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First 100,000 Apple TVs to start shipping later this month - report - Page 2

post #41 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

There's no way the studios will ever let you put a copy of a Blu-Ray disc on your computer.

Which is why managed copy is part of the Blu-ray?

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=60

Vinea
post #42 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

I think it still depends on seeing the final iTunes interface with aTV. If it can stream down movies or TV shows I purchased before or buy new without the computer on it has a lot of appeal. Or if Apple creates a NAS counterpart that works without a computer running.

Even as it is its not a bad IPTV model that's a la carte vs the buffet meal of cable or satellite. Less handy if you need the computer on but liveable. I get my fix of my shows with a season pass and I don't really have time for more. Why pay $100/month when I don't use it all if I can go a la carte?

Also, like murch there is a lot of appeal having my movie collection available through FrontRow/Coverflow. I've thought about ripping all my DVDs to a NAS but never had a front end I liked so never bothered. aTV looks to be that front end if I can get those DVDs into h.264 in iTunes for streaming resonably easily. I don't even care that much that it wont be uprez'd. Anything I care about I'll repurchase in 720p/24 from iTunes or buy on HD-DVD/Blu-Ray. There's maybe a handful of titles I would bother with. New titles I buy from iTunes if its price competitive and I get to skip that whole HD-DVD/BluRay debacle except for a couple titles that STILL don't exist in HD (like LOTR).

Oddly, I don't want to rent content. I'm a content packrat...hence the largish DVD collection. iTunes purchase is more appealing than XBox rental.

As for where is it heading? As long as there isn't widespread HDCP on PCs (Macs or Windows) I think the studios are squemish about selling HD movies on iTunes without aTV. With aTV they know they can hit the downrez bit anytime and not totally hose their iTunes HD movie sales.

Vinea

Dumb question, can you rip DVDs like you can cds (into iTunes)? I didn't think one could.
post #43 of 71
By a show of posts, how many of the people who dont like the iTV (or aTV) use iTunes to buy movies or T.V. shows. I would much rather watch my shows and movies, and as a bonus, my music and photos on my TV rather than my relativly small computer monitor. I think this is a good idea, and as Steve said, "it completes the story." More importantly, if I ordered at around 9 EST, will I be one of the 100,000? If I understood correctly, the first 100,000 will get theirs later this month, right?
post #44 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcharna View Post

By a show of posts, how many of the people who dont like the iTV (or aTV) use iTunes to buy movies or T.V. shows. I would much rather watch my shows and movies, and as a bonus, my music and photos on my TV rather than my relativly small computer monitor. I think this is a good idea, and as Steve said, "it completes the story." More importantly, if I ordered at around 9 EST, will I be one of the 100,000? If I understood correctly, the first 100,000 will get theirs later this month, right?

I buy an occasional TV show; right now it's my poor man's DVR. When I miss an episode, I go to iTunes and buy it. And if there's an episode of something for free, I might download that as well. There is and never will be an iTunes movie on my computer.

As for watching my downloaded episodes on TV, I hook my iPod up to my TV with a $!5 cable and watch away, $285 cheaper than the ATV. Or if I'm feeling lazy, I'll just watch it on my 20" widescreen iMac which isn't all that much smaller than my TV in the first place.

I like the idea of ATV but it doesn't do that much more than the $15 video cable allows me to do. Watching video isn't a spur of the moment thing, so taking 30 seconds to hook up the cable isn't much of an issue to me.
post #45 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by macbear01 View Post

(This style of Apple's is why the iPhone drops my jaw. I can't believe all of the features that little 1st generation baby has packed into it.)

You're right, as cool as the iPhone is, the AppleTV isn't. It's still underdeveloped and I cannot believe Steve let it out the door. Pure crap.

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post #46 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

You're right, as cool as the iPhone is, the AppleTV isn't. It's still underdeveloped and I cannot believe Steve let it out the door. Pure crap.

That's right! Apple TV is a $299 underdeveloped, feature-lacking paper weight. Oh, and as for the iPhone.. it would be WAY cool if it wasn't tied to a contract and cell provider.
post #47 of 71
Here's how I envision this shaking out, with some minor tweaking along the way. Just like Jobs said for the Apple iPhone ("Making phone calls is the killer app"), but in this case - TV is the killer app for the Apple TV. Music and Photos are simply elegantly designed extras that add to the digital lifestyle and personalize the experience.

The simple part for now...Apple wants you to buy a new Mac with 802.11N built in and with lots of storage (and/or you can add your own external storage for even more capacity). This computer may reside somewhere in your house other than your living room/family room/bedroom, etc. where your TV(s) are currently located. You then buy an Apple TV (also with 802.11N built in) to stream the movies and TV shows that you purchase from iTunes.

The cool part later...is going to be when the video (movies and TV) that's streamed to the Apple TV is true VoD AND live TV coming straight from the ITMS using WiMAX! How's 200+ plus channels of entertainment sound for your viewing pleasure? Oh, but you want TiVo like functionality, no problem, don't forget that OSX Leopard already has PVR/DVR functionality buried deep into its code base (I've seen the screen shots for it before on this forum). Something I'm sure that Apple could incorporate with Front Row via the Apple TV. Under this model, Apple will compete with Telco IPTV, Cable, and Satellite, which is one reason I think they chose Apple TV as the name for this product. Apple will either find a way to use their Apple Stores as WiMAX distribution hubs (already strategically located within wealthy demographic regions across the US to access a portion of their target markets) to circumvent the phone companies IPTV DSL based offerings and cable companies to deliver TV and VoIP over the last mile (or over the last 6 miles or so to be exact according to the standard for fixed WiMAX) OR partner with the phone companies to leverage their existing/developing WiMAX footprints across the US to reach broader markets.

The Cingular/AT&T agreement could be stretched to include the WiMAX offering in the future or they may just use a wireless provider's network (AT&T, Sprint, Clearwire, etc.) to become their own MVNO (Mobile Network Virtual Operator) to provide a seamless experience to the customer. This may also be the reason Apple went with Intel. Intel plans on building WiFi and WiMAX into their portable chipsets, so theoretically, Apple could utilize these chipsets in their Apple TVs or ask for this technology to be embedded into their desktop chips as well.

SO...you end up with a complete Apple solution for your all your home or mobile entertainment/communication needs. Apple computers located somewhere in your home for storage and/or a stackable storage solution that sits on top of the Apple TV (using the USB connector already on the box), an Apple TV connected to all the TVs in your home (possibly leased or rented by Apple as part of a service agreement to lower the cost of acquisition to the end user - just like your cable, satellite and IPTV set top box is provided today), an Internet connection provided via Apple using WiMAX for the last mile or Mobile WiMAX for access while on the road (connected to your laptop or iPhone), possibly a large screen Apple 40+ inch HD LCD down the road (we've all heard these rumors for some time now), and the next rendition of the iPod HiFi connected to your Apple TV for your virtual surround sound/home theater audio experience so you can enjoy the show or listen to your music in high fidelity. Oh, and don't forget the regular iPod as well. I have to admit. This would be a pretty slick implementation if they can pull it all together.

How exciting indeed! Apple TV? Sign me up. I'll take 3! One for each HDTV in my home. Potentially another example of Apple making something that we didn't know we wanted or needed until they made it for us. Man...I'd love to be a part of this!
post #48 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by nagromme View Post

So here's my current theory:

* AppleTV will appeal to only a small niche of people right now.

* With a MUCH larger selection of video/movie content on iTunes, it will gain a much larger audience.

* But it's a chicken-and-egg scenario. Video iPods alone are not enough to drive shows and movies to iTunes en masse. TV is where people want to watch them. Content providers need incentive to get their stuff on iTunes. Consumers need content to make them buy AppleTV. Which of the two comes first? More TV/movie content, with limited uses for it? Or AppleTV, with limited content to show on it?

* Apple can only control one of the two. So they release AppleTV before there's really a demand for it. Now the egg is laid. Some consumers will buy it, not many. But the platform is there as a gesture to content owners. More content will follow, and THEN more consumers will follow.

* Niche product for only a small number of people? Yes. It's a snowball that HAS to start small. Just like mobile video started small by tacking it onto the music iPod.

* So maybe we shouldn't be waiting for more AppleTV features, cool as they might be to imagine (like PVR). Maybe we should just be waiting for more TV shows and more movies on iTunes. It sounds boring, but maybe that's the main thing needed to make AppleTV (and who knows what other ventures) take off.


couldt really have put it much better

thats EXACTLY what happened with the ipod

only AFTER it came out did we get the iTunes music store so it stands to reason that we need a TV product in order to show the studios that there IS a market
post #49 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macadacious View Post

Here's how I envision this shaking out, with some minor tweaking along the way. Just like Jobs said for the Apple iPhone ("Making phone calls is the killer app"), but in this case - TV is the killer app for the Apple TV. Music and Photos are simply elegantly designed extras that add to the digital lifestyle and personalize the experience.

The simple part for now...Apple wants you to buy a new Mac with 802.11N built in and with lots of storage (and/or you can add your own external storage for even more capacity). This computer may reside somewhere in your house other than your living room/family room/bedroom, etc. where your TV(s) are currently located. You then buy an Apple TV (also with 802.11N built in) to stream the movies and TV shows that you purchase from iTunes.

The cool part later...is going to be when the video (movies and TV) that's streamed to the Apple TV is true VoD AND live TV coming straight from the ITMS using WiMAX! How's 200+ plus channels of entertainment sound for your viewing pleasure? Oh, but you want TiVo like functionality, no problem, don't forget that OSX Leopard already has PVR/DVR functionality buried deep into its code base (I've seen the screen shots for it before on this forum). Something I'm sure that Apple could incorporate with Front Row via the Apple TV. Under this model, Apple will compete with Telco IPTV, Cable, and Satellite, which is one reason I think they chose Apple TV as the name for this product. Apple will either find a way to use their Apple Stores as WiMAX distribution hubs (already strategically located within wealthy demographic regions across the US to access a portion of their target markets) to circumvent the phone companies IPTV DSL based offerings and cable companies to deliver TV and VoIP over the last mile (or over the last 6 miles or so to be exact according to the standard for fixed WiMAX) OR partner with the phone companies to leverage their existing/developing WiMAX footprints across the US to reach broader markets.

The Cingular/AT&T agreement could be stretched to include the WiMAX offering in the future or they may just use a wireless provider's network (AT&T, Sprint, Clearwire, etc.) to become their own MVNO (Mobile Network Virtual Operator) to provide a seamless experience to the customer. This may also be the reason Apple went with Intel. Intel plans on building WiFi and WiMAX into their portable chipsets, so theoretically, Apple could utilize these chipsets in their Apple TVs or ask for this technology to be embedded into their desktop chips as well.

SO...you end up with a complete Apple solution for your all your home or mobile entertainment/communication needs. Apple computers located somewhere in your home for storage and/or a stackable storage solution that sits on top of the Apple TV (using the USB connector already on the box), an Apple TV connected to all the TVs in your home (possibly leased or rented by Apple as part of a service agreement to lower the cost of acquisition to the end user - just like your cable, satellite and IPTV set top box is provided today), an Internet connection provided via Apple using WiMAX for the last mile or Mobile WiMAX for access while on the road (connected to your laptop or iPhone), possibly a large screen Apple 40+ inch HD LCD down the road (we've all heard these rumors for some time now), and the next rendition of the iPod HiFi connected to your Apple TV for your virtual surround sound/home theater audio experience so you can enjoy the show or listen to your music in high fidelity. Oh, and don't forget the regular iPod as well. I have to admit. This would be a pretty slick implementation if they can pull it all together.

How exciting indeed! Apple TV? Sign me up. I'll take 3! One for each HDTV in my home. Potentially another example of Apple making something that we didn't know we wanted or needed until they made it for us. Man...I'd love to be a part of this!

Why do people keep on insisting that Apple's iTunes Store is going head-to-head against the cable companies and/or phone companies? Talk about the chicken and the egg scenario. Where do most American's get their home high-speed internet access from? Cable or a phone company. Unless high speed access is suddenly divorced from these two services, the iTunes store's very existence in the US is dependent on them.

At my current location, my only option is cable internet. And let's say in theory, all the Apple stores started offering up WiMAX access, that still leaves most of the country out in the dark; It will be great for people in the large metropolitan areas. Why would the cable/telephone companies partner with Apple to circumvent their own efforts? They might, like the XBox 360/AT&T deal, partner to make the ATV their set-top box (I'm sure the networks and studios would love to allow Apple to add Fairplay DRM to the shows you recorded over your ATV DVR so they were tied to your iTunes account and at most 5 computers; say goodbye to burning DVD collections a la TivoToGo with Toast 8).

As for an iPod Hi-Fi for "virtual surround sound," no thanks, I'll stick with my 5.1 system for "real" surrond sound or hopefully soon upgrade to 6.1 or 7.1.
post #50 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by backtomac View Post

Dumb question, can you rip DVDs like you can cds (into iTunes)? I didn't think one could.

At the moment, there is no legal way to rip most commercial DVDs in the same way you would rip a strictly-confomant CD.

That being said, it is technically possible, and 3rd party software can be found which will do it.
post #51 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by lfmorrison View Post

At the moment, there is no legal way to rip most commercial DVDs in the same way you would rip a strictly-confomant CD.

That being said, it is technically possible, and 3rd party software can be found which will do it.

This is where ATV looses me. If I can't legally rip my DVD library into say iTunes how do I get video content to the ATV? There really isn't a lot at the itunes store. TIVO is more useful for me.
post #52 of 71
While I have my own questions about ATV can it stream live video, such as content from MLB.com? I don't think so at this point this whole 1080i verus 720p discussion is fascinating to me.

Basically, those whining about being forced to use 720p are saying something akin to: "I prefer having three litres of milk to a mere one gallon."

More than likely, most displays will show 1080i as 540p. You do the math.

That having been said, I'm leaning toward getting a Mini for my HT system to replace my DVD player (although I wish it had an HDMI output). ATV probably doesn't fit in my plans.
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post #53 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by backtomac View Post

This is where ATV looses me. If I can't legally rip my DVD library into say iTunes how do I get video content to the ATV? There really isn't a lot at the itunes store. TIVO is more useful for me.

And you legally rip your DVDs to your Tivo how? And your TiVO, except for the $700+ series 3, is inferior to the $10/month DVR from your cable company. That's assuming cablecard works.

Vinea
post #54 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

And you legally rip your DVDs to your Tivo how? And your TiVO, except for the $700+ series 3, is inferior to the $10/month DVR from your cable company. That's assuming cablecard works.

Vinea

No but with cable I've a wide variety of content that I can record and keeep as long as I want. I don't have any content on my computer that I would stream to my TV. If iTunes is where I'm going to get my content that's fairly limiting, at least for now. That's why I was wondering where you and Murch see this heading. I don't know the answer I just trying to learn.
post #55 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by backtomac View Post

I don't have any content on my computer that I would stream to my TV.

You don't? How about after the kids are in bed?

C.
post #56 of 71
Has anybody else noticed this tidbit from the Apple TV technical specs page:
Quote:
Video

* Video formats supported: H.264 and protected H.264 (from iTunes Store); up to 1.5 Mbps, 640 by 480, 30 fps, LC version of Baseline Profile with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps in .m4v, .mp4, and .mov; up to 768 Kbps, 320 by 240, 30 fps, Baseline profile up to Level 1.3 with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps; MPEG-4 up to 2.5 Mbps, 640 by 480, 30 fps, Simple Profile with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps

http://www.apple.com/ca/appletv/specs.html

It looks to me as though the Apple TV is only capable of decoding video up to 640x480. If that's the case, why can't it be made to support legacy televisions?
post #57 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

You don't? How about after the kids are in bed?

C.

<family agthers around HDTV with ATV>
Yeah let's see what we'll watch tonight, Pirates of the Carribean or the Anal Pirates. What do you kids think.....
post #58 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macvault View Post

Why did Apple do such a half-baked job with the Apple TV product? They could have done so much more with it. They still can and I'm sure they will in the future, but for the $299 it should allow a lot more flexibility and features than it does now

What do you expect for $299? The only thing I think it's lacking is 1000 BASE-T.
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post #59 of 71
With so many HDMI ready components it's very easy to max out your HDTV's high-end inputs.

Between a DVR, Cable Box, and DVD player, I don't want to have to manual switch these ports and shouldn't have to downgrade my cables or buy a new, overly expensive TV that has 4 or more HDMI ports (if those TV even exist).

I hope a 3rd-party company uses the AppleTV's look and footprint to make a Digital A/V switcher soon. It needs to have output and and 4 (though 5 seems ideal) HMDI inputs.
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post #60 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by backtomac View Post

<family agthers around HDTV with ATV>
Yeah let's see what we'll watch tonight, Pirates of the Carribean or the Anal Pirates. What do you kids think.....

Suddenly the "search for shared media - type in password" all makes sense.

C.
post #61 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

What do you expect for $299? The only thing I think it's lacking is 1000 BASE-T.

And the apparently ability to actually decode HD content...?
post #62 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macadacious View Post

Here's how I envision this shaking out, with some minor tweaking along the way. Just like Jobs said for the Apple iPhone ("Making phone calls is the killer app"), but in this case - TV is the killer app for the Apple TV. Music and Photos are simply elegantly designed extras that add to the digital lifestyle and personalize the experience.

The simple part for now...Apple wants you to buy a new Mac with 802.11N built in and with lots of storage (and/or you can add your own external storage for even more capacity). This computer may reside somewhere in your house other than your living room/family room/bedroom, etc. where your TV(s) are currently located. You then buy an Apple TV (also with 802.11N built in) to stream the movies and TV shows that you purchase from iTunes.

The cool part later...is going to be when the video (movies and TV) that's streamed to the Apple TV is true VoD AND live TV coming straight from the ITMS using WiMAX! How's 200+ plus channels of entertainment sound for your viewing pleasure? Oh, but you want TiVo like functionality, no problem, don't forget that OSX Leopard already has PVR/DVR functionality buried deep into its code base (I've seen the screen shots for it before on this forum). Something I'm sure that Apple could incorporate with Front Row via the Apple TV. Under this model, Apple will compete with Telco IPTV, Cable, and Satellite, which is one reason I think they chose Apple TV as the name for this product. Apple will either find a way to use their Apple Stores as WiMAX distribution hubs (already strategically located within wealthy demographic regions across the US to access a portion of their target markets) to circumvent the phone companies IPTV DSL based offerings and cable companies to deliver TV and VoIP over the last mile (or over the last 6 miles or so to be exact according to the standard for fixed WiMAX) OR partner with the phone companies to leverage their existing/developing WiMAX footprints across the US to reach broader markets.

The Cingular/AT&T agreement could be stretched to include the WiMAX offering in the future or they may just use a wireless provider's network (AT&T, Sprint, Clearwire, etc.) to become their own MVNO (Mobile Network Virtual Operator) to provide a seamless experience to the customer. This may also be the reason Apple went with Intel. Intel plans on building WiFi and WiMAX into their portable chipsets, so theoretically, Apple could utilize these chipsets in their Apple TVs or ask for this technology to be embedded into their desktop chips as well.

SO...you end up with a complete Apple solution for your all your home or mobile entertainment/communication needs. Apple computers located somewhere in your home for storage and/or a stackable storage solution that sits on top of the Apple TV (using the USB connector already on the box), an Apple TV connected to all the TVs in your home (possibly leased or rented by Apple as part of a service agreement to lower the cost of acquisition to the end user - just like your cable, satellite and IPTV set top box is provided today), an Internet connection provided via Apple using WiMAX for the last mile or Mobile WiMAX for access while on the road (connected to your laptop or iPhone), possibly a large screen Apple 40+ inch HD LCD down the road (we've all heard these rumors for some time now), and the next rendition of the iPod HiFi connected to your Apple TV for your virtual surround sound/home theater audio experience so you can enjoy the show or listen to your music in high fidelity. Oh, and don't forget the regular iPod as well. I have to admit. This would be a pretty slick implementation if they can pull it all together.

How exciting indeed! Apple TV? Sign me up. I'll take 3! One for each HDTV in my home. Potentially another example of Apple making something that we didn't know we wanted or needed until they made it for us. Man...I'd love to be a part of this!



Sorry to include the entire post, above... but it's very possible that Apple will have an upcoming media server, much like HP's multi-terabyte home server. With this type of dedicated server for all of your entertainment options (music/photos/video...) the AppleTV could possibly be more useful... for now, it's kinda like a space shuttle with no space station to to to.

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Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

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GOA

 

Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

Reply
post #63 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by lfmorrison View Post

Has anybody else noticed this tidbit from the Apple TV technical specs page:

http://www.apple.com/ca/appletv/specs.html

It looks to me as though the Apple TV is only capable of decoding video up to 640x480. If that's the case, why can't it be made to support legacy televisions?

Ooohh...that changed from yesterday. Yesterday it listed 720p24 in there too.

Vinea
post #64 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Ooohh...that changed from yesterday. Yesterday it listed 720p24 in there too.

Vinea

AppleTV is more of a piece of junk than even I thought it would be:

Quote:
Video formats supported: H.264 and protected H.264 (from iTunes Store); up to 1.5 Mbps, 640 by 480, 30 fps, LC version of Baseline Profile with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps in .m4v, .mp4, and .mov; up to 768 Kbps, 320 by 240, 30 fps, Baseline profile up to Level 1.3 with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps; MPEG-4 up to 2.5 Mbps, 640 by 480, 30 fps, Simple Profile with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

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Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

Reply

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Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

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post #65 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Ooohh...that changed from yesterday. Yesterday it listed 720p24 in there too.

Vinea

Unfortunate. Also, don't forget (according to briefed Apple staff on the showroom floor)
that photos are getting squished to 720 horizontal lines -- the fuzzification was obvious
on the 40-42" (Sony) 1080p TVs there. If a photo buff wants to see all 1080 lines on a
big-investment HDTV screen, use the DVI->HDMI cable solution
from a modern MacBook (or MBP, or Mini) using Front Row.
post #66 of 71
Frankly, the iPhone demo was the only thing that saved Apple's bacon for the time being. AppleTV is almost a non-starter now... Jeez, I wonder if anyone ordering this unit really understands what they're getting? Ouch!

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post #67 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

AppleTV is more of a piece of junk than even I thought it would be:

Or simply they wanted to hold that back because it implies iTunes selling movies at 720p24 until they actually start selling movies at 720p24 which apparently wont happen till they ship aTV.

On the plus side 720p60 and 1080i60 is more of a possibility now.

Vinea
post #68 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

AppleTV is more of a piece of junk than even I thought it would be:

Is it necessary to carry on with the bleak, thread-devolving negativity? Or maybe I'm the only one who'd prefer discussing these topics with less dreariness?
post #69 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Ooohh...that changed from yesterday. Yesterday it listed 720p24 in there too.

Vinea

Just checked again... and on the US site, 720p 24fps is still listed. But on the Canadian site it isn't. Maybe concessions are being made to appease the Canadian studio licensing administrators.

Maybe it's just that Apple Canada is engulfed in a slightly different reality distortion field than its southern counterpart.
post #70 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

I buy an occasional TV show; right now it's my poor man's DVR. When I miss an episode, I go to iTunes and buy it.

Why on earth would you pay for a show through iTunes that you've already paid for via your cable/satellite bill?
post #71 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by wilco View Post

Why on earth would you pay for a show through iTunes that you've already paid for via your cable/satellite bill?

Who still subscribes to cable?

Apple TV + iTunes Season Passes to the two or three shows you watch is way, way cheaper than Cable + TiVo.
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