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Fossil Of Devonian Fish-Land Animal Thingie

post #1 of 39
Thread Starter 
Six metres long shallow-water-dwelling predator, tetrapod anatomy, scales and fins:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/st...747926,00.html

The first complete fossil evidence of a creature in evolutionary transition between water and land habitats.

Really, really cool. I want to be a paleontologist.
post #2 of 39
Cool, yes. However, there will never come a day when I for a second believe Man to be a descendent of fish. That is insanity.
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post #3 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by DanMacMan
Cool, yes. However, there will never come a day when I for a second believe Man to be a descendent of fish. That is insanity.

In your lifetime, yes. In the lifetime of your known family tree, certainly. In the 3.5 billion years life has existed on this planet, absolutely not.
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post #4 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by hardeeharhar
In your lifetime, yes. In the lifetime of your known family tree, certainly. In the 3.5 billion years life has existed on this planet, absolutely not.

Absolutely? As in with no doubt whatsoever? With complete certainty? Without any question? As a matter of fact?

Just checking.
post #5 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
Absolutely? As in with no doubt whatsoever? With complete certainty? Without any question? As a matter of fact?

Just checking.

Absolutely not insanity, as a matter of fact.

But really, we don't need another evolution debate do we?

Seriously?
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post #6 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by hardeeharhar
Absolutely not insanity, as a matter of fact.

Thanks. Just checking.
post #7 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
Thanks. Just checking.

No problem...

Is anyone else NOT surprised they haven't found human bones in 600 million year old rock?
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post #8 of 39
BOT, I hate how they are always claiming they found a 'missing link' or transitional fossil. it makes it seem as if there are these defines species and the all of a sudden in a few years evolve into a new species. I know that's what some hard core creationists think evolutionists think but the term missing link implies it directly connects one fossil/life-form with another.

Awesome; we found a fossil that shows evidence how fish started showing characteristics that would make it easier to move around on land for some reason that could be speculated. Now we have 2 new "missing links". (not really)

Edit: Almost forgot to link to Carl Zimmer's blog about this: http://loom.corante.com/archives/200...wards_land.php
post #9 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by hardeeharhar
No problem...

Is anyone else NOT surprised they haven't found human bones in 600 million year old rock?

It must mean it's impossible to build a time machine because if it were possible you KNOW someone would try and make a killing on historical tourism

Travelling back in time to witness ancient life forms would be Epcot++++++
post #10 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Outsider
It must mean it's impossible to build a time machine because if it were possible you KNOW someone would try and make a killing on historical tourism

Travelling back in time to witness ancient life forms would be Epcot++++++

What would happen if someone accidentally stepped on some of the primordial ooze?
post #11 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
What would happen if someone accidentally stepped on some of the primordial ooze?

There was a Simpsons episode about this, you unoriginal fool!

Of course, the chances are good that the Simpsons writers borrowed it from some long-since-buried episode of the Twilight Zone.
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post #12 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Splinemodel
There was a Simpsons episode about this, you unoriginal fool!

Of course, the chances are good that the Simpsons writers borrowed it from some long-since-buried episode of the Twilight Zone.

Nope, it's a gloss on the Ray Bradbury story "A Sound of Thunder" (recently made into a movie that I think only has the name and the general premise in common with the story).

Pretty much the ur time travel paradox story, change the present by changing the past division.
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post #13 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by addabox
Nope, it's a gloss on the Ray Bradbury story "A Sound of Thunder" (recently made into a movie that I think only has the name and the general premise in common with the story).

Pretty much the ur time travel paradox story, change the present by changing the past division.

Hang on second...didn't H.G. Wells hit on this in "Time Machine"?
post #14 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
Hang on second...didn't H.G. Wells hit on this in "Time Machine"?

Did he? I thought it was straight up time travel.
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post #15 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by addabox
Did he? I thought it was straight up time travel.

Maybe so. Been a while.
post #16 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
Absolutely? As in with no doubt whatsoever? With complete certainty? Without any question? As a matter of fact?

Just checking.

come on Chris, both you and I know that man was planted here by the giants, the 'Nephilim' from the planet Nibiru who screwed our fair Earth maidens. Its in the bible

"The Nephilim were on the earth in those days -- and also afterward -- when the sons of God went to the daughters of men and had children by them." - Genesis 6

Just wondering Chris, does it say in the super Sun-Book why God created DNA? Its not like he needs to invent a mechanism that permits evolution if he just wants to fashion things out of dust.
post #17 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by hardeeharhar
In your lifetime, yes. In the lifetime of your known family tree, certainly. In the 3.5 billion years life has existed on this planet, absolutely not.

You should see my kids in a swimming pool! We couldn't have lost our gills all that long ago!



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post #18 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
What would happen if someone accidentally stepped on some of the primordial ooze?

You mean like Picard?
post #19 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Outsider
You mean like Picard?

And those damn inverse-Tachyon beams?
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post #20 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by hardeeharhar
And those damn inverse-Tachyon beams?

You'de think that inverse tachyon beams would distort time into the future.
post #21 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Outsider
You'de think that inverse tachyon beams would distort time into the future.

wouldn't an inverse Tachyon beam, be a joke for a normal particle/wave?
post #22 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by MarcUK
wouldn't an inverse Tachyon beam, be a joke for a normal particle/wave?

Or a mechanism for 3 starship Enterprises to close out a series.
post #23 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Outsider
BOT, I hate how they are always claiming they found a 'missing link' or transitional fossil. it makes it seem as if there are these defines species and the all of a sudden in a few years evolve into a new species. I know that's what some hard core creationists think evolutionists think but the term missing link implies it directly connects one fossil/life-form with another.

I read a quote by one of the authors, sorry I don't remember the link, that they themselves didn't like the term 'missing link'. I think that term is used by the press since it quickly conjures up a certain image in readers' minds. The scientists, however, pointed out that this wasn't THE missing link, but one of many in a series of animals that came between fish and tetrapods.

Another thing I don't like in most of the descriptions I've read in the press is the 'head of a crocodile" statement. I don't know if the authors said it or what, but it gives the wrong impression. Reptiles came much later, so this has nothing to do with crocodiles.

What I think is so neat about this find is that it matched the hypothesis so well. It was clear that you can't go from fish to land animal in a single mutation and that this had to take place in steps (pun absolutely completly intended). The time frame was also narrowed down, and so they went looking in rocks of the appropriate ages and found what they were looking for.
post #24 of 39
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Carson O'Genic

snip

find is that it matched the hypothesis so well. It was clear that you can't go from fish to land animal in a single mutation and that this had to take place in steps (pun absolutely completly intended). The time frame was also narrowed down, and so they went looking in rocks of the appropriate ages and found what they were looking for.

Exactly. It's the plain weirdness of this creature I find so fantastic.

I really love the idea of Earth as an alien planet.
post #25 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah
Exactly. It's the plain weirdness of this creature I find so fantastic.

I really love the idea of Earth as an alien planet.

Hassan, did you ever read Stephen Jay Gould's Wonderful Life?

One of its central stories is the discovery of the Burgess Shale fossil beds in Canada, harboring evidence of tiny sea creatures so entirely bizarre that it was assumed that they were parts of other, larger animals.

For instance, hallucigenia:



And my personal favorite, Wiwaxia:

They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #26 of 39
Thread Starter 
COOL.
post #27 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah
Exactly. It's the plain weirdness of this creature I find so fantastic.

I really love the idea of Earth as an alien planet.

Check out Aliens of the Deep by James Cameron. Although it is a little light on the actual science, the quality of the video taken was better than anything I had seen before. I gave it 4/5 stars in my Netflix account.
post #28 of 39
Speaking of Gould, there is an pretty good illustrated layman's book on the history of life called The Book of Life. That's where I saw the illustrations above.
post #29 of 39
Bump...

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Con...2154&t=TS_Home

New 'transitional' fossil discovered of a primitive Australopithecus, but post Ardipithecus, fills another gap between homo sapiens sapiens and pre-homo primates.

Also, saw a documentary on Discovery Health channel about human sex and it went into the reasons why humans look the way we do now, why the external sex organs on the female went from the back to the front, why our lips look the way they do, why our skin is smooth and our nipples are high on our bodies, etc. Check it out.
post #30 of 39
post #31 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Outsider
Bump...

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Con...2154&t=TS_Home

New 'transitional' fossil discovered of a primitive Australopithecus, but post Ardipithecus, fills another gap between homo sapiens sapiens and pre-homo primates.

Another great find. I guess the Ethiopian license plate should read 'Ethiopia - Birthplace of Humanity'.

I watched Nova last night about the Piltdown Man hoax. Apparently nationalism reagrding fossils was a big issue 100 years ago. Apparently, some in England had a problem with the all the good humanoid fossils coming from Germany (Neanderthal), France and Spain. So someone made up their own 'missing link' and planted him in East Sussex.
post #32 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Carson O'Genic
Another great find. I guess the Ethiopian license plate should read 'Ethiopia - Birthplace of Humanity'.

I watched Nova last night about the Piltdown Man hoax. Apparently nationalism reagrding fossils was a big issue 100 years ago. Apparently, some in England had a problem with the all the good humanoid fossils coming from Germany (Neanderthal), France and Spain. So someone made up their own 'missing link' and planted him in East Sussex.

and inadvertently set back the dispelling of creationism 150 years.
post #33 of 39
http://www.cbc.ca/story/science/nati...-20060412.html

"African fish hunts on land
Last Updated Wed, 12 Apr 2006 16:51:28 EDT
CBC News
Biologists have found an unusual fish that swims in the swamps of tropical Africa, but can catch prey on dry land.

The eel catfish catches insects and other prey on land by arching its body upwards out of the water and bringing its jaws down, trapping its prey against the ground.

In the water, the eel catfish, like other fish, captures its food by opening up its mouth and sucking up its prey. Since this trick won't work on land, it had to adapt with a different hunting strategy.

The catfish's neck is especially flexible, with specialized vertebrae that allow it to hold its head up out of the water without using fins.

A team headed by Sam Van Wassenbergh of the University of Antwerp in Belgium submitted a video of the eel catfish performing its feat in a lab setting for the Thursday issue of the journal Nature.

The researchers speculate that a similar feeding strategy could have been used by the first vertebrates to emerge from the oceans."

Another cool story about the wild lifeforms on our pretty little planet. One small splash for a catfish, one giant leap for dry land.
post #34 of 39
Also, don't forget the publication this week of an evolutionary explanation for a protein-binding site, a so-called irreducibly complex system. Drove Behe nuts. Hehe.
post #35 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Outsider
Or a mechanism for 3 starship Enterprises to close out a series.

Was it three or one...because those three were the same Enterprise...
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post #36 of 39
According to their own kind?... or not?
post #37 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Outsider
According to their own kind?... or not?

I have no idea what you mean, maybe I'm too tired...
post #38 of 39
If snakes were 'created' why would the old fossils have pelvis' and leg vestiges?
post #39 of 39
Quote:
Originally posted by Outsider
If snakes were 'created' why would the old fossils have pelvis' and leg vestiges?

OK, but my guess is that the same devilish gremlin thai put these bones in whales put them in these snakes. Notice they are extinct? That is becuase the big G told Noah not to let them on the boat because they are the devil's work. Unfortunately, those dammed whales could swim and they survived.
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