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Apple introduces new AirPort Extreme with 802.11n

post #1 of 66
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biggest non - announcement at the show....

but they screwed it up. no gigabit. stupid apple, 10/100 is for 1998.
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post #2 of 66
Looks good. I wish it had Gigabit Ethernet though just because I want the bandwidth to be as fast as feasible for wired connections.
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post #3 of 66
How is it even possible that it doesn't support gigabit ethernet??? I would have already ordered one if it did. I guess Stevo was spending all his time on the precious iPhone and forgot to add any innovation to this product.
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post #4 of 66
Interesting that they're saying the Mac Pro ("Intel Xeon Macs") have the n-capable hardware, too. Did we already know that?
post #5 of 66
I'm surpised by the lack of 1000 BASE-T, too. The Mac mini has it, why no the Airport Extreme or the AppleTV. That blows my mind!


Quote:
Originally Posted by ai51240 View Post

Interesting that they're saying the Mac Pro ("Intel Xeon Macs") have the n-capable hardware, too. Did we already know that?

Yes. I believe all the new Macs have had it since the C2Ds were released last year.
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post #6 of 66
During the Macworld Expo on Tuesday, Apple introduced its new AirPort Extreme, a simple and elegant wireless networking solution delivering up to five times the performance and twice the range of the previous AirPort Extreme.

Based on 802.11n technology, AirPort Extreme extends a wireless network to even more areas in a home or office and makes streaming digital content and transferring large files faster and easier, the company said.

The new AirPort Extreme Base Station ships in a sleek, new design with connections for networked computers, printers and a USB hard drive to quickly and easily share files or back up valuable data and content.

"The new Airport Extreme is the most powerful and easy to use Wi-Fi base station that we have ever made," said Philip Schiller, Apple's senior vice president of Worldwide Product Marketing. "With five times the performance and twice the range, now you can transfer bigger files faster and get access to the Internet and your favorite digital media from many areas in your house you couldn't reach before."

Using MIMO (Multiple In Multiple Out) smart antennas and 802.11n technology, AirPort Extreme now delivers greater data throughput and extends the reach of wireless connectivity to more areas of the home, business or school. With the ability to operate in either the 2.4 GHz or 5 GHz wireless frequencies, AirPort Extreme also reduces the possibility of interference from appliances and cordless phones that operate in the 2.4 GHz frequency. AirPort Extreme is backward compatible with Macs and PCs using previous generation 802.11b/g wireless technologies.



Apple said the AirPort Extreme Base Station features a simple, new design that is just 6.5 inches square and 1.3 inches tall, and a built-in USB port allows users to print wirelessly to a USB printer or turn any external USB hard drive into a shared drive so they can share files or backup valuable data from multiple computers on a network. New AirPort Utility software included with every AirPort Extreme "makes it very easy to set up a secure, wireless network for up to 50 simultaneous users within minutes," the company said. Users can also set security restrictions, including Internet access limits on their childrens' computers.



The AirPort Extreme Base Station also includes:

802.11n Wi-Fi wireless networking;
MIMO (Multiple In Multiple Out) smart antennas;
dual-band antennas for 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz frequencies;
three 10/100 Ethernet LAN ports;
one 10/100 Ethernet WAN port;
one USB port;
Wi-Fi Protected Access (WPA/WPA-2), 128-bit WEP encryption; and
a built-in NAT firewall.

Pricing & Availability

The new AirPort Extreme Base Station will be available in February through the Apple Store, at Apple's retail stores and Apple Authorized Resellers for a suggested retail price of $179. Nearly all currently shipping Macs support 802.11n when updated with 802.11n Enabler software, which ships with the AirPort Extreme Base Station.

The AirPort Extreme Base Station is based on an IEEE 802.11n draft specification and is compatible with IEEE 802.11a, IEEE 802.11b and IEEE 802.11g. Achieving the fastest data rates requires that all users have an 802.11n-enabled computer. Actual performance will vary based on range, connection rate, site conditions, size of network and other factors.

Appple said all Intel Core 2 Duo and Intel Xeon Macs except the entry 17-inch iMac with 1.83 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor support the 802.11n technology.
post #7 of 66
I'm liking that form factor though, looks good for a three-way AE / Mac Mini / ?TV stack! Throw in a LaCie hard drive at the base and you've one chunky little pile.

No gigabit is a bit lame, but more of a problem in real life I expect would be the: "all clients must be n for maximum speed, ie. do not mix in good old g's and ancient b's, you have been warned".

APX for me until it dies I think.

Edit: press shift+option+K to make an Apple sign for "AppleTV". I did, only it posts as a stupid ? mark here. Ah well.
post #8 of 66
Way to expensive for what it is....
post #9 of 66
sigh... no gigabit... I guess I will have to settle with Linksys WirelessN router. all the same, but with gigabit (even same price)...
post #10 of 66
Is there anyway to tell at this point what filesystem the APX uses with a connected USB HDD? I almost bought a linksys piece that did simlar (though wired) but they use some stupid filesystem no comptuer would read (accept through the linksys, and then the network @ 10/100 [ick]). If they'll let me unplug from the apx and then into a computer I'll buy, even without gig-e (eSATA is my friend). Isn't 802.11n rated at 300-600Mbps, real world 200-250?
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post #11 of 66
So how close would this be to Microsoft's Multi-thousand dollar Server solution. You know, using this along with a Mac and maybe an ?TV.
post #12 of 66
no gigabit. WTF?
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post #13 of 66
Wow , i was actually about to order one , but no gigabit ethernet kills it in my opinion.

How on earth they thought 10/100 from 1990's is gonna cut it in 2007 is beyond me. Anyone who knows their way around computers is gonna avoid this at this price point. Maybe at $100 , maybe , but close to $200 i can get much more than this flop offers. So sad so sad.
post #14 of 66
This lack of gigabit ethernet makes no sense whatsoever, especially since other products in the same price range do have it (e.g. Linksys). Are they really that gung ho on having your Xserve be wireless? Because I'm not a big fan of that kind of latency (and lack of concurrency) for my servers.

Then again, I suppose Apple has to have something to put in the 3-month bump after they market test it with all us early adopters . The only people who really are a market for this item's unique wins are people who want a fairly cheap NAS solution or who have a Core 2 Duo Mac.
post #15 of 66
I need a base station, gigE or not, anyone know what possible changes there are to the draft-n spec?
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post #16 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by octane View Post

I need a base station, gigE or not, anyone know what possible changes there are to the draft-n spec?

One assumes that the APX base station will be firmware-upgradable via a Software Update when 802.11n final is decided upon.

Tricky things, those assumptions....
post #17 of 66
Why oh why didn't the CD mbps have draft n? This looks like it brings nothing to the table for me.
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post #18 of 66
I'll buy it as soon as it has a gigE port.
post #19 of 66
I posted a message on Apple's discussion forms questioning why Apple choose 100MB rather then 1000MB.

My post was QUICKLY removed (I mean in under an hour).

Where's my freedom of speech in a public message forum? It's okay to ask lame ass questions but when someone posts a reasonable question they remove the post.

Nice Apple. WE KNOW YOUR GAME.
post #20 of 66
is there a way to enable the draft n without purchasing the Airport Extreme?
post #21 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by swansong View Post

One assumes that the APX base station will be firmware-upgradable via a Software Update when 802.11n final is decided upon.

Tricky things, those assumptions....

Yeah, they did the same thing with the draft-g stuff, they released it before it was final with the promise of firmware updates, I just have no idea how it turned out for the early adopters. Although, Apple didn't just release APX with the draft spec, TV has it too, that does lend some hope. OTOH, I read somewhere that the draft-n hardware spec is not final (obviously software isn't). Can anyone clarify that with a link to a credable source? (like, not cnet, etc)
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post #22 of 66
Saud,
Yes. Apple will be posting an update for the airport cards in all of the supported Core 2 duo Macs shortly - probably in a few days.
post #23 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saud View Post

is there a way to enable the draft n without purchasing the Airport Extreme?

I wouldn't have a problem with the gigabit missing except they put a USB 2.0 connection on it. Now that poses a problem for me. I have a ethernet 10/100 drive connected directly to the network via a Cat5e wire and while it is fast, it could be faster since I have all gigabit switches and CoreDuo stuff.

This is defintely a "no buy" until they get this upgraded to something useful.
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post #24 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillInSoBe View Post

I posted a message on Apple's discussion forms questioning why Apple choose 100MB rather then 1000MB.

My post was QUICKLY removed (I mean in under an hour).

Where's my freedom of speech in a public message forum? It's okay to ask lame ass questions but when someone posts a reasonable question they remove the post.

Nice Apple. WE KNOW YOUR GAME.

"Apple Discussions is a user-to-user support forum"

Did you expect any other user knowing the answer? Is it support? That's why it was deleted.
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post #25 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by aplnub View Post

I wouldn't have a problem with the gigabit missing except they put a USB 2.0 connection on it. Now that poses a problem for me. I have a ethernet 10/100 drive connected directly to the network via a Cat5e wire and while it is fast, it could be faster since I have all gigabit switches and CoreDuo stuff.

This is defintely a "no buy" until they get this upgraded to something useful.

This is speculative...
AppleTV is a pretty static device. Meaning, that 10, or even 20, years from now it could still work to do the same basic functions that it originally did. Perhaps, in an effort to increase longterm sales, they are going to release Gigabit Ethernet, 1080p and a larger HDD (80 to 100GB) with the device. Most people who are buying this now are "early adopters" and will most likely buy again when it's "refreshed". It gives Apple somewhere to go with the product.

Just a thought.
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post #26 of 66
So what's the best way to go about jabbing a manufacturer into making a 4 port gigE switch + USB 2.0 hub combo, the same size, shape, and color as the new APX?
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post #27 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandau View Post

biggest non - announcement at the show....

but they screwed it up. no gigabit. stupid apple, 10/100 is for 1998.

Now I have no problem with more speed but.....what is the usefullness of 1Gb Ethernet (1000Base-T) in a consumer product?
post #28 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by aplnub View Post

I wouldn't have a problem with the gigabit missing except they put a USB 2.0 connection on it. Now that poses a problem for me. I have a ethernet 10/100 drive connected directly to the network via a Cat5e wire and while it is fast, it could be faster since I have all gigabit switches and CoreDuo stuff.

This is defintely a "no buy" until they get this upgraded to something useful.

From http://www.sata-io.org/3g.asp:

Quote:
SATA 3Gb/s is double the speed of the current SATA interface of 1.5Gb/s. SATA 3Gb/s enables the highest level of performance while maintaining desktop cost structures.
post #29 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by khurtwilliams View Post

Now I have no problem with more speed but.....what is the usefullness of 1Gb Ethernet (1000Base-T) in a consumer product?

Consumer products, like MacBook and IMac all come with 10/100/1000 ethernet. The usefulness: It can (theoretically) add 10x more bandwidth to your wired devices.
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post #30 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandau View Post

biggest non - announcement at the show....

but they screwed it up. no gigabit. stupid apple, 10/100 is for 1998.

Technically speaking it's Gigabit Ethernet that is 1998.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.3

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post #31 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Consumer products, like MacBook and IMac all come with 10/100/1000 ethernet. The usefulness: It can (theoretically) add 10x more bandwidth to your wired devices.

But what will the consumer do with the extra bandwidth? My car does 120 miles per hour unless I take it to a race track it does me no good!
post #32 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by khurtwilliams View Post

But what will the consumer do with the extra bandwidth? My car does 120 miles per hour unless I take it to a race track it does me no good!

You have the analogy backwards, Gigabit Ethernet IS the track. The car is the computer's ability to process that information. If the AppleTV's processor is too slow and the RAM to little then the machine can't achieve fast enough speeds to handle all the data.



PS: Would that make Denial Of Service attacks Road Rag?
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post #33 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

You have the analogy backwards, Gigabit Ethernet IS the track. The car is the computer's ability to process that information. If the AppleTV's processor is too slow and the RAM to little then the machine can't achieve fast enough speeds to handle all the data.



PS: Would that make Denial Of Service attacks Road Rag?

Good point. I think my question is misunderstood. In my day to day life I can think of only one occassion (backing up a 40GB hard drive over the network) where I have wished I had unlimited bandwidth.

I guess I am wondering....if a 7 Mb/s or 15 Mb/s broadband connection is sufficient to download a full length movie from iTunes in just a few minutes then how often would I really need a 1000 Mb/s connection within my home network? An 802.11n connection is good for 108 Mb/s assuming a 100% connection. Unless we wire up our homes with CAT6 cable, do most of us need a network connection found only in large corporate networks with 10s of thousands of users? 1 Gb/s sounds great to a geek but my mom and dad could care less.
post #34 of 66
In real world when i switched from Netgear 100 to Netgear 1000 switch it trippled my transfer speed. So i can transfer DVD in 4-5 minutes from one PC to another instead of 15 minutes. Did that give you idea why gigabit ethernet port is a must even in consumer grade ?

Netgear switch with gigabit ethernet costs 40 - 50 bones , Dlink's great 4300 router costs $120. Yes this has draft N over 4300 router but 4300 has been out for over a year and has gigabit ports and is still $60 cheaper.

I cant believe Apple went THIS cheap with this gear.
post #35 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by wally007 View Post

In real world when i switched from Netgear 100 to Netgear 1000 switch it trippled my transfer speed. So i can transfer DVD in 4-5 minutes from one PC to another instead of 15 minutes. Did that give you idea why gigabit ethernet port is a must even in consumer grade ?

Netgear switch with gigabit ethernet costs 40 - 50 bones , Dlink's great 4300 router costs $120. Yes this has draft N over 4300 router but 4300 has been out for over a year and has gigabit ports and is still $60 cheaper.

I cant believe Apple went THIS cheap with this gear.

Dido this guy! I juse ordered a Buffalo 500 GB Gigabit network drive from Tiger Direct becuase Apple can't seem to understand we need gigabit speeds these days. I want to move 5 - 15 GB of data over my network every night while I am asleep. It takes forever on a 100 ethernet network HDD. As in, many many hours due to the number of files.

I have seen a 3x increase in speed between my C2D 24" iMac and CD MBP since moving to gigabit switches.

Bottom line, I spent $305 on a solution tonight with Tiger Direct because Apple is stuck in i Gadget land and forgot about the wireless networking.
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post #36 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by aplnub View Post

Dido this guy! I juse ordered a Buffalo 500 GB Gigabit network drive from Tiger Direct becuase Apple can't seem to understand we need gigabit speeds these days. I want to move 5 - 15 GB of data over my network every night while I am asleep. It takes forever on a 100 ethernet network HDD. As in, many many hours due to the number of files.

I have seen a 3x increase in speed between my C2D 24" iMac and CD MBP since moving to gigabit switches.

Bottom line, I spent $305 on a solution tonight with Tiger Direct because Apple is stuck in i Gadget land and forgot about the wireless networking.

There will be an 1Gb/s version I am sure. But...my point was that the vast majority of computer users are not tech geeks who have a "need" to move DVD content accross a home network or "15GB over the network" each night.


I happen to want the 1Gb/s.
post #37 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by khurtwilliams View Post

But what will the consumer do with the extra bandwidth? My car does 120 miles per hour unless I take it to a race track it does me no good!

But even Apple's own 'consumer' mac, the iMac, and its cheapest mac (mac mini) have had Gigabit for a while now ... why include that in your computer and not your router?

It makes no sense what-so-ever ... and I'm hoping its just a typo from their website.
post #38 of 66
It's not a typo, according to the Mac phone line. They were, frankly, a bit snotty about it.

I'd also like to see jumbo frame support. I would like to be able to have multiple streams coming off of my NAS to different computers, iTV, etc. around the house. I'm so irritated about the lack of gigE. I hope my n enable 24" iMac works with someone else's draft n router.
post #39 of 66
So I recently purchased a C2D MacBook Pro and am just wanting a clarification. So if I was to purchase a Linksys or Netgear wireless n router and didn't have the firmware update to my MacBook Pro, then I wouldn't be able to achieve n speeds? I had intended on buying Apple's Airport Extreme when it was updated after Macworld but now I just don't know if it's worth the extra money when I could have and 802.11n router for $70 less that could do everything that the Airport Extreme could do but have GB ethernet as well. Any thoughts?
post #40 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by snowboarder389 View Post

So I recently purchased a C2D MacBook Pro and am just wanting a clarification. So if I was to purchase a Linksys or Netgear wireless n router and didn't have the firmware update to my MacBook Pro, then I wouldn't be able to achieve n speeds? I had intended on buying Apple's Airport Extreme when it was updated after Macworld but now I just don't know if it's worth the extra money when I could have and 802.11n router for $70 less that could do everything that the Airport Extreme could do but have GB ethernet as well. Any thoughts?

You need to update the firmware. Here's hoping that someone posts the firmware onlne soon.

The Airport Extreme has built in Print/File Server capabilities. Something these other models don't have. THis probably doesn't warrant the additional cost, but it does at elast help set it apart.
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