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R.I.P. - New Orleans, August 29, 2005?? - Page 4  

post #121 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by Smircle
Sure, but this is hardly an excuse that rescue operations are going very very slow. Especially that FEMA has learned about the 20K people at the convention center three days late is a very bad sign. This is something that could have been avoided. IMHO.

I think that was a misstatement. I haven't read the account but I am sure they were talking about the additional people.
post #122 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by NaplesX
I think that was a misstatement. I haven't read the account but I am sure they were talking about the additional people.

Nope. I saw the interview with Mike Brown myself, live on CNN. Soledad O'Brian was incredulous.... she literally couldn't believe he was saying what he was saying.

Always sure, but often wrong, huh?
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post #123 of 269
i hate to say it, but every statement fromt he fema director (and i have had PLENTY of time to listen to him), has been ignorant. i am encouraged that i am finally hear some words of disappointment even from w as to how this situation has been handled. i am amazed that he will walk new orleans today, but now that they finally have the troops in there, it's probably more feasible.

personally, i am about ready to kick off the tv for a few days to clear my head, but i keep hoping for more news from north of the lake and mississippi.
When you're lovers in a dangerous time,
You're made to feel as if your love's a crime.
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
Gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight.

-...
When you're lovers in a dangerous time,
You're made to feel as if your love's a crime.
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
Gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight.

-...
post #124 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by rok
i hate to say it, but every statement fromt he fema director (and i have had PLENTY of time to listen to him), has been ignorant.

He's also a fucking liar. Plenty of food and armed guards? Give me a break.
post #125 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by FormerLurker
Nope. I saw the interview with Mike Brown myself, live on CNN. Soledad O'Brian was incredulous.... she literally couldn't believe he was saying what he was saying.

I saw that interview to. She was totally taken aback and asked him if he was serious.
post #126 of 269
post #127 of 269
4 days later?
VOTE OUT ALL INCUMBENTS! Its the only way we can clean up Congress.
VOTE OUT ALL INCUMBENTS! Its the only way we can clean up Congress.
post #128 of 269
Let's assume, for a moment, that people didn't *start* gathering at the convention center until late Tuesday, after the levees had finally broken and people were forced away from their homes.

Then, let's assume that *FEMA* didn't find out about those at the convention center until Wednesday or Thursday. We're not talking about city or state officials, but FEMA.

Let's also assume that those in charge also understand that you have to bring in an all or nothing effort: In other words, you can't bring in enough buses to take away only half of those at the convention center because the riots and violence would be ridiculous.

48 hours to be able to say "Here's your food. Here's your water. Here's your bus. Let's go," ain't too bad.
Living life in glorious 4G HD (with a 2GB data cap).
Living life in glorious 4G HD (with a 2GB data cap).
post #129 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by CosmoNut
Let's assume, for a moment, that people didn't *start* gathering at the convention center until late Tuesday, after the levees had finally broken and people were forced away from their homes.

Then, let's assume that *FEMA* didn't find out about those at the convention center until Wednesday or Thursday. We're not talking about city or state officials, but FEMA.

Let's also assume that those in charge also understand that you have to bring in an all or nothing effort: In other words, you can't bring in enough buses to take away only half of those at the convention center because the riots and violence would be ridiculous.

48 hours to be able to say "Here's your food. Here's your water. Here's your bus. Let's go," ain't too bad.

This is from tuesday.

They were fully aware of the seriousness at that time. It might have gotten worse since but already at that time they knew they had to put the rescue mission into full warp speed.
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
post #130 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by Anders
This is from tuesday.

They were fully aware of the seriousness at that time. It might have gotten worse since but already at that time they knew they had to put the rescue mission into full warp speed.

Not only that, but in the preceding days, they had predicted it would be worse than it turned out to be. In the day or two before it hit LA, it was downgraded from Cat 5 to 4. They should have been even more prepared than they needed to be, instead, they're much less prepared than they should have been.
post #131 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by giant
I saw that interview to. She was totally taken aback and asked him if he was serious.

Linky to CNN video
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post #132 of 269
I think they should fire that asshole.
post #133 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by the cool gut
I think they should fire that asshole.

Apparently he was fired from his last job.
post #134 of 269
"There was no way to evacuate the whole city!!!"

The planning for this disaster left something to be desired, I think.


V/R,

Aries 1B
"I pictured myself sitting in the shade of a leafy tree in a public park, a stylus in hand, a shiny Apple Tablet computer in my lap, and a pouty Jennifer Connelly stirring a pitcher of gimlets a...
"I pictured myself sitting in the shade of a leafy tree in a public park, a stylus in hand, a shiny Apple Tablet computer in my lap, and a pouty Jennifer Connelly stirring a pitcher of gimlets a...
post #135 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by Aries 1B
"There was no way to evacuate the whole city!!!"

The planning for this disaster left something to be desired, I think.


V/R,

Aries 1B

Yeah really. Bush should have been there and had a plan in hand. If he were a true leader ge would have landed in NOLA and directed things himself.

What a loser.
post #136 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by NaplesX
Yeah really. Bush should have been there and had a plan in hand. If he were a true leader ge would have landed in NOLA and directed things himself.

What a loser.

I don't understand why the only thing you feel strongly about is Bush. Nothing and no one else.

Do you have a crush?
post #137 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by Aries 1B
"There was no way to evacuate the whole city!!!"

The planning for this disaster left something to be desired, I think.


V/R,

Aries 1B

not to defend it, but remember they need drivers for thos ebuses, and the mayor had told everyone to get the hell out of town.

i hope this disaster teaches a lesson that there must be a plan to get out those who cannot get themselves out, or even those who do not wish to leave. fuck this whole "people have a right to stay." um, no. we try to keep people form committing suicide. at some point, staying for a cat 5 hurricane to hit new orleans can be considered suicide, and they should be hauled out kicking and screaming if necessary, lock down the city until all clear sounds, then let everyone back in orderly fashion.

but hindsight is always 20/20.
When you're lovers in a dangerous time,
You're made to feel as if your love's a crime.
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
Gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight.

-...
When you're lovers in a dangerous time,
You're made to feel as if your love's a crime.
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
Gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight.

-...
post #138 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
Apparently he was fired from his last job.

Well then it won't be new to him.
post #139 of 269
According to Colonel Hunt on O'reilly, this is what caused the delay:

First big mistake wad by LA Governor not to pull the trigger to federalize the troops. She should have done this 2 days before the storm hit. That would have kicked in more federal help. She didn't. After the storm 6000 NGuard and 1000 HPatrol troops gathered about 60 miles north of NOLA. The trigger was still not pulled until information reached the governor. This happened almost 3 days too late because once the storm hit there was no way for the governor get accurate information.

There was no plan in place from the governor's standpoint.
post #140 of 269
"George Bush doesn't like black people" , Kanye West on the NBC Telethon airing right now
post #141 of 269
*watches gas thrown on fire*
*sits back and waits for mayhem*
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post #142 of 269
I am seriously tired of hearing cries about racism when TODAY Jessie Jackson drove to the convention center with his bus & entorage to survey the situation then left without picking up a single person from the convention center area and then had the nerve to critisize the president for surveying the situation and actually said on the radio here that "if they can bring these media trucks in they can bring people out".

It's truely a shame that the system failed our citizens but it boils down to a lack of money and no definitive plan from anyone higher than the mayer (who is a truely great man btw). Stop all the crying about racism. New Orleans population is 67% black and that is why almost all of the people you are seeing at the superdome are black. I love this city and the majority of the people are genuinely great people but the fact of the matter is that the system failed us here. The country is learning a huge leson at our expense.

Further more I can assure you that aid is coming in and out like crazy...I personally saw TODAY a C-130 cargo plane and at least 40 hellicopters flying back and fourth from Baton Rouge to New Orleans. Unfortunatly the confusion, delays, extreme lack of federal funding up until the last few days, and lack of definitive athority on a higher level has only made the situation that much worse. Please stop crying racism. My personal experience here is that this is much more of a situation of incompitence and lack of federal funding than anything else....and all of this starts far below the authority of the president.
post #143 of 269
NO was a city that was on it's heals before the hurricane. Like any city it's had a gang problem. Add to that the malignant police corruption. They had/have gang members on the police force. It demoralized all the good cops. Add water and mix... When the Mayor initially said that looting was okay he gave teh green light to the armed thugs. 1/3 of the cops just walking away from they city. Can you imagine that happening in New York, Chicago or Boston? The mayor is responsible for his citizens. They were living in a bowl surrounded by water. Anyone without a car had no chance of making it out in time. Who's fault it is? The Mayor's.
post #144 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by Playmaker
I am seriously tired of hearing cries about racism when

Who cares about Jesse Jackson. The Tsunami victims got aid 2 fucking days after the disaster- and that's in poor countries. AND no one saw the Tsunami coming. Katrina was spotted WELL before it hit, and everyone new it was going to be bad. 5 days without ANYTHING. It is obviously because a)population is black or b) population is poor.

Do you think if the "Big one" hit L.A., that this would be the response? Do you honestly think it would be this pathetic?
post #145 of 269
Not to mention that Lt. Gen. Honore has now disproven that BS about it being too dangerous to bring in aid.
post #146 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by rok
not to defend it, but remember they need drivers for thos ebuses, and the mayor had told everyone to get the hell out of town.

i hope this disaster teaches a lesson that there must be a plan to get out those who cannot get themselves out, or even those who do not wish to leave. fuck this whole "people have a right to stay." um, no. we try to keep people form committing suicide. at some point, staying for a cat 5 hurricane to hit new orleans can be considered suicide, and they should be hauled out kicking and screaming if necessary, lock down the city until all clear sounds, then let everyone back in orderly fashion.

but hindsight is always 20/20.

I think that I would have pretty much figured out how to make it go, if it were me. Granted, there'd be no paint left on the side [Edit: both sides, the front, the back, AND the top, what with low hanging debris], and the transmission would be 'a hopeless pile o' jonk' (yes, I do miss Scotty), but I'd be someplace dry by now and so would everyone else on 'my' bus.

My hindsight is always 20/400+.

V/R,

Aries 1B
"I pictured myself sitting in the shade of a leafy tree in a public park, a stylus in hand, a shiny Apple Tablet computer in my lap, and a pouty Jennifer Connelly stirring a pitcher of gimlets a...
"I pictured myself sitting in the shade of a leafy tree in a public park, a stylus in hand, a shiny Apple Tablet computer in my lap, and a pouty Jennifer Connelly stirring a pitcher of gimlets a...
post #147 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by giant
Not to mention that Lt. Gen. Honore has now disproven that BS about it being too dangerous to bring in aid.

Honore seems to kick ass and take names.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
post #148 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by the cool gut
Who cares about Jesse Jackson. The Tsunami victims got aid 2 fucking days after the disaster- and that's in poor countries. AND no one saw the Tsunami coming. Katrina was spotted WELL before it hit, and everyone new it was going to be bad. 5 days without ANYTHING. It is obviously because a)population is black or b) population is poor.

Do you think if the "Big one" hit L.A., that this would be the response? Do you honestly think it would be this pathetic?

It took 6 days to get help to the worst hit areas during the tsunami, look it up.

There has been rescue efforts by all agencies from day one. Wake up.
post #149 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by midwinter
Honore seems to kick ass and take names.

Compare that to the Mayor...
post #150 of 269
Yup, looks like the Bush administration is going to be facing some tough questions later:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/09/....ap/index.html
post #151 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by the cool gut
Yup, looks like the Bush administration is going to face some tough questions later:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/09/....ap/index.html

Yup and he'll fair fine. I would be worried about the Mayor of NOLA and the LA Governor have some even more serious questions to answer, IMO.
post #152 of 269
Jeeez - even Tucker Carlson is on air right now saying "It's obvious that the Federal Government, and President Bush, failed here."

I guess you'd consider him a lefty-left liberal, maybe?

Your continued denials of the facts only make you look delusional.
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post #153 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by Bronxite
[NaplesX,] I don't understand why the only thing you feel strongly about is Bush. Nothing and no one else.

Bears repeating.
post #154 of 269
Looks like they couldn't have been more prepared - proof of a complete failure at the Federal level:

http://www.wired.com/news/planet/0,2...tml?tw=rss.TEK


"Computer models developed at Louisiana State University and other institutions made detailed projections of what would happen if water flowed over the levees protecting the city or if they failed."

here is a beauty-

"In comments on Thursday, President Bush said, "I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees.""

WHAT!??! Do they have a fucking monkey feeding this guy his lines?

"Several experts also believe the decision to make FEMA a part of the Department of Homeland Security, created after the Sept. 11 attacks, was a major mistake. Rubin said FEMA functioned well in the 1990s as a small, independent agency.

"Under DHS, it was downgraded, buried in a couple of layers of bureaucracy, and terrorism prevention got all the attention and most of the funds," she said.

Former FEMA director James Lee Witt testified to Congress in March 2004: "I am extremely concerned that the ability of our nation to prepare for and respond to disasters has been sharply eroded."
post #155 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by FormerLurker
Jeeez - even Tucker Carlson is on air right now saying "It's obvious that the Federal Government, and President Bush, failed here."

I guess you'd consider him a lefty-left liberal, maybe?

Your continued denials of the facts only make you look delusional.

The federal government is always making mistakes and taking to long to do certain things. But that's a side effect of beurocracy.

But you are then projecting fault to Bush, it's silly.
post #156 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by NaplesX
But you are then projecting fault to Bush, it's silly.

And one of the most partisan right-wingers in the media is quoted above as directly disagreeing with you.

Now THAT'S silly!
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post #157 of 269
What I heard was that the governor failed to call up the national guard before the storm. Failed to pull the "disaster area" trigger soon enough after the storm. That trigger starts the federal reaction. The mayor doesn't even know where people need to be rescued from. Why such a failure at a local level?
post #158 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by NaplesX
The federal government is always making mistakes and taking to long to do certain things. But that's a side effect of beurocracy.

Ah, the old "shit happens, it's not really anyone's fault" defense.... good one.

I guess it was a good call for Bush to go on TV and announce that the Gulf Coast was facing "a storm of historic proportions" and then continue his vacation/PR tour for 5 more days. And that anyone who says otherwise is an obvious Bush-hater.
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post #159 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by PBook12
What I heard was that the governor failed to call up the national guard before the storm. Failed to pull the "disaster area" trigger soon enough after the storm. That trigger starts the federal reaction.

Your first statement is suspect at best. Can you substantiate it with something better than "what I heard?"

Can you explain how both the Louisiana and the Mississippi governor (a Republican with closer ties to Bush than most) made the same procedural mistake?
Quote:
The mayor doesn't even know where people need to be rescued from.

That statement is completely false. I'd enjoy seeing you try to back it up, though.

Oh yeah, and welcome to Political Outsider...
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post #160 of 269
Quote:
Originally posted by FormerLurker
And one of the most partisan right-wingers in the media is quoted above as directly disagreeing with you.

Now THAT'S silly!

I don't agree with him and why should I?
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AppleInsider › Forums › Other Discussion › AppleOutsider › R.I.P. - New Orleans, August 29, 2005??