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Think Secret reports iTunes Movie Store debut at WWDC:

post #1 of 21
Thread Starter 
Think Secret

Well, if this is to be believed, Steve has buckled under the pressure from the movie execs and is going ahead with the rental plan.

A lot of obvious questions arise from this:
Pricing of rentals (old vs new movies)
Movie file size (will Apple impliment a Bittorret type download system to speed things up?*)
DRM restrictions

And does this herald the imminent arrival of the "true"video iPod....

discuss.

b.

* For the record I highly doubt this but it's an interesting thought none the less.
"The world is all that is the case"
~ Ludwig Wittgenstein
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"The world is all that is the case"
~ Ludwig Wittgenstein
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post #2 of 21
Doubtful.

Lets get TV shows in countries that aren't America first. I'm in the UK, and its just music videos and pixar short films.
post #3 of 21
I also live in the United Kingdom of no TV thru iTunes. But.... It was reported a little while ago that a deal has been done with the UK channels and they will be available soon...

The sad thing is, I can't remember where I read it so you might want to have a little dig around for the source. I seem to remember it being a 'reliable' source though
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post #4 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by Dazabrit
I also live in the United Kingdom of no TV thru iTunes. But.... It was reported a little while ago that a deal has been done with the UK channels and they will be available soon...

The sad thing is, I can't remember where I read it so you might want to have a little dig around for the source. I seem to remember it being a 'reliable' source though

Hello "East Enders" and old "Royle Family" reruns.
post #5 of 21
hahahahahaha
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post #6 of 21
If true then Apple would have to release a way to watch the movies off of the computer and on the TV in your living room at the same time that the movie store is anounced, and one would hope that it is not dependant on the computer other than a way to get the movies onto the device. If they are trying to get revenue out of the Movie store than it also needs to be inexpensive enough to compete with other technology and delivery models out there today. This, in my opinion, eleminates turning the Mac Mini into a Multi-Media device for the living room, though they could probably have a version of it that does this as well I think that something less expensive is needed in the $200 range and it needs to work with Windows.

The reasoning behind this is that they will be competing with On Demand Cable, Mail order rentals, Cable, and Brick and Mortor Video Rental, currently available download rental services, and other newcomers to the download movie delivery. Apple will want to reach a "critical mass" for the service as soon as possible. Being out there with a hardware/software solution early will help if the price,performance and features are right.

Other questions of importance are how the "rental" works. If it is part of the Quicktime and available to other people to initiate then that could help Quictime gain some ground against WMP and DIVIX which are well established on the WEB. Will it be able to play "rental" WMP and DIVIX files? If not they are eleminating the currently available downloadable content which could be a problem. Sure it is mostly Porn, but as Sony discovered a number of years ago that is a BIG driving force in video content market. I doubt that Apple will sell Porn, so I would hope that they support a format that is being used for content delivery today even though it uses a different DRM than Apples propriatary system. Without DIVIX and WMP support the available content playback would be very limiting and might be a deal breaker in a lot of potential sales, especially as other companies come out with competing hardware/software solutions in the coming months that are VIIV compliant.

Another big factor to success would be the term of rental. Watch once, 24 hours, 1 week, and so on. A watch once for $2 might be a deal breaker when current video rentals are up to a week or more at brick and mortor and as long as you like at NetFlix.
post #7 of 21
Wow, apparently the only ones left in the major studios are robber barons and fools. If I were Jobs, I'd work out a separate deal with (real) independent studios to sell their movies.

Quicktime is a given. It's highly probable that these rentals will be DRM'd H.264 files. WMP? DIVX? I think one would face disciplinary action for bringing those up at Apple.

Front Row integration and Bonjour streaming are very likely, but they may hold off.

Netflix was/is very close to offering their own downloadable rentals. They're the only real competition in this space. Save for Vongo.
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post #8 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by sCreeD
Wow, apparently the only ones left in the major studios are robber barons and fools. If I were Jobs, I'd work out a separate deal with (real) independent studios to sell their movies.

Quicktime is a given. It's highly probable that these rentals will be DRM'd H.264 files. WMP? DIVX? I think one would face disciplinary action for bringing those up at Apple.

Front Row integration and Bonjour streaming are very likely, but they may hold off.

Netflix was/is very close to offering their own downloadable rentals. They're the only real competition in this space. Save for Vongo.

For the hardware to succeed it must support WMP and DIVIX becouse those are the formats that are most widely available today, just as MP3 was when the iPod was released. It should also have software for Windows computers so that the consumer market for the hardware and video distribution is as large as possible instead of the 3% market share of Mac users.

The integrated hardware/software solution will be a big selling point, but it won't ensure the repeated success of the iPod.
post #9 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by @homenow
For the hardware to succeed it must support WMP and DIVIX becouse those are the formats that are most widely available today, just as MP3 was when the iPod was released. It should also have software for Windows computers so that the consumer market for the hardware and video distribution is as large as possible instead of the 3% market share of Mac users.

but when iTMS was announced, they didn't use MP3, even though it was widely available. they used AAC. sure you could import your own MP3s into iTunes, but that isn't an issue with movies, as few people actually rip their own movies. (sure there may be quite a few on these boards, but in general, i'd say less than 3% of iTunes users rip their own movies.)

Windows support is a sure thing, if they can get tv shows on windows, why not movies? the only problem will be, if they do in fact go to a higher resolution for movies, listing recommended specs for viewing that content. it's easy to do on Macs, just say, requires a G5 or Intel Mac or whatever; on PCs, it's a bit harder.
post #10 of 21
Why would Apple announce a consumer product at a developer conference? ThinkSecret are also speculating that a new iPod nano will be in the keynote.

I think it's more likely they'll either wait until Paris in September or have another press event.

--> Stephen
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post #11 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by stephend
Why would Apple announce a consumer product at a developer conference? ThinkSecret are also speculating that a new iPod nano will be in the keynote.

I think it's more likely they'll either wait until Paris in September or have another press event.

--> Stephen

My thoughts exactly. The repeatedly dump this under WWDC, when I think we are far more likely to see a Mac Pro at WWDC and a separate event for new iPods and video store.
post #12 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by confirmed
but when iTMS was announced, they didn't use MP3, even though it was widely available. they used AAC. sure you could import your own MP3s into iTunes, but that isn't an issue with movies, as few people actually rip their own movies. (sure there may be quite a few on these boards, but in general, i'd say less than 3% of iTunes users rip their own movies.)

Windows support is a sure thing, if they can get tv shows on windows, why not movies? the only problem will be, if they do in fact go to a higher resolution for movies, listing recommended specs for viewing that content. it's easy to do on Macs, just say, requires a G5 or Intel Mac or whatever; on PCs, it's a bit harder.

The "Store" can be whatever format they want. The local software/hardware needs to support other formats than Apple's proprietary DRM'd H.264 files that they will be distributing on iTMS. Ideally this would include the two formats that are most widely available in the distribution channel for content today which are DIVIX and WMP. Again, there has to be a hardware solution ready for getting the content off the computer and into the living room, and this is what needs to have a software connection to Windows PC's, probably through iTunes. Of course they could leave it to other companies such as Sony to come out with connections to the computer but then Apple looses the control over the user interface and experience, and I don't think that Apple would want this.
post #13 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by G_Warren
My thoughts exactly. The repeatedly dump this under WWDC, when I think we are far more likely to see a Mac Pro at WWDC and a separate event for new iPods and video store.

I totally agree BUT.... One reason I imagine they would want/need a 'big' WWDC event for this year (Nano/iTunes/Mac Pro/Leopard)is to make 'BIG' headlines once again.

The news has recently been dominated by negative Apple stories about future product delays, technical and/or cosmetic problems, lower quarterly profits than estimated and a million other issues..... The negative press seems to be in force at the moment.

Thats why I can see them using WWDC for a series of announcements. A 'Let's blow them out of the water' type of event.
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post #14 of 21
The best way to combat this would be to have a big splash at WWDC, followed up by measured releases through October and a big Media event in Late July or Early September for the Movie Service and Home Media Player (or pick your name).
post #15 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by JCG
The "Store" can be whatever format they want. The local software/hardware needs to support other formats than Apple's proprietary DRM'd H.264 files that they will be distributing on iTMS. Ideally this would include the two formats that are most widely available in the distribution channel for content today which are DIVIX and WMP.

I agree. I know people who won't buy an iPod because they don't want to spend time re-encoding their videos or music files. And some stupidly think that AAC is a proprietary Apple format.
post #16 of 21
Disbelieving also that WWDC would be the venue to entertain this
fantasy (movie rental announcement), nevertheless the technology
to pull it off would be intriguing.

Using the 1.5CB-per-movie encoding stats cited by QuickTime executive
Frank Cassanova (matching 480p standard definition using H.264),
this would have to be a kiosk -> iPod maneuver for rentals, rather than downloads.

Lots more traffic to Best Buy, Blockbuster, or Apple stores
for upselling opportunity...

Unfortunately, the current iPods only do 544x400 pixels to TV
using inefficient .mp4, so anything at widescreen 480p or better
would need all-new-iPods. It would be shameful for Apple
to do rentals at anything less than 480p, or otherwise restrict
it all to webstreaming for computer-only viewing.
post #17 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by blackbird_1.0
I agree. I know people who won't buy an iPod because they don't want to spend time re-encoding their videos or music files. And some stupidly think that AAC is a proprietary Apple format.

I didn't mean to imply that AAC is proprietary, but when coupled with their DRM model it is. As far as I know you cannot add DRM to an AAC file using Apple's scheme to protect your content, that ability is exclusive to Apple and used exclusively on content downloaded through iTMS, therefore the DRM is proprietary even if the file format is not.
post #18 of 21
The DRM-wrapping happens on the client side, after the download, so it must be a function call somewhere in QuickTime or iTunes, and therefore tecnically accessible to third parties, even when not documented.
post #19 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by JCG
I didn't mean to imply that AAC is proprietary, but when coupled with their DRM model it is. As far as I know you cannot add DRM to an AAC file using Apple's scheme to protect your content, that ability is exclusive to Apple and used exclusively on content downloaded through iTMS, therefore the DRM is proprietary even if the file format is not.

I believe his point was that people (erroneously) think that if they rip their media into AAC, that they are locked into the Apple hardware because AAC == Apple only.

Which it doesn't, any more than MP3 == Apple only.

It is only media purchased *from* Apple that is DRM laden, and therefore tied to Apple hardware, but that's not what he's talking about.
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post #20 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by Kickaha
I believe his point was that people (erroneously) think that if they rip their media into AAC, that they are locked into the Apple hardware because AAC == Apple only.

Which it doesn't, any more than MP3 == Apple only.

It is only media purchased *from* Apple that is DRM laden, and therefore tied to Apple hardware, but that's not what he's talking about.

You got it.
post #21 of 21
Could this be an atempt by Apple to throw off the rumor mill?

Was this Job's planted?

Sounds like it definitely could be...
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