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Dear Apple, (mac.com email) - Page 2

post #41 of 59
Sure ads and spam suck but that's how webmail is "free". I'm always surprised at how many people buy into the "free lunch" myth. Wake up people, there's no such thing as a free lunch! (Remember the ads for NetZero? "Free internet for life!" Well, now it's $9.95. Did you really think it would be free forever?) I wish people would stop whining, yes whinig about the new .Mac service. If you don't like it, don't get it. If you think there's a better value out there, go for it. "But Apple promised me it would be free forever! " Can you say naive? <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
Dude, you're gettin' a DULL!
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Dude, you're gettin' a DULL!
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post #42 of 59
[quote]Originally posted by iMax:
<strong>Sure ads and spam suck but that's how webmail is "free". I'm always surprised at how many people buy into the "free lunch" myth. Wake up people, there's no such thing as a free lunch! (Remember the ads for NetZero? "Free internet for life!" Well, now it's $9.95. Did you really think it would be free forever?) I wish people would stop whining, yes whinig about the new .Mac service. If you don't like it, don't get it. If you think there's a better value out there, go for it. "But Apple promised me it would be free forever! " Can you say naive? <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
right-o.

and apple never, ever said "free for life". a week has gone by since the .mac announcement, and there has yet to be anybody who can come up with proof of that.
post #43 of 59
It was never promised to be free "for life" and I can understand charging for the service. BUT...

This "all or nothing" approach has got to go!

Apple: Offer us an email only account WITHOUT forcing us to tie it to a full .Mac account!
Apple Computer, Inc.

AKA the Microsoft R&D Department
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Apple Computer, Inc.

AKA the Microsoft R&D Department
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post #44 of 59
[quote]Originally posted by iMax:
<strong>Sure ads and spam suck but that's how webmail is "free". I'm always surprised at how many people buy into the "free lunch" myth. Wake up people, there's no such thing as a free lunch!...</strong><hr></blockquote>

We are in agreement here. It's Groverat who needs the convincing. I would rather pay $15 a year for webmail.mac.com than have to deal with contracted spam ending up in my mailbox...and seizure inducing banner ads. Let's hope an updated pricing/subscription model comes soon.

Yahoo! Mail...web interface, 6 MB, large ads, 'bulk' mail otherwise known as spam. Account is one day old, as you can see I already have 'bulk' mail.



MSN Hotmail...web interface, 2 MB, large ads, a junk mailbox (I wonder why.) Account is 5 minutes old. I wonder how much spam I will have tomorrow? And worst of all, it supports Internet Explorer and Netscape 4.x and that's about it.



In contrast, the .Mac e-mail only account I created last week has received no spam at all.

[ 07-24-2002: Message edited by: Eugene ]</p>
I can change my sig again!
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I can change my sig again!
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post #45 of 59
The price $100, it is too expensive for me. It doesn't mean it dont worth.

For me I only use the email service. 5MB is enough for me. The others service is not necessary for me.

The iDisk, extreme slow. I wanted to share something to others. I can setup my apple desktop as an AFP/FTP file serve for file sharing via TCP/IP. The speed is almost the same as using iDisk. The storage is as big as the available HD space.

The Homepage, equal to Web-sharing, one of the powerful tools embed in OS X is apache web server.

I got a static IP from my ISP I dont need to tell everyone if my IP is changed.

I wont join it for $100, it is too expensive for me if I only use the email service.

I have been to an apple owner almost 10 years. I am very disappointed to apple, their policy. I cant see any benefit to being a apple owner.
Obi-Dun Kenobi
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Obi-Dun Kenobi
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post #46 of 59
[quote]Originally posted by Obi-Dun:
<strong>I have been to an apple owner almost 10 years. I am very disappointed to apple, their policy. I cant see any benefit to being a apple owner.</strong><hr></blockquote>

What was the benefit before 2000 then? Alternatve services exist from other providers. since you didn't use anything but e-mail, you shouldnt be missing much, right?
I can change my sig again!
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I can change my sig again!
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post #47 of 59
Thread Starter 
Wow, after the first slew of flames, I was afraid to read the rest. I'm glad to see that people are generally agreeing that we're getting a raw deal here.

I was wrong about the "for life" bit (and an ass about it). I read that somewhere, didn't check it, and adopted it like a fool.

Still, I'm especially pissed now because I currently live in a place where the unemployment rate is twice as bad as the US, and I really can't afford $100 or $50 a year right now.

Plus I'm pissed because my $400 iPod (bought when times were better) shipped with a 90 day warranty and the firewire port broke in the 14th week. While Americans were evidently getting replacements out of warranty for this problem at Apple Stores, in Hong Kong we were offered no such service and I'm left with a paperweight.

So I got pissed when faced with losing my 3 year old email account and wrote a lame letter without doing the research.

Donny, great letter!

Your letter contains the best suggestion, and one which I was contemplating myself. In lieu of offering any expensive storage for free, Apple should offer a free email forwarding account to all current mac.com email users. The drain on Apple's servers would be minimal, and Apple's customers would be happy.

I can go to enames or a similar registrar and register my own domain name, web storage and forwarding email account for around $15 a year. Please tell me how .mac is better.

I just wish I didn't have to cancel the good email account I've been using for the last three years, and risk missing mail from people whose email addresses I might have lost.
post #48 of 59
While I have no qualms about paying something for .mac, I do think that the $100/year is a bit steep, especially considering that between DH and I, we have 3 e-mail addresses that we cannot feasibly be rid of. One of them is a published business contact for me, one is my personal contact (which is registered with countless individuals and organizations), and one is DH's account. So, in all reality, .mac would cost us $120/year--OUCH!

We have both signed the petition below:

<a href="http://www.petitiononline.com/iTol/petition.html" target="_blank">http://www.petitiononline.com/iTol/petition.html</a>

Kirsten
"Blondes don't necessarily have more fun. People tend to expect so much
less from us that we just have more free time." (Vic Lee)

"Behold the power of CHEESE!"
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"Blondes don't necessarily have more fun. People tend to expect so much
less from us that we just have more free time." (Vic Lee)

"Behold the power of CHEESE!"
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post #49 of 59
[quote]Because ads and spam suck?<hr></blockquote>

Those pictures are weird. I have a yahoo account I get maybe 3 spam messages a week, all from CDNow who I ordered from but will never take me off their goddam lists. I've had it for a year or so now.

My MSN account gets crap from Amazon still, the only "unsolicited" spam I get is on my real address because some people thought they'd be funny and sign me up for crap you can't get off of.

Yeah, it's only 2MB, but it's for text messages. And it's free. Apple can't let me keep the e-mail address they gave me by at least making me jump through hoops?

I'm one of those crazy people that likes to have these things called "options" and "choices".

Can I pay $5/year to keep my e-mail address on an ad-filled webmail interface? Nope. $100 or nothing.

It's bullshit, no amount of spin changes that.
proud resident of a failed state
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proud resident of a failed state
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post #50 of 59
Spam blows big time!

I think on one of my Yahoo's I get about 30 a day. I love the bulk mail folder...
i am monkey
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i am monkey
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post #51 of 59
Bullshit, Groverat.

I have 8 messages in my hotmail account opened TWO days ago. 1 is the Microsoft welcome message and the rest are spam.
I can change my sig again!
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I can change my sig again!
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post #52 of 59
"Sure ads and spam suck but that's how webmail is "free"."

You sure? The ONLY advertisement in my free email is a small, discrete "This message brought to you by Loadmail" at the bottom of each message I send.

I have had the SAME free webmail address for close to 2 years, and honestly never received even 1 advertisement or spam message.

I get 5 MBs of space. It's reliable and relatively fast. I can send attachments.

So why the F*** should I pay some greedy bastard at Apple 50 bones a year to use what I already get for free?

Answer: I shouldn't.

I really feel like Mac users as a whole have been shafted over this whole .Mac thing. I guess Apple is no longer the 'good guy' in the computing industry I (and others) once thought they were.

Macs used to come with customer support over the phone, 24-7, for life. But they were built so well they rarely needed it.

Now, it costs a ridiculous sum of money to make a support call. They tried to charge me when I phoned in over a warranty repair on my G4 PowerBook! It was only after asking for a couple of different guys that I spoke to a representative who was knowledgeable, courteous, and settled my problem fairly and quickly.

My point is, Apple has morphed into the sort of bureaucracy that I don't like. there are still good people in the company but they are basically stuck on the Titanic, sinking slowly and surely.

Screw paying money for .mac services - I personally think we have all paid enough of a premium by laying down the extra funds to purchase a Mac, which are still quite overpriced compared to PCs if you look at the stats.

(DISCLAIMER: I love Macs, I have used Macs since 1991, and I hate PCs and Microsoft... but this latest piece of Apple's scheme really has me pissed off. Frankly, I am enough of a Mac lover to voice criticism as well as praise.

Many people here seem to have an apologetic attitude, making up reasons for Apple's ridiculous policy.)

Is this forum funded by Apple? Such a move by them should not get such staunch support from the consumer.

(PS, my email provider is loadmail, check it out at loadmail.com. Many email providers send your address as soon as it is registered to advertisers, but Loadmail does not.)

Sorry for the long rant, but I feel strongly about this matter - Apple may be within its legal rights to do this, but it's a dirty tactic at best and many people feel screwed.

stjobs
PowerBook G4/667/DVD/30 gig/512 MB RAM

"And then came the shot..."
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PowerBook G4/667/DVD/30 gig/512 MB RAM

"And then came the shot..."
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post #53 of 59
Everyone here seems so pissed about this .Mac thing. Apple only made two mistakes.

Mistake 1: OPTIONS

Not offering options such as 'email only' for .Mac. Apple should have offered options such as this to alieviate the fact that some people were using this as primary email and they want to continue using it as such. This also counts as advertising for Apple, just think about it. The "@mac.com" in every email address is a plug for Apple. It says loudly and proudly that this person owns a mac and it helps to promote the company. Apple could have increased revenue by offering options. Most people that are choosing not to subscribe anymore probably would still pay less for a 'email only' or 'email and web page only' accounts. Apple is loosing a large amount of cash on this bad decision. Steve Jobs has been quoted as saying that Apple likes options, well he should have applied that to his customer base. I'm sure that most people like options.

Mistake 2: MARKETING

They should have marketed .Mac as '$8.33 per month'. Rather than $100/yr. I'm sorry people but $8.33 per month is pretty cheap for web hosting. Most people don't even figure that out. They see $8/mo and $100/yr and they compare $8 vs $100 and say that $8 is cheaper. This is the same technique that infomercials have. "3 easy payments of $39.95. Yes! That's 3 installments of UNDER $40!!"

If Apple had played this out that way there would be less griping. But griping is unavoidable here. Everyone wants something for nothing. Everyone was getting it for free and now they are not and to them this is an outrage. They don't bother to figure that this is costing someone money. They just view this as "I didn't have to pay before, so why should I pay now?? Good god!! You're cheating me!! You're a crook!! You're TAKING my money!!" This is the same as saying because the grocery store was giving free samples of Bagel Bites yesterday you are ENTITLED to free Bagel Bites for the rest of your life. One phrase comes to mind : "There is no free lunch".

This isn't necessarily 'bait and switch' as many have coined it either. Apple decided to provide a service. They weren't sure how popular it would be and if it would even catch on. They provided it for free to test the waters and see how many people would bite. Then when they saw how many people bought into it. They decided that this was a worthwhile service to provide. But this service doesn't come for free. Apple doesn't get all the bandwidth and server space in the world for free. Some of you would rather have free .Mac and run Apple in the debt and maybe even Chapter 11 before you would consider paying a dime.

What if Apple came out and said that they would be bankrupt in 1.5 years if .Mac was free? Even if this was true most of you would complain about how false it is. You want something for free so much that you'll refuse to accept anything that tells you that you can't have something for free. I'll bet that most of you don't complain about not having DivX on Macs because you don't download illegal movies. You might even say that the movie companies deserve money for their movies and that is why you don't download 'moviez'. Isn't this the same thing? Shouldn't Apple deserve some revenue? Or are they supposed to just bite the bullet because you want your .Mac?

[ 07-28-2002: Message edited by: pyr3 ]</p>
post #54 of 59
"Apple decided to provide a service. They weren't sure how popular it would be and if it would even catch on. They provided it for free to test the waters and see how many people would bite. Then when they saw how many people bought into it."

That sounds pretty much like a bait and switch to me, giving people something for free to get them hooked and then charging for it is bait and switch to me! Any argument over that is just semantics, of course the reason Apple gave iTools for free for a while is because they wanted to get people hooked. Once we were hooked they were able to begin charging a ridiculous (IMHO) sum for the services that used to be free... and because many people now had their emails at mac.com, and depended on iTools, more would pay than if they had suddenly introduced .mac at its full price without the 'free' trial.

Regarding Apple & profits, I have absolutely no problem with Apple making money! I WANT Apple to succeed.

However, I want them to succeed THROUGH LEGITIMATE MEANS, not cheating consumers. I hate to say this, but these recent actions of Apple's remind me of Micro$uck.

And when I paid $2500 for a G4 PowerBook, it SHOULD have come with iTools, FREE, for the rest of my natural life! I think that is a lot of money for a computer, and not everyone can afford more for (formerly) free web services.

The argument of those who try to justify this newest piece of bullshit from Apple is akin to colonists in 1776 saying "the British have to make a profit somehow, might as well be through taxation without representation!"

I think and hope that true Mac fans will have a strong enough spirit to not become Redcoat loyalists, and to remain patriotic against this newest threat.

Remember when Apple was the cool, counterculture computer company that represented rebellion and justice? Remember the 1984 commercial?

All that's been flushed down the toilet.

-stjobs
PowerBook G4/667/DVD/30 gig/512 MB RAM

"And then came the shot..."
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PowerBook G4/667/DVD/30 gig/512 MB RAM

"And then came the shot..."
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post #55 of 59
since i am not wearing my flame-retardant underoos, i'm going to asvoid slogging through the majority of these posts to bring up a couple of other points.

first off, i will *probably* pay US$50 for the first year, and see what apple can do in the first year. then cancel, and see how my life changes without it a year from now. then see if it's worth US$100 per year for the services.

from what i can tell right now, it's not for me (but i will probably still get it, on the hope and promise that it will get better - read on for further details). my favorite part is the mac.com email account. and the webmail interface was long overdue, imho. grade: A

idisk, well, truth be told, it's just been way too slow to use for file transfer. that may change with upcoming releases, but if i am evaluating this off past experience, i would give it a grade: B (an extra nod that you can log on really easily, especially so under OS X, and 100 MB of space - a universal old-school zip disk, accessible anywhere).

backup. okay, this product baffles me. it makes sense in theory, but since it requires an active internet connection in order to operate, it won't work if you're on, say, your laptop and away from an internet connection. you can't even burn a CD without the connection. or what if your computer is about to die, and you need to back up your standard set of stuff to cd before reformatting. ah, but part of your problem is internet connection. oops. i guess you could use disc burner, but then what's the point of backup? huh? apple needs to re-examine this. maybe offer a special encrypted password to enter to allow for "offline" backup, to verify you're a .mac subscriber. anyway, in its current state, grade: D. [edit: i decided to lower the grade from C- to D, because if they're asking you to rely on disc burner when backup can't work, they are reinforcing how useless backup really is... instead, buy retrospect express for the same price. that's an EXCELLENT product for the price]

homepage: i have liked this interface to put up brief series of family photos, but, if reports are to be believed, then you're not allowed to use anything but apple's predefined templates. i guess apple also wants all .mac websites to conform to a certain look, as opposed to housing commerce or semi-professional sites (though art freelancers are gonna be annoyed to not hve some control over how their portfolios are displayed). also, as shown this past weekend with a story re: the L.A. store opening, there is apparently a bandwidth limitation. I suppose i expect that, but what is it? does anyone know? 100 MB is a lot of space for just family photos. maybe they need to give the space for family movies shot on an apple-branded video caera? i have not checked on these issues, so take this grade with a grain of salt. grade: C

virus: well, i personally prefer intego's virus barrier (yeah, the interface is strange, but norton's suite has been anything but (sweet, that is)). but as long as it's definitions are updated regularly, runs without interfering too much, and is stable, virus checking is good (and mac os x will become a target with increasing mainstream acceptance). grade: A- (unless it, too, requires a .mac access in order to run, then B- again).

so, is it worth US$50? maybe. enough for me to not want to miss the chance and have to pay $100 if i change my mind this winter.

is it worth US$100 right now, for new subscribers. no way. period. apple has to fix some issues, and if they add in functionality for ical, isync, maybe itunes to .mac (WITHOUT requiring internet access), then it will be worth it.

so there's my perspective.

p.s. i still think they should bundle jaguar and .mac together for something at or close to US$169. i would happily pay for that.

[ 07-29-2002: Message edited by: rok ]

[ 07-29-2002: Message edited by: rok ]</p>
When you're lovers in a dangerous time,
You're made to feel as if your love's a crime.
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
Gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight.

-...
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When you're lovers in a dangerous time,
You're made to feel as if your love's a crime.
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
Gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight.

-...
Reply
post #56 of 59
"I'm currently struggling as a freelance designer and cannot afford the horrendously expensive $99 a year Apple wants to charge for this "free" email account (I don't need the other .mac services)"

I hope that business has improved since your post - not being able to afford $99 as a business expense is really bad news...
post #57 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPDLVMH View Post

"I'm currently struggling as a freelance designer and cannot afford the horrendously expensive $99 a year Apple wants to charge for this "free" email account (I don't need the other .mac services)"

I hope that business has improved since your post - not being able to afford $99 as a business expense is really bad news...

Nine year old thread revive (without even quoting text properly) just to say that?

Not the best start to being here.
post #58 of 59
Thread Starter 
I can't believe I wrote that. I still use yhe same mac.com email address all these years later, and yes, my financial situation has improved a he'll of a lot, partly thanks to getting out of the design industry here in Hong Kong, which is to this day still a joke.
post #59 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

I can't believe I wrote that. I still use yhe same mac.com email address all these years later, and yes, my financial situation has improved a he'll of a lot, partly thanks to getting out of the design industry here in Hong Kong, which is to this day still a joke.

I'm glad things have improved for you. The design industry in Malaysia is pretty much rubbish as well, that's why I struggled too when I first came "back" to Malaysia at the end of 2004. More recently for the past four years I have been involved with an Apple reseller (recently ended the contract to refocus) doing various things including some web work, and I've only taken on a few freelance web projects. But print and web design in this country is not a very rewarding experience unless you are intensely into art and design and maybe live at home (as a lot of Asians do).

But overall I'm glad things have improved for you all these years later, that's great. I'm still using my .Mac account though I have changed my primary email address (but still a @mac.com address) about three years ago. I have a few gmail accounts for soaking up all the spam from various sites I log into plus for my iTunes account.

Working with the Apple reseller I have fortunately got a free MobileMe account as part of the online Apple sales training for all Apple Store employees and Apple reseller employees. It's given annually if you complete the appropriate sections of the online Apple sales training each year. Though this year it looks like Apple has not given out the free MobileMe accounts, at least for those who completed the requirements this year. Which makes me a bit annoyed because it is promised to you and documented in the online sales training. Not that I'm out for a free lunch, I have also put in a lot of time and effort in training and educating users about all things Apple including where possible, however rarely, MobileMe.

To most people $99 a year just to keep their email address is a bit harsh. But we'll have iCloud by the end of the year so, we'll see. I like the sync stuff for contacts and push email, so... ah well. I can pay out of my own pocket for MobileMe for a few more years but I definitely want to see some real value being offered by the end of this year, or at least a price cut. Personally, a price cut is not as important as Apple solidifying what the heck it actually wants to do in terms of the Cloud, and bringing a real cohesiveness and sensibility to their various cloud services.
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