to do a mockup for everyone this afternoon unless somebody else gets to it first - should be relatively easy....

Imagine the new iMac as the Cube, but with a screen attached via an arm off one side...talk about a small footprint (screen doesn't need to touch the desk).

Also, in response to previous posts, I don't believe that the new iMac will feature iPad functionality in its screen out-of-the box. The touch capabilities would probably add just a bit too much to the overall cost of a consumer machine at this juncture, and general marketing theory seems to go against it. If the iPad is for those who already have a Mac, it's a way for Apple to drive revenue from those who don't want to buy a new machine (or just have), as well as appeal to all its customers (not just limit the technology to those who buy the iMac). Besides, one post identifies Dolphin as having a 12.1" screen - the new iMac is 15" or so...so I doubt we'll see Steve ripping the screen of an iMac and walking it around the stage.

Any thoughts?

-S
post #276 of 490
Thread Starter 
Here are some more details on G5 based Mac's. The G5 does not use the MPX protocol to communicate with onboard devices but a never before used protocol called RapidIO. RapidIO is very similar to a highspeed serial bus like Firewire, but works at higher speed because it is a bus strictly for PCB (the actual motherboard). Included on die is a 333MHz 64bit memory controller for DDR-SDRAM. But the controller is flexible. It is unknown what speed the controller will run the memory in Apple machines. The 512KB L2 cache has a 256bit interface with the core that is 8-way set associate. The L3 cache interface can address up to 8MB or 16MB, I don't fully understand the docs I got on them. But it is 2 way set associative. I have little information on motherboard specifics. I also have little information on PCI specifics and this is where most of my job concentrates on. Seems very little hardware testing has been done outside Apple labs and what has is very secretive. I can only assume that the PCI bridge is not that different than past PowerMacs and therefore did not warrent excessive testing. I hope this is the case.
post #277 of 490
Another clue to a possible tablet Mac can be found in Carbon. After v1.4 Apple added a whole load of remote control functions that simulate various hardware events in software.

Currently you can simulate keystrokes (all of them), mice and scrollwheels.

Such things would make a keyboardless Mac possible, even without handwriting recognition.

Cool
James Savage - "You can take my Mac when you pry it from my cold dead fingers"

http://www.blackcat-software.com/
Reply
James Savage - "You can take my Mac when you pry it from my cold dead fingers"

http://www.blackcat-software.com/
Reply
post #278 of 490
:eek:
Dorsal do you have any idea when the G5 will be ready??
Is January a possible release date???
post #279 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by OverToasty:
<strong>

I'm glad somebody brought this up:

First, where's the productivity apps in XWindows, next - where's the standardized interface designed for both pen and mouse computer and, even more importantly - a large set of productivity apps that adhere to that interface. Can you do basic productivity things with those apps in those environments, like, can you cut and paste between them without blowing everything up.

&lt;stuff deleted&gt;
</strong><hr></blockquote>

I was thinking about apps in a HWR environment... of course you don't want to have to work with apps if a stylus is all you have and the app requires heavy keyboard input. For example, I wouldn't want to write in Word, or type in Terminal. So I was making a list of common apps where it would be possible to use only a stylus:

web browsing —&gt; doable to easy
email —&gt; easy for reading, doable for composing short msgs
word processing —&gt; yuk
spreadsheet —&gt; yuk
iTunes —&gt; easy
QuickTime Player —&gt; easy
iMovie —&gt; doable
Finder browsing —&gt; easy, esp. column view
rumored 'iPhoto' —&gt; easy

general pros: OS X scalable icons and big widgets
general cons: any fcn requiring modifier keys (although Newton had some niceties like 1-1/2 taps + drag was like an option-drag; so perhaps click-and-hold could bring up contextual menus, like FinderPop did)

Anyone care to add/edit?

[Edit: Blackcat just posted in the interim about Carbon... cool news.]

[ 12-20-2001: Message edited by: chromos ]</p>
post #280 of 490
[quote]Originally posted by Dorsal M:
<strong>Here are some more details on G5 based Mac's. The G5 does not use the MPX protocol to communicate with onboard devices but a never before used protocol called RapidIO. RapidIO is very similar to a highspeed serial bus like Firewire, but works at higher speed because it is a bus strictly for PCB (the actual motherboard). Included on die is a 333MHz 64bit memory controller for DDR-SDRAM. But the controller is flexible. It is unknown what speed the controller will run the memory in Apple machines. The 512KB L2 cache has a 256bit interface with the core that is 8-way set associate. The L3 cache interface can address up to 8MB or 16MB, I don't fully understand the docs I got on them. But it is 2 way set associative. I have little information on motherboard specifics. I also have little information on PCI specifics and this is where most of my job concentrates on. Seems very little hardware testing has been done outside Apple labs and what has is very secretive. I can only assume that the PCI bridge is not that different than past PowerMacs and therefore did not warrent excessive testing. I hope this is the case.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I'm a wee bit uncertain about this L3 cache thing. If the main memory is DDR333 with an onboard controller (presumably with very low latency unless someone's screwed up again), what is attached to the L3 port? It's latency isn't going to be that much less than main memory and to get to decently higher than main memory bandwidth it would have to be 128 bits wide, requiring a very large number of pins and a lot of power to drive it. Also the doubling of L2 reduces the need for L3 and it might be faster to simply avoid the complexity of the third level controller altogether.
On current G4s the appalling memory bandwidth and latency mean an off-chip L3 is very useful, on these proposed G5 based machines it looks a bit like an unnecessary luxury.
Any info on the units in the core? or I suppose that would be too much to ask for.

Michael
Sintoo, agora non podo falar.
Reply
Sintoo, agora non podo falar.
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Future Apple Hardware
AppleInsider › Forums › Mac Hardware › Future Apple Hardware › G5 - The truth