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Apple introduces iMac with built-in iSight - Page 3

post #81 of 139
10/13/05 at 2:49pm
Quote:
Originally posted by MiMac
Anyone notice that there's no inbuilt modem?
Anyone on dial-up (there are still a hell of a lot of users on dial-up) have to buy an external Apple 56k modem add-on \
Would it have cost so much to include an internal modem? Space issues or just cost cutting?

Most people don't need one - I would rather have the minority pay £35 then the majority have to pay more for a computer for something they don't need! I can understand that it does seem slightly backwards!
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post #82 of 139
10/13/05 at 3:30pm
Quote:
Anyone notice that there's no inbuilt modem?
Anyone on dial-up (there are still a hell of a lot of users on dial-up) have to buy an external Apple 56k modem add-on
Would it have cost so much to include an internal modem? Space issues or just cost cutting?

No it wouldn't have cost much but even $3 dollars multiplied by 3 million in sales adds up to some serious coin. It goes both ways...some people are happy to have the isight built in while others would prefer the modem.

I'm in hte former camp as Apple creating a USB modem makes my job a lot easier when it comes to dealing with fried or non-existant modems in older computers. Apple just gave us a $50 part that should work with most macs running a current OS X version. There's definitely a silver lining on this cloud.
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post #83 of 139
10/13/05 at 3:38pm
I really think Apple has awoken from the stupor they have been in.

I know the pro crowd is upset that it's always about the iPod and now this spectacular iMac (The ultimate dorm room computer). But it is exactly what Apple should be doing.

They are chasing the under 25 crowd as hard as they can. It's where the moneys at.

I mean be honest. Why would Apple even want to enter the enterprise market of no margins? I know that they would like to keep A/V, print and various other pro markets as well as education. But if they can capture the 12-25 crowd, all the rest doesn't matter.

I foresee in the near future that all macs will be consumer devices and that there will be a seperate pro line named something else.

I know it upsets the pro crowd because they have been so faithful and feel that if it wasn't for them then Apple would have been done a long time ago. But Apple can't survive on the pro market and education. It's just not there.

My hats off to Apple. Man what a company! This new iMac, the nano and new iPod is the start of something great.
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post #84 of 139
10/13/05 at 3:54pm
Yes, Apple's future looks very bright indeed. The itunes video concept is the start of something as big as the mp3 industry. It is just the very beginning but before long I bet almost all tv shows will be available on iTunes and then movies as the infrastructure catches up. The new iMac really isn't all that wonderful; however, the concepts apple has combined are really more than the sum of their parts. When apple has a replacement for the G4 all their lines will look as good as the imac... just give it time. Stock went up a good 4+ dollars today.
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post #85 of 139
10/13/05 at 4:58pm
Quote:
Originally posted by kresh
Why would Apple even want to enter the enterprise market of no margins? I know that they would like to keep A/V, print and various other pro markets as well as education. But if they can capture the 12-25 crowd, all the rest doesn't matter.

I foresee in the near future that all macs will be consumer devices and that there will be a seperate pro line named something else.

I think you've blurred the distinction between "enterprise" and "pro" there, maybe without intending to? Still, I mostly agree with what you might have meant.

Apple's strategy seems to be more one of finesse in choosing its markets rather than engaging in more direct confrontation with any opponents in them. Their success in certain markets may simply be having a noticeable and "significant enough" presence, without the need to dominate them.

Of course the iPod and iTMS are the exceptions, for now. And by the time that dominance wanes maybe they'll have diversified enough that it needn't matter. They can be satisfied letting someone else handle the long-term "mainstream maintenance" of those ventures while playing other markets where another "big thing" may or may not emerge.

That's one way to imagine Apple sustaining its current momentum without endangering itself to overgrowth. Sort of a fluctuation between little bits of Apple in many places and one big Apple in only a few. There's a lot of BS to that, too.

Oh, wtf, I forgot this is an iMac thread.
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post #86 of 139
10/13/05 at 6:30pm
Originally posted by TofuTodd
doesn't the X600 have VIVO, ie H.264 decode acceleration?

i think you are confusing VIVO with AVIVO
AFAIK in terms of the gaming cards only x1300, x1600 and x1800 have AVIVO.
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post #87 of 139
10/13/05 at 6:37pm
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
Most people don't need one - I would rather have the minority pay £35 then the majority have to pay more for a computer for something they don't need! I can understand that it does seem slightly backwards!

OS X updates are very modem-unfriendly anyway, I'd say people stuck on dial-up might be better off under Windows. Sure, service packs are large, but any updates to any part of iLife entail a ~30MB download, the same goes for some security stuff, iTunes has gone down in size only because Quicktime was split off, QT 7.0.3 was 33MB, IIRC. I think one recent batch of updates meant 130+MB, which is approaching Windows service pack territory. I don't think Apple understands differential updates or patches, it's basically re-downloading the entire program.

I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the "minority" of internet users, I think it could vary between 30 and 70% depending on region. Apple didn't give the education market any break for buying modem-less machines, at least with the mini. I think the camera is a more valuable update, but I can imagine there are a lot of people that would have more use for a modem than a camera, skimping a $5 part to charge $50 doesn't seem so friendly to me.
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post #88 of 139
10/13/05 at 7:33pm
Quote:
Originally posted by aturner10
I know it wouldn't be the most seemless way to do it, but couldn't you buy the video adapter and run a cable to your tv so you could use front row on something besides the iMac?

You could, and that might be a good idea given that the iMac has no inbuilt TV tuner...
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post #89 of 139
10/13/05 at 9:03pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Splinemodel
Note that the 1.5G option is $200. The cost of a 2GB stick is pretty damn high. On crucial's website it's above $1000. The big question is: Is the built-in 512MB a slot ("not user accessible") or is it soldered onto the motherboard?


The need for memory, and the desire for something like the 2.5 GB maxshould certainly be considered. I do not know how easily the slot can be accessed, but for now i would pay the $200 and wait some time before I went the max. This is usually against my philosophy of max memory is best, except perhaps on laptops where you want to save battery or if you happen to have an 8 GB max G5 PM!
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post #90 of 139
10/13/05 at 9:06pm
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffDM
...but I can imagine there are a lot of people that would have more use for a modem than a camera, skimping a $5 part to charge $50 doesn't seem so friendly to me.

I certainly can understand that the whole community is not yet off modems, but I wonder if the decision to make the modem a dangle wasn't a function of space in the new box...
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post #91 of 139
10/14/05 at 1:04am
Quote:
Originally posted by imiloa
i guess this means steve finally got over his bias against TV and its convergence with PCs.

This is nothing to do with TV but more about digital content. Now we definately will never see a TV tuner from Apple since all the TV stuff is converging with the digital side.
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post #92 of 139
10/14/05 at 1:18am
splinemodel, i was thinking though, what if say in the middle of 2006 you need 4gb or more? in any case 2gb sticks will certainly be excessively expensive through to the first half of 2006.

a powermac g5 with 4x512mb sticks would be sweet. that gives you 2gb right there. the models with 8 memory slots would give you that headroom to go to 4gb and then 8gb if you really needed. anyway we'll see by the end of october tha powermac updates. there will be a few more "great new powerpc products". the iLord has restored my faith. i suppose then we can see what type of memory slots 4 or 8 or whatever in the new powermacs
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post #93 of 139
10/14/05 at 3:33am
Quote:
Originally posted by Algol
I was wondering how good the X600 XT really is compared to other graphics cards like the 9800 XT and etc. Thanks

The Radeon x600 XT is more or less a higher-clocked 9600 XT with PCI Express connectivity.
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post #94 of 139
10/14/05 at 12:21pm
Quote:
Originally posted by jido
The Radeon x600 XT is more or less a higher-clocked 9600 XT with PCI Express connectivity.

What is PCI-Express?
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post #95 of 139
10/14/05 at 12:49pm
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
What is PCI-Express?

Serialized PCI that has an upstream/downstream speed of 4GBps.
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post #96 of 139
10/14/05 at 2:14pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Cubit
I certainly can understand that the whole community is not yet off modems, but I wonder if the decision to make the modem a dangle wasn't a function of space in the new box...

The modem is not big enough to actually affect the case size on way or another. I mean technically, yea it saves space getting rid of it, but the real world implications are more than likely unnoticeable.
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post #97 of 139
10/14/05 at 2:24pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Algol
The modem is not big enough to actually affect the case size on way or another. I mean technically, yea it saves space getting rid of it, but the real world implications are more than likely unnoticeable.

possibly - but I think it's also the extra cost of putting a modem in. Not everyone uses modems anymore and as it's a fading technology it's not that important to include it.
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post #98 of 139
10/14/05 at 2:47pm
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
possibly - but I think it's also the extra cost of putting a modem in. Not everyone uses modems anymore and as it's a fading technology it's not that important to include it.

Well I agree with that statement.
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post #99 of 139
10/14/05 at 5:52pm
i think including the isight is better than including a modem. if you still have only dial up, or unreliable broadband that would need you to use a modem every now and then, perhaps the latest snazziest imac g5 is not really for you \
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post #100 of 139
10/14/05 at 6:09pm
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
i think including the isight is better than including a modem. if you still have only dial up, or unreliable broadband that would need you to use a modem every now and then, perhaps the latest snazziest imac g5 is not really for you \

I think that's a rather brash statement.
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post #101 of 139
10/14/05 at 6:23pm
Originally posted by Placebo
I think that's a rather brash statement.

fair enough, but in my experience trying to encourage people to go mac for the past few years, and i'm confident i'm not alone in this, some people are just not "ready" for it. the new iMac g5 is a really quite a spectacular all-in-one-package and i think its value and utility and enjoyability would be severely compromised without reliable broadband to go with it. for specific things that people would want to do with it, fair enough, and the external modem is an option. but considering system updates, .mac and other web services, video ichat, itunes music and itunes video store, dial-up just won't cut it for that sort of experience.

for users primarily on dial-up, a mac mini would be much more appropriate in my opinion...
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post #102 of 139
10/15/05 at 9:49am
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
for users primarily on dial-up, a mac mini would be much more appropriate in my opinion...

I'm not so sure. Broadband is necessary for all computers these days for the reasons you gave. Obviously iSight would not work without broadband. However, there a plenty of people who just want a computer to edit and print digital photos and occasionally visit the internet. The iMac is much more suited for this type of person as it does not require any setting up monitors etc. It's also a very fast computer.
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post #103 of 139
10/15/05 at 10:43pm
Mad fun. I want one now. But i probably wont get one, need a portable mac moe than anything.

Its a pity Front Row cat control an inbuilt HDTV tuner.

And most windows PC's dont come with modems anymore - if u have that kind of internut, then get a USB modem. Apple even sells one for those that bothered to look.
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post #104 of 139
10/16/05 at 4:06am
Quote:
Originally posted by pyriX
Apple even sells one for those that bothered to look.

We were discussing whether it is time for Apple to not include the modem - of course we are aware there is an optional USB modem for £35/$49. I personally think it's ok not to include a modem - the majority don't need one so shouldn't have to pay more.
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post #105 of 139
10/16/05 at 4:59am
we all seem to be split into two distinct camps on this modem deal: the f*K-the-modem camp and the whats-up-with-the-no-modem camp. hmmm
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post #106 of 139
10/16/05 at 7:22am
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
we all seem to be split into two distinct camps on this modem deal: the f*K-the-modem camp and the whats-up-with-the-no-modem camp. hmmm

BUT - you have to admit the majority no longer use modems and therefore as it's a fading technology there is less reason to include it - if I had to remove one thing on the iMac I would remove the modem before anything else, including ethernet and the iSight.
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post #107 of 139
10/16/05 at 7:27am
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
BUT - you have to admit the majority no longer use modems and therefore as it's a fading technology there is less reason to include it - if I had to remove one thing on the iMac I would remove the modem before anything else, including ethernet and the iSight.

I would rather not have it and get another USB port.

Of course, I do fax sometimes but I would gladly purchase a USB modem for that.




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post #108 of 139
10/16/05 at 7:30am
Quote:
Originally posted by aplnub
I would rather not have it and get another USB port.

Of course, I do fax sometimes but I would gladly purchase a USB modem for that.




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definitely! - or FireWire 800? or DVI out for external monitors
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post #109 of 139
10/16/05 at 4:52pm
Is anyone else annoyed that frontrow and the remote are built in. I bought my imac 4 months ago (and I love it), but I have been praying to the computer Gods for an itunes remote, and when it comes I can't get one. I sacrificed all the virgins I could find lol.

Please give me an adapter of some kind PLEASE.
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post #110 of 139
10/16/05 at 5:15pm
Quote:
Originally posted by samiam
Is anyone else annoyed that frontrow and the remote are built in.

Well sure people are, but that will always happen. Products are ALWAYS being updated and therefore you will always be wanting the newer, better one. You'll never have the best for long and will usually wish you had waited for the new product. But, if you do wait, you will always be waiting 'cause there are always better products coming that will make your product look worse.
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post #111 of 139
10/16/05 at 5:16pm
Quote:
Originally posted by samiam
Is anyone else annoyed that frontrow and the remote are built in. I bought my imac 4 months ago (and I love it), but I have been praying to the computer Gods for an itunes remote, and when it comes I can't get one. I sacrificed all the virgins I could find lol.

Please give me an adapter of some kind PLEASE.

I have a PowerMac G5, and wouldn't mind having frontrow and one of those remotes via an adapter. I think if we wait a while, Apple might make that happen for us...

- JonYo
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post #112 of 139
10/16/05 at 6:19pm
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
BUT - you have to admit the majority no longer use modems and therefore as it's a fading technology there is less reason to include it - if I had to remove one thing on the iMac I would remove the modem before anything else, including ethernet and the iSight.

exactly. i was practising some diplomacy. as you can see from my posts above, i'm with the good-riddance-to-the-modem camp
although i am of the opinion that if one does get the brand spanking new imac g5, they really should get broadband if they don't have it already.
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post #113 of 139
10/16/05 at 6:54pm
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman ...now, if only they can pull off ONE whole year of production without stupid capacitor and midplane f*ups (not apple's fault in a sense i suppose)[/B]

Apple takes your money. If it breaks, it's their fault.
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post #114 of 139
10/16/05 at 7:54pm
Quote:
Originally posted by jouster
Apple takes your money. If it breaks, it's their fault.

i suppose i should clarify that yes, if it breaks, of course its apple's responsibility to fix it for you. but the dodgy capacitors was the subcontractors' "fault". well, maybe apple's fault (edit: as well) for choosing said dodgy subcontractor \
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post #115 of 139
10/16/05 at 9:00pm
Apple is all about the experience right out of the box. So many things really rely on broadband. Downloading from the ITMS, software updates, etc. They don't disallow dial up but come on, if you really feel the need to have a new machine then you would figure broadband is in play. If you are the type that still has dial up, you are probably the type that is still using an older machine, maybe OS 9 or probably something less than Tiger and are quite happy with everything.

I'm not so sure I like isight built in. Yeah, less cords would be nice. But not having the flexibility to aim or set up the isight to me is a limitation. Also, a lot of people have found that iGlasses really improves the iSight experience. How would this now be used?

On a side note, if they were able to squeeze isight into the case like this, why is the regular iSight so dang big?

We have a 20 inch iMac and love it. These new ones are even better and more droolworthy. These should sell really well and put the screws to the PC competition for features and price. Nice job Apple.
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post #116 of 139
10/16/05 at 9:21pm
Quote:
Originally posted by kcmac
Apple is all about the experience right out of the box. So many things really rely on broadband. Downloading from the ITMS, software updates, etc. They don't disallow dial up but come on, if you really feel the need to have a new machine then you would figure broadband is in play. If you are the type that still has dial up, you are probably the type that is still using an older machine, maybe OS 9 or probably something less than Tiger and are quite happy with everything.

I'm not so sure I like isight built in. Yeah, less cords would be nice. But not having the flexibility to aim or set up the isight to me is a limitation. Also, a lot of people have found that iGlasses really improves the iSight experience. How would this now be used?

On a side note, if they were able to squeeze isight into the case like this, why is the regular iSight so dang big?

We have a 20 inch iMac and love it. These new ones are even better and more droolworthy. These should sell really well and put the screws to the PC competition for features and price. Nice job Apple.


I think the isight's lens and CCD at the end of the lens would fit into the thickness of the new imac pretty easily. I think it's the other circuitry normally behind the CCD in the regular off-the-shelf isight, including the stuff that provides the isight's firewire connectivity, is now either (A) positioned differently, or maybe (B) no longer needed. I don't know if the built in isight uses an internal FW bus to go to the main board, or if it's some other type of connection, since it no longer has to be compatible with external types of ports. Nonetheless, only the lens and CCD of the built in isight need to be inline with each other and fit within the thickness of the new imac, anything else could be positioned differently or placed elsewhere in the case.

- JonYo
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post #117 of 139
10/17/05 at 12:59am
Quote:
Originally posted by sunilraman
i suppose i should clarify that yes, if it breaks, of course its apple's responsibility to fix it for you. but the dodgy capacitors was the subcontractors' "fault". well, maybe apple's fault (edit: as well) for choosing said dodgy subcontractor \

IBM and Dell both had very large capacitor issues so it is hardly an apple only thing.
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post #118 of 139
10/17/05 at 1:17am
well, HP is recalling over 100,000 battery packs:

Hewlett-Packard on Friday recalled 135,000 battery packs sold with its notebook computers shipped globally from March 2004 to May 2005.
http://cnet.com.au/mobilecomputing/n...0057581,00.htm
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post #119 of 139
10/17/05 at 2:58am
I do not agree with this 'everyone should have broadband' statement. I know people who only use the internet for sending emails and faxes. There is no reason why everyone should be forced into a broadband subscription they don't need when dial-up at a per minute tariff will be cheaper for them.

I do think Apple was right to remove the modem though, the purpose of a default configuration of a computer is to serve the majority and the majority of iMac customers will be using either a USB ADSL modem, ethernet or Airport for a broadband connection. I think making the 56k modem an optional extra is for the best. It is a little expensive though, I have to admit that.

On the balance of things I think more people will be pleased it comes with 802.11g and bluetooth as default than those who will begrudge £35 for a USB modem.
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post #120 of 139
10/17/05 at 8:37am
Quote:
Originally posted by pix
I do not agree with this 'everyone should have broadband' statement. I know people who only use the internet for sending emails and faxes. There is no reason why everyone should be forced into a broadband subscription they don't need when dial-up at a per minute tariff will be cheaper for them.

I could not agree more. There are many users that need a modem. Not only for internet, but for fax too. And I have never seen a statistics showing that "Most people don't need one", to quote MacCrazy's own statement. Even in the US, I hear that there are many regions where broadband services are problematic or non-existent.

Quote:

I think making the 56k modem an optional extra is for the best. It is a little expensive though, I have to admit that.

Too much expensive for my taste, I would add. It certainly should not be at 55 Euros that it is now. It is evident that Apple treats it like the memory modules on sell in the online store.
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