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Intel rolls out Broadwater, says 3.2GHz Woodcrest planned - Page 2

post #41 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by henryblackman
I may be right in thinking that in the Windows world, Merom will carry on the Centrino name as Intel Core already has, but Conroe will simply be referred to as Core 2. The message is confusing with Apple's non-use of the Centrino brand - but let's see what their marketing people come up with when their use of the various options pans out.

This is a common mistake.

Centrino isn't a CPU. It's a package consisting of the CPU, chipset and wifi components.

Apple doesn't use all the components so can't market it as Centrino even if they were inclined to do so. I'm not sure it'd carry any marketing clout anyway since it's mostly a badge marketing exercise. Manufacturers get discounts for sticking those horrible badges on their laptops.

There's similar schemes for VIIV and vPRO for media and office desktops respectively.


Quote:
Originally posted by henryblackman
In fact, another question... will Intel Core (Yonah) be discontinued, or be the budget option as Celeron is now? This might be what Apple need to differentiate Macbook from Macbook Pro, and Mac Pro from iMac/eMac?!?!

The Celeron M 4xx series is based on the Yonah already. I'd imagine Apple would have used that already if they wanted to. I'd also guess the Macbook Pro will use Merom as soon as the next CPU refresh and they up the Pro to 2.3Ghz although they may hold off for the next chipset for the MacBook to get better integrated graphics.

The iMac uses a laptop CPU - Yonah - with slow FSB and lower performance. The MacPro (or whatever it'll be called) won't. Already quite different even just at the technology level never mind the form factors. I do wonder though if they'll use Conroe instead of Merom in the next iMac. Conroe is likely to be cheaper as it's a desktop part.
post #42 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by nagromme
This thread, if you read the article, CONTRADICTS the months of discussion, in claiming that C2X is Woodcrest.

That's why I asked, is this new info?

And thanks to those who have answered: it sounds like MISinfo.

My bad. I Originally thought this was the The Intel Powermac / Powermac Conroe / Mac Pro thread, not realsing AI had statrted another thread with the same info rolled into it.
And we were doing so good at keeping clutter down about it too.
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post #43 of 147
I think the confusion of Core Duo Extreme, and woodcrest may be in reference to the 20%, or 40% lower wattage version of woodcrest that intel had mentioned previously. There were articles about this other woodcrest processor about a month ago, and all it is is probably a Conroe that can be used in dual sockets. I'm merely guessing of course, but it's possible that was the woodcrest reference. I just remember it used a lot less power than the current ones, and ran cooler also.
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post #44 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by onlooker
I think the confusion of Core Duo Extreme, and woodcrest may be in reference to the 20%, or 40% lower wattage version of woodcrest that intel had mentioned previously. There were articles about this other woodcrest processor about a month ago, and all it is is probably a Conroe that can be used in dual sockets. I'm merely guessing of course, but it's possible that was the woodcrest reference. I just remember it used a lot less power than the current ones, and ran cooler also.

Woodcrest will use a lot less power than the current Xeons which are still power hungry Netburst architecture chips for the most part. The exception being a low power Xeon based on Yonah, which barely anyone uses as it's also slower than almost every server class chip. And Opterons are faster and cooler in that server space anyway.
post #45 of 147
What I want to happen:
  • Mac Pro uses Woodcrest on the whole range, low model with 1 chip and top with 2 (the Quad)
  • iMac goes Conroe and switches internal design (again!) to desktop ram to match its new desktop cpu and chipset
  • new eMac and the Mac mini keep the bottom end ticking over
  • MacBook Pro goes Merom ASAP still using ATI's graphics cards
  • MacBook clings to Yonah until a new chipset with substantially improved onboard graphics comes out for Merom

What might happen instead:
  • Mac Pro uses Conroe (argh!) and although it'll be a strong machine, the ghost of the Quad will haunt us at least until next year! (the Quad is dead, long live the Quad?)
  • iMac stays Yonah in some daft move to "keep the gap" between the consumer and pro desktops / Intel offers a sweet discount deal which goes straight to Apple's profits
  • new eMac and Mac mini will basically keep the bottom end ticking over regardless, though just how much they'll be beneath the other models is all about the Yonah>Merom>Conroe transitions for iMac, MBP etc.
  • MacBook Pro goes Merom and <gulp> Intel graphics!?!?!
  • MacBook lingers on Yonah for ages and we all start upgrading them to Merom ourselves!

Come on Apple, do it right. The Yonah's been great so far, but don't let them Wintel folk ride off into the distance re: Merom, Conroe and Woodcrest. We expect our Pro Macs to come with industry leading hardware. You can do it!
post #46 of 147
fuyutsuki - spot on.

I'd add

'Apple introduces the Mac (non-Pro) with Conroe and cube like form plus new cheaper Cinema displays' to the wish list and 'Apple removes the ATi graphics from the iMac for Intel Integrated' for the what might happen if it's a disaster list.
post #47 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by aegisdesign
Woodcrest will use a lot less power than the current Xeons which are still power hungry Netburst architecture chips for the most part. The exception being a low power Xeon based on Yonah, which barely anyone uses as it's also slower than almost every server class chip. And Opterons are faster and cooler in that server space anyway.

I didn't say less power than current Xeons, I'm saying less power than the first batch of woodcrests. There were articles on it about a month ago. There are refrences to it many pages back in the PowerMac thread somwhere.

fuyutsuki if "what might happen" happens. I'll sell all my old macs, and forget the platform ever existed.
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post #48 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by onlooker
fuyutsuki if "what might happen" happens. I'll sell all my old macs, and forget the platform ever existed.

Ouch! Good luck with Ubuntu then.

I'm actually looking forward to Leopard even more than the new 64 bit hardware later this year. But I guess that's because I can afford it a little easier than a Mac Pro with or without Woodcrest!
post #49 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by henryblackman
OK. Merom, Conroe and Woodcrest are all Core 2 chips. Core 2 is simply the brand name for these things.

Woodcrest is considered a Xeon chip (at least that's the branding), but it is based on the Core 2 architecture, as this gives some significant performance gains in some circumstances, over the current Xeon architecture. It's also the most expensive of the lot because of those performance gains (bigger cache etc).

Merom, Conroe (Core 2 Duo/Extreme) and Woodcrest (Xeon) are based of the Core microarchitecture, also known as NGMA. The Core Duo (Yonah) architecture has no official name.

There are no such thing as a Xeon microarchitecture, the current Xeon CPUs are based on the NetBurst architecture. As far as I know, the Woodcrest has the same cache levels as the rest of the NGMA chips, apart from the low end which has just 2 MB. The high end multiprocessor CPUs are still based on NetBurst and employ a fairly handsome amount of L3 cache.

So, in short. There are no Core2 microarchtecture, there are no Xeon microarchitecture. They are just brand names. All the new CPUs are based of the Core/NGMA microarchitecture, with some small differences between the cores.
post #50 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by fuyutsuki
What I want to happen:
  • Mac Pro uses Woodcrest on the whole range, low model with 1 chip and top with 2 (the Quad)
  • iMac goes Conroe and switches internal design (again!) to desktop ram to match its new desktop cpu and chipset
  • new eMac and the Mac mini keep the bottom end ticking over
  • MacBook Pro goes Merom ASAP still using ATI's graphics cards
  • MacBook clings to Yonah until a new chipset with substantially improved onboard graphics comes out for Merom

What might happen instead:
  • Mac Pro uses Conroe (argh!) and although it'll be a strong machine, the ghost of the Quad will haunt us at least until next year! (the Quad is dead, long live the Quad?)
  • iMac stays Yonah in some daft move to "keep the gap" between the consumer and pro desktops / Intel offers a sweet discount deal which goes straight to Apple's profits
  • new eMac and Mac mini will basically keep the bottom end ticking over regardless, though just how much they'll be beneath the other models is all about the Yonah>Merom>Conroe transitions for iMac, MBP etc.
  • MacBook Pro goes Merom and <gulp> Intel graphics!?!?!
  • MacBook lingers on Yonah for ages and we all start upgrading them to Merom ourselves!

Come on Apple, do it right. The Yonah's been great so far, but don't let them Wintel folk ride off into the distance re: Merom, Conroe and Woodcrest. We expect our Pro Macs to come with industry leading hardware. You can do it!

I agree with your wish list, I like it. The 'what might happen instead' doesn't worry me to much. Consider this. Dell and most pc vendors will introduce conroe based desktops soon and I've seen it suggested that they may cost under $1000. That would humble the iMac packing only a ICD at a cost starting at $1200. One reason the iMac may not have gotten a speed bump yet is that Apple is busy redesigning for Conroe. Let's hope so.
post #51 of 147
Ideally, Apple is going to offer Woodcrest across the Pro lineup in single and dual configs...*unsoldered*. But who am I kidding, right?
post #52 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by kim kap sol
Ideally, Apple is going to offer Woodcrest across the Pro lineup in single and dual configs...*unsoldered*. But who am I kidding, right?

Whoah ... an easily *upgradeable* Pro Mac ... we can but dream! 8)

backtomac: I think this is indeed the case. The Yonah was the ideal chip to kick off Apple's Intel transition. I think the timing was all worked out precisely so that it could be used and we'd all be eager for it. But Yonah is 32 bit and there's no desktop version: it is a transitional chip for Intel as well as Apple. And from here on in it's Merom, Conroe and Woodcrest all the way (until the quad core models!)

That's what I really like about being on Intel now. The PACE!

AMD* are great competition who I sincerely hope are about to unveil something awesome of their own, to keep up the pressure in this two horse race which Apple are now riding for all that it's worth!

*Better declare my interest as a former AMD fanboy back in my Windows days. My first gen 800MHz slot Athlon still loiters on a shelf.
post #53 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by kim kap sol
Ideally, Apple is going to offer Woodcrest across the Pro lineup in single and dual configs...*unsoldered*. But who am I kidding, right?

The interesting problem then is where they put Conroe ?

If they stick with laptop parts in the iMac then it's going to be more expensive and slower than other desktops based on Conroe.

If they don't do a lower end MacPro with Conroe and use Woodcrest then they've only got expensive workstation class machines.

Conroe must go somewhere otherwise Apple's machines will be uncompetitive again.
post #54 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by fuyutsuki
Whoah ... an easily *upgradeable* Pro Mac ... we can but dream! 8)

backtomac: I think this is indeed the case. The Yonah was the ideal chip to kick off Apple's Intel transition. I think the timing was all worked out precisely so that it could be used and we'd all be eager for it. But Yonah is 32 bit and there's no desktop version: it is a transitional chip for Intel as well as Apple. And from here on in it's Merom, Conroe and Woodcrest all the way (until the quad core models!)

That's what I really like about being on Intel now. The PACE!

AMD* are great competition who I sincerely hope are about to unveil something awesome of their own, to keep up the pressure in this two horse race which Apple are now riding for all that it's worth!

*Better declare my interest as a former AMD fanboy back in my Windows days. My first gen 800MHz slot Athlon still loiters on a shelf.

My wife has an HP with Athlon chip. It was and still is a fine chip. I do think though that Intel is going to get the better of AMD with their core 2 chips. At least for a little while.
post #55 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by aegisdesign
The interesting problem then is where they put Conroe ?

If they stick with laptop parts in the iMac then it's going to be more expensive and slower than other desktops based on Conroe.

If they don't do a lower end MacPro with Conroe and use Woodcrest then they've only got expensive workstation class machines.

Conroe must go somewhere otherwise Apple's machines will be uncompetitive again.

iMac needs to go Conroe and I really expect it will. The form factor could handle a G5 so a Conroe should be just fine, and cheaper / faster than an equivalent Merom.

The problem with mixing Conroe and Woodcrest in the Mac Pro line is that they're quite different chips on the outside and require different chipsets and sockets. A whole new model of low end Mac Pro's, which people here call out for as simply the "Mac" or a new Cube could fill a hole and be the headless Conroe Mac which some will certainly desire. I'm not sure how this would fit in with Apple's policy of a clean model lineup though. They have been expanding SKU's recently with the multiple colour iPods and MacBooks I suppose, but I doubt we'll see this machine.
post #56 of 147
It would have been less confusing had the article stated:
Quote:
The world's largest chipmaker also divulged the clock speeds of two upcoming Core 2 Extreme processor and introduced a new low-voltage Core Duo chip.

During the presentation, Intel senior vice president Anand Chandrasekher ALSO officially unveiled the company's 965 Express Chipset, formerly code-named "Broadwater."

This MacWorld article makes it clearer:
Quote:
The P965 Express chipset, formerly code-named Broadwater, will work with Intel's new Core 2 Duo desktop processor, also known as Conroe, which is due to go on sale next month. The chipset has started shipping in volume to PC makers already, Intel said.

Chipsets are collections of chips that surround the main processor and connect it to other parts of the motherboard. Together, the new desktop chips will offer a big boost in PC performance, including better graphics, while also using less power, said Anand Chandrasekher, an Intel senior vice president, in a speech at the start of Computex trade show in Taipei.
post #57 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by aegisdesign
The interesting problem then is where they put Conroe ?

If they stick with laptop parts in the iMac then it's going to be more expensive and slower than other desktops based on Conroe.

If they don't do a lower end MacPro with Conroe and use Woodcrest then they've only got expensive workstation class machines.

Conroe must go somewhere otherwise Apple's machines will be uncompetitive again.

I vote for iMac. It may require a redesign but it would be worth the effort. If the form factor has to change a little to accomodate a desktop cpu so be it. Performace should take priority over form factor IMO.
post #58 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by fuyutsuki
  • MacBook clings to Yonah until a new chipset with substantially improved onboard graphics comes out for Merom

the G965, the broadwater with graphics version, will be out in a couple months, and is supposed to be quite a bit faster, and support more features, some important ones like hardware T&L.
post #59 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by backtomac
I vote for iMac. It may require a redesign but it would be worth the effort. If the form factor has to change a little to accomodate a desktop cpu so be it. Performace should take priority over form factor IMO.

I don't see why you guy's stress that it actually needs a redesign to handle the conroe CPU. The thing had a G5 in it before as previously stated.

Nevertheless I think Apple is going to change the enclosures of their entire lineup regardless, and very soon anyway.
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post #60 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by onlooker
I don't see why you guy's stress that it actually needs a redesign to handle the conroe CPU. The thing had a G5 in it before as previously stated.

Nevertheless I think Apple is going to change the enclosures of their entire lineup regardless, and very soon anyway.

I don't know. Some have suggested that Merom is going in to iMac since it would definately not require a redesign. I feel that conroe would be better even if a redesign is necessary. It looks like Conroe has room to grow in speed that Merom does not.
post #61 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by henryblackman
In fact, another question... will Intel Core (Yonah) be discontinued, or be the budget option as Celeron is now? This might be what Apple need to differentiate Macbook from Macbook Pro, and Mac Pro from iMac/eMac?!?!

I think you're correct about yonah becoming the new celeron with Merom being the centrino replacement. I couldn't see intel using a cpu for 8 months then dropping it forever.

 

 

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post #62 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by backtomac
I don't know. Some have suggested that Merom is going in to iMac since it would definately not require a redesign. I feel that conroe would be better even if a redesign is necessary. It looks like Conroe has room to grow in speed that Merom does not.

Yah I'll bite onto that. I don't think it would require a redesign on apple's part though, more intel who makes the mobo.

 

 

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post #63 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by emig647
I think you're correct about yonah becoming the new celeron with Merom being the centrino replacement. I couldn't see intel using a cpu for 8 months then dropping it forever.

As pointed out earlier, Yonah already IS the new Celeron M and Centrino isn't a CPU, it's a platform of technologies.

Quote:
Originally posted by emig647
Yah I'll bite onto that. I don't think it would require a redesign on apple's part though, more intel who makes the mobo.

Intel don't make the motherboard and in any case, the redesign would mostly be because of a change in the thermal requirements in the case, not the motherboard, and since the 2.1Ghz G5 was pretty close to the Conroe in TDP I'd guess there's no work in the case design to be done.
post #64 of 147
http://www.anandtech.com/IT/showdoc.aspx?i=2772&p=1

The Xeon 5160 (Woodcrest 3Ghz) just dominated Sun's T1 8-core proc and Opteron system.

Should there be any doubt that Apple's high end Mac Pro should be a SMP Xeon 5160?
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post #65 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by aegisdesign
Intel don't make the motherboard and in any case, the redesign would mostly be because of a change in the thermal requirements in the case, not the motherboard, and since the 2.1Ghz G5 was pretty close to the Conroe in TDP I'd guess there's no work in the case design to be done.

Who makes the motherboards and stamps intel on them then? Either way, the motherboard redesign was referring to the socket... what does the socket have to do with the case?

 

 

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post #66 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by emig647
Who makes the motherboards and stamps intel on them then? Either way, the motherboard redesign was referring to the socket... what does the socket have to do with the case?

The socket is a side issue. The design of the iMac is limited to an extent to what's inside it. If you add a much hotter chip then the design may have to change. However, I don't believe that it does need to since the case is the same as the last rev G5 iMac.
post #67 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by aegisdesign
The socket is a side issue. The design of the iMac is limited to an extent to what's inside it. If you add a much hotter chip then the design may have to change. However, I don't believe that it does need to since the case is the same as the last rev G5 iMac.

No the case is thinner. When apple went to the ICD they slimmed things up a bit and this meant we lost the ability to use VESA mounts.
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post #68 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by Booga
I think a lot of people speculating about Mac desktops are awfully hung up about the difference between Pentium 4's, D's, and Xeons. The bottom line is that it's all about performance and heat dissipation... when Apple can build an Intel desktop that rivals their PowerPCs in performance on MacOS productivity apps they'll release'em. It doesn't really matter what used to be a Xeon or a Pentium 4 class chip.

The distinction matters in the Pro towers mainly for one primary reason: dual socket. Xeon DP cores are generally very similar if not the same basic core as the consumer counterpart, so a Xeon alone doesn't mean it is faster than it's consumer counterpart. The consumer version would have it's multiprocessor capability reduced so it can't communicate with more than one IC. The Xeon platform chipsets do occasionally offer more advanced I/O than Intel's consumer counterparts, but for compute intensive tasks, a 3GHz P4 Xeon is about as fast as a 3GHz consumer P4.

Until some time next year, the top one or two tower models will have to be Woodcrest if it they are to be a Quad. The lower one or two models might be Conroe-based. After quad core chips are released, I really don't know what would happen, maybe a dual quad, but almost none of Apple's software can currently scale beyond two processors per task, much of iLife might only effectively use single processor. Apple needs to greatly improve its software to make a worthwhile case for an eight way computer.
post #69 of 147
For those of you unaware of the similarity between the iMac G5 and Core Duo, check out the motherboard comparison here...

http://mactree.sannet.ne.jp/~kodawar...c_intel03.html
post #70 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by hmurchison
No the case is thinner. When apple went to the ICD they slimmed things up a bit and this meant we lost the ability to use VESA mounts.

The loss of the VESA mount capability started with the iSight G5 iMac, not the Core Duo iMac.
post #71 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by hmurchison
No the case is thinner. When apple went to the ICD they slimmed things up a bit and this meant we lost the ability to use VESA mounts.

No, they did that with the last G5 with the iSight in. Same identical case.

It's not actually any thinner either. They just made the edge thinner. The first G5 iMacs were flat backed like an iPod. The later iSight G5 and Core Duo have convex backs and thinner edges. It's a visual trick.
post #72 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by hmurchison
No the case is thinner. When apple went to the ICD they slimmed things up a bit and this meant we lost the ability to use VESA mounts.

Didn't that happen on the last rev. of the G5 iMac? I remember watching the Stevenote where he showed off Front Row and Photobooth right after highlighting the iMac's new slim form.

I reckon the iMac case as is could handle Conroe easy, and SHOULD because it's Apple's mainstream desktop.

Edit: wow as soon as I've posted I see I'm third out of 3 put downs on that one!
post #73 of 147
Intel's kicking some BUTT!

It's finally really exciting to know that Apple CAN expand their product lines with Intel's coming technological lineup. Who's brilliant now? The jump has already proven to be the smartest move since OS-X.

Steve knew where he wanted to go more then 5 years ago and we are just now witnessing some of his visions. Can't wait to see what's around the corner from my fav company. We ALL know what a master Apple is at creating truley innovative stuff and it just looks wide open for them to do whatever they want.

Apple lust is already starting to build! Where will Apple be a couple years from now?
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post #74 of 147
Thanks for the update guys.

Sheesh memory's beginning to slip in my old age. I shan't mention that piece of misinformation again. As always you guys got my back.

Regards
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post #75 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by NVRsayNVR
Intel's kicking some BUTT!

Steve knew where he wanted to go more then 5 years ago and we are just now witnessing some of his visions. Can't wait to see what's around the corner from my fav company.

I'm sure Jonathan Ive has a few things up his sleeve now that Steve has given him the green light with the MacBook. 8)

It seems the plan was to release conservative (read: little modified) industrial designs at first (MBP and iMac) in order to emphasise that these Intels are still 100% Mac at heart. Then once we and the general public were cool with that, unleash the new models!

The MacBook is just the first of a bold new wave.
post #76 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by NVRsayNVR
Intel's kicking some BUTT!

It's finally really exciting to know that Apple CAN expand their product lines with Intel's coming technological lineup. Who's brilliant now? The jump has already proven to be the smartest move since OS-X.

I wouldn't be so sure.

So far the MacBook(Pro)s are running a lot hotter than expected and need bigger batteries to get decent battery life. If you were paying attention, Freescale actually released their Dual Core G4 8641D with built in DDR2 memory controller and a bunch of other stuff in it. It's been running at 2Ghz too.

Then their was PA Semi and who knows where IBM would be up to if the rug wasn't pulled last year. And there were various rumblings of technology from the consoles being offered to Apple. And now AMD are pushing the envelope with Coherant Hypertransport - a technology Apple could have used in it's G5s.

I don't think PowerPC is actually in that bad a shape just now but I don't think the switch was entirely about hardware.
post #77 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by aegisdesign
I wouldn't be so sure.

So far the MacBook(Pro)s are running a lot hotter than expected and need bigger batteries to get decent battery life. If you were paying attention, Freescale actually released their Dual Core G4 8641D with built in DDR2 memory controller and a bunch of other stuff in it. It's been running at 2Ghz too.

Then their was PA Semi and who knows where IBM would be up to if the rug wasn't pulled last year. And there were various rumblings of technology from the consoles being offered to Apple. And now AMD are pushing the envelope with Coherant Hypertransport - a technology Apple could have used in it's G5s.

I don't think PowerPC is actually in that bad a shape just now but I don't think the switch was entirely about hardware.

The G5's had this same problem though and the next chips to hit the MBP are already more efficient so the heat issue and battery longevity should be under control don't you think?

I really liked the idea of Freescale but Steve felt they were too slow in developing competitive chips and had issues with meeting supply demands.

Like Fuyutsuki suggests new case designs are immenent and will be in line with what's needed for these chips. Along with this Intel is on the move with more efficient chips so the question is... Where will it all take us, the consumer. I'm betting we go to cooler places with Intel!


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post #78 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by aegisdesign
I don't think PowerPC is actually in that bad a shape just now but I don't think the switch was entirely about hardware.

The race between Intel and AMD is now to Apple's favour like it is Dell and the rest. IBM and Motorola's historical (and continuing) difficulties to honour their roadmaps have been Apple's private bane for years and years. Now that problem is over, and Apple are playing the same ballgame as their competitors.

This isn't to say that the PPC architecture is now dead and buried. The consoles have pushed it in a new direction (and profitable from IBM's perspective). Integrated systems continue to dominate the actual number of chips produced. And I expect development to continue of course. BUT the platform's desktop credentials are set to decline even further now. Clockspeeds won't increase as strictly incrementally and regularly as AMD and Intel will achieve. It is, alas, a market which was already drifting away from Apple's needs long before the transition.

And never forget that AMD are a viable alternative now for Apple, a few years down the transition when the Intel name is no longer louder than "PowerPC" used to be.
post #79 of 147
PPC is not in bad shape when it comes to G5 vs. Netburst/Pentium. Pentium is dead, Core 2 is coming, and PPC vs. Core 2 won't look so good.

Meanwhile, G4 vs. Core 1 (or even Pentium M which is related) ALREADY is in bad shape. Which is why Macs don't have G4s anymore.

PS, to add to wish lists:

Let's see a broad range of Mac Pros:

* A new low-end lower-COST model (maybe smaller, maybe same size) that lacks a DVD burner (and/or uses a smaller HD) and uses a low-end Core 2 Duo Conroe, but allows gamers to BTO a really high-end GPU. Bingo! A mid-range headless at last!

* And then moving up the line, various Conroe AND Woodcrest models, topping out at quad cores.
post #80 of 147
Quote:
Originally posted by nagromme
PPC is not in bad shape when it comes to G5 vs. Netburst/Pentium. Pentium is dead, Core 2 is coming, and PPC vs. Core 2 won't look so good.

Meanwhile, G4 vs. Core 1 (or even Pentium M which is related) ALREADY is in bad shape. Which is why Macs don't have G4s anymore.

PS, to add to wish lists:

Let's see a broad range of Mac Pros. A new low-end model (maybe smaller, maybe same size) that lacks a DVD burner and uses a low-end Core 2 Duo Conroe, but allows gamers to BTO a really high-end GPU. Bingo! A mid-range headless at last! And the moving up the line, various Conroe AND Woodcrest models, topping out at quad cores.

N i c e...8)
never say never!
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never say never!
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