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Ps3

post #1 of 64
5/8/06 at 7:14pm
Thread Starter 
Seems like a joke. It is priced 200 dollers higher than the 360, for what? The graphics are about equal and while the processor on the PS3 may seem great it won't make too much a difference. Most all the games are supposed to be on 360 besides FFX111 (how many will they make?) and MGS. Splinter Cell IMO is better than MGS, and at least rivals it. The PS3 is lost on FPS compared to Halo, GR, Quake, and Half-Life. Anyone else think that the PS3 really won't be too great?


EDIT: By the way it seemed like this would be the best palce to put this seeing as it is future hardware other than Apple. Please move if needed.
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post #2 of 64
5/8/06 at 7:19pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shadow Slayer 26
Seems like a joke. It is priced 200 dollers higher than the 360, for what? The graphics are about equal and while the processor on the PS3 may seem great it won't make too much a difference. Most all the games are supposed to be on 360 besides FFX111 (how many will they make?) and MGS. Splinter Cell IMO is better than MGS, and at least rivals it. The PS3 is lost on FPS compared to Halo, GR, Quake, and Half-Life. Anyone else think that the PS3 really won't be too great?


EDIT: By the way it seemed like this would be the best palce to put this seeing as it is future hardware other than Apple. Please move if needed.

It is the same price as the 360 - the 20GB PS3 is equipped like the $399 xbox360, and the 360 is over $500 once you include the wireless adapter (which the PS3 has built in).

There are way more games in the pipeline for the PS3 than for the xbox. I like both systems - but you seem to have an axe to grind.

The PS3 will join my xbox360, and I will also get a Wii or two.
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post #3 of 64
5/8/06 at 7:37pm
I was expecting the PS3 to cost about $500, I'll probably preorder one tomorrow if I can find a store around here that's taking them.

I had already accepted the fact that a Blu-Ray player alone would probably set me back about $500 so instead of getting a Blu-Ray player in the next month and a PS3 in November, I'll just wait until November and get just the PS3.

As for the PS3 vs. Xbox 360 debates, can't it wait at least a few more days so people can actually *try* a PS3 out before claiming that one system is better than the other?

I'm looking forward to possibly seeing Halo 3 tomorrow at the Microsoft event and maybe learning more about their HD-DVD drive add-on, and am interested in seeing what Nintendo does with the Wii (which I think is a horrible name, the marketing department should be ashamed). I also wonder if Nintendo will further delay the new Zelda game or take it off the GameCube entirely. It's just about the only major, exclusive game left on the Cube's release list.

$500 is a lot of money for a console and we still have to see if the $600 console gets you anything more than just a 40 GB increase in the hard drive. Add in a second controller (likely $50), and 3 games (likely $50-60 each) and you're looking at spending $800 on November 17. That said, I have little doubt that Sony will have much of an issue selling out for the holidays.
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post #4 of 64
5/8/06 at 7:43pm
Well, I just finished reading a PDF from Sony's website and it's not looking good.

http://www.scei.co.jp/corporate/release/pdf/060509c.pdf

The $500 PS3 *is* severely lacking. The 20 GB Hard Drive version has no HDMI port, no memory card slots, and no 802.11 wireless.

So I'm looking at the $600 PS3 so I can get the most out of my 1080p TV. No HDMI port is a deal breaker for me on the $500 model.
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post #5 of 64
5/8/06 at 8:09pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Shadow Slayer 26
Seems like a joke. It is priced 200 doll[a]rs higher than the 360, for what? The graphics are about equal . . .

We shall certainly see if this is the case. The PS3 is so architecturally different than past machines that I don't think we'll see it uncorked until the 2nd generation of games. Even so, I'd wager that it's graphics are better in the first gen than the xbox's will ever be.

Sony took a gamble with PS3. If Blu-ray wins (which it looks like it will), and early unit sales are good enough to offset some of the Cell R&D, the cost will come down substantially. Sony wants to snuff out the xbox division entirely. It's hard to say if the PS3 was the right product to do just that, but things work out in the first year, there won't be a good reason to buy an xbox.
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post #6 of 64
5/8/06 at 8:18pm
I'll be pre-ordering mine tomorrow.
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post #7 of 64
5/8/06 at 9:36pm
I can wait a year and the price will plummet to normal human levels...
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post #8 of 64
5/8/06 at 10:52pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Splinemodel
We shall certainly see if this is the case. The PS3 is so architecturally different than past machines that I don't think we'll see it uncorked until the 2nd generation of games. Even so, I'd wager that it's graphics are better in the first gen than the xbox's will ever be.

Sony took a gamble with PS3. If Blu-ray wins (which it looks like it will), and early unit sales are good enough to offset some of the Cell R&D, the cost will come down substantially. Sony wants to snuff out the xbox division entirely. It's hard to say if the PS3 was the right product to do just that, but things work out in the first year, there won't be a good reason to buy an xbox.

I'm not even sure Sony is trying at this point. The gamepad design is telling...a rehash of a decade old design. I'd wager the "graphics" aren't even largely affected by the the differences in Cell and Xenon.

Just imagine Christmas 2006. The XBox 360's going to be shipping in quantity at $400. Availability is going to make Sony lose in Q4 2006 alone.
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post #9 of 64
5/8/06 at 11:14pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Fran441
The $500 PS3 *is* severely lacking. The 20 GB Hard Drive version has no HDMI port, no memory card slots, and no 802.11 wireless.

I've got to say... I am absolutely floored by that.

The PS3 is a $600 console. Holy mother of god.

I honestly can't believe that's true. I need some kind of confirmation on this.
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post #10 of 64
5/9/06 at 4:57am
I posted the Sony PDF right from their site, not sure how much more confirmation there can be.

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/705/705887p1.html

IGN is saying they ditched dual-HDMI completely on both models.
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post #11 of 64
5/9/06 at 5:07am
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Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
I've got to say... I am absolutely floored by that.

The PS3 is a $600 console. Holy mother of god.

I honestly can't believe that's true. I need some kind of confirmation on this.

Like I said, the xbox is really $500. And since the blu-ray player and cell processor cost $900 total just by themselves, you are getting a hell of a deal at $600.
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post #12 of 64
5/9/06 at 5:33am
Still, I can't justify $300 for a console. I hope the Wii is reasonable. Although, my gaming needs are pretty simple. A few Zelda or adventure type games and I'm good.
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post #13 of 64
5/9/06 at 11:39am
(moved from my general discussion thread)

Has anyone had a chance to see some of the new footage of the
new PS3 games that are coming out? I was on gametrailers.com
downloading videos of Metal Gear, the New Assassin game from
Ubisoft, Gran Tourismo, Warhawk, & etc. Everything looked incredible.
A couple suprising things that stood out:

The demo of Tiger Woods 2K7 -
This guy was making a virtual Tiger Woods say different catchphrases
in realtime & the quality of the character model was amazing. It made
the 360 version look like crap.

I saw a demo of a card battle game that uses an iToy camera. The
camera was pointed down at a special game board & the guy placed
a card down on it. All the sudden a 3D dragon popped out of the card!
The guy was even able to interact with it. He tried to pet it & the
dragon & it tried to bite his hand. Trippy...it reminded me of the 3D
chess game from Star Wars.

The live demo of Warhawk was sweet as well. Volumetric clouds,
smooth framerate & the guy was tilting the controller in order to
direct the craft.

The only thing that was lame was that the cheaper version of the
PS3 will not have an HDMI output. I'm guessing that alot of people
are going to be pissed about the $599 price tag also but I don't
think that it's that rediculous considering that it's an HD Bluray
player as well as a game system. I heard that the HD DVD add-on
for the 360 is going to be between $100-$200.


I was also reading the keynote for Nintendo's Wii system which is
also looking pretty sweet. Did they list a price for it yet? I've been
hearing different things; from $250 down to free when you buy 3
games & a second controller. That would be a genius move on
Nintendo's part if it's true. I'm pretty sure that Nintendo has sold
their previous systems at a small profit compared to Sony &
Microsoft which take $100+ loss on their systems. It would
guarantee them second place & possibly first if they did do that.
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Brock Samson: You didn't tell me Sasquatch was a... a dude.
Steve Summers: What, you couldn't tell?
Brock Samson: Not until I had to...[shudders] shave him.
Steve Summers: What are you, shy?...


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post #14 of 64
5/9/06 at 12:49pm
Grand Theft Auto 4 on Xbox 360 on October 16! The PS3 version in
November! I want to see some footage of that game stat!
Brock Samson: You didn't tell me Sasquatch was a... a dude.
Steve Summers: What, you couldn't tell?
Brock Samson: Not until I had to...[shudders] shave him.
Steve Summers: What are you, shy?...


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Brock Samson: You didn't tell me Sasquatch was a... a dude.
Steve Summers: What, you couldn't tell?
Brock Samson: Not until I had to...[shudders] shave him.
Steve Summers: What are you, shy?...


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post #15 of 64
5/9/06 at 12:57pm
That's October 2007.....
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post #16 of 64
5/9/06 at 1:05pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Fran441
That's October 2007.....

I just saw the correction:

(Updated: GTA4 is dropping in 2007 -- not 2006 -- meaning it will
ostensibly drop on both 360 and PS3 on the same date, or "day one" as
Mr. Moore said.)
Brock Samson: You didn't tell me Sasquatch was a... a dude.
Steve Summers: What, you couldn't tell?
Brock Samson: Not until I had to...[shudders] shave him.
Steve Summers: What are you, shy?...


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Brock Samson: You didn't tell me Sasquatch was a... a dude.
Steve Summers: What, you couldn't tell?
Brock Samson: Not until I had to...[shudders] shave him.
Steve Summers: What are you, shy?...


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post #17 of 64
5/9/06 at 1:45pm
Quote:
Originally posted by e1618978
Like I said, the xbox is really $500. And since the blu-ray player and cell processor cost $900 total just by themselves, you are getting a hell of a deal at $600.

Like all of Sony's proprietary formats, Blu-Ray will likely fail. And who the hell cares about having Cell? The games are what matters, no one is going to buy a Cell at any price.
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post #18 of 64
5/9/06 at 2:32pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
Like all of Sony's proprietary formats, Blu-Ray will likely fail. And who the hell cares about having Cell? The games are what matters, no one is going to buy a Cell at any price.

You are all making a big deal out of a $100 price difference, and I just don't see why.

The bottom of the line PS3 matches up feature wise with the top of the line xbox360. Both have a 20 gig hard drive, no wireless, no hdmi, component hdtv. The blu-ray disk means that there will be a lot more room to build good games in.

It is more powerful by far than a mac mini, and cheaper.
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post #19 of 64
5/9/06 at 4:01pm
Quote:
You are all making a big deal out of a $100 price difference, and I just don't see why.

We'll see if it's only a $100 on PS3's launch day. Plenty of time for Microsoft to drop their price.

I'm not saying the PS3 is a rip-off or that it won't be successful (even dominant), but I think the "you're getting a good deal" argument is groundless because customers are subsidizing Sony's efforts in a format war it will probably lose.

I really don't like the idea of paying so much for Sony's larger corporate goals.

Quote:
The blu-ray disk means that there will be a lot more room to build good games in.

This is a good point. The PS3 does certainly seem to have tremendous abilities.
I'm sure the dozens of GB of full motion video replacing gameplay will be fantastic.

Quote:
It is more powerful by far than a mac mini, and cheaper.

That's a very odd comparison to make. A meaningless one, as well.
Sony marketing hype aside, the PS3 is nothing more than a games console.

In truth, I may actually end up with a PS3. It is far more likely that I get one of those than an XBox360, actually. As a matter of fact, if Sony comes up with a solid media center software package for the PS3 I'd damn near guarantee I would have one.

The PS3 is a huge risk. With all that horsepower they can do some amazing things, what's so disappointing now is that their vision seems truly is as incremental as the name of the console indicates. It's like watching someone take a Ferrari out on a go-kart course.
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post #20 of 64
5/9/06 at 5:24pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
That's a very odd comparison to make. A meaningless one, as well.

The PS3 is going to run Linux - it comes pre-installed on the hard drive. You will be able to browse the internet, post to appleInsider, buy from amazon, run openoffice, etc.

It can do everything the mac mini can do (except run mac os X - at least until somebody gets it running).
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post #21 of 64
5/9/06 at 5:54pm
Quote:
Originally posted by e1618978
The PS3 is going to run Linux - it comes pre-installed on the hard drive. You will be able to browse the internet, post to appleInsider, buy from amazon, run openoffice, etc.

It can do everything the mac mini can do (except run mac os X - at least until somebody gets it running).

Where do you get this information?
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post #22 of 64
5/9/06 at 6:04pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
Where do you get this information?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3#_note-5

* Hard Drive: Standard 60 GB, 2.5", detachable/upgradeable, with [b]Linux pre-installed[\\b].[7][8]

http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS2370343858.html

"Sony President Ken Kutaragi confirmed that the Playstation 3 (PS3) has been delayed, at a press conference in Tokyo earlier this week. Kutaragi additionally confirmed that the gaming console will ship with an upgradable 60GB hard drive pre-installed with Linux, according to in-depth coverage at 1up.com."

The PS3 will be all the computer that most people need (in fact, all the computer they will EVER need unless some really big resource hog of an application becomes popular) - and they will sell 100,000,000 of them. Apple is doomed unless they merge with Nintendo. Microsoft needs to add a lot more computer functionality to the 360 if they want to survive in the home market also - I was expecting them to do it the first time round, to steal market share from Dell and co, but I guess that they were too chicken.
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post #23 of 64
5/9/06 at 8:47pm
Information; not wild, baseless rumors.

The idea that Sony would let unsigned code run on its console is, I think, absurd. With all the anti-piracy crap they turn out now why would they ship their baby completely open like that?
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post #24 of 64
5/9/06 at 10:55pm
Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
Like all of Sony's proprietary formats, Blu-Ray will likely fail.....

....because customers are subsidizing Sony's efforts in a format war it will probably lose.

Based on what? Your opinion?

Blu-ray has a majority of the Studios, CE manufactures and a higher capacity disc. Why is it likely to fail?

You want "information" from e1618978.
How about you give us the same thing. Or are your opinions simply based on your bias?
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post #25 of 64
5/9/06 at 11:21pm
I have history on my side; a history of Sony failing miserably at trying to get their media formats up front.

I don't have a bias against Blu-Ray. I have no affection for either HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. I am not convinced either format will do anything (I don't know if the demand for such a convoluted system as is presented by both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray, with its blacklists and downsampling, will ever capture the public imagination) or make a dent in the market.

I actually hope both fail on a grand scale. The DRM "precautions" taken by both are absolutely frightening.


Also, if I own another next-gen console aside from the Wii it will definitely be the PS3 over the Xbox360. I'm not anti-PS or anything.
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post #26 of 64
5/10/06 at 4:38am
Heh, I made the same arguments about 'history' with all the different examples of Sony's failed video formats in the HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray thread groverat, people just seem to dismiss it. They won't even acknowledge that the UMD movie format completely flopped.

But remember, those who ignore the past are doomed to repeat it. Sony seems to realize this and that's why they are throwing everything they have into this format. I still believe, however, that they are so concerned about building Blu-Ray market share, they are letting their console market share slip through their fingers and into the hands of Microsoft.
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post #27 of 64
5/10/06 at 4:43am
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Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
Information; not wild, baseless rumors.

The idea that Sony would let unsigned code run on its console is, I think, absurd. With all the anti-piracy crap they turn out now why would they ship their baby completely open like that?

What? An announcement by the Sony president is not good enough for you? What did you want for evidence? Letters written in a burning bush or something?

"The big feature of the processor is that multiple operating systems run on it. From the beginning, I wanted multiple OS to run on the processor simultaneously.

The Cell processor has a kernel called Level 0 at the bottom. This level is not disclosed and is kept secure. Level 1 handles operations close to the kernel, such as scheduling, the real-time kernel and device drivers. Level 2, which we call the guest OS layer, is for general-purpose operating systems such as Linux, PC and other Playstation OSes. All OSes and applications run on Level 2 or higher. Programmers can concentrate on their targeted area of concern without worrying about other OSes."

http://www.eetasia.com/ART_880037305...bd8aa3b_no.HTM

The Linux pre-loaded hard drive has been announced at multiple press conferences and interviews.
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post #28 of 64
5/10/06 at 4:44am
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If you factor in the HD-DVD expansion to the 360 and a year's subscription to Live, the cost is about the same as the PS3.

 

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post #29 of 64
5/10/06 at 7:57am
blu-ray has three things going for it that will more than likely trump the "history" argument.

numero uno: blu has the support from all but one of the major motion picture studios where as hd-dvd has only three studios behind it. (granted this can change, but it is a telling sign as to which way the movie industry wants to go.

numero dos: blu has the support of the porn industry. this alone could very well determine the outcome of the race as it did with beta vs vhs.

numero tres: like it or not, playsation 3 is going to be a hit regardless of how badly sony may have bungled things to date. even conservative estimates have the ps3 out selling xbox something 3-4 to 1. as has been pointed out, it's all about the games and ps3 already has a ton lined up.
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post #30 of 64
5/10/06 at 8:53am
Linux being preloaded can mean just about anything. Linux can be turned into just about anything, included completely locked-down systems (it happens all the time).

rws:

I didn't know big porn was behind Blu-Ray, that could be the biggest gamechanger of all.
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post #31 of 64
5/10/06 at 9:21am
Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
I didn't know big porn was behind Blu-Ray, that could be the biggest gamechanger of all.

Would it really? I mean, who buys porn on physical media anymore? I sure as hell don't (and I likes my porn).
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post #32 of 64
5/10/06 at 10:18am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Flounder
Would it really? I mean, who buys porn on physical media anymore? I sure as hell don't (and I likes my porn).

Ask the porn kings rolling around in the cash from their dvd sales.

 

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post #33 of 64
5/10/06 at 11:48am
Quote:
Originally posted by groverat
I didn't know big porn was behind Blu-Ray, that could be the biggest gamechanger of all.

Yeah, porn isn't actually an accurate predictor of future formats. It won once, with VHS, because VHS was cheaper.

People just like to repeat that story because it's fun to talk about porn. In a ten-year-old kind of way.
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post #34 of 64
5/10/06 at 12:19pm
Quote:
Originally posted by gregmightdothat
Yeah, porn isn't actually an accurate predictor of future formats. It won once, with VHS, because VHS was cheaper.

People just like to repeat that story because it's fun to talk about porn. In a ten-year-old kind of way.

i would say that people repeat this because the porn industry is usually an early adopter of technology. they understand it and they figure out how to make money with it generally before most of the rest of the industry.
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post #35 of 64
5/10/06 at 1:25pm
Quote:
Originally posted by running with scissors
i would say that people repeat this because the porn industry is usually an early adopter of technology. they understand it and they figure out how to make money with it generally before most of the rest of the industry.

That's a good point. They certainly figured out how to make money off the internet WAY before most.
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post #36 of 64
5/10/06 at 1:35pm
Quote:
Originally posted by running with scissors
i would say that people repeat this because the porn industry is usually an early adopter of technology. they understand it and they figure out how to make money with it generally before most of the rest of the industry.

Plus, there's the fact the porn is a kind of "invisible" market driver-- that is, wherever there is porn, there are absolutely huge numbers, be it VHS sales, DVD sales and rentals, or paid download activity, but those numbers are rarely broken out in "mainstream" discussions of market, uh....penetration?
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post #37 of 64
5/10/06 at 2:57pm
Here's an actual announcement of real non-game software for the next generation... Opera on the Nintendo Wii.
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post #38 of 64
5/10/06 at 4:47pm
Thread Starter 
Really how much time will it take for developers to fill up a Blu-Ray with actually game? Sure there could be movies and all but if I wanted a movie I would buy a movie. Oblivion is a massive game that took a lot longer to make than most games and it fit on a normal DVD. I don't think there will really be that many games that are bigger than Oblivion. Also eventually I will be able to download Linux onto my 360...does it really matter if it comes preinstalled?

The PS3 has also bottle-necked itself. It really doesn't have enough RAM to handle all of it's raw power. I'm not going to delude myself and say that technically wise the 360 is more powerful, I just think it will be able to do the same amount of things as the PS3.

In regard to games I prefer the 360's much more. Dead or Alive games are by far some of the best fighting games out there. Ninja Gaiden doesn't have much competition but it is still a fun game. All the major FPS are covered on the 360. Forza will dominate over GT. I mean come on GT for the PS3 is practically a HD GT game. Forza 2 (coming his xmas season) will be extremely amazing. 300+ cars and even more upgrades for them than the first game. The 360 has Oblivion and is getting Blue Dragon (from the orginal creator of FF). It will also have Mass Effect which is starting to look awsome. There are even rumors of a 360 version of WoW.

Connectivity on the 360 will most likely also be much better. Microsoft dominates the OS market (of course it does, even though we all wish it didn't...) and will be able to sync it's OS to the 360 much more easily than sony will be able to. Right now I'm using Connect360 to get all my music and picture on my 360. I'm just waiting for a version where I can send my Videos over for RvB and the Halo 3 trailer (yes I'm a fan of Halo, along with all the other popular FPS...I'm not one of those Halo fans who thinks Halo started FPSs). Also I have a feeling we will see the 360 becoming more and more a media hub. Microsoft wants this console to last a decade, they will add peripherals to get it to connect to everything tech. we use in our lives.

P.S. After watching some E3 I think I'm going to have to buy a Wii (I hate the name still) if it is cheap enough. My first Nintendo console besides gameboy...lol (I played on my friends NES, SNEW, N64 and so on so I never bothered to buy my own).
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post #39 of 64
5/10/06 at 6:27pm
If you start loading games up to hit 1080p you can fill up space very quickly.

If there's one thing that's constant in computing, it's that you can always use more space.
proud resident of a failed state
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proud resident of a failed state
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post #40 of 64
5/10/06 at 8:20pm
I will never pre-order anything from gamesux again. They screwed me over on the 360. I will most likely get a ps3 later on, after the hype has died down. Everyone remember that blu-ray might store lots of data, but it also reads at a snails pace compared to a dvd. Those drives won't have faster read until a rev. c or d ps3. Expect to do something during those awful load times. I would rather have slightly worse graphics then wait forever to play a game. And the controller for ps3 looks terrible, they should stick with what works. The ps3 also needs to lose that lame spiderman font.
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