Originally posted by groverat
And MCE is already there. The framework is already in place. No hoping involved, it's there.
I was talking about video on-demand, not DVR.
MCE already has on-demand CSI? How about Battlestar? ER? Not DVR'd, on-demand.
What you're describing isn't even close to what I mean.
Why doesn't Apple have it yet?
Why is it unreasonable to expect Apple to have it?
Because it doesn't fit with their fairly obvious strategy?
Look, *as a consumer* I'd love to have a DVR in there as much as you. It peeves me that it isn't. But *as an observer*, I think that Apple has a very different plan in mind, and that DVR doesn't fit into it. I think they're going to try and replicate the iTMS impact on music distribution, but for video to the home. DVR doesn't fit in that, because once on-demand is in place, a DVR has very little utility. So why wade into a market that is a) fractured, b) coming to be dominated by the cable companies who really don't play well with others, and c) going to be more or less irrelevant anyway if they can pull it off?
The iPod is just an mp3 player.
It is not about providing something that does not exist in any other fashion. You know that.
Well duh, but you claimed that there were three things that MCE did that FrontRow doesn't: DVR, radio station access, TV station access. The latter two are delivered over the net, right? Then, could someone with FrontRow please confirm or deny that they can or cannot access radio streams and/or television streams on the internet? I suspect they can, since iTunes can, and QuickTime Player can, and FrontRow just layers on top of them.
If so, that leaves just the DVR as the feature that MCE has that FrontRow doesn't, which was my original assertion. I could be wrong, but I don't think so.
I never said MCE was a smashing success, never. Not once.
It was argued that it was a failure and I disputed that. There's a huge difference between saying, "It's not a failure" and "It has set the world on fire."
I never said you did. What I'm saying is that with such vague numbers, *no* conclusions can be drawn, just hunches. You think it's been at least moderately successful, obviously, but it's unclear at *what*. Units sold? Bundling with XP makes that a useless number. My hunch is that the number of installations of MCE being used as a DVR is miniscule compared to the number of Tivos and cable company boxes out there. 'rat, you're part of a very bleeding edge group, and not the mainstream user by any means. I mean come on, you aren't even using an MCE box, you modded an XBox. Not. Main. Stream. Not even close.
It doesn't matter, if it changes just change the card (and the software. It's all PCMCIA Type 2.
My understanding was that the successor is *not*, and that was the problem. Damn, I wish I could remember the name. WWEC?
Like what? What could be the problem?
They ALREADY want you to hook the mini up to your TV. Why not add DVR? It's not like they are divorcing the TV and the Mac, they just don't have DVR.
Oh c'mon - output != input, you know that. The consumer has control over the display device, but not the input device, in most cases.
I agree that the technological issues are much less than they were a year ago, or two years ago, but I still think, based solely on external speculation, that they won't bite on the DVR market. It seems they have something else in mind. (Hint: true on-demand, not just 'play video over internet')
Obviously they don't have to, or else they would.
You are intentionally missing the point.
That makes two of us then.
This is amusing to me. It doesn't make good business sense... until Apple eventually does it.
Never said that, please don't put words in my mouth.
MCE already has video-on-demand. It's already there.
Really? Or is it just displaying the same content I can show in my web browser? Two very very different things, 'rat. As I said above, my suspicion is that FrontRow can show the same types of data, and that is so not what I mean by on-demand. Try Showtime-on-demand, or HBO-on-demand. How about The-Entire-WB-movie-catalog-on-demand? Or maybe Every-ESPN-Classic-game-on-demand? How about The-Discovery-Channel-Every-Series-Every-Episode-on-demand? We're not there yet. My suspicion is that Apple is going to try to push for that model. In which case a DVR doesn't make much sense.
And as those capabilities expand Microsoft will already have an established and matured (and well-spread!) platform on which to put these new VOD services. Because all home-bound copies of Windows sold from now on will likely have MCE bundled in.
You may be right, but none of that has squat to do with the DVR, does it? And besides, now you're talking about #-of-units of Windows vs. Mac, and adding a DVR to the mini isn't going to change that situation appreciably.
But it's retarded... until Apple does it.
If Apple does it tomorrow it's smart.
If they wait 5 years that's smart, too.
The right time to jump in? When Steve says.
Now you're just being obtuse on purpose. Stop putting words in my mouth.