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2 months, 2 dead Macbooks!!!

post #1 of 19
Thread Starter 
I bought a black Macbook one of the first days it was available. I love the computer besides the fact it gets a bit warm (to the point that it hurts sitting on my legs). The first one was working great when all of a sudden it was non responsive, nill, nothing.....Took it in and they immediately replaced it with a new one, no questions asked. By the way I lost all of the school work I had on it.

Macbook #2. I have been really trying not to use it on my lap thinking this would keep it from getting too hot and causing any problems down the road. In fact, I have been only using it on hard smooth surfaces so it has a little space to keep it cool.

I love the computer and how easy it is to use. This morning I turned it on and it fired right up. Went to take care of something briefly and came back about an hour later, totally non responsive. When the screen is closed the little status light in the front of it would light up just as if the computer was on, but when the screen is opened, nothing.....By the way I lost all of my school stuff AGAIN!

What the hell is going on? Is it something I am doing? I feel like scrapping the apple idea and going back to a cheaper (and more durable?) PC notebook. I have yet another appointment tonight at the apple store.`
post #2 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by Ctimrun
I bought a black Macbook one of the first days it was available. I love the computer besides the fact it gets a bit warm (to the point that it hurts sitting on my legs). The first one was working great when all of a sudden it was non responsive, nill, nothing.....Took it in and they immediately replaced it with a new one, no questions asked. By the way I lost all of the school work I had on it.

Macbook #2. I have been really trying not to use it on my lap thinking this would keep it from getting too hot and causing any problems down the road. In fact, I have been only using it on hard smooth surfaces so it has a little space to keep it cool.

I love the computer and how easy it is to use. This morning I turned it on and it fired right up. Went to take care of something briefly and came back about an hour later, totally non responsive. When the screen is closed the little status light in the front of it would light up just as if the computer was on, but when the screen is opened, nothing.....By the way I lost all of my school stuff AGAIN!

What the hell is going on? Is it something I am doing? I feel like scrapping the apple idea and going back to a cheaper (and more durable?) PC notebook. I have yet another appointment tonight at the apple store.`

I am on my second MacBook as well. My first one had a problem where the battery icon would have an "X" over it even though is was powered on. Apple store technicians couldn't figure it out after two attempts so they exchanged it for me.

My friend at work in the process of exchanging his MacBook as well.

Great QC work Apple. Keep it up.
post #3 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by Ctimrun
Is it something I am doing?

While I feel your pain, there's one thing you're not doing: BACKING UP YOUR DATA. Whether you go back to Windows machines or stick with Apple, it's a habit you should get in to.
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post #4 of 19
My experience has been horrible. I sent mine out last week and they claim it just arrived yesterday. Now my reapir is on hold due to parts back order because these pieces of crap are dying like crazy. And now I am hearing about people waiting 2 plus weeks for repairs which is just pathetic. And from what I have read people are also getting them back and they start shutting down again. This means Apple is replacing these logic boards with the same part that is failing on the MacBooks to begin with. My crappy Dell has better support and I have never had to use them. Utter bullshit I say.
post #5 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by GreggWSmith
And from what I have read people are also getting them back and they start shutting down again. This means Apple is replacing these logic boards with the same part that is failing on the MacBooks to begin with. My crappy Dell has better support and I have never had to use them. Utter bullshit I say.

Maybe they'll start using better logic boards like they seem to be doing with the MB Pro:

http://www.engadget.com/2006/07/08/a...-macbook-pros/

It's really getting beyond a joke. They made a big mistake with the ibooks and they became synonymous with logic board failure. If they are making the same mistakes with the new machines then they are just being asinine now.
post #6 of 19
sounds like you've had two HD problems to me...
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"i find that if you keep talkin', your mouth comes up with stuff..." Karl Pilkington
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post #7 of 19
Thread Starter 
Well, they did not explain anything to me at all, they just toook all my old stuff and handed a new one over to me. I guess it is good they will just keep giving me a new computer, but I keep losing all of my stuff that is on it. They asked if I wanted to recover what I had on it and I said yes. They called me this morning and said they could not recover my files.

If this one does not work out then I will be selling the replacement and buying a more durable PC laptop or notebook or whatever they are called now.

I am pretty dissappointed because I feel as though this computer is very delicate and could break at any time. I am reluctant to do any of my work on it. I will just be e-mailing all of my work to myself so that I can get it from another computer!

This stinks.....
post #8 of 19
If they couldn't recover your files, then it's a disk issue.

Two in a row is an oddity though - you're not doing anything like setting it on top of a large CRT are you? (ie, getting it near magnetic fields)
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post #9 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by Kickaha
If they couldn't recover your files, then it's a disk issue.

I concur. Obviously he had a failing HD.

Quote:

Two in a row is an oddity though - you're not doing anything like setting it on top of a large CRT are you? (ie, getting it near magnetic fields)

Could not it be heat too? We are in summer (well, in northern hemisphere). HDs are sensible in heat.
post #10 of 19
Quote:
My crappy Dell has better support and I have never had to use them.

Would you have he same sentiment if you had one of the Dells that burst into flame?
post #11 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by PB
I concur. Obviously he had a failing HD.

Unless it was the mobo, and it prevented FW Target Mode? Just speculating... but still, yanking the drive and plopping it in an external enclosure for testing would seem reasonable.

Quote:
Could not it be heat too? We are in summer (well, in northern hemisphere). HDs are sensible in heat.

Ehhhhhh, maybe. I can't see how even 20deg diff of room temp is going to cause that big a difference when the internal temp is *MUCH* higher. The difference in cooling ability won't be that big.
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post #12 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by Kickaha
Unless it was the mobo, and it prevented FW Target Mode? Just speculating... but still, yanking the drive and plopping it in an external enclosure for testing would seem reasonable.

Well, I would say that they tried this one too before giving an answer to the client. Is not that the meaning of trying to get the data out in a repair center?

Quote:

Ehhhhhh, maybe. I can't see how even 20deg diff of room temp is going to cause that big a difference when the internal temp is *MUCH* higher.

That's the problem. These machines can run really hot and 10 degrees Celcius more from the summer season can be fatal. Hard disks can be very sensible to temperature. From what I remember, they must not operate at more than 45-50 dgrees Celsius or something like that, even when the CPU hits 60 or 70 degrees. So, a 10 degrees difference from season alone cannot be ignored. That's why it is generally recommended to backup up more frequently during summer. Not that doing so in the rest of the year harms, but this is more addressed to people that do not backup regularly.
post #13 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by PB
These machines can run really hot and 10 degrees Celcius more from the summer season can be fatal. Hard disks can be very sensible to temperature.

Definitely. I'm sure that's what killed my Mini HD. Some days my room was like a greenhouse. These days, I keep all my windows open during Summer.

However, I don't know why they would replace the whole computer just for a broken HD. I know they do that with ipods but surely not notebooks.

I suppose if they didn't have any HDs in stock then it would be quicker to just swap the machine.
post #14 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by PB
That's the problem. These machines can run really hot and 10 degrees Celcius more from the summer season can be fatal. Hard disks can be very sensible to temperature. From what I remember, they must not operate at more than 45-50 dgrees Celsius or something like that, even when the CPU hits 60 or 70 degrees. So, a 10 degrees difference from season alone cannot be ignored. That's why it is generally recommended to backup up more frequently during summer. Not that doing so in the rest of the year harms, but this is more addressed to people that do not backup regularly.

Hmm. I still don't buy it - with a cooling system (heatsink, fans), a 10deg differential in the external environment does *not* correspond to a 10deg differential *inside*. All it means is that the cooling will not be *as efficient*, and it will take longer to cool. It does mean that the absolute lowest temp you can achieve is 10deg warmer, but even that is so far below the tolerances of the hard drive as to be inconsequential.

Wait - I'm thinking 10deg Fahrenheit, not Celsius. That's 5.5deg C, IIRC.

Think of it this way... heat up a horseshoe in coals. Get it red hot, around 600degF. Now plunge it into one of two buckets of water - one at 70degF, and one at 80degF. The one in the 70degF water will cool only slightly faster, and be 10degF cooler when done - but the 80degF one will also be much cooler than it was. If 'red hot' is the failure temp of the hard drive, then the 10degF difference at the bottom end is trivial.

Now, if you exceed the operating environment parameters, then yeah, you might have problems, but even those have a healthy safety zone. (What is it for the laptops - 95degF max?)

I can see where a system with just-adequate cooling capability would be pushed into the not-adequate cooling capability zone, but it's because of the relative efficiencies, not the absolute temp differential of the environment. At some point, yes, the HD will be into the red zone, but I'm not sure that 10degF difference from the 'optimal' of room temperature is going to be significant. Maybe 10degC would be.
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post #15 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by Kickaha
At some point, yes, the HD will be into the red zone, but I'm not sure that 10degF difference from the 'optimal' of room temperature is going to be significant. Maybe 10degC would be.

In your previous post you talked about 20 deg difference:
Quote:
Ehhhhhh, maybe. I can't see how even 20deg diff of room temp is going to cause that big a difference when the internal temp is *MUCH* higher.

I considered that you talk about degrees Fahrenheit. The correspondence to degrees Celcius is this: C = 5/9 * (F - 32). So in terms of difference DC = 5/9 * DF. About half the degrees Fahrenheit, which places us at 10 degrees Celsius. That's what I am talking about, and actually I observe differences of room temperature 7-12 degC between hot and cold seasons, every year in my place.
post #16 of 19
So? Do you observe a difference of 10 C in your computer?
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post #17 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by hardeeharhar
So? Do you observe a difference of 10 C in your computer?

Mostly yes. I mean, when the fan is not on, the difference is more or less 10 degrees, something that certainly stress thermally the machine more than in winter time. When the fan is working, the difference is around 6-8 degrees more in summer for the same task.
post #18 of 19
PB, unless your laptop's temp is equalizing with the environment, I don't see how that's going to be that consistent, with a functioning cooling system. I'm not saying you're lying, just... it doesn't wash with what I'd expect from basic thermodynamics. I'd have to see a well-controlled comparison between the two external temps, and how the elevated temp (because there will be *some*) corresponds against the hard drive's operating tolerances and it's failure curve, before I'd believe that seasonal differences within the environmental operating parameters cause any serious changes in failure rates. \

*shrug* My bet is that he either got two bad drives, or something in his environment is causing the issues. It may very well be temperature, but I wouldn't expect that to be a concern unless it exceeded the operating specs. That may be the case, though.
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post #19 of 19
Quote:
Originally posted by Kickaha
PB, unless your laptop's temp is equalizing with the environment, I don't see how that's going to be that consistent, with a functioning cooling system. I'm not saying you're lying, just... it doesn't wash with what I'd expect from basic thermodynamics.

The differences I quoted are approximative CPU (not HD) temperature differences. I don't know what the effect would be on HD temperature. I guess similar, at least when the fan is not working, only that the HD is nowhere near that hot as the CPU.
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