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Apple previews iTV set-top device - Page 3

post #81 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell

Because people already have DVD players?

That's true but to some extent it would be nice to reduce the number of devices in the equipment rack. It would make a very slick little player, I think, though probably not as good as a player with a DCDi or HQV chip.
post #82 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jootec from Mars

Another hopefully. Hopefully can pull stuff from a blu-ray or hd-dvd player connected to Mac or PC. And I really hope in the future with hard drives getting larger and cheaper that Apple will look in to the possibility of being able to rip your DVD's which you can then access via iTV.

The reason you can't rip your DVD's (legally) today isn't because hard drives are too small and expensive. It's because the studios won't allow it. This isn't going to change because Apple has a nice box sitting in your living room.
post #83 of 344
Not that I really care as I'm not a Pc user but it does say Mac-Pc so I guess FRONT ROW will be the second Pc app?
post #84 of 344
This is a great business model for movie studios. I have purchased a bunch of DVDs it and loan it to a bunch of friends and family members after watching it. With iTunes store, each of these friends and family members would have had to buy their own copies from iTunes. And movie studios don't even having to spend for packaging.
post #85 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kishan

I don't think that Steve showed us everything this thing can do. If he did, he would essentially be giving all his competitor's photocopiers a six month headstart. I am hopeful that this little box will do quite a bit more than was shwon today.

Apple has the iTunes store already along with content providers signed up. And the iTV is already working as the demo has shown. I don't think competitor can do this and 6 months of additional progress if given the opportunity. I give Apple a little more credit than that.

If anything, we will hear more about this before Christmas shopping season so shoppers won't spend all their money on Blu-Ray or HD-DVD players and content before iTV is ready. Unless Apple thinks their product will be so great they will switch to downloading regardless.
post #86 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by byamabe

Pretty useless (i.e. I wouln't even consider buying it) if I can only play movies that I buy from the iTunes Store. Pay $299 for the convenience of watching an overpriced movie on my TV that I can't burn or play anywhere else unless I buy another $249 portable player (I don't own a video iPod). I'll just go to Best Buy, get the movie for $6.99, and save over $500. Maybe I'll sound like those people that doubted the iPod when it was announced, but one appeal of the iPod was that it made your music collection more portable. The iTunes Store/iTV combo makes your video less portable at a price premium.

Right. Because the iTV only serves one purpose... playing the full length movies available on iTunes
post #87 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell

Because people already have DVD players?

Because the DVD players that Apple's market wants are HD-DVD/Blu-Ray players and they cost 2x as much as the iTV.
post #88 of 344
Why put the USB on the back?

I purchaced a DVD player for the in-laws with a USB plug and multi-card reader on the front. That is useful.

Is it just me or does this seem like a wireless MacMini dock? That would explain why there is no optical drive built in. Would you seriously want to be controling the mac in your office from your tv?
post #89 of 344
Well its about time. I've only been saying this is what they should build for about 5 years now.
Providing grist for the rumour mill since 2001.
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post #90 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by beta.services

Why put the USB on the back?

I purchaced a DVD player for the in-laws with a USB plug and multi-card reader on the front. That is useful.

Is it just me or does this seem like a wireless MacMini dock? That would explain why there is no optical drive built in. Would you seriously want to be controling the mac in your office from your tv?

Let me guess: or you are a recent switcher, or you don't have a Mac.
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post #91 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by SharkBait

Some random thoughts for your consideration:
  • HDMI is of no value over component unless you're HD.
  • The 802.11 n standard is non-finalized, so you can't really say you're n-compliant - yet.
  • The MacPro's that contained airport were delayed (mine included) - n-ready but not n-compliant?
  • People like myself considered spending this much on the DLO HomeDock, and this thing kicks that thing around the block.
  • Steve hinted at using this as a monitor. Picture yourself with a bluetooth keyboard by the La-Z-Boy, with your MacPro in the den, surfing on the big-a$$ plasma you just bought.
Comments?

HDMI has an obvious value over component and optical audio cables. That being - ONE cable. Ya know, the reason it was invented... that and copy protection intentions...

Yeah I think it's obvious this thing will use 802.11n
post #92 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by baygbm

Exactly. Like I said, I have no need for this service so long as I have something like Netflix. If you live near a Netflix distribution center (and I do) turn around time is literally 24 hours for new movies... and because you always have 2, 3, or 5 movies in your possession (and more in your queue) you always have something you want to watch at home or on the way.

Everyone has a mailbox and a DVD player. Not everyone has a modern computer, with a fast internet connection, and the $299 iTV box necessary for this new service.

I'm sure Steve and other Apple execs have T1 at home. Do you? Downloading music is quick enough with DSL or cable but a near DVD quality movie?

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad this option of movie downloads is there. But for now I'll stick with Netflix.


FYI a T1 is only 1.544 Mbits at its best. Lots of people have 3Mbit cable/DSL.
post #93 of 344
I'm sorry but I strongly disagree with most of the opinions! People don't want to hook up an other device to their TV which only works together with their computer. It's to complicated for the majority. They just want one simple device that can do everything instead of haveing a Computer, DVD Player, Homecinema System, Stero and iTV. The wohle streaming Idea will not be the next big thing! Sorry, but trust me!
post #94 of 344
After seeing Jobs presentation its clear that iTV primary function is to stream media from the Mac to the TV. Its not intended to be a DVD player, its not a set top box, its not a DVR.

Hopefully room will be left open for third party options to give it more functionality. Will it be able to stream media back to the Mac? Will it be able to sit between the cable box and television? Will it be open for third party software?

If so Elgato could make a device that captures the decoded cable box signal, send the decoded signal to the television, and use iTV to stream the signal back to the Mac for recording on hard drive.

Quote:
Pretty useless (i.e. I wouln't even consider buying it) if I can only play movies that I buy from the iTunes Store

Well so far none of Apples hardware/software forces you to only use iTunes media, what does it benefit Apple to start now.

Quote:
Why go to the time and expense ($9.99, $12,99, or $14.99) to buy one near DVD quality movie when for the same money, I can get all the movies I want in a month from Netflix on DVD?

The same reason people download music instead of buying CD’s. Convenience.

Quote:
It will play anything quicktime can play, and quicktime (via flip4mac) can play wmp files.

On your Mac sure, but I assume this box will do its own decoding of media streams/files (it certainly will have to for video). So, unless Apple supports decoding of Windows Media files on the box, I doudt you will be able to do it. Same for DiVX and other formats Apple doesn't usually support.

I’m sure Flip4Mac would decode WMP files before it would be streamed to the box. You can save WMP files as QT in F4M.

Quote:
As far as HD, I read (MacRumors feed) that the Incredibles clip played during the presentation was HD.

Steve said in his presentation that those were 640x480 clips being shown.

Quote:
And I really hope in the future with hard drives getting larger and cheaper that Apple will look in to the possibility of being able to rip your DVD's which you can then access via iTV.

Not a snow balls chance in hell of this happening. Apple would loose all favor with content providers. Plus legal or not there are options for ripping DVD's and using the media as quicktime movies.
post #95 of 344
Quote:
People don't want to hook up an other device to their TV which only works together with their computer. It's to complicated for the majority. They just want one simple device that can do everything instead of haveing a Computer, DVD Player, Homecinema System, Stero and iTV.

This would likely be really expensive mess that does no one thing very well.
post #96 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by gar

Let me guess: or you are a recent switcher, or you don't have a Mac.

I have a mac, but my iMac sits on my desk and i can reach the back. There are 2 usb plugs on my keyboard, and i dont have to worry about pulling anything out of a cupboard o get to it.

Thats why they moved AV plugs to the front of TV's and VCR's. Once your home entertainment system is setup, you dont want to have to move the equipment to do something that you only need to do once in a while (i.e. Plug in a usb key with images, movies or music.) Would you really want to?
post #97 of 344
If Apple release a device that had an optical drive and a HDD, they would be doing 2 things.

1) They would be cutting into mac mini sales. I wouldnt want to guess how many, because it would probably be very small.

2) Not providing an upgrade path. If we see the device as it was shown, then by years end (2007) there may be a new device with a butil in optical dirve. Maybe Apple will wait for wide availability for BlueRay before they make a move like that. But people that bought the drive less device will be more likely to upgrade to the newer one.

If the device shipped with optical and HDD, then how many new features can the add to make a good enough argument for an upgrade 6 months later?
post #98 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by beta.services

Is it just me or does this seem like a wireless MacMini dock? That would explain why there is no optical drive built in. Would you seriously want to be controling the mac in your office from your tv?

Mac mini + iTV = HTPC

In addition to being used alone with a wireless connection to a Mac or PC in another room I believe it was also designed to transform a Mac mini into the media Mac many have been waiting for. It looks like it is the same footprint as the Mac mini so the two could be stacked together. I'd still prefer they added the iTV features to a high-end Mac mini but this is the next best thing.

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     197619842013  

     Where were you when the hammer flew?  

 

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iPhone 5 • iPad 4 • CR48 Chromebook • ThinkPad X220

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post #99 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1984

Mac mini + iTV = HTPC

In addition to being used alone with a wireless connection to a Mac or PC in another room I believe it was also designed to transform a Mac mini into the media Mac many have been waiting for. It looks like it is the same footprint as the Mac mini so the two could be stacked together. I'd still prefer they added the iTV features to a high-end Mac mini but this is the next best thing.

Just an FYI, but the Mac mini can already do everything this streaming media decoder box can do. The only advantage to buying this box and stacking it on a Mac mini would be that it has separate decoder hardware for video, and I assume it would thus reduce the CPU load on the mini.
post #100 of 344
Well, I haven't heard this speculation yet, but maybe the USB port is so that you can plug your iPod directly in and no computer is necessary.

Then maybe you'll be able to buy music and videos through the iTV and store them on your iPod so you don't need a computer for your media center. Another option/addition would be a wireless iPod that you can purchase movies/music on and then connect to the iTV. Or perhaps both.

For that matter, why even store the media at all. If the iTV can talk with the iTunes Store, just get your media on demand.

Now, all those features might make this worth $299, but then again, would you really want to pay $299 just for the privilege of having a front end to the iTunes Store? Maybe Apple should be giving this box away as a front end to the iTunes Store, and then if you want to keep the media locally, you have to buy a Mac or an iPod.
post #101 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by rarity

I'm sorry but I strongly disagree with most of the opinions! People don't want to hook up an other device to their TV which only works together with their computer. It's to complicated for the majority. They just want one simple device that can do everything instead of haveing a Computer, DVD Player, Homecinema System, Stero and iTV?

I'm absolutely not agreeing with you here. If all-in-one is what "we" want where are all the devices then?

Adding all that into one box just creates complexity.

iTV is excactly what I've been asking for for years. I have a great DVD player/HDD recorder, a great amp and a great plasma, and I just need a simple device to let me see my photos on the tv, select and hear music on my stereo and perhaps watch whatever kind of QT movies I have.

I don't need a computer in my living room since I won't be using 99% of that computers features.

And the best of it all? I can mix and match my devices to get what I want.
JLL

95% percent of the boat is owned by Microsoft, but the 5% Apple controls happens to be the rudder!
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JLL

95% percent of the boat is owned by Microsoft, but the 5% Apple controls happens to be the rudder!
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post #102 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbelkin

Not that I really care as I'm not a Pc user but it does say Mac-Pc so I guess FRONT ROW will be the second Pc app?

Why? It's not accessing FrontRow on your computer - it has FrontRow built in.
JLL

95% percent of the boat is owned by Microsoft, but the 5% Apple controls happens to be the rudder!
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JLL

95% percent of the boat is owned by Microsoft, but the 5% Apple controls happens to be the rudder!
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post #103 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by byamabe

...
Maybe I'll sound like those people that doubted the iPod when it was announced, but one appeal of the iPod was that it made your music collection more portable. The iTunes Store/iTV combo makes your video less portable at a price premium.

There is a huge difference in the way people are consuming
music and movies respectively.
Regarding the movie store: It is not about collecting a huge
number of movies in order to own them and carry them over to
one place to another. That doesn't make sense. Imho.

The huge success of the iPod is based opon the possibility
to carry your entire music collection from A to B, in order
to listen them anywhere and everywhere. Movies doesn't
work that way.

Btw on topic: What is the difference between the announced Apple TV device
and the already existing Elgato EyeHome?
" I will not commit anything to memory that I can get from another source . . . "
ALBERT EINSTEIN
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" I will not commit anything to memory that I can get from another source . . . "
ALBERT EINSTEIN
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post #104 of 344
Now all I need is something to store all these Movies on. I have an iBook and the 60 GB drive is maxed out. Hey Apple, how bout making us a nice home network storage server with RAID etc to store all this great content. This would also allow for streaming content even if my computer/ibook is not on the network.
post #105 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by eAi

Well, they'd probably have issues calling it iTV in the UK as one of the major TV channels here is called ITV...

Given the way ITV is going down hill the name may well be free by Spr 07.
post #106 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by mariofreak85

Hey, $299 to turn any mac into a media center PC is well worth it in my opinion.

I for one will be buying one.

It's not a media center, it's a media center extender. It basically streams front row from your Mac to your TV. Similar devices have existed for a couple years now on the PC side. Personally, I like the device, hate the price. PC extenders couldn't sell for $200, I'm very doubtful Apple can sell the same for $300 with no computer DVR capability.
post #107 of 344
Well,

I thought of what I believe to be a great name for the iTV boxen...

but when I tried to submit it to Apple I read their unsolicited ideas policy

of course, I'm sure they can't legally maintain the idea is theirs as soon as you submit it but still...

I wonder if they'll come up with my idea themselves.
iPatch

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iPatch

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post #108 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by ~ufo~

Well,

I thought of what I believe to be a great name for the iTV boxen...

but when I tried to submit it to Apple I read their unsolicited ideas policy

of course, I'm sure they can't legally maintain the idea is theirs as soon as you submit it but still...

I wonder if they'll come up with my idea themselves.

Well... go on, share it with your buddies... or at least with me
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post #109 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtotes

Given the way ITV is going down hill the name may well be free by Spr 07.

Oh this is so true! Nobody watches ITV anymore. They've brought back a few favourites for next season though, Cracker etc..

Their core demographic has moved on.
post #110 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by ~ufo~

Well,

I thought of what I believe to be a great name for the iTV boxen...

but when I tried to submit it to Apple I read their unsolicited ideas policy

of course, I'm sure they can't legally maintain the idea is theirs as soon as you submit it but still...

I wonder if they'll come up with my idea themselves.

Ideas are cheap, implementation is expensive.
post #111 of 344
"With that USB port on the back I'm hoping for the ability to plug a large hard drive in there as I am nervous about the whole streaming thing."

OR THE USB COULD HAVE ONE OF THOSE TINY LITTLE HD AND TV THINGYS IN IT THOSE SHUFFLE SIZED THINGS WHATEVER THEY ARE CALLED! THAT WOULD BE KILLER!

post #112 of 344
Did anyone else notice how many times Steve used the phrase "big flat screen TV"? He said it over, and over, and over. I got the feeling the iTV will be released with an Apple branded "big flat screen TV", or Apple will release a "big flat screen TV" with the iTV's functions built in.

I'm not sure how smart a move that would be - that market is pretty full of big players, but if Apple built Front Row into it, and it integrated smoothly with your media library, it might be a decent revenue stream. The big manufacturers (Samsung, Sony, Panasonic, et al) make nice SCREENS, but they don't offer the media integration and user experience branding that Apple does.

- Jasen.
post #113 of 344
But with an iTV it will...
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post #114 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasenj1

Did anyone else notice how many times Steve used the phrase "big flat screen TV"? He said it over, and over, and over. I got the feeling the iTV will be released with an Apple branded "big flat screen TV", or Apple will release a "big flat screen TV" with the iTV's functions built in.

I'm not sure how smart a move that would be - that market is pretty full of big players, but if Apple built Front Row into it, and it integrated smoothly with your media library, it might be a decent revenue stream. The big manufacturers (Samsung, Sony, Panasonic, et al) make nice SCREENS, but they don't offer the media integration and user experience branding that Apple does.

- Jasen.

Yea, I was thinking the same thing. He said it over and over and over even though one's living room viewing device could be a CRT/projector, etc.
post #115 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasenj1

Did anyone else notice how many times Steve used the phrase "big flat screen TV"? He said it over, and over, and over....

I also notice that. My gut feeling is that whenever this periph is released, content from the iTunes store will be, at least, 1280 pixels wide (by whatever tall to maintain perspective).

Rhetorical Q: Does the iTV come with adapters for RCA composite or S-video? I have a 7 year-old SD CRT that has only those inputs-as do a lot of people.
post #116 of 344
So I was getting ready for work this morning and thinking about the iTV when it hit me that this device may not be about movies 'right now'... All of teh arguments about pricing and the files not being HD, etc... are valid (although I would have thought 9.99 for a CD was ridiculous 3-4 years ago). However, there are a couple of other media types available right now that fit the bill perfectly... Thursday night, 8pm. Oh shoot, I missed Lost again, or I would love to catch up with the last 4 episodes of Lost before the new season starts (project Runway, NFL highlights, whatever). Now you can instantly access that content on your TV whenever you like. The content is there, better quality, fast download and now viewable on a TV set. I think this is the hidden gem here. Add on the abilty to sync the iTV to your stero and stream all of your music to your hoime stereo that may have previously been sitting on your office computer and you have a nice add on for the living room.

Sure there are DVRs and they will compete, but you can't always find last seasons episode 7 of Lost and what about people who only subscribe to HBO for the Sopranos? Now they can dump HBO and just download Spranos/Six Feet Under/Whatever for a fraction of the price.

Movies will come and are a huge wow factor, but I think (and this is just my opinion) that the other media is the gem here for the moment.

Makes sense or am I smoking something?
post #117 of 344
Yes, the day will come when everything in your entertainment center will carry the Apple logo. Well, except the set top box. Though I will never part with my paradyme speakers.

The bottleneck right now is bandwidth. Once we're up to around 30 MBPS or higher then Netflix, Blockbuster, and all the others will be as good as dead. Blockbuster already is though they don't know it yet.
post #118 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vox Barbara

There is a huge difference in the way people are consuming
music and movies respectively.
Regarding the movie store: It is not about collecting a huge
number of movies in order to own them and carry them over to
one place to another. That doesn't make sense. Imho.

The huge success of the iPod is based opon the possibility
to carry your entire music collection from A to B, in order
to listen them anywhere and everywhere. Movies doesn't
work that way.

Btw on topic: What is the difference between the announced Apple TV device
and the already existing Elgato EyeHome?

I thought I had no need to carry around all my 400+ CDs of music until the iPod came along. Now I'm thinking yeah, this is neat. I get to enjoy the thousands of $$ that I spent on music much much more. Previously, the CDs sat on the rack because it was too much trouble to keep loading and unloading them on the player.

This is the genius of Apple. They open up markets by offering you something that you never thought you'd ever need and now you can't live without.

Carrying all your movies and videos around in your pocket may sound silly right now but I can see commuters latching on to that, or parents contemplating long flights or drives with their kids, or just visiting with friends and watching a movie together. It's just way more convenient. Right now, you have to rummage through your DVD collection and spend time picking what you feel like watching. With your movies in your pocket, you just grab the video iPod on your way out the door. And no large rack of DVDs taking up space and causing an eyesore in your living room.

Do not underestimate the lure of 'grab and go' convenience to today's harried consumers.

As to Elgato EyeHome. I have one of those, it's back in its box taking up space. The software was too finicky, it won't stream iTunes purchases, and it's not portable. Now I just slip my iPod in the dock that sits right next to the receiver. And when I need to be somewhere I just grab the iPod and go. I stick it to the aux. jack in the car or listen over earphones. What set up can be even more convenient than that?
post #119 of 344
The iTV better support other codecs and higher resolution! If it does then I'd love to buy it, even at $299.
post #120 of 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeePeeSee

HDMI has an obvious value over component and optical audio cables. That being - ONE cable. Ya know, the reason it was invented... that and copy protection intentions...

Most home theater users won't see any benefit from HDMI/One cable.. Most connect video direct to the set, and run audio through a reciever then to a 5.1/7.1 set of speakers.. Now, if they try to run the HDMI cable through the reciever w/ HDMI inputs, it's possible, but most everyone I know that's tried this have had issues with the HDMI copy protection scheme (name escapes me at the moment, HDCP?)...

DVI out with a DVI-> HDMI cable would be fine by me.


jwd
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