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apple aquires emagic

post #1 of 110
Thread Starter 
There was some speculation here last week that apple was about to aquire a leading audio app. They just have. check it out.


<a href="http://www.emagic.de/english/news/index.html" target="_blank">emagic.de</a>
post #2 of 110
[quote]Macintosh®-based products account for over 65 percent of Emagic’s current revenues. Emagic’s Windows-based product offerings will be discontinued on September 30, 2002.<hr></blockquote>

Whoever next??

J :cool:
post #3 of 110
- I used to be SdC, ting5, and YAR, but I'm sticking to Jet, I promise.
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- I used to be SdC, ting5, and YAR, but I'm sticking to Jet, I promise.
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post #4 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by wakerickman:
<strong>There was some speculation here last week that apple was about to aquire a leading audio app. They just have. check it out.


<a href="http://www.emagic.de/english/news/index.html" target="_blank">emagic.de</a></strong><hr></blockquote>

HOLY SH¡T!!!!!!!! This is amazing! Emagic is the the BEST possible company in the field to purchase! Its no secret that 65% of all top 10 hits in the US and UK are created using some sort of Emagic product. Logic Audio rocks but it costs a fortune. Oh baby, I can't wait for a free version of iLogic! And we can also expect an Apple Music Studio Pro software package as well for about $1000 (and EDU $300 EDU price). It's great to see Apple finally taking the music recording market seriously and doing it the right way. YEA!!!!!
post #5 of 110
[quote]Macintosh-based products account for over 65 percent of Emagic's current revenues. Emagic's Windows-based product offerings will be discontinued on September 30, 2002.
<hr></blockquote>

Sometimes Apple is lucky that it have less than 10% of the market share. If MS had done this...
post #6 of 110
at first i want my copy of an OS X version of Logic Audio Platinum 5 ... i hope they don't want current customers to pay for the update ... and then i will see what they'll do with the software - apple's final cut pro is a very good software and i hope they will combine these two products to have a uber-audio-video-production-software...
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post #7 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by Yet Another Registration:
<strong>
Nannie-nannie-boo-boo!

</strong><hr></blockquote>

Thanks for your input
post #8 of 110
Indeed VERY very big news. I have been reviewing Logic Audio 5 Platinum the last couple of months (for a danish magazine), and it is a GREAT product.

I have also tried the Mac OS X version...

RSN - and that's a fact!
post #9 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by Power Apple:
<strong>RSN - and that's a fact! </strong><hr></blockquote>


yeah, we all wish. Maybe now that Apple is in control it becomes reality.
I'm still undecided though if the step to discontinue Windows versions is a good one.


bye.
post #10 of 110
First off, well done to ting5/yar for breaking this rumour.

Secondly, :eek: :eek: :eek: !

Wow - I'm a staunch MOTU supporter, but this has good ramifications for myself at work now.

I can now happily tell the IT Dpt that our music software of choice (I'm a music teahcer) will not be supported for PCs anymore. YAY!!

Time to invest in a few eMacs and change over to OS X! Go Apple! Viva la revolution!
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post #11 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by GnOm:
<strong>

I'm still undecided though if the step to discontinue Windows versions is a good one.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

See Mac+'s post above. This is exactly why discontinuing the Windows version is a good idea.

J :cool:
post #12 of 110
This is a really big deal as it shows that Apple are finally serious about maintaining their near total command of the pro audio biz. Emagic are a big company and this purchase would not have been cheap!! :eek:
I expect to see a "final cut pro"-type approach, where Logic will become an Apple app (but not a free iApp) and the hardware expertise will be folded into future powermac designs. This is really , really good news for us audio freaks!! Now lets just hope Apple doesnt f*$k it up!! <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
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post #13 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by Jamie:
<strong>

See Mac+'s post above. This is exactly why discontinuing the Windows version is a good idea.

J :cool: </strong><hr></blockquote>


yepp, that's the positive side of it. The negative is cutting off one third of the users some of them just jet spended a lot of money on Logic and leaving them very pissed at emagic and/or Apple and that'll rather make them switch to Cubase than to Mac.
Hmm, after saying that I'm still undecided.


bye.
post #14 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by GnOm:
<strong>
yepp, that's the positive side of it. The negative is cutting off one third of the users some of them just jet spended a lot of money on Logic and leaving them very pissed at emagic and/or Apple and that'll rather make them switch to Cubase than to Mac.
Hmm, after saying that I'm still undecided. </strong><hr></blockquote>

We don't yet know what kind of exit strategy they might offer the windows users, if any. Of course, their wintel product should work after the purchase as well as it did before the purchase.
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post #15 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by GnOm:
<strong>


yeah, we all wish. Maybe now that Apple is in control it becomes reality.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Have you used the Mac OS X version??
I can tell you that it makes no difference for the Mac OS X version if Apple is in control or not!
post #16 of 110
For those of us not familiar with audio apps can someone give us a thumbnail sketch of emagic and how they rank in the world of pro and consumer apps? I've heard names like Motu and Pro Tools and such tossed about but have have no idea what they mean.

BTW - ting5 - thanks for the scoop.
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post #17 of 110
As I said, I'm a MOTU fan - and although I feel a tinge of regret for them being left out of the big buy-out party, I am for the most part happy with Apple's decision.

Whilst I believe MOTU's hardware and software solutions to be elegant as well as top-class, they were/are a very Mac-centric company.

Understandably, Apple have done their homework. In fact, I would not have been surprised if they polled teachers when they were designing the eMac. Something along the lines of "What software do you use in your curriculum area?" If most of the educators replied Emagic's Logic (or a variation thereof, such as MicroLogic) Apple would easily see this company as having significant inroads into the education market as well as the pro audio side. Apple then buys them out - ceases support for Windows products and hopefully picks up a significant marketshare.

This is why a buyout of Avid's ProTools, MOTU's DP or PropellerHeads' Reason and ReBirth would not have appeared as lucrative - even if their software products were perceived as being superior and/or market leaders. Essentially, they don't hold a strong Windows user base which Apple could hopefully convince to :eek: *switch* :eek:

If they bought these companies out, it would be like stealing from one hand to give to the other.

Anyway, the upshot is Apple is now headlong into developing music software. That's win-win baby!

And about time too!!

[Edit - typos: hate 'em]

[ 07-01-2002: Message edited by: Mac+ ]</p>
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post #18 of 110
as avid and FCP are now at heads and full competition so to will protools and apples emagic ( also owned by avid) - is that a coincidence?
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post #19 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by Thereubster:
<strong>I expect to see a "final cut pro"-type approach, where Logic will become an Apple app (but not a free iApp) and the hardware expertise will be folded into future powermac designs.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Please note that Emagic will continue as a seperate division, so I think that Logic will continue as a product.

But Emagic is supposed to be working on a pro audio app that will be interesting for pro video users too.

Combine Final Cut Pro, CinemaTools, Shake, Rayz, Chalice and Emagic's "secret super audio app", and I think Apple have something big up their sleeves.

They just need a 3D app - Alias|Wavefront or Maxon? (Apple seem to like the German companies: Astarte and Emagic, so why not Maxon).
JLL

95% percent of the boat is owned by Microsoft, but the 5% Apple controls happens to be the rudder!
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JLL

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post #20 of 110
No I dont think it is co-incidence.... Apple are reportedly pissed at Digidesign for arse-ing around for so long with Protools for OSX, so maybe they decided to take matters into their own hands. THis is good because now there (will be) 3 excellent OSX audio apps, Cubase SX, Digital performer and Apple/logic 5/6. Combine with G5 Powermac Cant wait!!!
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post #21 of 110
I wouldn't compare ProTools and Logic Audio together. Sure they both produce music but Protools and it's plethora of HW and Software makes in more of a Production Enviroment than LA. I hope Apple keeps all of the functionality and makes a kick ass product. I just spoke with a rep at Guitar Center and he had just recently went to a demo of LA and said that it literally BLEW HIM AWAY. I mentioned ACID and he said LA has looping as good as ACID and many other feature. Kudos Apple. I'll be looking for this App.


Looks like my wish of having "Office Production" is coming true. Apple only needs a decent 3D application to rule the roost! I nominate Maya!!

[ 07-01-2002: Message edited by: hmurchison ]</p>
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post #22 of 110
<a href="http://www.emagic.de/english/products/logic/lap/logicControl___XT.html" target="_blank">THIS IS WHAT I WANT!!!!1</a>
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post #23 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by JLL:
<strong>

Please note that Emagic will continue as a seperate division, so I think that Logic will continue as a product.

</strong><hr></blockquote>

JLL How do you know that eMagic will continue as a separate division? Won't Apple just tweak and rebadge the Logic line of applications as their own now? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
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post #24 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by neutrino23:
<strong>For those of us not familiar with audio apps can someone give us a thumbnail sketch of emagic and how they rank in the world of pro and consumer apps?</strong><hr></blockquote>
One could say that Logic Audio Platinum is THE senquenser, at leat in the pro market. It is often with ProTools as it runs natively on TDM hardware (what PT uses), Cubase and Nuendo do not, Im not sure about Digital Performer.
It is not that popular in the consumer/hoddyist market, because of its high price and long learning curve, Apple could surely do something to those two things. I think the best way to do this would be to make MicroLogicAV or Logic Audio Silver more mac like, and bundle it with ever sold mac, that would be sweet.

[ 07-01-2002: Message edited by: Decurion ]</p>
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post #25 of 110
[quote]Apple are reportedly pissed at Digidesign for arse-ing around for so long with Protools for OSX <hr></blockquote>

I wouldn't be so sure of that. More ss than any other app ported from 9 yet, Protools is probably the most difficult. Digidesign has been waiting for 10.2, the support needed in the OS just hasn't been there. With ProTools, you have an incedibly complex system that needs low level access to hardware and must work in perfect sync. Digi won't release a buggy product becasue they have clients that rely on ProTools for billing hours.

However, this is not to say that this isn't a shot across the bow for Digidesign. However, I think that the two products fill different niches.
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post #26 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by Mac+:
<strong>

JLL How do you know that eMagic will continue as a separate division? </strong><hr></blockquote>

From the <a href="http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2002/jul/01emagic.html" target="_blank">Apple Press Release</a>:

[quote]Emagic will operate as a wholly owned division of Apple.<hr></blockquote>

J :cool:
post #27 of 110
This is more of a threat to Mark of the Unicorn and Steinberg, I think, than Digidesign (Avid). In fact, because Logic Audio is the only one of the three big audio/midi sequencers (Logic, Cubase, Digital Performer) to closely integrate with Pro Tools, this acquisition actually positions Apple to exert pressure in two ways -- upon Logic, and upon Pro Tools (slightly and indirectly, but still...)
post #28 of 110
1st - i'm psyched.

2nd- i'm a little worried.


there is no turning back now. Apple is going to HAVE TO offer the whole widget now cause who will develop for a platform that provides it's own apps.

midi and audio have been too complicated for too long.

mac simple + logic = good.
post #29 of 110
it's a good point to say that no one will probably develop sequencers for mac anymore. logic is so good already, and will only get much better now, that no other companies will be able to compete on the platform.
post #30 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by giant:
<strong>it's a good point to say that no one will probably develop sequencers for mac anymore. logic is so good already, and will only get much better now, that no other companies will be able to compete on the platform.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Geez - I hope this isn't the case. I use MicroLogic AV and whilst it is solid, the gui is pretty mundane. I've also been checking the Logic Gold programme on the eMagic website. Same gui layout (for the most part), understandably, but with more buttons for more features.

MOTU's Digital Performer kicks Logic's butt in terms of having a slick gui - and industry leading features (granted most were propietory such as Free MIDI and MTS, but they were always ahead of the game). Secondly, MOTU's hardware (aside from the ludicrously expensive top end ProTools hardware) is the hardware that most people rely on day in day out for their DAWs. To this end, I would suggest that MOTU's integration of hardware and software is (was?) superior to the competition.

Did anybody ever see <a href="http://www.apple.com/creative/musicaudio/motu/" target="_blank">this</a>?

How long until it disappears from Apple's website?
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post #31 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by neutrino23:
<strong>For those of us not familiar with audio apps can someone give us a thumbnail sketch of emagic and how they rank in the world of pro and consumer apps? I've heard names like Motu and Pro Tools and such tossed about but have have no idea what they mean.

BTW - ting5 - thanks for the scoop.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Logic is positioned beside Nuendo and now Cubase SX as the leading VST platforms. MOTU is a hardware maker who also makes an app that is not widely used (their hardware is their meal ticket), while Pro Tools is a TDM platform with both hardware and software. Someone said earlier that Pro Tools is more of an "environment" but that isn't necessarily true anymore.

The VST platfom which Apple is aligning beside is an open one which allows 3rd Party companies to develop hardware which works with the VST software. Pro Tools is the same thing only closed - meaning you can only buy products which Digidesign makes. This makes the Pro Tools hardware high priced because the market is cornered.

As VST effects processing units for your PCI slot become more available it is becoming a very rich "environment". I already have 2 PCI hardware processors by two different companies to add effects to my music. I believe this open system is a good one and promotes competition in the hardware.

Which brings us to Apple getting involved in the "open" system. This is great news and although I'm not a Logic fan I will now watch it's releases with more interest. It is natural that Apple has chosen the more upgradable VST platform as this is more akin to the movement happening with Final Cut in the video market.

People getting the same work done with smaller setups.

BM
post #32 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by Power Apple:
<strong>

Have you used the Mac OS X version??</strong><hr></blockquote>


I wish I had, but it's still not released


bye.
post #33 of 110
If Apple could translate the guts of Logic into an iApp with the functionality of say... Pro Tools Free, I think it could sell a lot of machines. There are a lot of hobbyist musicians out there who would really benefit from an iMusic or whatever, like the aspiring filmmaker hit the goldmine finding iMovie. I really like the direction Apple is headed with these recent acquisitions. Now if we just had a breakthrough new Power Mac...
post #34 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by Mac+:
<strong>
Geez - I hope this isn't the case. I use MicroLogic AV and whilst it is solid, the gui is pretty mundane. I've also been checking the Logic Gold programme on the eMagic website. Same gui layout (for the most part), understandably, but with more buttons for more features.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

There's a pretty huge difference between Micrologic and Logic Audio Platinum, not all of which is immediately apparent from looking at screen shots of the main user interface.

[quote]Originally posted by Mac+:
<strong>
Did anybody ever see <a href="http://www.apple.com/creative/musicaudio/motu/" target="_blank">this</a>?

How long until it disappears from Apple's website?</strong><hr></blockquote>

There are also features there on Digidesign and Steinberg. Just because Apple bought Emagic doesn't mean they want to eradicate these other companies completely. I'm sure they'd love it if Logic took a position in the audio/midi market similar to their position with FCP in the DV market, but if actually benefits Apple if Digi/Steinberg/MOTU keep making products for the Mac.
post #35 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by hmurchison:
<strong>

Looks like my wish of having "Office Production" is coming true. Apple only needs a decent 3D application to rule the roost! I nominate Maya!!

[ 07-01-2002: Message edited by: hmurchison ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

I was thinking about SoftImage but later thought kinda impossible cause it's under Avid
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post #36 of 110
Well, if they had to buy somebody, I'm glad they bought the best - eMagic - I just hope they actually got God with the deal (Programmer Gerhard Lengeling), not just a compendium of the best ideas he had yesterday, now to be updated by committee.

Gerhard was so committed back when I met the guy, that he took his PowerBook with Logic's source code with him everywhere, lunch, dinner, meetings, it didn't matter, just in case he had an idea.

(It's too bad women don't find this sexier, cause if they did, the world would be a much better place, especially in a few generations ... but I digress ...)

... there's a war which has been simmering for quite some time now, but is due to break open fairly widely, fairly soon.

And it's all due to DSP.

Thanks to the G4's AltiVec engine (and hopefully, the soon to be released DDR capable 7500 G4's, followed - cross the fingers - with next years G5's) ... the whole purpose of having proprietary DSP cards is slowly going out the window. Anybody's who's seen a demo of Reason on OSX (or even Nuendo on OS9!) knows that the days of proprietary and very expensive hardware DSP cards providing a compelling value proposition for a large number of users, are quickly coming to an close.

So it's going to get harder and harder for Digi to justify it's prices for it's hardware ...

There's clearly a move away from closed formats and towards open standards of file and data interchange which can take advantage of native DSP.

This is what's happening in Video, and I'm totally unsurprised that it's starting to happen in something that takes (generally) 1/10th video's bandwidth, Audio.


What I hope Apple can bring to the table in all of this is better cooperation with eMagic, on architecting a central killer, AltiVec DSP engine ... I mean, it's all well and good that eMAgic's got some cool Native stuff today, but man, with the coming wave of DDR AltiVec chips, there's going to be one hell of a lot of horsepower just waiting to be harnessed provided the write software could be written for it.

I'm hoping the new Apple/Emagic partnership could do this.

Hell, if they can't do it, nobody could.
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post #37 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by sizzle chest:
<strong>
There's a pretty huge difference between Micrologic and Logic Audio Platinum, not all of which is immediately apparent from looking at screen shots of the main user interface.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Granted, I understand and acknowledge this - I was just cutting corners with my post and didn't want to delve into the merits of the technical wizadry which makes a programme tick. My main beef was that I preferred the gui/working environment of DP to what I saw on the eMagic web site.

[quote]Originally posted by sizzle chest:
<strong>
There are also features there on Digidesign and Steinberg. Just because Apple bought Emagic doesn't mean they want to eradicate these other companies completely. I'm sure they'd love it if Logic took a position in the audio/midi market similar to their position with FCP in the DV market, but if actually benefits Apple if Digi/Steinberg/MOTU keep making products for the Mac.</strong><hr></blockquote>

OK, I didn't realise this since I didn't look around there... I hit that page directly as a link from the MOTU web site. Me being lazy. Apologies. (Sheesh - it's 2:25am , I gotta get some sleep!)

Bottom line is I hope the other companies continue to make their programmes and offer viable alternatives for the end user.

Whilst I'm happy with what this means for Apple's market share, I am beginning to become concerned if this results in companies such as MOTU biting the dust. We've already seen Opcode go down... I wouldn't want that to happen to MOTU/Steinberg/Digi.

No matter, sizzle chest, you talk sense. I hope that music software thrives on the Mac platform and becomes a key drawing card which entices others to *switch*. As I said, it's about time Apple put some effort into promoting music/audio software tools.
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post #38 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by Jamie:
<strong>quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Mac+:

JLL How do you know that eMagic will continue as a separate division?


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From the Apple Press Release:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Emagic will operate as a wholly owned division of Apple.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

J :cool: </strong><hr></blockquote>

Thanks Jamie - I understand that - my question was that if this is going to develop into something similar to FCP, then wouldn't they (Apple) instead just rebadge the eMagic line of programmes as Apple ones?
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post #39 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by JLL:
<strong>

Please note that Emagic will continue as a seperate division, so I think that Logic will continue as a product.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

This is a very good point. Have any of the other Apple buyouts had statements to this effect or just Emagic? Perhaps it will remain just as it is except no more Windows version and better integration with OS X.
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post #40 of 110
[quote]Originally posted by apple.otaku:
<strong>

This is a very good point. Have any of the other Apple buyouts had statements to this effect or just Emagic? Perhaps it will remain just as it is except no more Windows version and better integration with OS X.</strong><hr></blockquote>

If this is the case, then am I right in surmising that Apple's buyout policy was primarily to cease Widows music apps from Emagic, and - at the same time - hopefully pick up their market share. I feel like I'm missing something. Surely, they'll want to release some software as their own, won't they?

I would have thought that we'll see a trickle down effect and be provided with some new Apple branded products. Perhaps, sepcifically in the education sector. Also, what about MIDI/audio hardware... do you think Apple will go there now?

I don't get Apple saying that Emagic will remain as a separate entity. What does this achieve for them after a buy-out? :confused:

How does this compare with the FCP scenario - I can't remember who they bought out there... can somebody point me in the right direction please for a comparison. Thanks.
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