or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mac Hardware › Future Apple Hardware › Dell beats Apple in unveiling 8 core Xeon workstations
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Dell beats Apple in unveiling 8 core Xeon workstations - Page 2

post #41 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by skatman

I didn't know that Apple was a rival of Dell?!
From what I have seen, the two companies have very few customers who would x-shop them.

They are rivals in the PS and video editing areas.

A couple of years ago Jobs said that he winced every time he wrote a check out to Dell for Pixar.

Maybe now they have been switching to Macs.
post #42 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by troberts

I believe the quad-core chips Intel is about to release is pin compatible with the dual-core chips that are in the Mac Pro so there is no reason why Apple could not add quad-core chips to the ala-carte list of options. The problem with the quad-core chips the Mac Pro could get is all the cores will share one connection to the chipset which creates a bottleneck.

Tigerton, on the other hand, will allow each core to have it's own connection to the chipset so it will not have that bottleneck, but it will require a new motherboard design which means Apple will have to make a decision. Either continue to sell the Quad Mac Pro in addition to the Octo Mac Pro so they get sales from people that will pay/can afford a Quad Mac Pro, but not an Octo Mac Pro, or go all Octo and hope sales are high enough to offset any lost sales from people who won't pay/can't afford an Octo Mac Pro.

If I was going to buy a Mac Pro I would get the 3.0 GHz Quad now and wait for Tigerton before getting an Octo.

Tigerton is a Xeon MP product, intended for four-socket servers for a total of sixteen cores. Xeon MP is almost never put into a workstation, and such a system would start at around $10k. I don't see any indication that each core gets its own dedicated link. However, each socket will have its own bus, but that's no different than what the dual socket systems currently have.
post #43 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM

Tigerton is a Xeon MP product, intended for four-socket servers for a total of sixteen cores. Xeon MP is almost never put into a workstation, and such a system would start at around $10k. I don't see any indication that each core gets its own dedicated link. However, each socket will have its own bus, but that's no different than what the dual socket systems currently have.

I believe that each die (two cores) gets it's own link in the 4 core Cloverton. Eight core units will have a more advanced system.
post #44 of 57
I think I'll wait until the picture becomes a little clearer.

I think post Leopard will be a better time to buy a Mac Pro. What with Adobe's app's going universal.

Maybe Tigerton will be closer by then.

And a 'cool edition' bump to the power hungry G80 will be on the cards. (G80 looks like a great card by Nvidia by the way...)

Lemon Bon Bon

You know, for a company that specializes in the video-graphics market, you'd think that they would offer top-of-the-line GPUs...

 

WITH THE NEW MAC PRO THEY FINALLY DID!  (But you bend over for it.)

Reply

You know, for a company that specializes in the video-graphics market, you'd think that they would offer top-of-the-line GPUs...

 

WITH THE NEW MAC PRO THEY FINALLY DID!  (But you bend over for it.)

Reply
post #45 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by theapplegenius

DELL WINZ LOL!

Gee, for such a big company, they have a real inferiority complex.

How so?
post #46 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross

I believe that each die (two cores) gets it's own link in the 4 core Cloverton.

No, there is one FSB per socket.

Right now, Intel is saying that Tigeton is only for the big machines, but I suspect it will trickle down to the desktop to face off AMD's "true quad core".
post #47 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmf

No, there is one FSB per socket.

This was my understanding as well. To add another FSB would mean an entirely new socket and a new chipset to use it. I doubt that socket 77x can suddenly be augmented for a second FSB like that. As it is, the Blackford chipset was designed to handle Clovertown, and I don't see anything about another pair of busses in the diagrams.

Quote:
Right now, Intel is saying that Tigeton is only for the big machines, but I suspect it will trickle down to the desktop to face off AMD's "true quad core".

Kentsfield is that desktop trickle-down of Tigerton and is supposedly being released this year. From what I've seen, it is mostly the same chip with subtle differences at best.
post #48 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheToe

If I have 7,000 processors, 800 TB of RAM, and 500 Petabytes of hard drive space... will my computer finally be able to do my job for me?

I'm not sure about your personal productivity rates of change, but it will make the power company damn happy to serve you the monthly bill.
post #49 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM

Kentsfield is that desktop trickle-down of Tigerton and is supposedly being released this year. From what I've seen, it is mostly the same chip with subtle differences at best.

I hate to be a nitpicker, but otherwise I know the information will just propagate...

Kentsfield is the desktop version of Clovertown; both of them are MCMs. Tigerton is a single-die quad-core (aka "true quad core") scheduled for mid 2007.
post #50 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmf

No, there is one FSB per socket.

Right now, Intel is saying that Tigeton is only for the big machines, but I suspect it will trickle down to the desktop to face off AMD's "true quad core".

It has dual independent busses on the Bensley server platform. You're saying that each bus is per socket?

"Also in November, Intel will intro the server-oriented Clovertown in the Xeon 5300 series. Like the 5100 series, Xeon 5300s will use the formidable Bensley server platform with its dual, independent front-side busses and FB-DIMM memory subsystem."

Article here:

http://techreport.com/etc/2006q3/fal...index.x?page=1
post #51 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmf

I hate to be a nitpicker, but otherwise I know the information will just propagate...

Kentsfield is the desktop version of Clovertown; both of them are MCMs. Tigerton is a single-die quad-core (aka "true quad core") scheduled for mid 2007.

We really don't know if Tigerton will be a MCM design or a 4-core single die design. The only thing we really know is that Tigerton is slated as the next Xeon MP. As mentioned above, Xeon MP processors are for the 4+ socket server market. Tigerton + Caneland (4 sockets, 4 FSBs (1 per socket), and FB-DIMM) will be a good replacement over the existing Tulsa architecture. Well almost anything would be.

As far as the relationship between Cloverton and Kentsfield, there really isn't any father-son relationship. If I had to use one, they would be brothers. They use the same ICM cores, and are just packaged differently for different markets. That's about it.

For Apple, they will use Cloverton on the existing Mac Pro. It's a drop in replacement and the path of least cost, presuming Apple was forward thinking with its thermal design.
post #52 of 57
I'm still hoping there'll be a 2.66 Octo by next Spring. But shouldn't one just wait for Tigerton instead? Won't it be clocked higher?

Lemon Bon Bon

You know, for a company that specializes in the video-graphics market, you'd think that they would offer top-of-the-line GPUs...

 

WITH THE NEW MAC PRO THEY FINALLY DID!  (But you bend over for it.)

Reply

You know, for a company that specializes in the video-graphics market, you'd think that they would offer top-of-the-line GPUs...

 

WITH THE NEW MAC PRO THEY FINALLY DID!  (But you bend over for it.)

Reply
post #53 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross

It has dual independent busses on the Bensley server platform. You're saying that each bus is per socket?

"Also in November, Intel will intro the server-oriented Clovertown in the Xeon 5300 series. Like the 5100 series, Xeon 5300s will use the formidable Bensley server platform with its dual, independent front-side busses and FB-DIMM memory subsystem."

Article here:

http://techreport.com/etc/2006q3/fal...index.x?page=1

Same site, showing the DIB in an Intel diagram:

http://www.techreport.com/etc/2006q2...t/index.x?pg=1

Below the diagram is text explaining it. In short, it's just jargon to note that each socket has its own bus rather than all sockets sharing the same bus. Previous multi-socket Intel chips simply shared a bus.
post #54 of 57
The first Macs back in the 80's as well every computer that has shipped since then (both PC & Mac) all have had the same exact hardware. Buying so-called hardware upgrades actually only unlocks pre-existing hardware. Installing more RAM chips doesn't really add speed to the computer, but simply unlocks it's capabilities even further. Every computer is connected to a secret network all the time, and when hardware or software items are added, they simply cause the computer to communicate with the manufacturers of such hardware, causing the computer to activate the technology which was already installed to begin with. Technology is much farther along than we know. It's super tiny. It has been under our noses for years. The industry simply shows a little bit more as we pay them more money. We think all of these little quad, super quad, cores, and super duper core chips and things we are adding to our computers are actually improving something. All it's really doing is unlocking a little more of the speed and software embedded microscopically into the casing of every computer made for the past 30 years.

Well, maybe not. But what if? LOL.
Always remember..wherever you go, there you are.
Reply
Always remember..wherever you go, there you are.
Reply
post #55 of 57
Edited
onlooker
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: parts unknown




http://www.apple.com/feedback/macpro.html
Reply
onlooker
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: parts unknown




http://www.apple.com/feedback/macpro.html
Reply
post #56 of 57
Why is this news? Apple has a notoriously slower product update cycle compared to other computer companies. The flipside of course is that when they do come out with products, they are quite a bit better than the competition at the time of release.
post #57 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by icfireball

Why is this news? Apple has a notoriously slower product update cycle compared to other computer companies. The flipside of course is that when they do come out with products, they are quite a bit better than the competition at the time of release.

That was at least partially due to having used 680x0 and PowerPC processors in the past. Their track record (short as it is) on Intel isn't too bad if you look past the noise that the PC manufacturer's make about announcing use of the new cores before they are able to ship them in significant volume.
Providing grist for the rumour mill since 2001.
Reply
Providing grist for the rumour mill since 2001.
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Future Apple Hardware
AppleInsider › Forums › Mac Hardware › Future Apple Hardware › Dell beats Apple in unveiling 8 core Xeon workstations