or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Other Discussion › AppleOutsider › PoliticalOutsider › Impeach on the Beach
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Impeach on the Beach - Page 2

post #41 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman

Bravo, Celemourn. Did you serve in Iraq? My hat's off to you. I have a question. Would be logical/feasible to even start an impeachment process during a time of war?

I did. Though whom I served and to what end is yet to be seen. To answer your question Artman, I personally feel that it would be a horrible mistake, and a suspension of normally good judgement to NOT begin the impeachment process simply because we are involved in a pseudo-war (in my opinion, I feel it's not really war unless you are either facing the military of another nation, or you are intentionally killing the enemy's civilian populace in an effort to break their will. Until then, I feel it should just be called "Police action" or "Military actions" or whatever. It ain't war till the murder starts). Dictators around the world have shown that they gain the most power during times of crisis. The strong, charismatic man attracts the fearful populace in dire times, and can either lead them to freedom in the shadow of Churchill, or to murder and oppression in the shadow of Hitler. To suspend good sense and precaution during a crisis is paramount to inviting disaster. To his credit, Bush displayed incredible restraint on several occasions: 1) After September 11, 2001, he took his time before invading Afganistan. The 82nd Airborn Division at Fort Bragg, NC is capable of deploying ANYWHERE in the world in 18 hours from the time you say go. Bush waited a full month. We saw the benefits of that wait in a swift initial victory over the Taliban. The current problems are, I feel, more due to mismanagement, than initial foolishness. Of course, Iraq is a different story. Back to the subject, 2) When North Korea recently conducted the nuke test, no nukes flew toward Pyong Yang. Wise move. I think. Certainly has bought us some time, rather than annihilating millions and millions of civilians instantaneously. That's about where my kind words for Bush end for now though.

I feel that being at war is neither a logical nor a sound reason for postponing or foregoing an impeachment. If it is warranted when we are at war, then it is warranted when we are not, and vice versa.

<Opens Flame-Retardant Umbrella>

Bring it.
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #42 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

So let's get this straight...he should or could be impeached because "people don't like him and are fed up?" That's not why we impeach a President.

BR:



That's ridiculous. "Global havoc?" He's created global havoc? This kind of thinking just astounds me, because clearly you can't see that the "good will" of the world was nothing but political bullshit to begin with. Our foreign policy shouldn't be based on what makes other nations happy with us. It should be based on our national interests.

Secondly, let's explore the "global havoc" idea. You're telling me Afghanistan wasn't a war you supported? Or, are you taking issue with mistakes made in the process of overthrowing the Taliban? Iraq has not gone well, but that hardly creates global havoc. Iran and NK would still be rogue states without our actions. Russia would still be dealing with Iran, and acting in its interests. We'd still have rampant anti-Americanism in the Arab world. We'd still have a rising Red China and rising oil demand. Bush didn't create any of these problems by invading Iraq and refusing to make another utterly useless "deal" with NK. He didn't put a madman in power in Iran, either.


I supported finding and bringing to trial OSBL. Has he done that?

And please do I really have to go into all the other stuff? Illegal wire tapping ( yes it was judged illegal ), wanting to change the law retroactively concerning rights of political prisoners, starting a 2nd new war without real provocation, wanting to compound the error by sending more troops. I could go on......

Face it. This guy is a major fuck up!

Someone needs to contain this guy before he does anymore damage. Also he's just the type that just hasn't got caught at doing something really damning yet ( smoking gun ). Make no mistake though that item is out there I assure you.

PS. the global havoc is in the fact that other's don't trust us anymore. And quite frankly why should they?

In effect he took a dangerous hornet's nest and hit it with a stick so now they're twice as mad.

And by the way in my book supporting Bush is about as anti- american as you can get as he hardly reflects the values of our founding fathers.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
post #43 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I supported finding and bringing to trial OSBL. Has he done that?

And please do I really have to go into all the other stuff? Illegal wire tapping ( yes it was judged illegal ), wanting to change the law retroactively concerning rights of political prisoners, starting a 2nd new war without real provocation, wanting to compound the error by sending more troops. I could go on......

Face it. This guy is a major fuck up!

Someone needs to contain this guy before he does anymore damage. Also he's just the type that just hasn't got caught at doing something really damning yet ( smoking gun ). Make no mistake though that item is out there I assure you.

PS. the global havoc is in the fact that other's don't trust us anymore. And quite frankly why should they?

In effect he took a dangerous hornet's nest and hit it with a stick so now they're twice as mad.

And by the way in my book supporting Bush is about as anti- american as you can get as he hardly reflects the values of our founding fathers.

I'd say he broke it open and let everything fly out. A democrat in office would likely have done the same thing, at least initially, I think.
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #44 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celemourn View Post

I'd say he broke it open and let everything fly out. A democrat in office would likely have done the same thing, at least initially, I think.


Well personally I don't think anyone else that's ever been electable to the office of the president could be this stupid. Be they democrat or republican.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
post #45 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well personally I don't think anyone else that's ever been electable to the office of the president could be this stupid. Be they democrat or republican.

One serious character flaw which I have noticed in Bush is that he values Loyalty over Integrity. For example: Back at the beginning of Operation Iraqi Freedom, General Chief of Staff of the Army, General Erik Shinseki, was directly asked by a reporter how many troops would be required, and for how long, to provide security in Iraq. He answered candidly that up to 150,000 soldiers on the ground for five years would likely be required. Bush's PR guys instantly (like the next day) refuted his estimates, and claimed, in very insulting language, that General Shinseki didn't know what he was talking about. A few day later, Bush himself said publicly that General Shinseki's estimates were unrealistically high. He then forced General Shinseki, one of the most experienced Generals he had at his disposal (Shinseki served in combat in Vietnam, and had over 30 years of service) to retire. General Shinseki dared to answer a question honestly, rather than being evasive and sticking with the party line of, "Oh, not that many. Don't worry about it. Trust us." and was forced to retire because of it. In the military, I should point out, being forced to retire is the way they get rid of you when you become a problem but you haven't done anything that warrants disciplinary action. It's a kind of easy out, and very, VERY embarrassing.

That, plus his disrespect for the value of life (when he publicly mocked death-row inmate Karla Fay Tucker after her execution, which he authorized (I don't care who it is, death should not be made light of. It is a very VERY serious matter.)) are, in my eyes, two glaring character flaws of his.
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #46 of 124
Thread Starter 
Null.
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
post #47 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slewis View Post

2 Questions

1) In order to Impeach Bush, wouldn't the House have to have a 2/3s Majority Vote in the Democrats favor?

2) Do the Democrats have that? Or even enough support from the Republican party to actually Impeach him?

Sebastian

1) it would have to be in favor of removal, not in favor of the Democrats. The two overlap, but it's a BIG difference.

2) That's the idea exactly. It's not SUPPOSED to be easy to get rid of the President. He checks the power of Congress and of the Courts. The courts check the power of the President and of Congress. Congress checks the power of the courts and of the President. Three separate groups who each have a hold on the coat tails of the other two help to prevent any one faction (or two for that matter) from gaining a toe-hold. Supposedly.
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #48 of 124
Thread Starter 
Null.
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
post #49 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slewis View Post

1) Yes Terrible wording, sorry about that, but 2/3 right?

2) In other words, make it really hard for any one part of the Government to rid another. I should've paid more attention in Social Studies last year 8)

Sebastian

1) dunno. Ask a poly-sci (pah! science! right!) major. ;-D I bet it is at least though, for at least one point in the process, considering it takes 2/3 to override a veto or change the constitution.

2) Don't worry, I don't think I paid attention either... not sure though... I forget. ;-)
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #50 of 124
Thread Starter 
Null.
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
post #51 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slewis View Post

1) Ah, I don't pay attention to politics too much, just a few things I notice on the news when I'm doing something else 8)

2) Well it didn't help that my Notebook literally fell apart (it was a cheap notebook) halfway through the School Year

Sebastian

1) Most people don't. I feel compelled to say that that is part of the problems we see with our political system, but I know that's not true. Even if 99% of the population voted, the statistics would likely end up being the same.

2) I never read my notes anyway. I just use the notebook to scribble in to get the kinesthetic learning aid. I actually tend to throw away my notes every week or so. Just scribbles anyway. All the good stuff is in the books.
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #52 of 124
Thread Starter 
Null.
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
post #53 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celemourn View Post

1) Most people don't. I feel compelled to say that that is part of the problems we see with our political system, but I know that's not true. Even if 99% of the population voted, the statistics would likely end up being the same.

2) I never read my notes anyway. I just use the notebook to scribble in to get the kinesthetic learning aid. I actually tend to throw away my notes every week or so. Just scribbles anyway. All the good stuff is in the books.

Don't quote me on this but I think is's a simple majority in the House and 2/3's in the Senate. Yup just wiki'ed it those are the rulez.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
Reply
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
Reply
post #54 of 124
Thread Starter 
Null.
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
post #55 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

Don't quote me on this but I think is's a simple majority in the House and 2/3's in the Senate. Yup just wiki'ed it those are the rulez.

1) Damn, man. You broke the pattern!


2) I was trying to get 150 of those in a row! j/k (sorta)

A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #56 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

To quote midwinter:

Get a job.

Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
post #57 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celemourn View Post

1) Damn, man. You broke the pattern!


2) I was trying to get 150 of those in a row! j/k (sorta)


Sorry to break the chain, but I did find it a bit odd, I thought you guys needed some help.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
Reply
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
Reply
post #58 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

It pretty much sums up the irrational hatred of this President and his administration.

I stopped here without reading the rest of the thread, but...

There is no irrational hatred of this president. It is all completely rational.
post #59 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celemourn View Post

I feel that being at war is neither a logical nor a sound reason for postponing or foregoing an impeachment. If it is warranted when we are at war, then it is warranted when we are not, and vice versa.
<Opens Flame-Retardant Umbrella>
Bring it.

I completely forgot that the Nixon Impeachment process occurred during the waning years of Vietnam, silly me. But is there time in the situation we are in in the Middle East?

Another thing, I actually believe that this administration realizes that they have little time left. If this is the case then I wouldn't be surprised if in the next 2-3 months:

1. They ramp up troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.
2. The Naval defense's are ramped up in the Gulf.
3. Israel launches air attack on all nuclear facilities in Iran.
4. And all Hell breaks loose.

Would Israel bomb Iran?

This BBC report is worth watching
.

So if we want to have an impeachment process started. We better hurry the fuck up.
post #60 of 124
Thread Starter 
Null.
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
Þ & þ are called "Thorn" & þey represent þe sound you've associated "th" wiþ since þe 13þ or 14þ century. I'm bringing it back.
<(=_=)> (>=_=)> <(=_=<) ^(=_=^) (^=_=)^ ^(=_=)^ +(=_=)+
Reply
post #61 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Bush could and should be impeached. There has been ample discussion of th ereasons elsewhere (with plenty of links for support with very lkittlesupport except name-calling by those supporting King George).

Now with Bush sending more troops (there were mistakes made, dear troops, you paid for them, and now he's asking more of you to pay more for them) combined his incapability/refusal to work with others in government (outside of his small group of cronies) shows even more strongly than ever why action needs to be taken NOW.

I will be labled a Bush Hater by someone on these boards for my comments, but that is the best those who support him can do.

There are sound reasons supporting impeachment proceedings against this jerk (supported elsewhere with plenty of links, unlike those posts in favor of Bush which lack support as if we are supposed to believe it all as the word of Godette) and I pray that the Dems have the courage to go ahead with them.




You can post all the links you want. The man hasn't done anything that warrants impeachment. Period.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
post #62 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post



You can post all the links you want. The man hasn't done anything that warrants impeachment. Period.


Articles of Impeachment by Center for Constitutional Rights

"Book Description
In the halls of Congress and on the front pages of a growing number of mainstream periodicals, impeachment is being discussed more and more widely. And many leading constitutional scholars agree: There has never been so strong a case for impeachment since Richard Nixon.

In this gripping new book, one of our nation's leading institutions of constitutional scholarship, the Center for Constitutional Rights, sets out the legal arguments for impeachment detailing four separate charges: warrantless surveillance, misleading Congress on the reasons for the Iraq war, violating laws against torture, and subverting the Constitution's separation of powers. It is, say the CCR attorneys, a case of black letter law, with abundant evidence.

The book also contains the relevant laws and legal precedents. It explains what the Constitution says about impeachment and gives a brief history of impeachment, its procedures, and previous articles of impeachment against presidents Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton.

About the Author
Founded in 1966 by attorneys defending civil rights activists in the South, the Center for Constitutional Rights is one of America's most prestigious collectives of constitutional lawyers and experts."

Resolved, That George Walker Bush, President of the United States, is impeached for high crimes and misdemeanors, and that the following Articles of Impeachment be exhibited to the... (Introduced in House)

"109th CONGRESS

2d Session

H. RES. 1106

Articles of Impeachment against George Walker Bush, President of the United States of America, and other officials, for high crimes and misdemeanors.

IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

December 8, 2006

Ms. MCKINNEY submitted the following resolution; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

RESOLUTION

Articles of Impeachment against George Walker Bush, President of the United States of America, and other officials, for high crimes and misdemeanors.

Resolved, That George Walker Bush, President of the United States, is impeached for high crimes and misdemeanors, and that the following Articles of Impeachment be exhibited to the United States Senate:

Articles of Impeachment exhibited by the House of Representatives of the United States of America in the name of itself and of all the people of the United States of America, against George Walker Bush, President of the United States of America, and other officials, in maintenance and support of its impeachment against him for high crimes and misdemeanors.

Be it resolved by the House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled that:

ARTICLE I. FAILURE TO PRESERVE, PROTECT AND DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION

In violation of the oath of office, which reads: `I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States', George Walker Bush, in his conduct while President of the United States has demonstrated a pattern of abuse of office and of executive privilege, and disregard for the Constitution itself.

This conduct includes the following:

Manipulating Intelligence and Lying To Justify War

In violation of the separation of powers under the Constitution and his subsequent obligation to share intelligence with the Congress, George Walker Bush, while serving as President of the United States of America, in preparing the invasion of Iraq, did withhold intelligence from the Congress, by refusing to provide Congress with the full intelligence picture that he was being given, by redacting information by, for example, removing portions of reports such as the August 6, 2001, Presidential Daily Brief, and actively manipulating the intelligence on Iraq's alleged weapons programs by pressuring the Central Intelligence Agency and other intelligence agencies to provide intelligence such that `the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy' as revealed in the `Downing Street Memo'. To this end, President George Walker Bush and Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld created the Office of Special Plans inside the Pentagon to override existing intelligence reports by providing unreliable evidence that supported the claim that Iraq's alleged weapons of mass destruction posed an imminent threat to the United States of America. By justifying the invasion of Iraq with false and misleading statements linking Iraq to the attacks of September 11, 2001, and falsely asserting that Iraq had a nuclear weapons program for which it was importing aluminum tubes and uranium, these assertions being either false, or based on `fixed' intelligence, with the intent to misinform the people and their representatives in Congress in order to gain their support for invading Iraq, denying both the people and their representatives in Congress the right to make an informed choice, George Walker Bush, President of the United States, did commit and was guilty of high crimes against the United States of America.

ARTICLE II. ABUSE OF OFFICE AND OF EXECUTIVE PRIVILEGE

In violation of his oath to `faithfully execute the office of President of the United States', George Walker Bush, in his conduct while President of the United States, has consistently demonstrated disregard for that oath by obstructing and hindering the work of Congressional investigative bodies and by seeking to expand the scope of the powers of his office.

This conduct includes the following:

Failure To Uphold Accountability

In abrogation of his responsibility under the oath of office to take care that the Laws be faithfully executed, by which he agreed to act in good faith and accept responsibility for the overall conduct of the Executive Branch, a duty vested in his office alone under the Constitution, George Walker Bush, failed to take responsibility for, investigate or discipline those responsible for an ongoing pattern of negligence, incompetence and malfeasance to the detriment of the American people.

Those whom George Walker Bush, as President of the United States of America, has failed to hold to account include but are not limited to the following top-level officials in his administration:

(a) RICHARD CHENEY- In violation of his oath of office to support and defend the Constitution, Richard Cheney, Vice President of the United States of America, played a key role in manipulating intelligence in the interest of promoting the illegal invasion of Iraq by pressuring analysts at the Central Intelligence Agency to `fix' their intelligence estimates of the danger posed by Iraq in relation to weapons of mass destruction, whereby Richard Cheney, Vice President of the United States, did commit and was guilty of high crimes against the United States of America.

(b) CONDOLEEZZA RICE- In violation of her Constitutional duty to share and provide accurate and truthful intelligence information with the Congress, as former National Security Advisor to the President, did play a leading role in deceiving Congress and the American public by repeating and propagating false statements concerning Iraq's alleged weapons of mass destruction program, including false information that the purchase of aluminum tubes demonstrated that Iraq was pursuing a nuclear weapons program, false information that Iraq was seeking to purchase uranium and false information that Iraq sought help in developing a chemical and biological weapons program; whereby Condoleezza Rice, Secretary of State of the United States of America, did commit and was guilty of high misdemeanors against the United States of America.

By neglecting to superintend the conduct of these officials and to hold members of the Executive Branch responsible for their negligence or violations of law, George Walker Bush, President of the United States, did commit and was guilty of high misdemeanors against the United States of America.

Wherefore, by their aforementioned conduct, George Walker Bush, Richard Cheney, and Condoleezza Rice warrant impeachment, trial, and removal from office.

ARTICLE III. FAILURE TO ENSURE THE LAWS ARE FAITHFULLY EXECUTED

In violation of his duty under Article II, Section 3 of the Constitution of the United States of America to `take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed', George Walker Bush, during his tenure as President of the United States, has violated the letter and spirit of laws and rules of criminal procedure used by civilian and military courts, and has violated or ignored regulatory codes and practices that carry out the law.

This conduct includes the following:

Illegal Domestic Spying

In violation of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) [50 U.S.C. Chapter 36], George Walker Bush did clandestinely direct the National Security Agency and various other intelligence agencies, in secret and outside the lawful scope of their mandates, for purposes unrelated to any lawful function of his offices, to conduct electronic surveillance of citizens of the United States on U.S. soil without seeking to obtain, before or after, a judicial warrant, thereby subverting the powers of the Congress and the Judiciary by circumventing the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) courts established by Congress, whose express purpose is to check such abuses of executive power, provoking the presiding judge of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court to file a complaint and another judge to resign in protest, the said program having been subsequently ruled illegal (ACLU vs. NSA); he has also concealed the existence of this unlawful program of spying on American citizens from the people and all but a few of their representatives in Congress, even resorting to outright public deceit as on April 20, 2004, when he told an audience in Buffalo, New York: `any time you hear the United States Government talking about wiretap, it requires . . . a court order. Nothing has changed, by the way. When we're talking about chasing down terrorists, we're talking about getting a court order before we do so', whereby said George Walker Bush, President of the United States, did commit and was guilty of high crimes against the United States of America.

In all of this, George Walker Bush has repeatedly and unapologetically misled the American people and has sought to undermine the system of checks and balances established by the Founding Fathers. Wherefore George Walker Bush, by such conduct, and in the interest of saving our Constitution and our democracy from the threat of arbitrary government, warrants impeachment and trial, and removal from office."

Zogby Poll: 53% of Americans Support Impeachment

"New Zogby Poll Shows Majority of Americans Support Impeachment;
ImpeachPAC is Launched to Support Pro-Impeachment Candidates

By a margin of 53% to 42%, Americans want Congress to impeach President Bush if he lied about the war in Iraq, according to a new Zogby poll commissioned by AfterDowningStreet.org, a grassroots coalition that supports a Congressional investigation of President Bush's decision to invade Iraq in 2003.

The nationwide telephone poll was conducted by Zogby International, the highly-regarded non-partisan polling company. The poll interviewed 1,200 U.S. adults from October 29 through November 2.

The poll found that 53% agreed with the statement:

"If President Bush did not tell the truth about his reasons for going to war with Iraq, Congress should consider holding him accountable through impeachment."

42% disagreed, and 5% said they didn't know or declined to answer. The poll has a +/- 2.9% margin of error."



post #63 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post



You can post all the links you want. The man hasn't done anything that warrants impeachment. Period.

Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
post #64 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post


Brit Hume, we're looking at you....
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
post #65 of 124
eye
bee
BEE
Reply
eye
bee
BEE
Reply
post #66 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post


Hell, I'll volunteer if no one else will. But will that mean I have to give one to Cheney too before Pelosi becomes president?
post #67 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

Hell, I'll volunteer if no one else will. But will that mean I have to give one to Cheney too before Pelosi becomes president?

Steady, man. There are limits to the human capacity to endure horror.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
post #68 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Steady, man. There are limits to the human capacity to endure horror.



Ahem. Capacity, indeed.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
Reply
post #69 of 124
He must have been thinking about the unitary executive when that picture was taken.
post #70 of 124
Ahhhhhhh!!!!!!!! My soul has fled my body!
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
post #71 of 124

Did that actually get introduced, or was it just a draft that some congressman was trying to get action on?
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #72 of 124
jimmac:

Quote:
And please do I really have to go into all the other stuff? Illegal wire tapping ( yes it was judged illegal ), wanting to change the law retroactively concerning rights of political prisoners, starting a 2nd new war without real provocation, wanting to compound the error by sending more troops. I could go on......

Face it. This guy is a major fuck up!

Well look, you're entitled to think that, just as I'm allowed to think otherwise. But being a "fuck up" has nothing to do with impeachment. What you're saying is that Bush delibrately committed a crime. That's patently absurd. White House legal counsel advised him that he could authorize such a wiretapping program. Now, if the courts disagree, and it's clear they do, that's the end of that. It doesn't mean he committed a crime. Ditto on the detaining of prisoners. Losing a legal battle doesn't mean there has been a "high crime or misdemeanor" committed.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
post #73 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celemourn View Post

1) it would have to be in favor of removal, not in favor of the Democrats. The two overlap, but it's a BIG difference.

2) That's the idea exactly. It's not SUPPOSED to be easy to get rid of the President. He checks the power of Congress and of the Courts. The courts check the power of the President and of Congress. Congress checks the power of the courts and of the President. Three separate groups who each have a hold on the coat tails of the other two help to prevent any one faction (or two for that matter) from gaining a toe-hold. Supposedly.

No, that's not how it works. The House would draw up Articles of Impeachment. Then the Senate would hold a trial. They could then vote to remove the President from office. Impeachment and being removed from office are two different things.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
post #74 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post

Articles of Impeachment by Center for Constitutional Rights

"Book Description
In the halls of Congress and on the front pages of a growing number of mainstream periodicals, impeachment is being discussed more and more widely. And many leading constitutional scholars agree: There has never been so strong a case for impeachment since Richard Nixon.

In this gripping new book, one of our nation's leading institutions of constitutional scholarship, the Center for Constitutional Rights, sets out the legal arguments for impeachment detailing four separate charges: warrantless surveillance, misleading Congress on the reasons for the Iraq war, violating laws against torture, and subverting the Constitution's separation of powers. It is, say the CCR attorneys, a case of black letter law, with abundant evidence.

The book also contains the relevant laws and legal precedents. It explains what the Constitution says about impeachment and gives a brief history of impeachment, its procedures, and previous articles of impeachment against presidents Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton.

About the Author
Founded in 1966 by attorneys defending civil rights activists in the South, the Center for Constitutional Rights is one of America's most prestigious collectives of constitutional lawyers and experts."

Resolved, That George Walker Bush, President of the United States, is impeached for high crimes and misdemeanors, and that the following Articles of Impeachment be exhibited to the... (Introduced in House)

"109th CONGRESS

2d Session

H. RES. 1106

Articles of Impeachment against George Walker Bush, President of the United States of America, and other officials, for high crimes and misdemeanors.

IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

December 8, 2006

Ms. MCKINNEY submitted the following resolution; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

RESOLUTION

Articles of Impeachment against George Walker Bush, President of the United States of America, and other officials, for high crimes and misdemeanors.

Resolved, That George Walker Bush, President of the United States, is impeached for high crimes and misdemeanors, and that the following Articles of Impeachment be exhibited to the United States Senate:

Articles of Impeachment exhibited by the House of Representatives of the United States of America in the name of itself and of all the people of the United States of America, against George Walker Bush, President of the United States of America, and other officials, in maintenance and support of its impeachment against him for high crimes and misdemeanors.

Be it resolved by the House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled that:

ARTICLE I. FAILURE TO PRESERVE, PROTECT AND DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION

In violation of the oath of office, which reads: `I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States', George Walker Bush, in his conduct while President of the United States has demonstrated a pattern of abuse of office and of executive privilege, and disregard for the Constitution itself.

This conduct includes the following:

Manipulating Intelligence and Lying To Justify War

In violation of the separation of powers under the Constitution and his subsequent obligation to share intelligence with the Congress, George Walker Bush, while serving as President of the United States of America, in preparing the invasion of Iraq, did withhold intelligence from the Congress, by refusing to provide Congress with the full intelligence picture that he was being given, by redacting information by, for example, removing portions of reports such as the August 6, 2001, Presidential Daily Brief, and actively manipulating the intelligence on Iraq's alleged weapons programs by pressuring the Central Intelligence Agency and other intelligence agencies to provide intelligence such that `the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy' as revealed in the `Downing Street Memo'. To this end, President George Walker Bush and Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld created the Office of Special Plans inside the Pentagon to override existing intelligence reports by providing unreliable evidence that supported the claim that Iraq's alleged weapons of mass destruction posed an imminent threat to the United States of America. By justifying the invasion of Iraq with false and misleading statements linking Iraq to the attacks of September 11, 2001, and falsely asserting that Iraq had a nuclear weapons program for which it was importing aluminum tubes and uranium, these assertions being either false, or based on `fixed' intelligence, with the intent to misinform the people and their representatives in Congress in order to gain their support for invading Iraq, denying both the people and their representatives in Congress the right to make an informed choice, George Walker Bush, President of the United States, did commit and was guilty of high crimes against the United States of America.

ARTICLE II. ABUSE OF OFFICE AND OF EXECUTIVE PRIVILEGE

In violation of his oath to `faithfully execute the office of President of the United States', George Walker Bush, in his conduct while President of the United States, has consistently demonstrated disregard for that oath by obstructing and hindering the work of Congressional investigative bodies and by seeking to expand the scope of the powers of his office.

This conduct includes the following:

Failure To Uphold Accountability

In abrogation of his responsibility under the oath of office to take care that the Laws be faithfully executed, by which he agreed to act in good faith and accept responsibility for the overall conduct of the Executive Branch, a duty vested in his office alone under the Constitution, George Walker Bush, failed to take responsibility for, investigate or discipline those responsible for an ongoing pattern of negligence, incompetence and malfeasance to the detriment of the American people.

Those whom George Walker Bush, as President of the United States of America, has failed to hold to account include but are not limited to the following top-level officials in his administration:

(a) RICHARD CHENEY- In violation of his oath of office to support and defend the Constitution, Richard Cheney, Vice President of the United States of America, played a key role in manipulating intelligence in the interest of promoting the illegal invasion of Iraq by pressuring analysts at the Central Intelligence Agency to `fix' their intelligence estimates of the danger posed by Iraq in relation to weapons of mass destruction, whereby Richard Cheney, Vice President of the United States, did commit and was guilty of high crimes against the United States of America.

(b) CONDOLEEZZA RICE- In violation of her Constitutional duty to share and provide accurate and truthful intelligence information with the Congress, as former National Security Advisor to the President, did play a leading role in deceiving Congress and the American public by repeating and propagating false statements concerning Iraq's alleged weapons of mass destruction program, including false information that the purchase of aluminum tubes demonstrated that Iraq was pursuing a nuclear weapons program, false information that Iraq was seeking to purchase uranium and false information that Iraq sought help in developing a chemical and biological weapons program; whereby Condoleezza Rice, Secretary of State of the United States of America, did commit and was guilty of high misdemeanors against the United States of America.

By neglecting to superintend the conduct of these officials and to hold members of the Executive Branch responsible for their negligence or violations of law, George Walker Bush, President of the United States, did commit and was guilty of high misdemeanors against the United States of America.

Wherefore, by their aforementioned conduct, George Walker Bush, Richard Cheney, and Condoleezza Rice warrant impeachment, trial, and removal from office.

ARTICLE III. FAILURE TO ENSURE THE LAWS ARE FAITHFULLY EXECUTED

In violation of his duty under Article II, Section 3 of the Constitution of the United States of America to `take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed', George Walker Bush, during his tenure as President of the United States, has violated the letter and spirit of laws and rules of criminal procedure used by civilian and military courts, and has violated or ignored regulatory codes and practices that carry out the law.

This conduct includes the following:

Illegal Domestic Spying

In violation of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) [50 U.S.C. Chapter 36], George Walker Bush did clandestinely direct the National Security Agency and various other intelligence agencies, in secret and outside the lawful scope of their mandates, for purposes unrelated to any lawful function of his offices, to conduct electronic surveillance of citizens of the United States on U.S. soil without seeking to obtain, before or after, a judicial warrant, thereby subverting the powers of the Congress and the Judiciary by circumventing the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) courts established by Congress, whose express purpose is to check such abuses of executive power, provoking the presiding judge of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court to file a complaint and another judge to resign in protest, the said program having been subsequently ruled illegal (ACLU vs. NSA); he has also concealed the existence of this unlawful program of spying on American citizens from the people and all but a few of their representatives in Congress, even resorting to outright public deceit as on April 20, 2004, when he told an audience in Buffalo, New York: `any time you hear the United States Government talking about wiretap, it requires . . . a court order. Nothing has changed, by the way. When we're talking about chasing down terrorists, we're talking about getting a court order before we do so', whereby said George Walker Bush, President of the United States, did commit and was guilty of high crimes against the United States of America.

In all of this, George Walker Bush has repeatedly and unapologetically misled the American people and has sought to undermine the system of checks and balances established by the Founding Fathers. Wherefore George Walker Bush, by such conduct, and in the interest of saving our Constitution and our democracy from the threat of arbitrary government, warrants impeachment and trial, and removal from office."

Zogby Poll: 53% of Americans Support Impeachment

"New Zogby Poll Shows Majority of Americans Support Impeachment;
ImpeachPAC is Launched to Support Pro-Impeachment Candidates

By a margin of 53% to 42%, Americans want Congress to impeach President Bush if he lied about the war in Iraq, according to a new Zogby poll commissioned by AfterDowningStreet.org, a grassroots coalition that supports a Congressional investigation of President Bush's decision to invade Iraq in 2003.

The nationwide telephone poll was conducted by Zogby International, the highly-regarded non-partisan polling company. The poll interviewed 1,200 U.S. adults from October 29 through November 2.

The poll found that 53% agreed with the statement:

"If President Bush did not tell the truth about his reasons for going to war with Iraq, Congress should consider holding him accountable through impeachment."

42% disagreed, and 5% said they didn't know or declined to answer. The poll has a +/- 2.9% margin of error."





Stupid. Absolutely, incredibly stupid. So is McKinney, btw. Maybe she should just punch him instead? \
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
post #75 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post


Dude, as much as we disagree, you post some hysterical shit.

Of course, Clinton's impeachment had nothing to do with a blowjob, but whatever.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
Reply
post #76 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

No, that's not how it works. The House would draw up Articles of Impeachment. Then the Senate would hold a trial. They could then vote to remove the President from office. Impeachment and being removed from office are two different things.

Thanks for clarifing that. Do both the senate and the house vote, or just the senate?

Last line: precisely what I've been saying. Trials ain't a bad thing.
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #77 of 124
post #78 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

jimmac:



Well look, you're entitled to think that, just as I'm allowed to think otherwise. But being a "fuck up" has nothing to do with impeachment. What you're saying is that Bush delibrately committed a crime. That's patently absurd. White House legal counsel advised him that he could authorize such a wiretapping program. Now, if the courts disagree, and it's clear they do, that's the end of that. It doesn't mean he committed a crime. Ditto on the detaining of prisoners. Losing a legal battle doesn't mean there has been a "high crime or misdemeanor" committed.


SDW you have one gigantic blind spot when it comes to Bush. Read Artman's post again if you haven't.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
post #79 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Stupid. Absolutely, incredibly stupid. So is McKinney, btw. Maybe she should just punch him instead? \

You know, I had given you the benefit of the doubt that you were just insulting people because you were aggravated by this discussion. I'm now beginning to suspect that you are simply a horribly rude and offensive person for whom the value of their intellect is depreciated by their personality. You are acting shamefully and you dishonor yourself and those you defend. You are doing much harm by reinforcing the "Insulting, irrational, and arrogant Republican" stereotype.

You are making a mockery of yourself and the Republican party, and you should be thoroughly ashamed of yourself. Your behavior is deplorably immature.

In other words, you are being a total asshole.

Unfuck yourself and come back to the discussion when you are ready to act intelligently and actually present arguments and evidence which will help to sway others to your position, rather than acting like fucking child.
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
post #80 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post


Why is Iraq a stick of butter?
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
A Conclusion is the place where you get tired of thinking. - Lesicus Stupidicus
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: PoliticalOutsider
AppleInsider › Forums › Other Discussion › AppleOutsider › PoliticalOutsider › Impeach on the Beach