or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Other Discussion › AppleOutsider › methods of Propoganda and spin
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

methods of Propoganda and spin

post #1 of 45
Thread Starter 
A great read to see how easily the western world has been brainwashed.

http://www.thedoctorwithin.com/index...perception.php
post #2 of 45
Well yes, once the science of spin arose, it simply took the place of the previous king, religious organizations.

One would have hoped that things would improve, but...
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
post #3 of 45
Haha, well, the list of myths that this anti-science web page provides contains many statements that are factual, and many more that are probable or at the least debatable. Many others, like "pharmaceuticals restore health" are just too vague to even address. I've bolded the ones that I think are factual, and italicized the ones that I believe are probable or debatable.

Pharmaceuticals restore health
Vaccination brings immunity
The cure for cancer is just around the corner
Menopause is a disease condition
When a child is sick, he needs immediate antibiotics
When a child has a fever he needs Tylenol
Hospitals are safe and clean.
America has the best health care in the world.
Americans have the best health in the world.
Milk is a good source of calcium.
You never outgrow your need for milk.
Vitamin C is ascorbic acid.
Aspirin prevents heart attacks.
Heart drugs improve the heart.
Back and neck pain are the only reasons for spinal adjustment.
No child can get into school without being vaccinated.
The FDA thoroughly tests all drugs before they go on the market.
Pregnancy is a serious medical condition
Infancy is a serious medical condition
Chemotherapy and radiation are effective cures for cancer
When your child is diagnosed with an ear infection, antibiotics should be given immediately 'just in case'
Ear tubes are for the good of the child.
Estrogen drugs prevent osteoporosis after menopause.
Pediatricians are the most highly trained of al medical specialists.
The purpose of the health care industry is health.
HIV is the cause of AIDS.
AZT is the cure.
Without vaccines, infectious diseases will return
Fluoride in the city water protects your teeth
Flu shots prevent the flu.
Vaccines are thoroughly tested before being placed on the Mandated Schedule.
Doctors are certain that the benefits of vaccines far outweigh any possible risks.
There is a terrorist threat in the US.
There is a bioterrorist threat in the US.
The NASDAQ is a natural market controlled by supply and demand.
Chronic pain is a natural consequence of aging.
Soy is your healthiest source of protein.
Insulin shots cure diabetes.
After we take out your gall bladder you can eat anything you want
Allergy medicine will cure allergies.
An airliner can be flown with professional precision by a group of crazed amateurs into a 100-storey building and can cause that building to collapse on its own footprint. Twice.
The Iraqis blew up the World Trade Center.
post #4 of 45
Retarded.
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
post #5 of 45
Thread Starter 
so who got as far as Edward Bernays?

no-one, lame, well as you're all showing the attention span of 5 year olds, i'll just give you the funny video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzaqXFcsH2U
post #6 of 45
That's a pretty dumb site.
post #7 of 45
Quote:
Let's say you're in a crowded cafeteria, and you buy a cup of tea. And as you're about to sit down you see your friend way across the room. So you put the tea down and walk across the room and talk to your friend for a few minutes. Now, coming back to your tea, are you just going to pick it up and drink it? Remember, this is a crowded place and you've just left your tea unattended for several minutes. You've given anybody in that room access to your tea.

Why should your mind be any different?

Because fear and paranoia is not the answer to anything.
post #8 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chucker

Because fear and paranoia is not the answer to anything.

I agree. Paranoia is dumb, and the people that perpetuate it are dumb. I received an email from a female friend all about the precautions that one should take to avoid being kidnapped and raped. I couldn't believe some of the advice it gave. I anyone would like me to post it hear or email it to them I would be glad to. It's a good laugh, and yet scary at the same time.
"We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty!" ~ Vroomfondel
Reply
"We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty!" ~ Vroomfondel
Reply
post #9 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcUK

so who got as far as Edward Bernays?

no-one, lame, well as you're all showing the attention span of 5 year olds, i'll just give you the funny video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzaqXFcsH2U

Sorry, read the whole thing, still not seeing anything spectacularly new or interesting in there.

People in position of power have *always* used propaganda and lies to influence the masses. Period. End of story.

And, given that the piece was so *incredibly* poorly referenced, with assertions made without citations to back them up...

...how certain are you that you haven't swallowed a big chunk of propaganda?
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
post #10 of 45
I am not an expert in all fields but I will try to give my own personal advice on some subjects :

Pharmaceuticals restore health (overall it's true)
Vaccination brings immunity (it bring for most people (% depending of the type of vaccination), a particular immunity for the particular disease)
The cure for cancer is just around the corner (no it is not, but many cancers have a chance to be cured today)
Menopause is a disease condition (it's not, it's physiological, but it do noes bring any good)
When a child is sick, he needs immediate antibiotics (who said that ? )
When a child has a fever he needs Tylenol (don't know that one, probabily an US thing)
Hospitals are safe and clean. (overall they are, but there is always exceptions, but it's more accurate to say that hospiital are safe and clean than the contrary)
America has the best health care in the world. (it's not for every US people, but who claim it is ? )
Americans have the best health in the world. (can't reply for that one, but sure it's one of the best)
Milk is a good source of calcium. (cheese is better, but that's right)
You never outgrow your need for milk.
Vitamin C is ascorbic acid.(yes it is !)
Aspirin prevents heart attacks. (in a certain way, yes, all people with stents are under aspirin or alike)
Heart drugs improve the heart. (if not they are useless drugs aren't they ? )
Back and neck pain are the only reasons for spinal adjustment.
No child can get into school without being vaccinated.(It depend on the countrie)
The FDA thoroughly tests all drugs before they go on the market. (yes)
Pregnancy is a serious medical condition (no)
Infancy is a serious medical condition (no)
Chemotherapy and radiation are effective cures for cancer (yes, but it's not a cakewalk) Explain that it's not effective to one of my best friend.Without chemotherapy his son will be dead now.
When your child is diagnosed with an ear infection, antibiotics should be given immediately 'just in case' it's a real bacterial infection, it's mandatory. For virus it does not help
Ear tubes are for the good of the child. No ear tubes are just a punishment
Estrogen drugs prevent osteoporosis after menopause. It certainly help
Pediatricians are the most highly trained of al medical specialists. No, but you should ask the advice of the pediatricians on that one.
The purpose of the health care industry is health. No it's to stole our money
HIV is the cause of AIDS. If you disagree, I can inoculate you the HIV free of charge ...
AZT is the cure. There is many others cures
Without vaccines, infectious diseases will return . Those who say the contrary are criminals in my book : luckily they are not in charge of our health
Fluoride in the city water protects your teeth : it's true (but it's forbidden in France)
Flu shots prevent the flu.(not always, but I always do my flu shot)
Vaccines are thoroughly tested before being placed on the Mandated Schedule. no they are never tested : what a waste of time
Doctors are certain that the benefits of vaccines far outweigh any possible risks. Yes
There is a terrorist threat in the US. Of course, like in any other countrie.
There is a bioterrorist threat in the US. It's mostly possible
The NASDAQ is a natural market controlled by supply and demand. I don't know what mean natural
Chronic pain is a natural consequence of aging. It's not natural, but most aged people have chronic pain unfortunately
Soy is your healthiest source of protein.
Insulin shots cure diabetes. It do not cure diabete, but it allow you to survive
After we take out your gall bladder you can eat anything you want (don't know what a gall blader is)
Allergy medicine will cure allergies. Not always unfortunately, but sometimes it do (especially if you are allergic to only one thing)
An airliner can be flown with professional precision by a group of crazed amateurs into a 100-storey building and can cause that building to collapse on its own footprint. Twice. This nice complot theory
The Iraqis blew up the World Trade Center. Officialy in US, it's not any more the case

My question is : who is the spin doctor here ?
post #11 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell

I've bolded the ones that I think are factual, and italicized the ones that I believe are probable or debatable.

Strange - the bolded ones are exactly the ones I'd outline as having been obviously most subject to spin and distortion....

"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats" - H L Mencken
Reply

"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats" - H L Mencken
Reply
post #12 of 45
That's funny, because they're the ones backed up by scientific evidence.
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
post #13 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardeeharhar

That's funny, because they're the ones backed up by scientific evidence.

Yes - I think the two things are related...

"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats" - H L Mencken
Reply

"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats" - H L Mencken
Reply
post #14 of 45
Sorry to say this: but you are an idiot then.
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
post #15 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardeeharhar

Sorry to say this: but you are an idiot then.

I work at it....

"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats" - H L Mencken
Reply

"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats" - H L Mencken
Reply
post #16 of 45
Propaganda is far more subtle to pick up for most people because when we agree with something, we think it's automatically true.

Any time news is delivered with some sort of analysis, it's propaganda. Those who claim to be "objective" journalists, for instance, fail to acknowledge that every human communication, including their "news" is laden with value judgments about what to include, what to exclude, and how to present the information. Conscious or unconscious, we all speak with some sort of agenda; most of the time, it's benign, sometimes not. Because of this, people need to listen to the news with a critical ear-- and take into account whether the news professors let you know where they stand and that they have an angle. Think of people who speak and raise controversy-- Rush Limbaugh, Jesse Jackson... You may not agree with them, but you know where they stand because they acknowledge it. You then listen accordingly. But someone like Brian Williams from NBC or Dan Rather-- who appeared objective to so many until he had to resign for being a bit too over-eager to present information that was entirely fabricated, and unchecked-- many people just accept that these guys are speaking the "truth," when their biases are just a bit more polished and subtle.
There's no there there. But, I'm working on it.
Reply
There's no there there. But, I'm working on it.
Reply
post #17 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricksbrain

Any time news is delivered with some sort of analysis, it's propaganda.

Wow. \

So whenever someone gives you their opinion, they're propagandistic?
post #18 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricksbrain

Any time news is delivered with some sort of analysis, it's propaganda.

I'd say more often than not, it's a lack of analysis that turns news into proganda. One side's "talking points" (usually the Republicans these days) get reported in the news either unchallenged ("Today the President said..."), or, at best, we get counterpoint in he said/she said fashion, pitting one talking point against another but never delving at all into whose BS stinks more when you examine the facts.

When what one side says is more logically sound or better in line with the facts than another side in the general public debate, it's a false neutrality and a disengenuous "objectivity" to simply pit sound-bite length talking points against one another without any commentary about the accuracy or soundness of what's being said.

This kind of false neutrality lets the better propagandist, and the side who gets the most air time for their slant on things, win.
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
Reply
post #19 of 45
Yes. Any opinion is propaganda. That doesn't mean it's wrong, though. If someone makes decisions about what others should hear, it's a version of the truth, only. If someone doesn't acknowledge that, they may be selling you a bridge.

If you think one "side" or the other has a stronger hold on delivering the news of the day, you're falling victim to your own perspective. Again, because you agree with something, it must be right... right? Socrates. The Church. Gallileo. Newton. Hawkings. Your political leader du jour. Your friend. Your desires? Your conscience? Strong opinions, lots of evidence, much disagreement. None of them 100% right, most likely.


In another few years, much of what people believe will be "proven" wrong according to new standards of "truth," only to be proven wrong again in a few more years. Since the truth doesn't really change, it must be our perspectives that do. Humans are limited by their perceptions, so for us to judge the truth is ridiculous; we see what we know. For the rest, we make up stories. So here we are, back to propaganda. Information that backs the truth we want, not necessarily what is.

The truth is the sum of all things. If someone tries to sell the truth as anything less, it's propaganda.
There's no there there. But, I'm working on it.
Reply
There's no there there. But, I'm working on it.
Reply
post #20 of 45
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardeeharhar

That's funny, because they're the ones backed up by scientific evidence.

the only one of those I'd agree with is hiv causes aids, the rest simply aren't true.
post #21 of 45
Prove it.

Great thing about science, you can provide evidence.
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
post #22 of 45
Thread Starter 
Ascorbic Acid is completely useless to the body unless it is of the L-enantiomer type - which is then known as vitamin C.
post #23 of 45
I wouldn't go that far marcuk.

Even D-ascorbate is capable of reducing things in vivo. While it is true only l-ascorbate is recognized by enzymes, it is also true that all natural sources of ascorbic acid are the l-enantiomer.
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
post #24 of 45
Thread Starter 
but what this list is showing us, is that there are common misconceptions about the degree of truth. Alot of things on that list are 'sketchily' true, but in 'fundamentalist' reality - are broad statements of common misconception.

I think near everything on that list has a basis in truth, but is not the whole and full truth, and in not knowing the definite truth, we allow ourselves to be manipulated by our fears and pulled into a false sense of security by our desires, for the benefit of no-one but a profit making machine or a political agenda.

Afterall, a drug company could sell us some very expensive drugs containing 'ascorbic acid' - and people would flock to buy them thinking they were doing themselves some benefit, but unless it was L-ascorbic, it could be completely useless.
post #25 of 45
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha

Sorry, read the whole thing, still not seeing anything spectacularly new or interesting in there.

People in position of power have *always* used propaganda and lies to influence the masses. Period. End of story.

And, given that the piece was so *incredibly* poorly referenced, with assertions made without citations to back them up...

...how certain are you that you haven't swallowed a big chunk of propaganda?

but why do people desire to be lied too and accept this crap? In not knowing the truth from the propoganda, we allow ourselves to be led like sheep to the slaughter. Infact some people positively desire it. Why?
post #26 of 45
Because that's how people are. Thinking is too hard, it's much better to be told what to do. Sure, they may claim they want freedom to think, but really, most people are just looking for a surrogate mommy or daddy to lead them by the hand through the big scary world. It's the reason behind most religious organizations, and it's the reason behind political spin and propaganda.

Cue Devo's _Freedom of Choice_.

The irony is, in accepting the article you linked to at face value, without requiring it to back up its claims, you fell prey to the same trap. It looked like what you wanted to hear, and on the face of it, it spoke with an air of authority, so you accepted it. Oops.

This is where the Big Bad Science has a leg up - it requires evidence, and it requires logic, and it requires a trail of proof. It's not perfect, and a lot of people just cite the most recent references, without ever going back and double-checking the original sources of data, but the point is that you *CAN*. That article? No way to track down those claims one way or the other. If you didn't know any better, you might just swallow them as true, lock, stock, and barrel.

See, the thing about the Vitamin-C/ascorbic acid thing is... every scientist knows that only one form is bioreactive. That's true for almost *ALL* lab-produced chemicals. The thing is, in most simple reactions in the lab, the two chiral forms are produced in equal amounts. So for a given 100mg of lab-produced ascorbic acid, 50mg is pure Vitamin C, 50mg is less effective, but not useless. The claim, therefore, that ascorbic acid != Vitamin C is hogwash. This is high school chemistry.

So, now that that one's been shown to be bunk, how does that make you feel about the authenticity of the other claims, since you can't check any of them?
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
post #27 of 45
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha


See, the thing about the Vitamin-C/ascorbic acid thing is... every scientist knows that only one form is bioreactive. That's true for almost *ALL* lab-produced chemicals. The thing is, in most simple reactions in the lab, the two chiral forms are produced in equal amounts. So for a given 100mg of lab-produced ascorbic acid, 50mg is pure Vitamin C, 50mg is less effective, but not useless. The claim, therefore, that ascorbic acid != Vitamin C is hogwash. This is high school chemistry.

So, now that that one's been shown to be bunk, how does that make you feel about the authenticity of the other claims, since you can't check any of them?

Were not talking about what every scientist knows, were talking about what average Joe on the street 'thinks' he knows, and theres a big difference, because if you aren't privvy to the absolute knowledge, you can be led right down the garden path.

As you've shown, only 50% of lab produced Ascorbic Acid is Vitamin C - 50% of it is not. Those privvy to this knowledge know this, but a vast majority do not.

Now I didn't mean to get into a discussion about Vitamin C. I'm using it as an example. Misconceptions are always based around not being privvy to the knowledge, and when you are ignorant of the whole truth, the half truth can be used against you to deceive you into holding an opinion that is based on truth, but not true.

Im sure no one really gives a fuck about vitamin C - but there are larger issues, some of which have become knowledge - like WMD in Iraq - where not being privvy to the complete set of facts and information can lead us into a postion of ignorance, which leads to a public misconception in which the information is used to bolster the publics misconception and as such - like there was a bit of a 'half truth' in there being WMD's in Iraq - there 'WERE' but not when we 'INVADED' - OK, crap vitamin C doesn't kill innocent people, but intentionally CRAP intelligence does.
post #28 of 45
Thread Starter 
What really happened is that alot of people saw that list at the start of the article, and thought thats a pile of shit because they were convinced by their 'misconceptions' and therefore the whole article must be shit.

And the whole article is referencable - in this internet age every single thing on that list is referencable and verifyable if you can be bothered. It seems most people prefer their misconception and cant be bothered. And when this happens you are zombied sheep walking to an abbatoir.

Whats worse, is that the governments know this is how the vast majority of people are.

Really - soon there wont be a need to even formulate the propaganda.
post #29 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcUK

Ascorbic Acid is completely useless to the body unless it is of the L-enantiomer type - which is then known as vitamin C.


Scientific mumbo-jumbo. Everyone knows that D works fine if you look into a mirror when you swallow it. The people can't be fooled.
"some catch on faster than others"
Reply
"some catch on faster than others"
Reply
post #30 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcUK

Were not talking about what every scientist knows, were talking about what average Joe on the street 'thinks' he knows, and theres a big difference, because if you aren't privvy to the absolute knowledge, you can be led right down the garden path.

As you've shown, only 50% of lab produced Ascorbic Acid is Vitamin C - 50% of it is not. Those privvy to this knowledge know this, but a vast majority do not.

Now I didn't mean to get into a discussion about Vitamin C. I'm using it as an example. Misconceptions are always based around not being privvy to the knowledge, and when you are ignorant of the whole truth, the half truth can be used against you to deceive you into holding an opinion that is based on truth, but not true.

Im sure no one really gives a fuck about vitamin C - but there are larger issues, some of which have become knowledge - like WMD in Iraq - where not being privvy to the complete set of facts and information can lead us into a postion of ignorance, which leads to a public misconception in which the information is used to bolster the publics misconception and as such - like there was a bit of a 'half truth' in there being WMD's in Iraq - there 'WERE' but not when we 'INVADED' - OK, crap vitamin C doesn't kill innocent people, but intentionally CRAP intelligence does.

You're right, but the example picked, vitamin C, was a really piss-poor one because it's something that every high school graduate in the US should know. And, you missed the point - the article claimed that they simply weren't equivalent, it made no reference to supporting material, nor did it provide any evidence or argument on its own. It asserted a half-truth as true, and you swallowed it... which is precisely what the article is touting as evil incarnate.

So basically, it boils down to: question what you're told, ask for proof, ask for original source references, and require the one making assertions to back up their claims solidly before accepting them at face value.

Sounds like science to me.

It also sounds like what you *didn't* do when accepting the claims in that article as truth.

Pot, kettle.
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
post #31 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcUK

Were not talking about what every scientist knows, were talking about what average Joe on the street 'thinks' he knows, and theres a big difference, because if you aren't privvy to the absolute knowledge, you can be led right down the garden path.

As you've shown, only 50% of lab produced Ascorbic Acid is Vitamin C - 50% of it is not. Those privvy to this knowledge know this, but a vast majority do not.

Now I didn't mean to get into a discussion about Vitamin C. I'm using it as an example. Misconceptions are always based around not being privvy to the knowledge, and when you are ignorant of the whole truth, the half truth can be used against you to deceive you into holding an opinion that is based on truth, but not true.

Im sure no one really gives a fuck about vitamin C - but there are larger issues, some of which have become knowledge - like WMD in Iraq - where not being privvy to the complete set of facts and information can lead us into a postion of ignorance, which leads to a public misconception in which the information is used to bolster the publics misconception and as such - like there was a bit of a 'half truth' in there being WMD's in Iraq - there 'WERE' but not when we 'INVADED' - OK, crap vitamin C doesn't kill innocent people, but intentionally CRAP intelligence does.

It do not make an huge difference that only half of the acid is absorbed. It's also the case for many drugs where only half the quantity is levogyre. That's not really a big deal
BTW, if you have a normal diet, you don't really need a vit C supply
An excess of vit C is bad for health either.
post #32 of 45
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by southside grabowski

Scientific mumbo-jumbo

If I hold you over the edge of a cliff, will I get a better fuck?
post #33 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcUK

What really happened is that alot of people saw that list at the start of the article, and thought thats a pile of shit because they were convinced by their 'misconceptions' and therefore the whole article must be shit.

Wrong, bucko. Like I said, I read the whole thing to the end. I looked for references, I read the bibliography, and I even checked a couple of them.

So maybe what you really think happened, is just to make yourself feel better that the article *is* shit.

Quote:
And the whole article is referencable - in this internet age every single thing on that list is referencable and verifyable if you can be bothered. It seems most people prefer their misconception and cant be bothered. And when this happens you are zombied sheep walking to an abbatoir.

OMFG. Hypocricy much? Did *YOU* do any reference checking? Did *YOU* question *ANYTHING* in that article?

And I'm sorry, but in case you hadn't noticed, *ANYTHING* can found on the Internet. I can find you pages that 'prove' that Elvis is alive and living at Area 51 with his alien lover, for fuck's sake.

Quote:
Whats worse, is that the governments know this is how the vast majority of people are.

Yes, yes they are.

Quote:
Really - soon there wont be a need to even formulate the propaganda.

Obviously. You've proven that quite thoroughly. Hook, line, and sinker.
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
post #34 of 45
Thread Starter 
so if we ignore the list that makes you throth at the mouth, what part of the rest of the article do you find to be in error?
post #35 of 45
Nothing, really, as I stated at the beginning. It's just not anything *new*.

People are sheep, organized bodies of power have always taken advantage of that. Modern advertising techniques are just writing down what leaders have done since time immemorial.

There's. Nothing. New. Here.

Unfortunately, the article tries to give itself a weight of authority by spouting completely unsubstantiated (and often wrong) bits of information as 'proof' that they should be trusted. Classic propaganda technique. "Trust us! See? Only *we* know the truth!"

The article does precisely what it says is evil and bad, and tries to aggrandize itself (and the author) by spouting old news as something new and shiny... and is therefore pretty worthless.

I suppose if you'd never stopped to consider the topics, it might seem like some big breakthrough, but consider that in getting so excited about the truthiness of it, you exercised the same lack of thought that anyone else who falls to spin does.

ie, what did you learn? To think for yourself, or just shift the desire to be led to a new master?

Edit: speeling mistak
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
post #36 of 45
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha

Nothing, really, as I stated at the beginning. It's just not anything *new*.

People are sheep, organized bodies of power have always taken advantage of that. Modern advertising techniques are just writing down what leaders have done since time immemorial.

There's. Nothing. New. Here.

Unfortunately, the article tries to give itself a weight of authority by spouting completely unsubstantiated (and often wrong) bits of information as 'proof' that they should be trusted. Classic propaganda technique. "Trust us! See? Only *we* know the truth!"

The article does precisely what it says is evil and bad, and tries to aggrandize itself (and the author) by spouting old news as something new and shiny... and is therefore pretty worthless.

I suppose if you'd never stopped to consider the topics, it might seem like some big breakthrough, but consider that in getting so excited about the truthiness of it, you exercised the same lack of thought that anyone else who falls to spin does.

ie, what did you learn? To think for yourself, or just shift the desire to be lead to a new master?


whats considered *new* is really a state of mind. Every piece of information is *new* the first time you hear it. Its nothing *new* that Jesus-never-existed as a physical person in Palestine circa 1st C. - Thats been known to the elite for 2000 years, but the majority dont know this. Its nothing *new* that Apple make the best consumer operating system. This has been known for 20 years, so why does Apple have a 3% market share - most people dont know apple makes an alternative. Is nothing *new* that propaganda takes place. The educated have known this for thousands of years, but joe schmoe still laps it all up. All of these things are known to people privvy to the best information of the whole story.

As shown a vast majority of people dont have the slightest clue of these things, and it needs to be pointed out again and again for infinity so that people can be saved from their own ignorance and stupidity.

Profit controls virtually everything you see, read, hear and more disturbingly, what you think - And it needs to be pointed out regularly, because for someone, this might be *new* information, and they might want to act on it, lest they (un) willingly become another mindless drone.
post #37 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcUK

whats considered *new* is really a state of mind. Every piece of information is *new* the first time you hear it. Its nothing *new* that Jesus-never-existed as a physical person in Palestine circa 1st C. - Thats been known to the elite for 2000 years, but the majority dont know this. Its nothing *new* that Apple make the best consumer operating system. This has been known for 20 years, so why does Apple have a 3% market share - most people dont know apple makes an alternative. Is nothing *new* that propaganda takes place. The educated have known this for thousands of years, but joe schmoe still laps it all up. All of these things are known to people privvy to the best information of the whole story.

As shown a vast majority of people dont have the slightest clue of these things, and it needs to be pointed out again and again for infinity so that people can be saved from their own ignorance and stupidity.

Profit controls virtually everything you see, read, hear and more disturbingly, what you think - And it needs to be pointed out regularly, because for someone, this might be *new* information, and they might want to act on it, lest they (un) willingly become another mindless drone.

While a worthy goal, perhaps you could find example literature that doesn't rely on the same sheep-think to make sure it is believed.

Just an idea.

Message: good.

That article: horrible.
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
post #38 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha

Prove it.

Great thing about science, you can provide evidence.

But it's rather hard to prove a non-connection.
post #39 of 45
Just throwing this question out there:

How many people understand that compounds can have non-identical mirror images?
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
Reply
post #40 of 45
diastereomers?
There's no there there. But, I'm working on it.
Reply
There's no there there. But, I'm working on it.
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: AppleOutsider
AppleInsider › Forums › Other Discussion › AppleOutsider › methods of Propoganda and spin