Sci-Fi GeekOut This Friday Night (USA) - Page 4

Patience, sir. Patience. Try my Lost wiki.

And in terms of criticism: I would argue that of the two, BSG is the sprawling, plotless monstrosity.

I do not feel about Lost the way I felt about Twin Peaksthat they were writing by the seats of their pants. Give it time.

Did you see anyone get raped? Or did they just say they raped her? Is the blonde Cylon acting that way because she was raped or because she's acting like she was raped? They beat up that Sharon back on Caprica to sell it to Helo.

I hate comments like this. Of course it has a plot. Humans are attacked by the machines they created. In order to save humanity they have to find earth.

I will make what seems to be a minor quibble: finding Earth seems to be an afterthought at this point. The main plot, thus far, as been this: HOLY SHIT WE'RE BEING ATTACKED. It was not until very late in the first season that we saw any serious attempt to deal with the "find Earth" side of things. And even the second season dealt with that sporadically. And now? What are we discussing? Some other plotline.

That, as EM Forester would attest, is a story, not a plot. The essential weakness of BSG is that it is episodicthere is barely enough to string us along from episode to episode.

Don't get me wrong. I'm enjoying BSG. But I'm only enjoying it because I've been willing to give it the benefit of the doubt. If they don't begin to build in some serious, serious arcs, I'm going to lose interest something fast.

And in the Miniseries, someone (Baltar?) left a note in Adama's cabin saying that also.

Sorry couldn't disagree more!

Why do you think they do the " Previously on Battlestar Galactica " at the beginning?

BSG is about what happens when you create something that becomes self aware like the Cylons.

Now the Humans are treating that creation in ways that if it were them they would call it shameful and barbaric. So who's the bad guy here the Cylons or the Humans?

If you had listened to what the show's creator Ron Moore has been saying you'd be seeing the Cylons in a different light this season.

This show is epic from it's good writing, great acting, ( the last 5 min of " Pegasus " was the most riveting I've seen in TV for a long time ) to it's great FX and music. And it is leading somewhere ( " And they have a plan " ). Think about it. B5 a show known for it's long arcs wasn't really clear about where it was going until the end of the second year.

PS. I just love Edward James Olmos's acting! At the end of " Pegasus " the show down between him and Michelle Forbes was edge of your seat stuff! He tends to be able to show lot's of emotion without pulling a Shatner and chewing up the scenery. As he was walking down the hall after hearing the court martial was over he just had that " Don't frack with Adamma " look.

Damn them for making us wait until January!

I have no idea how you get tyhat any of those could be arcs. Here's some stuff for you:

1) People stranded on islands has been a common theme in philosophy and literature throughout the eighteenth century, and is generally used as a means of exploring both individual consciousness (Robinson Crusoe) and politics (Lord of the Flies) and, in general, the question of the nature of man. The show is very conscious of this, of course.

2) The show is consistently preoccupied with relations between fathers and children. We are not yet sure why this the case.

3) There are also clear concerns with fate/destiny (none of the pens Claire tries to sign the adoption papers with will work; all the various characters encountering one another. We are not yet sure why this is going on, but the show seems to be making an argument that, for some reason, this particular group of people are fated to be together.

4) Names often associate characters with philosophies: John Locke, Christian Shepherd, Rousseau, and now Desmond (of the world).

I won't even get into the various questions: what are the numbers and what do they do? Is Walt special? How is Locke healed? What is the hatch for? And on and on.


It is exploring a great deal at once, and when questions are answered by giving us more questions. So we find out what's in the hatch, only to get several more questions: what is quarantine written on the hatch? What is Desmond doing down there? What does Desmond inject himself with? How to the numbers figure into that countdown?


Only recaps the events in each episode? Did you not look at the themes section? the timeline? the thoughts and theories? unclassified bits? questions?

Because it's episodic? Just like every other drama on TV?


Are you sure? Maybe it's about whether or not civilization can be maintained in a culture that is homeless? Or maybe it's about whether or not a creator has an obligation to his creation (a la Frankenstein)? Or maybe it's about terrorism and paranoia? Or maybe it's about the dangers of technology? Or maybe it's about religionpolytheism (humans) vs monotheism (cylons)?


Indeed. That is one of the central questions that's emerged in the finale.


Different than what?


I really hate the way that the term "epic" gets used loosely, but you are correct. This is a show that is, indeed, epic. It is a tale of gods and monsters and an attempted journey home by a band of heroes.


No one is saying that it's a bad show. I'm just saying that it really seems to be a kind of plotless monstrosity. We'll see what happens. We have had a few story-arcsStarbuck going after the arrow of Apollo, Hilo and Sharon, the breakup of the fleetbut the connective tissue? Seems to be "holy shit they're attacking us!"


Look, I believe that the show is going somewhere. I just think that right now, it's a plotless monstrosity. And also, please note that you have made two arguments here: 1) the show is not a plotless monstrosity and it has clear arcs and trajectories, and 2) the arcs and trajectories are unclear and may not emerge until the end of the 2nd year, like B5 (which I never watched).


Olmos is fantastic, yes. But please understand that whether or not someone is a good actor has no bearing whatsoever on whether or not the show has a plot.

Cheers

That is what I am thinking, but it will be interesting to see how the writers are going to get the crew of the Pegasus onto the Galactica. The original series had the Pegasus take on the two base stars while its Vipers were defending the Galactica so it was a no-brainer that they would join the fleet, but the writers are not going to that route. Maybe the unknown ship will not get detroyed, but it will destroy the Pegasus. Remember, Starbuck took the black bird to do her own photo recon and if the unknown ship gets away there will be time to destroy it later after studying the photographs. When the Colonial fleet does destroy the ship then it will unite the two crews into one. Hopefully, they have both battlestars go in together so we can see how the Colonial fleets rolls.

I was in Best Buy and I had season one, with the mini series, in my hand and a Best Buy employee said there is a UK version with more stuff on it. Does anyone have the UK version of season one that can tell me what the extra stuff is?

TPTB of TP had it working fine until they gave us who killed Laura Palmer. After that, it became messy, but there was an underlying notion that Evil did, and it had come to roost in Twin Peaks (I won't give any info away to those who haven't received the DVDs queued at NetFlix, and it you don't; you should). And, there is nothing wrong with flying by one's pants--especially since TP was very avant garde for its time (1990 or so). It also showed some of the most visceral and shocking scenes (without resorting to actually showing them) that I've seen until Millenium.

It was a fountainhead for The X-Files, Millenium, American Gothic, Lost, and Desperate Housewives. I'm not writing that you don't think it's good; it's that your comment reflects what a lot of critics have said about TP because it's been associated as a precursor to Lost in a few articles. Some forget how seminal the show was at the time (especially in soundtrack, cinematography, and saddle shoes) and that it was a certain phenomenon (and marketed as such--I have the audio cassette of Dale Cooper's messages to Diane).

Regarding Lost, I am a huge fan, and I've been loving it since its kick-ass pilot: one of the most tremendous first fifteen minutes in TV history. I have, really, no issues with the show, and I've been happily enjoying the ride. I suppose I do have patience, but I also trust TPTB in running the show. They've provided clues to those that notice. The flashbacks provide character info and motivations, clues to the island (or certain circumstances in the current timeline), or both. I can see why some characters are tied to the island (Locke, Hurley), others that might (Walt, Claire, Jack), and others might not be (Kate, Charley, Sun and Jin, Boone and Shannon, Sayid) but were on the wrong flight at the right time--as far as we know, currently.

I really don't care what the monster, hatch, Others, Black Rock are right now, but I will when the narrative tells me I should. While I enjoy spoilers, I don't like reading ahead. Lost is doing fine; I hope ADD-America allows it to blossom at its own pace.

I agree with this, but I don't believe it makes BSG a "plotless monstrosity." The Cylon menace is the driving plot-theme (what is their plan?)--not finding Earth. Earth is the McGuffin. The same with Lost: its McGuffin is "Holy shit! We need to get off this island!" It's plot-theme is what the heck is the island all about? What is its plan?

The shows are quite similar:

• After a cataclysm, survivors find themselves away from home and civilization.
• A pair of leaders emerges (one of each pair reluctantly). Each in the pair has different philosophies, and one betrays the other.
• To keep the McGuffins fresh, each show has characters that leave the group and strive to achieve them.
• Each antagonist (the Cylons and the Island), cause characters to see things which other characters can't.
• Though originally established that each group is all that there is, new characters are introduced (Pegasus; The Others)
• A misty menace is lurking: Boomer's baby; the disease on the Island
• Character(s) that were thought lost (will) return to the group

Obviously, I'm being a bit general; these are rather conventional narrative set-ups in having the fun of watching the characters deal with this stuff.

Of the two, Lost has a longer shelf-life: the island, ironically, is larger than space to introduce new characters/ideas/tribulations. Eventually, as the Lost-a-ways finally leave island in 5 seasons, Galactaca and the rag-tag fleet will need to find Earth in 4. After which, Fonzie--start your engine.

(and perhaps X-Files or Millennium is the better comparison, since both of those left me feeling as if I'd been dutifully trying to piece things together only to find that the creators didn't seem to be sure where they were headed. My particular beef with TP is simply that I don't trust, nor do I particularly care for, David Lynch (with the exception of The Straight Story or whatever it was called...about the lawnmowers).


Well, I think there are enough of us who want a well-written drama to fill the enormous vacuum left by Sorkin's departure on The West Wing and the end of Buffy and Angel (which I liked less) to hopefully displace the mouth-breathers who demand more and more shows about cruelty. Er, I mean reality TV shows.


Don't get me wrong. It's not that I don't think there are questions driving the thing. It's just that those questions don't seem to drive the plot. I'm hopeful that the appearance of the Pegasus will change things, if only by trying to push them to answer the questions you list rather than just run like hell.

And I agree with you completely about the island on Lost. The brilliance of the thing, displayed in the Hurley episode, is that the show even points out the various McGuffinsHurley rants about why no one seems to ask the obvious questions or try to look for the obvious things one would look for.


Agreed completely.

OK, maybe it is not Friday, but I just found out 3 stations have picked up Farscape and FOX is playing Stargate Atlantis. It is nice to see more Sci-fi on OTA broadcasts. (Even if it is old.)

It's pretty clear after the last few episodes that one of the main points is about the Cylons and how they've been treated.

They do the " previously on BSG " because one episode leads to another and are part of a larger arc.

The Cylons are in a more sympathetic light this season because of what's going on.


Sorry you never watched B5 because it's considered the king of plot driven, large story arc, SciFi tv shows and it started just like this with all the plot points being set up. Just like any good novel.

Stargate SG1 started out on Fox. If I remember. One of the networks.

I think that there's a DVD purchase in my future. Join the Demographic!

V/R,
Aries 1B

Midwinter, your LOST wiki is a spectacular labor of love. My complements. The fact that LOST takes place in a contemporary (assumed) setting gives the writers plenty of opportunity to tie in characters (in particular) to Classic literature and history in clever ways. BSG has neatly (I think) tied in some Greek mythology to its plotline/background.

However, come on midwinter, the survivors as portrayed on LOST are STUPID. Frakken cripes, lets go take a stroll through the jungle that Lostzilla uses to mark its territory What an island full of dopes and crybabies. Yes, I realize that in itself is a plot device but sheesh

Man, I really, really wanted to like LOST.

Now, some of your criticism aimed at BSG is valid. I agree with a lot of it. It is somewhat episodic although I disagree with you as to the extent. So be it. Both shows share some underlying survival concepts interestingly enough. I just prefer BSGs way of doing it. BSG can very easily slip into full blown solve the problem in one hour TV fair. I have faith all involved will keep it high quality throughout its run.

Just as an aside, I would like to see a scifi show just once show people floating about the ship if it was damaged. Imagine being in a space battle and your enemy manages to knock out your gravity units! Now that would suck I think the ONLY time I have ever seen that was in one of the Star Trek movies. Most of which by the way (sorry suni) I felt stunk. The exceptions being First Contact and The Wrath Of Khan. Just my humble opinion.

That's cool. For some reason I hold TP dear--like an ex-girlfriend that's a glorious train wreck. Of Lynch I have a love/indifference. I've enjoyed all of his movies, but I don't own them, nor do I feel like watching them again (except Dune and The Elephant Man if they're on cable).

To stray a bit OT: Millenium was a show that Fox rewarded Carter, and the network didn't know what to do with. It's first season was so incredibly dark that it (ahem) alienated (and creeped out) some die-hard X-F heads (my wife included). I adored the first season and am shocked that some of the eps passed Standards and Practices. It makes the current Night Stalker seem utterly white bread. Its second season, with Morgan and Wong running the show, got re-directed away from satanic psycho of the week, and the third seemed just a bone thrown to Carter so it could be run in syndication. The first season Lucy Butler eps are my favorite.

A bit closer to topic: Mentioning Morgan and Wong, as was posted up-thread, Space: Above and Beyond is coming on DVD, but it is available now as a Best Buy exclusive. I've been watching a couple episodes each Friday in between Firefly on Sci-Fi and BSG. While the effect of 9/11 has become too much marketspeak as explanation for darker creative efforts, it really does apply in watching S:AaA and BSG back-to-back. It is an interesting juxtaposition.

I really like S:AaA and its gung-ho Semper Fi themes. Its theme music is wonderful (and so different from BSG's). It is quite good and stands the test of time (hard to believe it's 10 years old). I watched the final episode last Friday and am sorry it ended. Morgan and Wong's credit at the end says "AMF" (Adios, motherf*ckers) to Fox for axing the show. It was, though, the most expensive show produced up to that time.

Also I'm really digging Firefly. I hope Serenity is still in theaters when Sci-Fi finishes the 13 episode run in a couple weeks.

Danke. Feel free to spread the word.


Actually, there's an episode where Hurley makes exactly the same complaints you do. In other words, the show is aware of what you perceive to be a weakness.

I think I saw SA in HD briefly flicking throught the channels the other day. I'm not a SA fan (I liked the movie SG, but couldn't stand the acting in the SG series), so I didn't pay much attention other than to notice that it was on channel 702 (FOX HD) and not on the SciFI channel.

SciFi channel and commedy central, are both very much analog regular old TV. The Daily show on CC is particularly pixilated and even the audio distorts using my comcast/motorola DVR box (which decodes HD beautifully but sucks for analog). I wish I could watch BSG in HD, oh that would be most wonderful.

I watched Invasion and Night Stalker last week. Invasion was creepy and looked promising, Night Stalker was more so-so, but I'll give it another try this week.

Anybody else?

I am wondering if the UK version has more extra features or if the episodes themselves are longer. I am not worried about getting more extras, but I would like to have longer episodes (extended/additional scenes) because the extra footage can change the feel of the episodes.

And The Undiscovered Country where the Klingon Chancellor's ship loses gravity...

And kids as far as BSG goes well we all know the good stuff ( in any tv series ) doesn't start until the 3rd season!

Speaking of season three, I saw on TV last night that this Friday we can see an all new Battlestar Galactica episode. The SciFi website has a game you can play, but it doesn't have Safari listed as one of the required browsers which might explain why both levels kept spinning making it impossible to play the game.

In case anyone's keeping track, I'm still ticked off with all of you.

We in Canada still have a couple weeks before BSG Season Two gets underway.

I just got done watching Battlestar Galactica and it looks like this season is going to be a violent one. The Cylons are going to stop their missions and watch the humans go at each other.

Wow! Great Battlestar episode!
Really looking forward to next week!

wow... that was so good, I think I'll watch it again.

No kidding, BSG was smoking! Cmdr. Cain sounds like she became completely unhinged after the initial Cylon attack. From the stories being laid out this episode it sounds like a mutiny could occur on the Pegasus.

Anyone watch either of the Stargate episodes? Found it amusing to watch everyone acting junk-sick on the Atlantis episode. I like the idea of the wraith enemy, but I wish they'd lose the female commander at Atlantis.