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The Worst President in History?  

post #1 of 1703
Thread Starter 
I just finished reading this really well thought Presidential critique from Rolling Stone . I have to say it really put chills down my spine. Anyway please read the story and discuss, I'm really interested in hearing from the Bush apologist/supporters on this.

Excerpt; "According to the Treasury Department, the forty-two presidents who held office between 1789 and 2000 borrowed a combined total of $1.01 trillion from foreign governments and financial institutions. But between 2001 and 2005 alone, the Bush White House borrowed $1.05 trillion, more than all of the previous presidencies combined."

When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
post #2 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by Relic
I just finished reading this really well thought Presidential critique from Rolling Stone . I have to say it really put chills down my spine. Anyway please read the story and discuss, I'm really interested in hearing from the Bush apologist/supporters on this.

Excerpt; "According to the Treasury Department, the forty-two presidents who held office between 1789 and 2000 borrowed a combined total of $1.01 trillion from foreign governments and financial institutions. But between 2001 and 2005 alone, the Bush White House borrowed $1.05 trillion, more than all of the previous presidencies combined."



I agree with this whole heartedly! I've always said he was the worst in my lifetime. Why not ever?

It's really too bad some people are only waking up to this now.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
post #3 of 1703
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by jimmac
I agree with this whole heartedly! I've always said he was the worst in my lifetime. Why not ever?

It's really too bad some people are only waking up to this now.

They are waking up though, just the other day I was talking to my Mom who is a Republican Christian Conservative and she is now for impeachment. What really convinced me she changed, half way threw the conversation she told me to contact her via iSite because since I live in Switzerland she was pretty sure the NSA was monitoring because we used quote "key words for authorized active monitoring". WOW!, talk about a reality check, here's a woman who would never be considered a threat but she's already pro-actively thinking about people monitoring her.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
post #4 of 1703
Let's remember that $1 trillion isn't worth now what it was before now.

It is still a lot of money.
Living life in glorious 4G HD (with a 2GB data cap).
Living life in glorious 4G HD (with a 2GB data cap).
post #5 of 1703
I can say that the tide is certainly turning (almost undoubtedly by design). The last time I was home (the deep South), my relatives had lost that smugness they'd had for most of Bush's presidency and were beginning to grumble about various issues.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
post #6 of 1703
We can only hope that he is the worst.

I don't think the US can afford anyone worse without breaking up.

Should registerded republican voters be held accountable for the 1.05 Trillion?
post #7 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by jamac
We can only hope that he is the worst.

I don't think the US can afford anyone worse without breaking up.

Should registerded republican voters be held accountable for the 1.05 Trillion?

Oh, now that would be funny. Tie presidential economic failures directly to the pockets of the people who voted for them.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
post #8 of 1703
Or you could send the offspring of the Chickenhawks into combat they started.
"I do not fear computers. I fear the lack of them" -Isaac Asimov
"I do not fear computers. I fear the lack of them" -Isaac Asimov
post #9 of 1703
I'm sure this got posted/linked to when it made the rounds a while back, but it still makes me laugh/cry:


Dear Red States...

We've decided we're leaving. We intend to form our own country, and
we're taking the other Blue States with us.

In case you aren't aware, that includes Hawaii, Oregon, Washington,
Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois and all the Northeast. We
believe this split will be beneficial to the nation, and especially to
the people of the new country of New California.

To sum up briefly: You get Texas, Oklahoma and all the slave states. We
get stem cell research and the best beaches. We get Elliot Spitzer. You
get Ken Lay.

We get the Statue of Liberty. You get Dollywood.
We get Intel and Microsoft & Apple. You get WorldCom.
We get Harvard, Berkely, & Stanford, You get Ole' Miss.

We get 85 percent of America's venture capital and entrepreneurs.
You get Alabama.
We get two-thirds of the tax revenue, you get to make the red states pay
their fair share.

Since our aggregate divorce rate is 22 percent lower than the Christian
Coalition's, we get a bunch of happy families. You get a bunch of single
moms.

Please be aware that Nuevo California will be pro-choice and anti-war,
and we're going to want all our citizens back from Iraq at once. If you
need people to fight, ask your evangelicals. They have kids they're
apparently willing to send to their deaths for no purpose, and they
don't care if you don't show pictures of their children's caskets coming
home. We do wish you success in Iraq, and hope that the WMDs turn up,
but we're not willing to spend our resources in Bush's Quagmire.

With the Blue States in hand, we will have firm control of 80 percent of
the country's fresh water, more than 90 percent of the pineapple and
lettuce, 92 percent of the nation's fresh fruit, 95 percent of America's
quality wines (you can serve French wines at state dinners) 90 percent
of all cheese, 90 percent of the high tech industry, most of the U.S.
low-sulfur coal, all living redwoods, sequoias and condors, all the Ivy
and Seven Sister schools, plus U. of chicago, Stanford, Cal Tech and
MIT.

With the Red States, on the other hand, you will have to cope with 88
percent of all obese Americans (and their projected health care costs),
92 percent of all U.S. mosquitoes, nearly 100 percent of the tornadoes,
90 percent of the hurricanes, 99 percent of all Southern Baptists,
virtually 100 percent of all televangelists, Rush Limbaugh, Bob Jones
University, Clemson and the University of Georgia.

We get Hollywood and Yosemite, thank you.

Additionally, 38 percent of those in the Red states believe Jonah was
actually swallowed by a whale, 62 percent believe life is sacred unless
we're discussing the death penalty or gun laws, 44 percent say that
evolution is only a theory, 53 percent that Saddam was involved in 9/11
and 61 percent of you crazy bastards believe you are people with higher
morals then we lefties.

By the way, we're taking the good pot, too. You can have that dirt weed
they grow in Mexico.

Sincerely,
Author Unkno wn in New California
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
post #10 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by addabox
and 61 percent of you crazy bastards believe you are people with higher morals then we lefties.

Perhaps the most amusing (and ironic) part.

Amusing because I find irony amusing. Ironic because someone goes on for a whole page (or two) sharing their view of how superior the blue states are and concludes with an accusation of the red states of have an air of moral superiority.
post #11 of 1703
Unfortunately, they get the nukes.
post #12 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
Perhaps the most amusing (and ironic) part.

Amusing because I find irony amusing. Ironic because someone goes on for a whole page (or two) sharing their view of how superior the blue states are and concludes with an accusation of the red states of have an air of moral superiority.

I actually agree with this.

"If you don´t want to be liberal and show solidarity then f... you, we´re gone"
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" - President Bush
post #13 of 1703
Who would you pick to replace him ?

1. The NUT farmer, NUT, Jimmy Carter ?

2. Slick Willie, campaign $$$$$$ in exchange for U.S. nuclear secrets and MIRV technology plus cigars for Monica ?

3. The Hildabeast, who avoided many felonies from Arkansas to to the Whitehouse ?

4. Cindy Sheehan-Chavez, the patriot ? Wrong !
It is Cindy Seahag-Chavez !!!

5. Slobs like Michael Moore or Ward Churchill ?

6. John- Vietnam / hidden medical records - Kerry ?

7. Al -Saudi-Gore, the ex-prez who bashes his own country ?

8. How about a Harry Belefonte ?

9. How about a Ramsey-Saddam-Clark ?

10.Lastly how about the rum runner Teddie-the swimmer- Kennedy ?

You could take anyone of these people as prez, make the ACLU your Whitehouse Staff and enlist the New York Times as your Whitehouse Spokesperson and turn the U.S. over to the U.N. as a member state instead of a member country !

Yep, Bush is horrible, but the left loves numbers 1-10 above, it kind of sums up who the left really are, and it is only the tip of the iceberg !
"some catch on faster than others"
"some catch on faster than others"
post #14 of 1703
Nah. Probably...

1. George "Read My Lips/It's the economy stupid" Bush - tied with - Georgey "Dear Leader" Bush, Jr.

2. Ronnie "I can't remember what I forgot or when I forgot it" Contra Reagan

3. Anne "Kill all the Muslims" Coulter

4. Rush "Pill poppin" Limbaugh

5. "I'm sending you this letter from jail" Abramoff.

6. Scooter "fuck national security" Libby

7. Duke "I'm Abramoff's cell buddy" Cunningham

8. Tom "I'm quit" DeLay

9. Carl "I never met a CIA agent I liked" Rove

10. "Heckuva Job" Brownie

11. "Duck and Cover" Chertoff

12. Condi "Bin Laden determined to strike within the U.S." Rice

12. "Everything's a-okay in Iraq" Rumsfeld

12. Paul "We don't need any more troops" Bremmer

13. Scotty "9/11, 9/11, 9/11, 9/11, 9/11" Bartlett

14. Trent "I vote for racists for president" Lott

15. Bill "Under investigation" Frist

16. Rick "Kill all the gays" Santorum

I could go on and on...
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
post #15 of 1703
Ah the refreshing sounds of civilized political discourse.
post #16 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by addabox
Dear Red States...

i was musing through wikipedia the other day about whatever bullshit. clicked on some links, and others and others, and eventually found myself in the deep south. apparently, theres a movement down there to re-secede (i got the feeling it wasn't too strong tho). perhaps the two secessions could be peaceful.
post #17 of 1703
Man.

Life down there would suck.
post #18 of 1703
You know, I wish they would.

The South is kinda its own deal, and on its own terms you would at least know what you were getting, should you elect to live there.

In fact, things might take a turn for the better, once the South was no longer the national target of so much racial demagoguery.

The dixie-less USA, on the other hand, would swing sharply to the left and experience a sudden reduction in shit-head office holders.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
post #19 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by Northgate
Nah. Probably...

1. George "Read My Lips/It's the economy stupid" Bush - tied with - Georgey "Dear Leader" Bush, Jr.

2. Ronnie "I can't remember what I forgot or when I forgot it" Contra Reagan

3. Anne "Kill all the Muslims" Coulter

4. Rush "Pill poppin" Limbaugh

5. "I'm sending you this letter from jail" Abramoff.

6. Scooter "fuck national security" Libby

7. Duke "I'm Abramoff's cell buddy" Cunningham

8. Tom "I'm quit" DeLay

9. Carl "I never met a CIA agent I liked" Rove

10. "Heckuva Job" Brownie

11. "Duck and Cover" Chertoff

12. Condi "Bin Laden determined to strike within the U.S." Rice

12. "Everything's a-okay in Iraq" Rumsfeld

12. Paul "We don't need any more troops" Bremmer

13. Scotty "9/11, 9/11, 9/11, 9/11, 9/11" Bartlett

14. Trent "I vote for racists for president" Lott

15. Bill "Under investigation" Frist

16. Rick "Kill all the gays" Santorum

I could go on and on...



You forgot Richard " I am not a crook " Nixon.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
post #20 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
Ah the refreshing sounds of civilized political discourse.


Hey! It's just the truth man!
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
post #21 of 1703
Imagine this?

FOX Poll: Gloomy Economic Views; Bush Approval at New Low

A Fox News poll with Bush's approval at 33%. Take the percentage of the population utterly clueless about current events, add all of the people who would approve of a dirty sweatsock as long as it could say "Praise Jesus!", and you couldn't get much lower than 33%.

I can't imagine how the perspective of history will ever make Bush look any better than this.
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
post #22 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by shetline
Imagine this?

FOX Poll: Gloomy Economic Views; Bush Approval at New Low

A Fox News poll with Bush's approval at 33%. Take the percentage of the population utterly clueless about current events, add all of the people who would approve of a dirty sweatsock as long as it could say "Praise Jesus!", and you couldn't get much lower than 33%.

I can't imagine how the perspective of history will ever make Bush look any better than this.

At least he's going in the right direction.



PSHH! YA RLY!
post #23 of 1703
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by southside grabowski
Who would you pick to replace him ?

1. The NUT farmer, NUT, Jimmy Carter ?

2. Slick Willie, campaign $$$$$$ in exchange for U.S. nuclear secrets and MIRV technology plus cigars for Monica ?

3. The Hildabeast, who avoided many felonies from Arkansas to to the Whitehouse ?

4. Cindy Sheehan-Chavez, the patriot ? Wrong !
It is Cindy Seahag-Chavez !!!

5. Slobs like Michael Moore or Ward Churchill ?

6. John- Vietnam / hidden medical records - Kerry ?

7. Al -Saudi-Gore, the ex-prez who bashes his own country ?

8. How about a Harry Belefonte ?

9. How about a Ramsey-Saddam-Clark ?

10.Lastly how about the rum runner Teddie-the swimmer- Kennedy ?

You could take anyone of these people as prez, make the ACLU your Whitehouse Staff and enlist the New York Times as your Whitehouse Spokesperson and turn the U.S. over to the U.N. as a member state instead of a member country !

Yep, Bush is horrible, but the left loves numbers 1-10 above, it kind of sums up who the left really are, and it is only the tip of the iceberg !


Wow, you sure got our number, I mean with only 300+ million people in the US will have no choice but to turn to those who you listed. We're so lost, we need a worthy candidate, but who, quick everyone repent your liberal ways, let's get Jeb Bush.

Weird anomaly, you say Bush is a bad a President but you don't believe there is anyone else capable of doing his job. I say this because you wouldn't have done the whole, "Then who else could do it, a Liberal, hah!", thing. Just admit it, Appleinsider is on your assignment sheet to spread government propaganda, I'm yet to see a post from you outside of PoliticalOutsider or even one that doesn't have a "I Love Bush" stamp on it.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
post #24 of 1703
How about a virtual software president..? a bit like the little software pets, maybe Adobe can help.
post #25 of 1703
Good lord. . . more partisan crap. The democrats have their own share of worthless and annoying representation. The problems we have probably won't be solved by something as simple as swearing in the other party. It would be nice if that were the case.

Anyway, I'd put W. in the list of "five bad presidents" for sure. Maybe not the worst, though, for the simple reason that he isn't (and likely won't be) impactful enough to actually convince anyone who follows him to continue doing things the way he does them. The sign of a REALLY bad president, in my opinion, is one who subverts the "american way" and manages to convince his successors that it's a good idea. I'm sure I'll get labeled for using "american way," but it's still the most concise phrase for encapsulating the philosophies used to architect the nation, way back when. If you don't appreciate these, that's another issue.
Cat: the other white meat
Cat: the other white meat
post #26 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by southside grabowski
Who would you pick to replace him ?

1. The NUT farmer, NUT, Jimmy Carter ?

2. Slick Willie, campaign $$$$$$ in exchange for U.S. nuclear secrets and MIRV technology plus cigars for Monica ?

3. The Hildabeast, who avoided many felonies from Arkansas to to the Whitehouse ?

4. Cindy Sheehan-Chavez, the patriot ? Wrong !
It is Cindy Seahag-Chavez !!!

5. Slobs like Michael Moore or Ward Churchill ?

6. John- Vietnam / hidden medical records - Kerry ?

7. Al -Saudi-Gore, the ex-prez who bashes his own country ?

8. How about a Harry Belefonte ?

9. How about a Ramsey-Saddam-Clark ?

10.Lastly how about the rum runner Teddie-the swimmer- Kennedy ?

You could take anyone of these people as prez, make the ACLU your Whitehouse Staff and enlist the New York Times as your Whitehouse Spokesperson and turn the U.S. over to the U.N. as a member state instead of a member country !

Yep, Bush is horrible, but the left loves numbers 1-10 above, it kind of sums up who the left really are, and it is only the tip of the iceberg !

This guy has to be one of you acting as a foil . . . this kind of willful stupidity is really too much

The kicker is this 'Ramsay-Saddam-Clark'



I mean, there is well nigh no thought beyond the ability to spell in these posts . . . like a twitching ganglia responding to the stimulus from the lowest portions of the residual pre-cambrian brain stem -

oops, I mean the Rightist Blogosphere
"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
--George W Bush

"Narrative is what starts to happen after eight minutes
--Franklin Miller.

"Nothing...

"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
--George W Bush

"Narrative is what starts to happen after eight minutes
--Franklin Miller.

"Nothing...

post #27 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by Splinemodel
Good lord. . . more partisan crap. The democrats have their own share of worthless and annoying representation. The problems we have probably won't be solved by something as simple as swearing in the other party. It would be nice if that were the case.

Anyway, I'd put W. in the list of "five bad presidents" for sure. Maybe not the worst, though, for the simple reason that he isn't (and likely won't be) impactful enough to actually convince anyone who follows him to continue doing things the way he does them. The sign of a REALLY bad president, in my opinion, is one who subverts the "american way" and manages to convince his successors that it's a good idea. I'm sure I'll get labeled for using "american way," but it's still the most concise phrase for encapsulating the philosophies used to architect the nation, way back when. If you don't appreciate these, that's another issue.

This is assuming that somehow the precedence set, with regards to elections, electronic voting etc, dismantling of everything 'civilizational', and the huge ultra right swing will somehow dissipate simply because it has proven to be ultra-idiocy with near malicious motivations of corporate statism exhibited by this worst-of-all-presidents!!

I think you overestimate us
"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
--George W Bush

"Narrative is what starts to happen after eight minutes
--Franklin Miller.

"Nothing...

"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
--George W Bush

"Narrative is what starts to happen after eight minutes
--Franklin Miller.

"Nothing...

post #28 of 1703
Shit Northgate that was high quality.
"Overpopulation and climate change are serious shit." Gilsch
"I was really curious how they had managed such fine granularity of alienation." addabox
"Overpopulation and climate change are serious shit." Gilsch
"I was really curious how they had managed such fine granularity of alienation." addabox
post #29 of 1703
Love your sig Aquatic.
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
post #30 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by Northgate
Love your sig Aquatic.

It needs more midwinter.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
post #31 of 1703
And in song as well

kinda thrown together and some odd chords... but

"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
post #32 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by Relic
I just finished reading this really well thought Presidential critique from Rolling Stone . I have to say it really put chills down my spine. Anyway please read the story and discuss, I'm really interested in hearing from the Bush apologist/supporters on this.

Excerpt; "According to the Treasury Department, the forty-two presidents who held office between 1789 and 2000 borrowed a combined total of $1.01 trillion from foreign governments and financial institutions. But between 2001 and 2005 alone, the Bush White House borrowed $1.05 trillion, more than all of the previous presidencies combined."


An article in Rolling Stone that trashes the President? Shocking!

Historians (read: Ivory Tower Academia) think Bush's policies are a disaster and that he will be the worst President in history? SHOCKING!

Pieces like this, that try to make speculative historical predictions are the worst kind of "pile on" elitist politics. In the 1980's, they were saying that Reagan was a mediocre President. I still remember the story...they said he didn't have the intelligence for the job and that he wouldn't really be remembered. Yet today, the American people on the whole consider Reagan to be the greatest (or near greatest) President of the 20th century, and rank him in the top 5 of all presidents. Back then, it was another group of historians making the prediction.

Historians are not infallible and due to the world in which many of them live (liberal academia), they tend to have certain viewpoints that don't exactly match up with our current President's, or for that matter, most of the country.

All that said, we have no idea how history will judge George Bush, nor do we know what is to come in the remaining years of his administration. If anything, history teaches us that the most popular Presidents are not always considered the best Presidents year later. Relative to GWB, it's too early to tell what the outcome of issues like Iraq will be, which I argue is the single most important issue of Bush's presidency...at least for now.

Though jimmac et al will label me an apologist or kool-aid drinker, the fact is that I am not happy with Bush's second term thus far. I am concerned about our spending levels and the general expansion of non-security related spending. I don't see him taking the lead on immigration/border security either. I still don't consider him a failure in the least. Currently, the economy is at near full employment which I believe was partially caused by the Bush tax cuts. We are experiencing robust economic growth as well. I support his efforts in the WOT and his response to 9/11 in general, incuding the NSA program and operations in Afghanistan.

Iraq is currently consuming Bush's presidency, along with gas prices. People are judging the state of economy on gas prices, which makes little sense (that said, I believe we need congressional involvement on that issue). People are also tired of the Iraq situation and don't see a lot of direction, though I think there is a direction and that things are far better then is being portrayed. The mainstream media is also complicit in a lot of what we see with respect to Bush's popularity. It's a "pile on" effect as I previously alluded to. 5 years ago they were running articles called "The Rumsfeld Way" and making him (for example) into a media darling. Now, they find six retired generals to trash him for two weeks, most of whom were saying the exact opposite thing not one year ago. The old media and democratic party smell blood in the water.

In the end, we just don't know how history will judge Bush. However, I know it's great fun for some of you to gloat and revel in current events. That's OK...if it's therapeutic for you, I support it
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
post #33 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by SDW2001
An article in Rolling Stone that trashes the President? Shocking!

Historians (read: Ivory Tower Academia) think Bush's policies are a disaster and that he will be the worst President in history? SHOCKING!

Pieces like this, that try to make speculative historical predictions are the worst kind of "pile on" elitist politics. In the 1980's, they were saying that Reagan was a mediocre President. I still remember the story...they said he didn't have the intelligence for the job and that he wouldn't really be remembered. Yet today, the American people on the whole consider Reagan to be the greatest (or near greatest) President of the 20th century, and rank him in the top 5 of all presidents. Back then, it was another group of historians making the prediction.

Historians are not infallible and due to the world in which many of them live (liberal academia), they tend to have certain viewpoints that don't exactly match up with our current President's, or for that matter, most of the country.

All that said, we have no idea how history will judge George Bush, nor do we know what is to come in the remaining years of his administration. If anything, history teaches us that the most popular Presidents are not always considered the best Presidents year later. Relative to GWB, it's too early to tell what the outcome of issues like Iraq will be, which I argue is the single most important issue of Bush's presidency...at least for now.

Though jimmac et al will label me an apologist or kool-aid drinker, the fact is that I am not happy with Bush's second term thus far. I am concerned about our spending levels and the general expansion of non-security related spending. I don't see him taking the lead on immigration/border security either. I still don't consider him a failure in the least. Currently, the economy is at near full employment which I believe was partially caused by the Bush tax cuts. We are experiencing robust economic growth as well. I support his efforts in the WOT and his response to 9/11 in general, incuding the NSA program and operations in Afghanistan.

Iraq is currently consuming Bush's presidency, along with gas prices. People are judging the state of economy on gas prices, which makes little sense (that said, I believe we need congressional involvement on that issue). People are also tired of the Iraq situation and don't see a lot of direction, though I think there is a direction and that things are far better then is being portrayed. The mainstream media is also complicit in a lot of what we see with respect to Bush's popularity. It's a "pile on" effect as I previously alluded to. 5 years ago they were running articles called "The Rumsfeld Way" and making him (for example) into a media darling. Now, they find six retired generals to trash him for two weeks, most of whom were saying the exact opposite thing not one year ago. The old media and democratic party smell blood in the water.

In the end, we just don't know how history will judge Bush. However, I know it's great fun for some of you to gloat and revel in current events. That's OK...if it's therapeutic for you, I support it



I'm glad you're starting to admit the inevitable. However Iraq isn't consuming Bush's presidency. Bush is. He's done what he came to do. Now he's on the way out and doesn't care.

He's a sham, a snake oil salesman of the worst kind. America was taken in by him and now is paying for it. It's as simple as that.

By the way only some see Reagan as a great president. Other's see him in a different light.

I think the history lesson from Bush will be more definite. One of the biggest mistakes we ever made!


Sorry if you don't like the way the worm is turning but for me it was just a matter of time for this guy.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
post #34 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by SDW2001
An article in Rolling Stone that trashes the President? Shocking!

Dude, RS is totally right-wing.

Wait... a knee-jerk reaction from someone with no independent critical thinking ability whatsoever who has the utter ignorance to claim "American people on the whole consider Reagan to be the greatest (or near greatest) President of the 20th century"... SHOCKING!


A large portion of (EDUCATED) America believes Reagan to be the SECOND worst president EVER.

But to the blind "educated" = "elitist".

SHOCKING!!!
post #35 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by tonton
But to the blind "educated" = "elitist".

And, apparently, to some, being a conservative or republican or Bush supporter or Reagan supporter = "uneducated".



Let's be clear... "elitist" = "elitist" no matter what level of educational achievement or political leaning...it just happens that, in some cases, a higher level of education achievement seems to endow some people with a sense that they know better (i.e., "elitism") than (many) others. As your statement ("A large portion of (EDUCATED) America believes Reagan to be the SECOND worst president EVER.") hints at.
post #36 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
And, apparently, to some, being a conservative or republican or Bush supporter or Reagan supporter = "uneducated".



Let's be clear... "elitist" = "elitist" no matter what level of educational achievement or political leaning...it just happens that, in some cases, a higher level of education achievement seems to endow some people with a sense that they know better (i.e., "elitism") than (many) others. As your statement ("A large portion of (EDUCATED) America believes Reagan to be the SECOND worst president EVER.") hints at.


Ok. Let's not apply a label of academia to it. Let's just call it people who bother to think.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
post #37 of 1703
I think it's funny that people are hurling charges of elitism around when the Bush administration is the most unabashedly elitist group of folks who have occupied the White House in any of our lifetimes.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
post #38 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by midwinter
I think it's funny that people are hurling charges of elitism around when the Bush administration is the most unabashedly elitist group of folks who have occupied the White House in any of our lifetimes.

Yeah, did you hear that they decided that the DOE doesn't need the advice of SCIENTISTS to help direct its SCIENTIFIC pursuits...

"We don't need no stinkin' scientist'- GWB
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
post #39 of 1703
I don't know why I bother responding to SDW anymore, but from Wiki:

Quote:
"Living in an ivory tower" usually depicts an intellectual who lives only for his work and doesn't care much about, or is ignorant of, or thought to have made insufficient efforts to understand the social and political consequences of it

For an admin so detached from reality, WRT tax cuts, the march of freedom, US border safety, children who are left behind, and which refuses to justify or excuse its on-the-ground failures to criticism from scientists, economists and generals because it is incapable of admitting to them...

Could anything be more ivory-towerish?

--B
...


...
...


...
post #40 of 1703
Quote:
Originally posted by hardeeharhar
Yeah, did you hear that they decided that the DOE doesn't need the advice of SCIENTISTS to help direct its SCIENTIFIC pursuits...

"We don't need no stinkin' scientist'- GWB

Sure. It's a perfect storm:

Academics = liberals = bad
Academics = ivory tower pinheads = no common sense
Scientists = academics = liberals = bad
Expertise = not to be trusted

Filter this through anything...global warming, theories about the universe, energy policy, domestic or foreign policy and you have a ready-made recipe for a public that will balk at anyone who dares to know anything.

Front this with teh scion of one of the greatest political dynasties in US history for a leader—who everyone perceives as a regular guy—and place behind him a bunch of academics from Chicago who think that the herd needs to shut the hell up so the leaders can lead and who are willing to let him be the face and you have the Bush administration.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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